Apple exec suggests new iMacs may not come till 2013

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  • Reply 101 of 169
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 12,787member
    Please don't make excuses for Apples behavior here.
    gazoobee wrote: »
    I think you're going way over the top here in your criticism.  The fact is an iMac from three generations ago is still a fast, powerful machine even for things like video editing and graphics.  the new ones are faster and it would be great to get a new one every year but to say that it's a "grave mistake" is just silly.  Most people use a computer to browse the web and type a few documents.  Even in business the most use they will get is a large spreadsheet or two.  Even an iMac from the very beginning of the aluminium models (generations ago) is still more than sufficient for that.  
  • Reply 102 of 169
    drblankdrblank Posts: 3,383member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by 26Chrisr View Post


    To be perfectly honest, anyone buying a iMac today is being ripped off by Apple PERIOD.


     


    Since the May 2011 iMac appeared, the cost of its components have dropped substantially, particularly the CPU, RAM, GPU and LCD panel - given the Apple premium is already 30% on all their  desktops at launch, that means today anyone one purchasing the iMac is giving 50% of the price to Apple directly in profit.


     


    The company has no excuses, its a blatant rip-off and the fools purchasing 18 month old technology don't have much of a clue - they are but shinny toys to go with their iOS toys.


     


    All desktop users are asking for - that's those of us who making both a living and enjoy leisure time on their Mac's - is a slight revision of the existing product and not a new Steve Ive inspired re-design.


     


    Surely, it is not too difficult to make the leap to Ivy Bridge and a new GPU - perhaps with additional RAM and larger HDD in top end model.


     


    Judging by the Mac Pro revision, it appears Apple are giving us the finger - 



    You know what?  I think you should buy a Dell or an HP, or better yet, go buy an Acer leave Appleinsider because it sounds like you aren't the type of person that Apple needs or even wants as a customer.   If I was Apple and I found out who you were, I walk over to your business with a BRAND new Dell hunk of junk, take your Apple away from you and give you a restraining order to buy anything from Apple ever again.  Yes, component prices go down, but guess what shipping costs have gone up, labor costs have gone up and other things have gone up, the dollar has been devalued.  They aren't making a TON of money on desktops in the first place.  Do you think Aluminum prices have gone down?  Seriously, these things are not high mark up like software and they aren't ripping you off for software updates like Microsoft is, are they? NO. $30 or now $20 for a major OS release rather than what MS charges.  You really need to understand the cost of doing business before you open your mouth.  OR better yet, make your own PC and Operating System and see how far you get.  GO to Fry's or some component Build it Yourself computer parts store and make your own computer.


     


    When Apple buys components they typically do YEARLY purchases or some kind of BIG contract.  If a particular component price drops significantly below what they bought it under their contract, they don't always get automatic price protection.  OK?  So, when they made their contract for 1333DDR memory, it was done at the time when they initiated the contract. IF the price of memory dropped because memory companies are dumping memory, Apple, just most other computer mfg don't always get price protection.  Now, if you don't want to understand this, then no one can help you.  If you feel the product is too expensive, then buy something else.  Computer hardware is not, nor will it ever be high margin products.  

  • Reply 103 of 169
    drblankdrblank Posts: 3,383member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by drblank View Post


    You know what?  I think you should buy a Dell or an HP, or better yet, go buy an Acer leave Appleinsider because it sounds like you aren't the type of person that Apple needs or even wants as a customer.   If I was Apple and I found out who you were, I walk over to your business with a BRAND new Dell hunk of junk, take your Apple away from you and give you a restraining order to buy anything from Apple ever again.  Yes, component prices go down, but guess what shipping costs have gone up, labor costs have gone up and other things have gone up, the dollar has been devalued.  They aren't making a TON of money on desktops in the first place.  Do you think Aluminum prices have gone down?  Seriously, these things are not high mark up like software and they aren't ripping you off for software updates like Microsoft is, are they? NO. $30 or now $20 for a major OS release rather than what MS charges.  You really need to understand the cost of doing business before you open your mouth.  OR better yet, make your own PC and Operating System and see how far you get.  GO to Fry's or some component Build it Yourself computer parts store and make your own computer.


