Hard to know where to start with an abomination like the Mini. First thing Apple needs to do is wipe the slate clean and design a desktop computer to replace what is actually a headless iBook.
Start by building the new Mini around a desktop quad core Ivy Bridge i5 with CTO option for a quad core i7 with hyperthreading. Add three PCIe slots, with one occupied by a full length video card. Build the case so that access to the drive bays is as simple and quick as with the Mac Pro, and add two full sized drive bays. Boot drive is a mini-PCIe SSD similar to what's used on the MacBooks, so those two drive bays can be used for data, time machine, backups, etc.
Just because it isn't small doesn't mean it can't be cool. Ive can work his magic on the case, but above all keep the components standard issue desktop parts so the cost remains low and Apple gets their phat profit margins. Keep the ports accessable. That means USB ports in front so users don't have to turn the damn thing around to plug in a flash drive. Use enough fans to keep it quiet without running the CPU at ungodly temperatures.
The current Mini is worthless, terminate it with extreme prejudice.
Suppose there is no new mini this year. When do the Haswell mobile processors come out? Q2 2013 or Q1?
They are most likely late Q2 2013. Lack of a mini is extremely unlikely. This would put it on a 2 year refresh when the current hardware should be pin compatible. It costs them very little to keep it up to date. It's not like we're in October with Haswell coming out in January or February. There is an imminent refresh due here.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Junkyard Dawg
Start by building the new Mini around a desktop quad core Ivy Bridge i5 with CTO option for a quad core i7 with hyperthreading. Add three PCIe slots, with one occupied by a full length video card. Build the case so that access to the drive bays is as simple and quick as with the Mac Pro, and add two full sized drive bays. Boot drive is a mini-PCIe SSD similar to what's used on the MacBooks, so those two drive bays can be used for data, time machine, backups, etc.
I'd expect embedded graphics to become more prevalent in future years. I don't see a mini being built to accommodate such a gpu.
Quote:
Originally Posted by wizard69
Further coming high speed RAM standard don't support anything but soldering to the motherboard to assure signal integrity.
Funny but I seldom here of documented RAM failures from respectable RAM vendors.
as to RAM upgrades these days you can buy a machine up front with enough RAM. By the time you need a justifiable RAM upgrade it makes more sense to buy a new machine.
This is a Mac Forum where we are talking about Mac OS. I really don't care about the problems with Windows.
I've been looking for information on future standards, but I haven't turned up much. Typically if you're purchasing quality ram, it's unlikely to go bad. It's still possible to end up with a bad stick out of the box, which is why I suggest memtest after installation. Some brands do consistently receive more complaints at some of the typical outlets.
Hard to know where to start with an abomination like the Mini. First thing Apple needs to do is wipe the slate clean and design a desktop computer to replace what is actually a headless iBook.
Or maybe they've kept it around and in the form it has been since its creation because it sells well like that and serves the needs of a large number of people who understand why it exists, unlike you.
Start by building the new Mini around a desktop quad core Ivy Bridge i5 with CTO option for a quad core i7 with hyperthreading. Add three PCIe slots, with one occupied by a full length video card. Build the case so that access to the drive bays is as simple and quick as with the Mac Pro, and add two full sized drive bays.
Calling the Mac mini an abomination is a bit unfair I feel. Are there things to be improved on? Absolutely. Will they improve upon those things? Doubtable.
What anecdotal evidence? Beyond that proprietary evidence isn't needed, much is publicly known about the science of reliability.
As to the perfection of solder, nothing is perfect! However industry has reached a high level of perfection when it comes to soldering. Baring some well know failures, surface mount technology and soldering in general has dramatically increased the general reliability of electronics.
The vast majority of electronic failures occur very early in a products life, so you are extremely likely to have a device run for a very long time if it doesn't fail during the warranty period.
Dealing with uneconomical repairs is a daily reality. It happens with automobiles, TVs refrigerators and a bunch of other things. An automobile has one hell of a lot more parts too.
It isn't lost it is rather not of a concern. One of the guys I work with repairs computers on the side. On many occasions he has had people decline simple repairs to instead give him the old machine to be replaced with a new one. You look on repair ability as an important consideration while others don't even bother.
Maybe maybe not. Comments are rather worthless unless they are quoting service reports. However HP is not the first nor the last to suffer a process failure.
How many iPhone failures involve RAM?
Because it is a waste of money, isn't reliable, connectors waste space and generally goes against the trend in shrinking electronics. Further coming high speed RAM standard don't support anything but soldering to the motherboard to assure signal integrity.
Funny but I seldom here of documented RAM failures from respectable RAM vendors.
as to RAM upgrades these days you can buy a machine up front with enough RAM. By the time you need a justifiable RAM upgrade it makes more sense to buy a new machine.
This is a Mac Forum where we are talking about Mac OS. I really don't care about the problems with Windows.
Are you really that obtuse? Bloatware takes away performance on any platform. It is not a problem unique to
Windows,now that you bring up the subject of Windows. Microsoft has simply been the dominant vendor of "office productivity suites". Without Microsoft's support of the Mac platform some years ago there is considerable doubt that Apple would have survived.
You dissemble in a meaningless way to no good end.
Start by building the new Mini around a desktop quad core Ivy Bridge i5 with CTO option for a quad core i7 with hyperthreading. Add three PCIe slots, with one occupied by a full length video card. Build the case so that access to the drive bays is as simple and quick as with the Mac Pro, and add two full sized drive bays. Boot drive is a mini-PCIe SSD similar to what's used on the MacBooks, so those two drive bays can be used for data, time machine, backups, etc.
