Most of the competition, (which is to say thermostats with all the same features but butt ugly and made out of plastic with a crappy LCD screen), are about $150.00. So in fact this is priced just like many Apple products, a 50-60%% or so premium over what a middle range alternative would be.
Go to Lowes.com and search for thermostat. Programmable thermostats as low as about $40.
The thing I don't understand about the Nest is the marketing. All the materials and the picture on the box show "70" (degrees) when pretty much every country in the world has been using Celcius forever.
If you are going to sell a product world-wide, to put an obviously weird US-only temperature on the box is a bad choice. Stupid people are going to think it's a meat thermometer because a 70 degree temperature would normally be deadly. Whereas those who understand that it means 70 degrees Fahrenheit are going to be slightly insulted.
It's such a completely unnecessary blunder to make on the box art.
That assumes that they use the same box worldwide.
Woodlink, I have been reading this site for years and never posted once. But I was so outraged, by your snotty comment implying we have no energy reserves and how it relates to this device, I had to reply.
1) Google the Bakken oil reserves. There are at a minimum of 4.3 BILLION barrels of recoverable oil and more recent estimates put it at 24 BILLION BARRELS. This is at only one location not including the western slope and other areas.
2) We have so much natural Gas we can be an exporter to the world with more energy than Saudi Arabia and Iran combined.
3) I took my family up to Santa Barbra California a few years back. As we walked the beach we found what looked like balls of tar in the sand. Was there an oil spill? No, there is so much oil it is literally oozing up from the ocean floor. Incredibly they are unable to go after it due to a drilling moratorium. This moratorium was put in place by environmentalist. I guess if your an environmentalist, better to let it wash ashore than put it to good use. Please google for more information and you will find locals that are outraged by this policy.
4) The Obama administration is doing all that it can to block the pipe line to bring the Bakken and Canadian oil to market. Why? To drive the price up and make renewables competitive. You will find the secretary of energy publicly stating so.
Thus what the other commentator said was correct. Energy prices will fall dramatically if Obama is defeated. If this happens we will finally get our economy moving again.
Woodlink you should not laugh at others because it is your profound ignorance that is the joke!
Just because someone doesn't agree with you doesn't make them ignorant or stupid.
There are plenty of reasons to be concerned about our energy usage:
- Balance of trade. We have a trade deficit of hundreds of billions of dollars with energy being a major factor. That causes great harm to our economy.
- Pollution. Look at many southern cities in the summer and the number of ozone alert days.
- Healh care. Consider how much money we spend on health care for asthma and other breathing diseases at least partially caused by burning hydrocarbons
- Military costs spent defending our energy sources in the middle east.
- Pure waste. Most studies show that we could easily reduce our energy usage by 20-30% without having any impact on GNP or lifestyle. That's an enormous amount of money being wasted.
- Global warming. While a lot of 'drill, baby, drill' people ignore the science, 97% of climate scientists and the national academies of science of every major country agree that we are damaging our climate.
- Getting energy out of Bakken is far less efficient than ever before. At one time, it took you the energy of a barrel of oil to get about 20-40 barrels out of the ground. With Bakken, it's down to about 4:1 - and declining.
so the 'ignorant' one is the one who simply thinks that the solution to our energy problems are found in the Bakken reserves
First I would like to say I like the nest device and plan on being several for my properties. I just need to know if I can control it remotely. Secondly I apologize to all the readers out there that dislike politics in these forums. But I can no longer stand idly by and allow false hoods to continue. So no need to read on unless you enjoy political debate.
Now for "Jragosta"
Quote:
Just because someone doesn't agree with you doesn't make them ignorant or stupid.
If you think that way then why at the end of your comment do you imply I am.
Quote:
Balance of trade. We have a trade deficit of hundreds of billions of dollars with energy being a major factor. That causes great harm to our economy.
As I stated we have plenty of energy in North America to meet our needs. I even stated just a few places. So I believe you just made my point!