     


    When Apple buys components they typically do YEARLY purchases or some kind of BIG contract.  If a particular component price drops significantly below what they bought it under their contract, they don't always get automatic price protection.  OK?  So, when they made their contract for 1333DDR memory, it was done at the time when they initiated the contract. IF the price of memory dropped because memory companies are dumping memory, Apple, just most other computer mfg don't always get price protection.  Now, if you don't want to understand this, then no one can help you.  If you feel the product is too expensive, then buy something else.  Computer hardware is not, nor will it ever be high margin products.  


     


    Maybe Apple can't get enough 8 core processors from Intel yet and they want to add some other features and a product redesign because the new processors demand new fans that have to be made, or some other chips haven't shipped or whatever the case may be.  You don't know, I don't know and until Apple releases a redesign or tells us then we don't know.  We can only guess. But Apple is not intentionally giving anyone the finger.  That's just plain dumb reasoning.  Sorry, but that is just plain dumb.


  • Reply 104 of 169
    gwmacgwmac Posts: 1,796member


    Screw the Xeon. If Intel can't get their act together and make a Xeon compatible with thunderbolt or USB3, then Apple should release a brand new computer just like they did yesterday with the retina Macbook. I have the perfect name for it. Mac simply call it a Mac. It would  include a high end quad or maybe hex core i7, a modern GPU, thunderbolt, USB3, two drive bays at a minimum, one open PCIx slot. Once Intel get their act together with a Xeon, you can continue the Mac Pro line, but keep the Mac Pro as only a dual CPU system. You could choose between 4, 6, or 8 cores per CPU.  No more single CPU option for the Mac Pro since the new Mac would fill that need. There really is no advantage to a single CPU Mac using a Xeon over a Core i7. 


     


    The core i7 Mac would satisfy a lot of people yearning for a new and up to date workhorse Mac. This new extreme edition would be perfect. Yeah it is pricey at about $999 but so are the Xeons. Apple could also offer two less expensive options. But a mac with a high end i7 would satisfy a lot of people disappointed that there was no Mac Pro update. The iMac can never use the fastest CPU or GPU because of thermal issues.  


     


    http://ark.intel.com/products/64887/Intel-Core-i7-3920XM-Processor-Extreme-Edition-(8M-Cache-up-to-3_80-GHz)

  • Reply 105 of 169
    asciiascii Posts: 5,941member


    I personally think the Mac Pro is finished. I think there will be another iMac, they are just waiting a month or two, so as to let people focus on the new hotness.


     


    Long term, maybe they want us to use laptops with external monitors, or just AirPlay to our HDTV if we want a big screen.

  • Reply 106 of 169
    conrailconrail Posts: 489member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Marvin View Post



    There is no job in 2012 you can do on a Mac Pro that you cannot do on a Macbook Pro


    Awesome!  Where do I plug this in?  http://www.blackmagic-design.com/products/decklinkhdextreme/

  • Reply 107 of 169
    eksodoseksodos Posts: 186member


    The current iMac really is an incredibly powerful machine. I don't think consumers are crying out for faster processors in them. It's all about that gorgeous display that just dominates the product.

