Is it possible to make a "world" LTE phone? The new iPad is not "world" LTE, although it is "world" 3G. Is there a single chip solution available for a "world" LTE?
It's very complicated. Extra circuitry would need to be added to support additional bands (see my post above). It's theoretically possible, but the value in adding that additional circuitry doesn't yet exist because LTE deployment is so sparse, so far. Verizon and AT&T are the largest deployments of LTE in the world to date, so it's worthwhile to support those. Plus the only real competition in phones (and tablets) with LTE is in the U.S. right now.
Apple's very pragmatic. They don't tend to add hardware that would add cost until and unless it will actually be useful to a significant or meaningful segment of their market(s). Once LTE networks are rolled out more broadly they'll add support for additional LTE bands in subsequent iPhones and iPads.
But I thought AT&T iPhones are already "4G". And all that's required is updating to iOS 5.1
Nothing personal to you, but I really wish people would get off this hobby horse about what's "real" 4G and what's not.
The fact is that if one goes by the actual, original specification by the committee, there is *nothing* that is "real" 4G that will arrive for at least a few years. Not anywhere on the planet.
The choice is simply calling the technology currently emerging with the 4G speeds "4G," or waiting for 3 years before the very first "real" 4G implementation emerges. Most people would say that the main differentiating feature of 4G is the fact that it's way faster which the stuff emerging today is. If we want to wait for all the technical details to line up and the speeds to reach their theoretical maximums, then we'll all be waiting a long long time.
The basebands in Apple's phones have been "capable" of supporting AWS for at least a couple years now, the problem is that there has been a limitation to the number of bands you can support at one time and whether you want to add the auxiliary components for the RF transceivers.
The diagram in this article *is* showing the additional components that would be needed to support T-Mobile's AWS band.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX
They allow introduced the iPhone 4 as a penta-band phone to the FCC but never activated the 5th band, which I think was only used by Japan's largest MNO.
Both the iPhone 4 and the iPhone 4S do UMTS/HSDPA/HSUPA at 850, 900, 1900, 2100 MHz and GSM/EDGE at 850, 900, 1800, 1900 MHz.
That's five bands: 850, 900, 1800, 1900, 2100.
There is no "inactive" 5th band on either phone. It's just that they only support four bands for any one telecom standard.
The new iPad now supports 6 bands: 700 (E-UTRAN band 13 or 17, depending on model), 850, 900, 1800, 1900, and 2100.
The diagram in this article shows support components for 7 PA bands. The GSM/EDGE components would include the 1800 Mhz band, so it's actually 8 bands total (!). No doubt the antenna design and tuning will be highly complex.
Nothing personal to you, but I really wish people would get off this hobby horse about what's "real" 4G and what's not.
The fact is that if one goes by the actual, original specification by the committee, there is *nothing* that is "real" 4G that will arrive for at least a few years. Not anywhere on the planet.
I actually wish they just use "5G" for current LTE and "6G" for LTE Advanced. Then people could shut up about what's really "4G" or not. ("I want the one that's got more 'G's!!")
It's all just marketing, rather than technical terminology, anyway. They might as well use the names of colors, or emotions, or shapes.
...or big cat names, like Panther, Tiger, Leopard, Lion, etc.
The diagram in this article *is* showing the additional components that would be needed to support T-Mobile's AWS band.
Both the iPhone 4 and the iPhone 4S do UMTS/HSDPA/HSUPA at 850, 900, 1900, 2100 MHz and GSM/EDGE at 850, 900, 1800, 1900 MHz.
That's five bands: 850, 900, 1800, 1900, 2100.
There is no "inactive" 5th band on either phone. It's just that they only support four bands for any one telecom standard.
The new iPad now supports 6 bands: 700 (E-UTRAN band 13 or 17, depending on model), 850, 900, 1800, 1900, and 2100.
The diagram in this article shows support components for 7 PA bands. The GSM/EDGE components would include the 1800 Mhz band, so it's actually 8 bands total (!). No doubt the antenna design and tuning will be highly complex.
1) Read the diagram again. All required component are not on one chip.
2) As shown, being technically possible doesn't mean technically advantageous. There are almost often tradeoffs. Gobi is great but it can't be everything to everyone... yet.
3) As noted, Apple had the 5th band tested but it was never active. Inactive does not mean non-existent.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcarling
Some possible improvements that we might see in the next iPhone:
- LTE
- 1GB of RAM (up from the current 512MB)
- 10 megapixel camera
- Gorilla Glass 2 (would allow for either more battery capacity or a slightly thinner phone)
- faster CPU/GPU (more responsive)
I think LTE, specifically the MDM9615, is very likely. What is unsure is whether Apple can finally put more LTE bands on one device. If Apple could have put Verizon and AT&T's LTE bands on one device they could halved the number of cellular iPads this year. That is a cost savings on many levels so it would seem to me there were technical reasons preventing it.
