Dell feeling iPad pressure after soft notebook sales, earnings miss

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  • Reply 21 of 44
    mstonemstone Posts: 11,510member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Macky the Macky View Post


    I remember. And I remember how cautious everyone was about saying that the iPad could blow away the netbook. Either Steve Jobs had the biggest set of balls in the universe, or he really saw the future clearer than anyone else in the industry.



    I think SJ saw the absolute ineptitude of today's adult population with regard to computing. Real computers are just too difficult for them to use or understand. Even of the people who do use notebooks, 90% of them could get by just fine, probably better, with an iPad.

  • Reply 22 of 44
    ahmlcoahmlco Posts: 432member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by mstone View Post


    I think SJ saw the absolute ineptitude of today's adult population with regard to computing. Real computers are just too difficult for them to use or understand. Even of the people who do use notebooks, 90% of them could get by just fine, probably better, with an iPad.



     


    I guess that explains it's popularity amount adults, young adults, teens, and kids... or not.


     


    The point is that for many tasks, an iPad is easier to carry and easier to use in circumstances and places where using a traditional notebook might be impractical (or even impossible). Standing in line, in a car, on a train or plane, perched on a bench, curled up on a couch or in bed, the tablet form factor is simply easier to use.


     


    Yes, it's more accessible. But I've been working in computers for nearly 40 years now, and I'm here to tell you that I don't use may iPad daily because I don't understand "real" computers...

  • Reply 23 of 44
    mstonemstone Posts: 11,510member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by ahmlco View Post


    Yes, it's more accessible. But I've been working in computers for nearly 40 years now, and I'm here to tell you that I don't use may iPad daily because I don't understand "real" computers...



    Probably everyone on this forum falls into that same category, which as I projected, is the 10% of all notebook users who actually need a full computer. If SJ had envisioned that expert computer users would be the primary target market, the iPad would be a flop and it would also have user accessible file system, USB ports and memory card reader. It was designed for computer illiterates but is also enjoyable to use for the computer expert but in no way replaces the full computer that experts require.

  • Reply 24 of 44
    sockrolidsockrolid Posts: 2,788member

    Quote:


     




    Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

    Late Apple co-founder Steve Jobs pointed out in 1996 that his rival "wasn't perfect at predicting the future" when Apple's market cap passed Dell's.


     



    Steve Jobs said that in 2006, not 1996.


     


     


    Quote:


     




    Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

    As of the close of market on Tuesday, Apple's market capitalization was nearly 20 times that of its rival.


     



    I'd add that when Apple's market cap first passed Dell's in 2006, Dell's market cap was roughly $72 billion.


    It has declined 69%, to $22 billion, in just six years.  And it's still declining.

  • Reply 25 of 44
    ahmlcoahmlco Posts: 432member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by mstone View Post


    It was designed for computer illiterates but is also enjoyable to use for the computer expert but in no way replaces the full computer that experts require.



     


    Saying that it was designed for computer "illiterates" misses the point. It was designed to be easily used by everyone, "illiterates", computer users, and computer "experts" alike. 


     


    And it is, in fact, replacing the need for a "full" computer for many uses and in many industries. It may not be a complete replacement for a "full" computer for "experts" yet, but it's already made tremendous inroads in the two brief years it's been available. More and more people are beginning to use it for content creation, media creation, and even for development.


     


    You can be dismissive if you want, but Iit's early days, yet.

  • Reply 26 of 44
    ewanewan Posts: 36member


    Everyone has a laptop now, there hasn't been anything new in Operating Systems, that is why notebook sales are "soft", not because of the iPad. It may be hard for you to understand this but the iPad isn't a full computer and doesn't directly compete with laptops. I have an iPad and can't imagine not having a laptop because there are so many basic functions that aren't available on the iPad. Stop hyping up the iPad, you made me waste $700 because of your hype.

  • Reply 27 of 44
    tallest skiltallest skil Posts: 43,399member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Ewan View Post

    Everyone has a laptop now…


     


    That's not true.