  • Reply 108 of 169
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 12,787member
    taugust04 wrote: »
    Wow, there is a lot of over-reaction to the minimal Mac Pro refresh, and the lack of an iMac refresh. With every quarter that goes by, there is an increasing percentage of laptop vs desktop sales. Apple is simply dedicating their resources to where the profits are, which are iOS devices and Mac laptops.
    Resources? Are you nuts, they have over $100 billion in the bank, hey could afford an iMac, Mini and Pro refresh. Oh it is not an over reaction to say that the Pro refresh is a joke. More precisely it is an insult to the Mac Pro community.
    That being said, I don't think desktops are going anywhere, and the lack of a refresh doesn't point to that. The iMac and Mac Pro are relatively stable and mature platforms, as most of the desktop PC industry is as a whole. Intel's roadmap's for desktop CPU's have also been 'slowing down' as of late as well, which could partially explain the longer refresh cycle of the iMac.
    Oh come on, we all know Ivy Bridge is out. While it certainly offers little in the way of performance gains the support for USB 3 is important to iMac users.
    The other question to ask, is, does Intel have a Xeon capable chipset available that supports Thunderbolt and USB 3.0? If the answer is no, then, that answer helps partially explain why the Mac Pro was just speed-bumped today and not much else.
    So explain the video card! More so is it that difficult for Apple to write a driver for a third party USB 3 chip? Mind you it has been over two years now.
    Apple didn't take the plunge on USB 3.0 on their mobile computers until Intel had the integrated chipset available to make it so. Although they are doing a lot of customization in the iOS hardware area, and in the power management of their mobile computers, one thing Apple has not been doing is spending a lot of resources on customizing chipsets for their desktops and laptops. Most are based on reference designs and chipsets from Intel, and I wouldn't expect that to change any time soon.
    Well that is in part garbage because some of Apples IP is in the laptops. However if your primary supplier is failing, isn't it about time to look for a third party.
    As mobile computers become faster and more powerful, they are increasingly becoming part of the 'pro' workflow. I think the new MBP with Retina Display is a testament to that. The new model may not be a mainstream bestseller due to pricing, but, it's going to sell will in the pro and pro-sumer markets that need the additional horsepower and features the new model offers.
    Actually I suspect Apple will have a huge backlog. I'm objective enough to see the retina MBP as a very compelling machine. However it is not a desktop machine nor can it effectively compete with one.
    I would expect Mac laptops continue to be refreshed on a yearly basis, since the technology is continuing to improve at a faster rate than in the desktop segment of the market. The iMac and Mac Mini will probably go to a 12-18 month cycle.
    You do realize that the Mini uses the same laptop chips that you claim are improving so damn fast!!! The fact is Ivy Bridge is exactly what the Mini needs to make it a more vible platform.
    The Mac Pro may go two years between major technology refreshes, with only speed bumps in between. I think it's more telling that the Mac Pro did not get discontinued today (as the 17" MacBook Pro did), than the minimal refresh to the line. The fact it's still in the product line means Apple is still getting enough sales to justify still running the factories to produce them.
    Do you really think anybody would be buying the Mac Pro as it is now unless they had no choice? What today's non releases tells us is that Apple doesn't give a damn about the desktop. If the rumors about no iMacs until 2013 are true it also indicates a disdain for their customers.
    Otherwise, they would be in the Apple product graveyard.
    My prediction: expect an iMac refresh in the fall, and a Mac Pro refresh in 2013.

    So you think it is wise and proper for Apple to continue to sell grossly outdated iMacs to their customers when the hardware solutions exist to modernize the machines? Is it good for customer relations to say you can't have a desktop with USB 3 because we are to damn lazy to build one? Frankly I don't care if the product would only be on the market for six months until the current iMacs replacement cones. For me it is a question of ethics. If Apple advertised the iMac as their antique computer that would be one thing but they don't do that. Instead it is offered up as a modern computer which it isn't anymore.
  • Reply 109 of 169
    nvidia2008nvidia2008 Posts: 9,262member


    2012: Quiet iMac speed bump.


    2013: 26" iMac Retina.

  • Reply 110 of 169
    nvidia2008nvidia2008 Posts: 9,262member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by eksodos View Post


    The current iMac really is an incredibly powerful machine. I don't think consumers are crying out for faster processors in them. It's all about that gorgeous display that just dominates the product.