Is 1GB RAM really a propriety for Apple since the resolution won't be changing?
So long as it's a better camera in other regards that's fine but over all I'd rather see improvements outside of pixel count.
I think GG2 is very likely. It seems to have no downsides for Apple's needs.
I'm sure about a faster CPU/GPU (clockspeed) but I would expect we'll see the A6 drop in size and increase in performance while using less power.
I can't even image how big this product release is going to be. Everyone I know is really ready for a 4.2 (?) screen, A6 cpu, 4G, and 4.0 bluetooth just to name a few of the features. And a new design......I'm READY.
I'm afraid everyone you know is going to be disappointed when the screen and form factor remain relatively unchanged.
I'm not sure where I heard it, but I am of the opinion that the late Qualcomm LTE chips would be far more energy efficient than those of a year ago. Would that be the MDM9615" LTE chip mentioned above?
I'm not sure where I heard it, but I am of the opinion that the late Qualcomm LTE chips would be far more energy efficient than those of a year ago. Would that be the MDM9615" LTE chip mentioned above?
For example, Apple has been using a WiFi/BT/FM radio chip for years but never enabled the FM radio. They allow introduced the iPhone 4 as a penta-band phone to the FCC but never activated the 5th band, which I think was only used by Japan's largest MNO.
The fifth band you refer (Band 6) to is completely inside another band (Band 5 - 850MHz).
Apple is reportedly moving along with development of its next-generation iPhone, and is now reviewing parts submitted by suppliers for potential use...
Comments
Is it possible to make a "world" LTE phone? The new iPad is not "world" LTE, although it is "world" 3G. Is there a single chip solution available for a "world" LTE?
It's very complicated. Extra circuitry would need to be added to support additional bands (see my post above). It's theoretically possible, but the value in adding that additional circuitry doesn't yet exist because LTE deployment is so sparse, so far. Verizon and AT&T are the largest deployments of LTE in the world to date, so it's worthwhile to support those. Plus the only real competition in phones (and tablets) with LTE is in the U.S. right now.
Apple's very pragmatic. They don't tend to add hardware that would add cost until and unless it will actually be useful to a significant or meaningful segment of their market(s). Once LTE networks are rolled out more broadly they'll add support for additional LTE bands in subsequent iPhones and iPads.
But I thought AT&T iPhones are already "4G". And all that's required is updating to iOS 5.1
Nothing personal to you, but I really wish people would get off this hobby horse about what's "real" 4G and what's not.
The fact is that if one goes by the actual, original specification by the committee, there is *nothing* that is "real" 4G that will arrive for at least a few years. Not anywhere on the planet.
The choice is simply calling the technology currently emerging with the 4G speeds "4G," or waiting for 3 years before the very first "real" 4G implementation emerges. Most people would say that the main differentiating feature of 4G is the fact that it's way faster which the stuff emerging today is. If we want to wait for all the technical details to line up and the speeds to reach their theoretical maximums, then we'll all be waiting a long long time.
The basebands in Apple's phones have been "capable" of supporting AWS for at least a couple years now, the problem is that there has been a limitation to the number of bands you can support at one time and whether you want to add the auxiliary components for the RF transceivers.
The diagram in this article *is* showing the additional components that would be needed to support T-Mobile's AWS band.
They allow introduced the iPhone 4 as a penta-band phone to the FCC but never activated the 5th band, which I think was only used by Japan's largest MNO.
Both the iPhone 4 and the iPhone 4S do UMTS/HSDPA/HSUPA at 850, 900, 1900, 2100 MHz and GSM/EDGE at 850, 900, 1800, 1900 MHz.
That's five bands: 850, 900, 1800, 1900, 2100.
There is no "inactive" 5th band on either phone. It's just that they only support four bands for any one telecom standard.
The new iPad now supports 6 bands: 700 (E-UTRAN band 13 or 17, depending on model), 850, 900, 1800, 1900, and 2100.
The diagram in this article shows support components for 7 PA bands. The GSM/EDGE components would include the 1800 Mhz band, so it's actually 8 bands total (!). No doubt the antenna design and tuning will be highly complex.
Nothing personal to you, but I really wish people would get off this hobby horse about what's "real" 4G and what's not.
The fact is that if one goes by the actual, original specification by the committee, there is *nothing* that is "real" 4G that will arrive for at least a few years. Not anywhere on the planet.
I actually wish they just use "5G" for current LTE and "6G" for LTE Advanced. Then people could shut up about what's really "4G" or not. ("I want the one that's got more 'G's!!")
It's all just marketing, rather than technical terminology, anyway. They might as well use the names of colors, or emotions, or shapes.
...or big cat names, like Panther, Tiger, Leopard, Lion, etc.