     


    Quote:


    …there hasn't been anything new in Operating Systems, that is why notebook sales are "soft"…



     


    That's not true.


     


    Quote:


    Stop hyping up the iPad, you made me waste $700 because of your hype



     


    No, no one but yourself "made" you "waste" your money on an iPad.

  • Reply 28 of 44
    sunspot42sunspot42 Posts: 93member


    Dell was the king of the mailorder clonemakers, and benefited from *not* having a retail presence back when computers cost around $2,000.  Shipping was fairly cheap, and you didn't have to pay 5-10% sales tax, which added another $100-$200 to the price of a store bought Compaq, IBM, HP, Apple, Sony or Packard Bell (remember them?) computer.  And since Dell was build-to-order, you weren't running the risk of getting yesterday's (or yesteryear's) technology, like you did if you bought a PC retail that had been sitting around in a store room at CompUSA for 6 months.


     


    Dell also let you customize your machine, which again allowed you to get a lot more of what you wanted for your money.  That wasn't an option for retail boxes - you were stuck with what the manufacturer had configured them with.


     


    This gave Dell huge advantages over its rivals.


     


    All of those advantages started to evaporate after about 2003.  Laptops became more popular than desktops, and laptops offer fewer customization options.  HP and Compaq got better about getting fresh inventory to their retailers, and their combined size post-merger allowed them to better compete on price with Dell.  Components that used to be costly options - like advanced sound cards and 3D graphics - became standard features included on virtually all motherboards.  Worst of all for Dell, the average selling price of a desktop PC - and eventually even a laptop - fell well under $1,000.  So the whole no-sales-tax advantage for Dell fell from $100-$200 a system down to $25-$75 a system, which barely made it worth the hassle of dealing with shipping (and dealing with Dell's reviled outsourced support).


     


    Dell has never successfully adjusted its business model to deal with this new operating environment, and now you're seeing the results.  Their "me too" attempts at cracking the consumerized post-PC device market have been disastrous, while they've completely missed the boat when it comes to the high-touch customer service and support model Apple applied to their PC business.  At this point I don't think there's any way out of this situation for them.  They're sorta the RIMM of the PC business, and like RIMM it's largely Apple that's eating their lunch.

     

  • Reply 29 of 44

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by mstone View Post


    I think SJ saw the absolute ineptitude of today's adult population with regard to computing. Real computers are just too difficult for them to use or understand. Even of the people who do use notebooks, 90% of them could get by just fine, probably better, with an iPad.



    Ineptitude is with computers is not what SJ saw. He saw computers as everyday utilitarian devices; no need to create devices which are artificially complex. The general rule I learned years ago was you don't make people pay for features they cannot or will not use; make the advanced features and cost apparent only to those needing the features. Good design comes with hiding the complexity and this is much more difficult and requires much more expertise than the opposite. Apple hides the inherent complexity better than any other company. "Easy to use", "it just works", KISS, Occam's Razor all say the same thing. As Gregory Chaitin says, knowledge and understanding is compression. 

  • Reply 30 of 44
    lamewinglamewing Posts: 742member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Ewan View Post


    Everyone has a laptop now, there hasn't been anything new in Operating Systems, that is why notebook sales are "soft", not because of the iPad. It may be hard for you to understand this but the iPad isn't a full computer and doesn't directly compete with laptops. I have an iPad and can't imagine not having a laptop because there are so many basic functions that aren't available on the iPad. Stop hyping up the iPad, you made me waste $700 because of your hype.



    I have been using computers since my first Atari 800 and I don't have a laptop, just a handbuilt PC and a new Mac Mini. 


     


    Everybody - me = NOT Everybody

  • Reply 31 of 44
    dona83dona83 Posts: 14member


    I have a Dell work machine, it's truly a piece of crap. Four service calls in just over two years for a hard drive controller/audio board issue, and the battery is completely shot. This from their Vostro business line. It's no Precision or Latitude but I expected way better. Now that AutoCAD is available for Mac, I'm going to be upgrading very soon. 