Quote:
Health care. Consider how much money we spend on health care for asthma and other breathing diseases at least partially caused by burning hydrocarbons
Are you actually asserting asthma is caused by the burning of hydrocarbons? Or are you suggesting that it may aggravate it? It may indeed make it worse but not the root cause. Thus the sooner we bring our natural gas online the better for all.
Quote:
Military costs spent defending our energy sources in the middle east.
Again you just made my point we have plenty of energy here if we are allowed to go get it. Let's use our own local energy.
Quote:
Pure waste. Most studies show that we could easily reduce our energy usage by 20-30% without having any impact on GNP or lifestyle. That's an enormous amount of money being wasted.
By what measure? What may be considered waste to some may not be to others. That being said, items like Nest's thermostat maybe of significant help in those areas where there is waste. In your reply please site your source so I may know what they are referencing. I have a hard time imagining we are wasting 20 to 30% of our oil imports. People and business typically don't burn money like that.
Quote:
Global warming. While a lot of 'drill, baby, drill' people ignore the science, 97% of climate scientists and the national academies of science of every major country agree that we are damaging our climate.
That is a flat out lie! Care to site your source of 97% climate scientists.
Quote:
Getting energy out of Bakken is far less efficient than ever before. At one time, it took you the energy of a barrel of oil to get about 20-40 barrels out of the ground. With Bakken, it's down to about 4:1 - and declining.
I don't know this to be true please site your source.
Quote:
so the 'ignorant' one is the one who simply thinks that the solution to our energy problems are found in the Bakken reserves
What about your opening statement? "Just because someone doesn't agree with you doesn't make them ignorant or stupid."
Further please read my entire comment. I mentioned natural gas, off shore oil, Canadian and Western slope just to name a few places not just the Bakken.
Jragosta and woodlink, you are entitled to your opinions but if you don't know something just don't make stuff up. Simply because you heard it somewhere before or is politically correct.
Good luck to you both and as you grow older and wise I think your opinions will shift greatly.
If true, I think this would actually be a brilliant move. This thing is getting alot of attention and praise from the media and from the tech community. Now, that positivity it will be associated with Apple, and instead of being portrayed as something to compete with Apple's innovation and aesthetic, it will be seen as being embraced and supported by Apple. Not only that, but will get many people who are going to purchase it into an Apple store.
4) The Obama administration is doing all that it can to block the pipe line to bring the Bakken and Canadian oil to market. Why? To drive the price up and make renewables competitive.
You're ignorance is amazing. It was blocked because there wasn't enough time to evaluate the suggested alternative path. The pipeline is still in the works. I can see you must watch Fox news all day long and complaining that you lost your job pumping gas @ $8/hr.
Secondly I apologize to all the readers out there that dislike politics in these forums. But I can no longer stand idly by and allow false hoods to continue. So no need to read on unless you enjoy political debate.
Are you actually asserting asthma is caused by the burning of hydrocarbons? Or are you suggesting that it may aggravate it? It may indeed make it worse but not the root cause. Thus the sooner we bring our natural gas online the better for all.
I never suggested that asthma was caused by burning fossil fuels. But burning of fossil fuels clearly makes it worse.
Again you just made my point we have plenty of energy here if we are allowed to go get it. Let's use our own local energy.
And the energy you are advocating has negative consequences. I'm not advocating anything except that ALL factors should be considered in making an energy decision. In evaluating our energy usage as a society, we should be considering all the externalities (look it up).