- LTE
- 1GB of RAM (up from the current 512MB)
- 10 megapixel camera
- Gorilla Glass 2 (would allow for either more battery capacity or a slightly thinner phone)
- faster CPU/GPU (more responsive)
10 megapixel camera
Oh, for crying out loud. People need to get off the megapixel kick.
The diagram in this article *is* showing the additional components that would be needed to support T-Mobile's AWS band.
Both the iPhone 4 and the iPhone 4S do UMTS/HSDPA/HSUPA at 850, 900, 1900, 2100 MHz and GSM/EDGE at 850, 900, 1800, 1900 MHz.
That's five bands: 850, 900, 1800, 1900, 2100.
There is no "inactive" 5th band on either phone. It's just that they only support four bands for any one telecom standard.
The new iPad now supports 6 bands: 700 (E-UTRAN band 13 or 17, depending on model), 850, 900, 1800, 1900, and 2100.
The diagram in this article shows support components for 7 PA bands. The GSM/EDGE components would include the 1800 Mhz band, so it's actually 8 bands total (!). No doubt the antenna design and tuning will be highly complex.
1) Read the diagram again. All required component are not on one chip.
2) As shown, being technically possible doesn't mean technically advantageous. There are almost often tradeoffs. Gobi is great but it can't be everything to everyone... yet.
3) As noted, Apple had the 5th band tested but it was never active. Inactive does not mean non-existent.
Some possible improvements that we might see in the next iPhone:
- LTE
- 1GB of RAM (up from the current 512MB)
- 10 megapixel camera
- Gorilla Glass 2 (would allow for either more battery capacity or a slightly thinner phone)
- faster CPU/GPU (more responsive)
I think LTE, specifically the MDM9615, is very likely. What is unsure is whether Apple can finally put more LTE bands on one device. If Apple could have put Verizon and AT&T's LTE bands on one device they could halved the number of cellular iPads this year. That is a cost savings on many levels so it would seem to me there were technical reasons preventing it.
Is 1GB RAM really a propriety for Apple since the resolution won't be changing?
So long as it's a better camera in other regards that's fine but over all I'd rather see improvements outside of pixel count.
I think GG2 is very likely. It seems to have no downsides for Apple's needs.
I'm sure about a faster CPU/GPU (clockspeed) but I would expect we'll see the A6 drop in size and increase in performance while using less power.
I can't even image how big this product release is going to be. Everyone I know is really ready for a 4.2 (?) screen, A6 cpu, 4G, and 4.0 bluetooth just to name a few of the features. And a new design......I'm READY.
I'm afraid everyone you know is going to be disappointed when the screen and form factor remain relatively unchanged.
Isn't it a little late in the cycle to be reviewing potential hardware components. I would have thought they would be testing prototypes by now.
You'll know when they start testing prototypes when people start finding them in bars.
I'm not sure where I heard it, but I am of the opinion that the late Qualcomm LTE chips would be far more energy efficient than those of a year ago. Would that be the MDM9615" LTE chip mentioned above?
Yes it would.
- http://www.anandtech.com/show/4925/w...-28nm-maturity
Note: iPhone 5 refers to what we call the iPhone 4S, as in 5th gen iPhone, not to what people are calling the 6th iPhone.Oh, for crying out loud. People need to get off the megapixel kick.
http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/news/...one-camera.ars
Main benefits:
-Noise reduction
-Loosless zoom
-Better color reproduction
Too bad this tech will be soon available on WP but not on iPhone.
Yes, the MDM9615 should support Voice over LTE, though Verizon and AT&T won't be turning it on their networks until next year.
But why? Will my voice travel faster? Better?
Oh, for crying out loud. People need to get off the megapixel kick.
And get on the Gigahertz kick?
Or how about the multicore kick?
As long as it doesn't get warm, or else Consumer Reports will get non-recommendy on your ass!
Band 4 is 1700 Mhz AWS used in the U.S. by T-Mobile
Band 4 is used by AT&T, Telus and Bell for LTE.
Apple curiously calls it 2100 instead of AWS in the iPad specs.
Very disappointed there's no band III (LTE 1800) for Australia, Europe and Asia.
Isn't it a little late in the cycle to be reviewing potential hardware components. I would have thought they would be testing prototypes by now.
These are power amplifiers and filters, there are many vendors that can provide these to Apple's specs.
For example, Apple has been using a WiFi/BT/FM radio chip for years but never enabled the FM radio. They allow introduced the iPhone 4 as a penta-band phone to the FCC but never activated the 5th band, which I think was only used by Japan's largest MNO.
The fifth band you refer (Band 6) to is completely inside another band (Band 5 - 850MHz).
Apple is reportedly moving along with development of its next-generation iPhone, and is now reviewing parts submitted by suppliers for potential use...
Oh, for crying out loud. People need to get off the megapixel kick.
I'm not getting off the kick until the camera at the back of the iPad is 9.7 MP, to match the screen size!