     


    Certainly a Retina iMac will be "the pro desktop workstation" for 2013. This way Apple streamlines the Mac line. They have "legacy" stuff like Mac Pro, Mac Mini, old iMac and old Macbook Pro, which is replaced by MacBook Air, Retina MBP and within the next 1.5 years Retina iMac. 


     


    In Apple's case the momentum is all iPhone and iPad. Macs and OS X won't be going anywhere, it's a key part but I imagine Apple wants to streamline it to "the computer you're going to buy if you're not buying a phone or tablet". Hence Retina MBP and Retina iMac.


     


    Interestingly before the keyonte last night I used my Apple Bluetooth Keyboard with my Retina iPad for the first time. It hit me how killer it was. An actual full-fledged computer with a Retina display? Indescribable. 


     


    And you can bet your bottom dollar in China and Asia anyone who's anyone (aka everybody trying to gain status aka almost everyone) will be gunning purely for the MBA, Retina MBP or in 2013 Retina iMac.

  • Reply 111 of 169
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 12,787member
    I really hope so but it doesn't look promising.
    bregalad wrote: »
    There may be major changes to the desktop lineup next year, but I'm still confident that Apple will update the iMac and Mac mini next month when Mountain Lion ships.

    The following is based simply on the current lineup and chips that are available. I have no inside information.

    >>>>>don't care about the current iMac design.

    MiniCore i5 3210M (2.5GHz), Intel 4000 graphics

    MiniCore i5 3320M (2.6GHz), nVidia GeForce GT 640M LE - optional Core i7 3520M (2.9GHz)

    MiniCore i7 3612QM (2.1GHz), Intel 4000 graphics

    Server

    I was actually hoping for a bit more of a performance gain. I also dislike the marketing of the machine as a server. Make a quad core mainstream.

    Beyond that though I want to see other updates to the Mini. First would be the use of a Blade SSD for boot and apps without loosing the space for conventional drives. The other thing is support fort more RAM. It is a given that the other Ivy Bridge features like USB 3 would be supported.

    As to the quad core machine I'd like to see the ability to support higher wattage processors so that we can sustain higher clock rates. Actually I'd like to see quad core move into the lower end model.
  • Reply 112 of 169
    crunchcrunch Posts: 180member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by melgross View Post




    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Kolchak View Post



    You know what else makes it look like Apple doesn't care about the pro line anymore? The industrial design. The "cheese grater" case has been around how long now? Almost exactly nine years, with the introduction of the PowerMac G5. Apple has never kept any design for any other computer around that long. It's not like it's a great design, either. Bulky, with those curved handles. Ridiculously heavy thanks to the heavy gauge aluminum. And to my eyes, butt ugly. Sure is less elegant than the simple and sleek Quicksilver (but similarly bulky) PowerMac G4. Granted, the internals are very neatly laid out and getting to them is easier than with PC towers. But to be absolutely honest, a very dated design.




    Not really.


     


    Not really motion seconded.

  • Reply 113 of 169
    crunchcrunch Posts: 180member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Conrail View Post




    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Marvin View Post



    There is no job in 2012 you can do on a Mac Pro that you cannot do on a Macbook Pro


    Awesome!  Where do I plug this in?  http://www.blackmagic-design.com/products/decklinkhdextreme/



     


    Into a Thunderbolt port as soon as Blackmagic gets their head out of their.....

  • Reply 114 of 169
    drblankdrblank Posts: 3,383member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post





    Actually I've been asking for years that question, why oesnt Apple make a good keyboard.

    Please don't let Apples marketing BS blind you to the current situation.


     


     


    Wizard, so the MacPro isn't where people want it to be, but I am sure in good time, they'll announce a new version to satisfy those that want USB 3, Thunderbolt, E5 chips, etc.  Show me ONE SINGLE Windows laptop that has Thunderbolt (which, BTW, is way better than USB 3), has a 5K display in a case that is aluminum, that is less than .75 inches thick, that weight less than 4.5 lbs?  I'll wait for your answer.  Until then, Apple will release products when they can and you decide to buy it or not.  Right now, they can't release any major releases for whatever reason and the thing is, these hardware companies can't redesign their top end systems every 6 months.  They'll lose money if they do that.