  • Reply 32 of 44
    charlitunacharlituna Posts: 7,215member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by ahmlco View Post


     


    I guess that explains it's popularity amount adults, young adults, teens, and kids... or not.


     


    The point is that for many tasks, an iPad is easier to carry and easier to use in circumstances and places where using a traditional notebook might be impractical (or even impossible). Standing in line, in a car, on a train or plane, perched on a bench, curled up on a couch or in bed, the tablet form factor is simply easier to use.



     


    Yep. We use them at work all the time for all kinds of things in part because on a set, especially on location, there often aren't that many places to huddle around a laptop or even to set one down. being able to pass around something that can be held in one hand is a blessing. being able to slide it into the side pouches of the set chairs is great. no one has had an issue with getting used to typing etc. 

  • Reply 33 of 44
    charlitunacharlituna Posts: 7,215member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by ahmlco View Post


     


    Saying that it was designed for computer "illiterates" misses the point. It was designed to be easily used by everyone, "illiterates", computer users, and computer "experts" alike. 


     



     


    Agreed. It wasn't designed for idiots that can't handle a 'real' computer. It was designed for those that feel no need to dig around in the guts of the system but want to focus on the tasks to be done. tasks that don't necessarily need a major super strength system. Like reading email or listening to music. You don't need a 20 GHz 50 core processor, 1000 GB of RAM blah blah for that kind of task. If you are doing something that needs that, you get that kind of computer. 

  • Reply 34 of 44
    fredaroonyfredaroony Posts: 619member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by rcoleman1 View Post


    For those who don't already know...Dell = crap.



    Do you actually have an example or do you just make outlandish comments with no basis?

  • Reply 35 of 44
    wokd33wokd33 Posts: 4member
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  • Reply 36 of 44
    tallest skiltallest skil Posts: 43,399member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by fredaroony View Post

    Do you actually have an example or do you just make outlandish comments with no basis?


     


    Do you re~ally want to go down this road? image

  • Reply 37 of 44
    relicrelic Posts: 4,735member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Ewan View Post


    Everyone has a laptop now, there hasn't been anything new in Operating Systems, that is why notebook sales are "soft", not because of the iPad. It may be hard for you to understand this but the iPad isn't a full computer and doesn't directly compete with laptops. I have an iPad and can't imagine not having a laptop because there are so many basic functions that aren't available on the iPad. Stop hyping up the iPad, you made me waste $700 because of your hype.



    That's a bummer that you wasted money for something you don't like. Why not sell it, you'll loose 50 - 80 bucks on the deal but it's better then owning a device you won't use. May I suggest you looking into the Asus Transformer series of tablets, maybe you could even find someone who is willing to trade with you. I think you will find a lot of those missing features in the Asus and if you don't like the OS there is a Ubuntu Linux Rom that works great now for the Transformer. Just a suggestion, I know a lot of laptop users who bought the iPad expecting a similar experience only to find out that it's nothing like it. The iPad was never intended to replace a normal computer, I don't no why people try in the first place.

  • Reply 38 of 44
    fredaroonyfredaroony Posts: 619member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post


     


    Do you re~ally want to go down this road? image



    Happy to hear some examples instead of vague child like comments.

  • Reply 39 of 44
    tallest skiltallest skil Posts: 43,399member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by fredaroony View Post

    Happy to hear some examples instead of vague child like comments.


     


    Of course you would. Dell is consistently at or near the bottom in ratings for hardware, software, and customer service, regardless of where you look for ratings.

  • Reply 40 of 44
    fredaroonyfredaroony Posts: 619member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post


     


    Of course you would. Dell is consistently at or near the bottom in ratings for hardware, software, and customer service, regardless of where you look for ratings.



    Ahh so you don't actually have any proof but just vague accusations? Although I don't own any Dell gear as all mine is Apple, minus my phone, I use them at my work and to say they are "crap" is just juvenile. 

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