By what measure? What may be considered waste to some may not be to others. That being said, items like Nest's thermostat maybe of significant help in those areas where there is waste. In your reply please site your source so I may know what they are referencing. I have a hard time imagining we are wasting 20 to 30% of our oil imports. People and business typically don't burn money like that. </p>
Based on my company's experience. We have customers in a wide enough range of markets that it is fairly representative. Out of several hundred customers, every one has reduced their energy usage by 10-30% - and that's only the low-hanging fruit since we select projects that pay for themselves in 1-3 years (average about 18 months). If we chose to implement all projects with a 3 year payback, the total savings would actually be over 30%.l
I was going from memory. The actual numbers are:
(in each case, the number is the ratio of energy recovered to energy input)
US Oil production 1970 --- 30
US Oil production today --- 15
Oil sands --- 3
Oil shale --- 3.5 to under 2
I have one, bought it last fall. It has saved me a fortune in Heating and Cooling costs. Love the new 2.0 update. Funny how many people are knocking this product when they have no idea what it is actually capable of doing.
Comments
Go to Lowes.com and search for thermostat. Programmable thermostats as low as about $40.
That assumes that they use the same box worldwide.
Just because someone doesn't agree with you doesn't make them ignorant or stupid.
There are plenty of reasons to be concerned about our energy usage:
- Balance of trade. We have a trade deficit of hundreds of billions of dollars with energy being a major factor. That causes great harm to our economy.
- Pollution. Look at many southern cities in the summer and the number of ozone alert days.
- Healh care. Consider how much money we spend on health care for asthma and other breathing diseases at least partially caused by burning hydrocarbons
- Military costs spent defending our energy sources in the middle east.
- Pure waste. Most studies show that we could easily reduce our energy usage by 20-30% without having any impact on GNP or lifestyle. That's an enormous amount of money being wasted.
- Global warming. While a lot of 'drill, baby, drill' people ignore the science, 97% of climate scientists and the national academies of science of every major country agree that we are damaging our climate.
- Getting energy out of Bakken is far less efficient than ever before. At one time, it took you the energy of a barrel of oil to get about 20-40 barrels out of the ground. With Bakken, it's down to about 4:1 - and declining.
so the 'ignorant' one is the one who simply thinks that the solution to our energy problems are found in the Bakken reserves
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta
Just because someone doesn't agree with you doesn't make them ignorant or stupid.
You don't seriously believe that do you? That seems like such an odd statement judging by your last five thousand or so posts.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gazoobee
All the materials and the picture on the box show "70" (degrees) when pretty much every country in the world has been using Celcius forever.
If you are going to sell a product world-wide…
But are they? Does it even work worldwide?
First I would like to say I like the nest device and plan on being several for my properties. I just need to know if I can control it remotely. Secondly I apologize to all the readers out there that dislike politics in these forums. But I can no longer stand idly by and allow false hoods to continue. So no need to read on unless you enjoy political debate.
Now for "Jragosta"
Quote:
Just because someone doesn't agree with you doesn't make them ignorant or stupid.
If you think that way then why at the end of your comment do you imply I am.
Quote:
Balance of trade. We have a trade deficit of hundreds of billions of dollars with energy being a major factor. That causes great harm to our economy.
As I stated we have plenty of energy in North America to meet our needs. I even stated just a few places. So I believe you just made my point!
Quote:
Health care. Consider how much money we spend on health care for asthma and other breathing diseases at least partially caused by burning hydrocarbons
Are you actually asserting asthma is caused by the burning of hydrocarbons? Or are you suggesting that it may aggravate it? It may indeed make it worse but not the root cause. Thus the sooner we bring our natural gas online the better for all.
Quote:
Military costs spent defending our energy sources in the middle east.
Again you just made my point we have plenty of energy here if we are allowed to go get it. Let's use our own local energy.
Quote:
Pure waste. Most studies show that we could easily reduce our energy usage by 20-30% without having any impact on GNP or lifestyle. That's an enormous amount of money being wasted.
By what measure? What may be considered waste to some may not be to others. That being said, items like Nest's thermostat maybe of significant help in those areas where there is waste. In your reply please site your source so I may know what they are referencing. I have a hard time imagining we are wasting 20 to 30% of our oil imports. People and business typically don't burn money like that.
Quote:
Global warming. While a lot of 'drill, baby, drill' people ignore the science, 97% of climate scientists and the national academies of science of every major country agree that we are damaging our climate.