     


    If you have a MacPro and NEED USB 3, here's a link for you.  http://eshop.macsales.com/item/CalDigit/U3HOSTADPTR/?utm_source=google&utm_medium=shoppingengine&utm_campaign=googlebase&gclid=CM_RgamKybACFccBRQodnh_AZA


     


    IF you need other upgrades for the MacPro, go to OtherWorldComputing because they might have some interim solution for you. 

  • Reply 115 of 169
    gwmacgwmac Posts: 1,796member


    Out of curiosity, how many people here wanting a new mac Pro were considering the single CPU option? And if so, would you be happy with a slightly smaller Mac Pro that included thunderbolt, USB3, a modern GPU and something like this as the CPU. http://ark.intel.com/products/64887/Intel-Core-i7-3920XM-Processor-Extreme-Edition-(8M-Cache-up-to-3_80-GHz)


     


    When Apple chose to go exclusively with Xeons in the Mac Pro it made sense. Not so much anymore if they are going to be 2 years or more behind the core line for supporting key technologies like USB3 and thunderbolt. If even AMD can offer support for thunderbolt which was invented by Intel, why can't Intel do the same for Xeon? It just doesn't make any sense. Maybe Apple should partner with AMD and their 12 core opterons to build a new Mac Pro in the same way they switch between nvidia and AMD for GPU's. It is not like Apple is getting any advantage from being the only maker exclusive to Intel. All those Windows ultrabook commercials Intel pays for proves that Intel shows no loyalty to Apple. 

  • Reply 116 of 169


    No new iMacs was a very sad disappointment.  No acknowledgment of the Mac Pro upgrade, and half baked upgrade at that, was equally as bad.  It could have been a major presentation coup had they upgraded their entire line up at once, and in my opinion, spurred sales from great headlines.  Quite the big splash opportunity for Tim Cook.  For what ever reason, the lack of announcements are sorely disappointing to us mac fans.  The Mac Pro non announcement and weak upgrade, as stated above, delivers a very poor message to consumers.  To me it says, "we don't care about this product line. We have spent 2 years doing virtually nothing to it.  We are not even going to bother to give it thunderbolt, something available on even our cheapest computers".  So as a Mac Pro owner this comes as a complete slap in the face by apple.  A pro machine, used by many graphics people who move huge files from major external drives and no thunderbolt, no usb3?  Yet both these ports are on a 999$ mac book air??!!!  Wow apple, you really really don't care about your high end users willing to spend $4K on one of your machines!  A very sad showing for a great company!  

  • Reply 117 of 169
    isheldonisheldon Posts: 570member
    Get rid of this glossy piece of iMac dung already.
    Jonny can you hear me?
  • Reply 118 of 169
    gwmacgwmac Posts: 1,796member


    I have heard a lot of talk about the E5 series, but the E3 is an Ivy Bridge Xeon that is now shipping. Why was the E3 never an option for a Mac Pro?


     


    http://ark.intel.com/products/series/53495

  • Reply 119 of 169
    mstonemstone Posts: 11,510member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Crunch View Post


     


    Into a Thunderbolt port as soon as Blackmagic gets their head out of their.....



    Yeah right. Black Magic makes some of the best gear out there and it is mostly platform independent Windows, Mac & Linux. Accusing them of head up ass is about as far off the mark as you could possibly be.

  • Reply 120 of 169
    drblankdrblank Posts: 3,383member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Conrail View Post


    Awesome!  Where do I plug this in?  http://www.blackmagic-design.com/products/decklinkhdextreme/



    I think he didn't realize that you need PCI slots.  Can you do with a 12 core system that they have now?  What is it that you need that the current MacPro can't do? I am just curious.

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