That is a flat out lie! Care to site your source of 97% climate scientists.
Quote:
Getting energy out of Bakken is far less efficient than ever before. At one time, it took you the energy of a barrel of oil to get about 20-40 barrels out of the ground. With Bakken, it's down to about 4:1 - and declining.
I don't know this to be true please site your source.
Quote:
so the 'ignorant' one is the one who simply thinks that the solution to our energy problems are found in the Bakken reserves
What about your opening statement? "Just because someone doesn't agree with you doesn't make them ignorant or stupid."
Further please read my entire comment. I mentioned natural gas, off shore oil, Canadian and Western slope just to name a few places not just the Bakken.
Jragosta and woodlink, you are entitled to your opinions but if you don't know something just don't make stuff up. Simply because you heard it somewhere before or is politically correct.
Good luck to you both and as you grow older and wise I think your opinions will shift greatly.
If true, I think this would actually be a brilliant move. This thing is getting alot of attention and praise from the media and from the tech community. Now, that positivity it will be associated with Apple, and instead of being portrayed as something to compete with Apple's innovation and aesthetic, it will be seen as being embraced and supported by Apple. Not only that, but will get many people who are going to purchase it into an Apple store.
Quote:
Originally Posted by First viceroy
4) The Obama administration is doing all that it can to block the pipe line to bring the Bakken and Canadian oil to market. Why? To drive the price up and make renewables competitive.
You're ignorance is amazing. It was blocked because there wasn't enough time to evaluate the suggested alternative path. The pipeline is still in the works. I can see you must watch Fox news all day long and complaining that you lost your job pumping gas @ $8/hr.
Let's please keep the politicking out of here… There's zero reason for it to be in this thread.
You are in no position to be discussing climate science if you can't even use Google.
Good. Then stop lying.
Where did I do that? I implied no such thing.
OTOH, it IS clear that you are spreading falsehoods.
Where did I do that? I simply pointed out that there are negative consequences to the way we use energy that the "drill, baby, drill" people ignore.
I never suggested that asthma was caused by burning fossil fuels. But burning of fossil fuels clearly makes it worse.
And the energy you are advocating has negative consequences. I'm not advocating anything except that ALL factors should be considered in making an energy decision. In evaluating our energy usage as a society, we should be considering all the externalities (look it up).
Based on my company's experience. We have customers in a wide enough range of markets that it is fairly representative. Out of several hundred customers, every one has reduced their energy usage by 10-30% - and that's only the low-hanging fruit since we select projects that pay for themselves in 1-3 years (average about 18 months). If we chose to implement all projects with a 3 year payback, the total savings would actually be over 30%.l
Flat out lie? Hardly:
http://junksciencecom.files.wordpress.com/2011/09/pnas-2010-anderegg-1003187107-1.pdf
Or try:
http://nationalacademies.org/onpi/06072005.pdf
So where's your evidence?
I'll dig it up when I get a minute.
I never said that it did. But posting completely inaccurate statements and then pretending that I said things that I didn't say does.
Here it is.
http://www.evworld.com/syndicated/evworld_article_1900.cfm
I was going from memory. The actual numbers are:
(in each case, the number is the ratio of energy recovered to energy input)
US Oil production 1970 --- 30
US Oil production today --- 15
Oil sands --- 3
Oil shale --- 3.5 to under 2
Quote:
Originally Posted by ascii
Perhaps you want to look in to the causes of the recent Seaway pipeline reversal.
my comment was that this country has no clue what to do on energy...
doesn't matter if we could drill THROUGH the Earth and suck crude oil from under the Middle East...
meanwhile, Obama will continue to tour bankrupt solar panel making companies.
I have one, bought it last fall. It has saved me a fortune in Heating and Cooling costs. Love the new 2.0 update. Funny how many people are knocking this product when they have no idea what it is actually capable of doing.