Are you really that obtuse? Bloatware takes away performance on any platform. It is not a problem unique to
Windows,now that you bring up the subject of Windows. Microsoft has simply been the dominant vendor of "office productivity suites". Without Microsoft's support of the Mac platform some years ago there is considerable doubt that Apple would have survived.
You dissemble in a meaningless way to no good end.
Who here was discussing bloat ware? The discussion was about hardware and soldered in RAM.
Hard to know where to start with an abomination like the Mini. First thing Apple needs to do is wipe the slate clean and design a desktop computer to replace what is actually a headless iBook.
Well this is a little extreme, the Mini is an entry level machine which serves a purpose. In its current form it is just a little too little in overall capability.
Start by building the new Mini around a desktop quad core Ivy Bridge i5 with CTO option for a quad core i7 with hyperthreading. Add three PCIe slots, with one occupied by a full length video card. Build the case so that access to the drive bays is as simple and quick as with the Mac Pro, and add two full sized drive bays. Boot drive is a mini-PCIe SSD similar to what's used on the MacBooks, so those two drive bays can be used for data, time machine, backups, etc.
An interesting configuration. Though honestly I'd rather see a slightly different configuration in that the machine have more drive bays. Those drive bays could be laptop sized for all I care.
Just because it isn't small doesn't mean it can't be cool. Ive can work his magic on the case, but above all keep the components standard issue desktop parts so the cost remains low and Apple gets their phat profit margins. Keep the ports accessable. That means USB ports in front so users don't have to turn the damn thing around to plug in a flash drive. Use enough fans to keep it quiet without running the CPU at ungodly temperatures.
Well let's just say no to standard desktop parts, at least when talking power supplies.
The current Mini is worthless, terminate it with extreme prejudice.
Being a constant promoter of XMac even I see that as a bit extreme, it is a machine that has its place. When talking about XMac I'm not thinking tower either, that is the Mac Pros place. Frankly I see full size slots as a thing of the past though slots are still needed. In this case though there might be a division between internal and external slots with internal slots supporting fast SSD storage cards built around a new industry standard.
I have done my part to get the new mini to come out. I finally broke down and ordered upgrade parts (SSD, RAM, etc) for my old mini instead of waiting for any new machines.
Therefore we should get new desktops macs this tuesday.
That's part of what is making me grow some disdain for Apple. It would be nice for them to drop just a few vague hints every once in a while. To go to Apple.com and have them say "We have something cool planned for the fall for our Mac line. Stay tuned."
That's part of what is making me grow some disdain for Apple. It would be nice for them to drop just a few vague hints every once in a while. To go to Apple.com and have them say "We have something cool planned for the fall for our Mac line. Stay tuned."
Your disdain is completely foolish. You really want them to just give up sales?
Apple already does that. Every time there is a keynote and every time there is a quarterly earnings call, the executives will say "great new products coming up soon". They don't need to say diddly squat about anything more specific than that, nor should they.
Between those hints and the actual, known release dates of the chips themselves, we know that things are coming down the pike.
Between those hints and the actual, known release dates of the chips themselves, we know that things are coming down the pike.
They've really been pushing it this time. The mini shares a lot of parts with the macbook pro. It should be available by now. Either way expect another somewhat long refresh after this as you're unlikely to see a haswell mini prior to the second half of next year.
Your disdain is completely foolish. You really want them to just give up sales?
Apple already does that. Every time there is a keynote and every time there is a quarterly earnings call, the executives will say "great new products coming up soon". They don't need to say diddly squat about anything more specific than that, nor should they.
Between those hints and the actual, known release dates of the chips themselves, we know that things are coming down the pike.
I guess I admit I'm being impatient. It's probably because I don't have a whole lot going on in my life right thus I'm clamoring just to see an update so I can say "Oh cool that's what is in it and those are the options." Not to mention the lawsuit garbage with Samsung just pisses me off because it's almost like tabloid trash to me at the grocery store. I get that sites are obligated to report on it but is anyone actually interested in the day to day developments of he said she said?
History says what you want a tech company can't give. Read up on the Osborne Effect and the early history of personal computers. Pre announcing hardware to replace existing hardware has a chilling effect on sales. In a literal sense it has destroyed companies in the past.
I guess I admit I'm being impatient. It's probably because I don't have a whole lot going on in my life right thus I'm clamoring just to see an update
Take a vacation or find a loose woman. Seriously don't get wrapped in trivial things regarding a fruit company.
Frankly I'm extremely disappointed that Apple is jerking the Mini community around the way it is but I don't get overly involved in that reality. I realize that many things could be behind the delays including allocation from Intel. There is also the possibility that the Mini is dead.
so I can say "Oh cool that's what is in it and those are the options." Not to mention the lawsuit garbage with Samsung just pisses me off because it's almost like tabloid trash to me at the grocery store. I get that sites are obligated to report on it but is anyone actually interested in the day to day developments of he said she said?
Skip those articles then!
Your situation is no different than the clowns from the past that would read the negative articles in newspapers and then declare that the world is going to hell and the end is near. Obviously it isn't and if you want there are more positive things to be concerned with. It is unfortunate that we have a publication environment where money equals negative imagery. Even political success revolves around negativity these days. You as an individual can resist though.
There is also the possibility that the Mini is dead.
Sigh... You hit the nail on the head regarding the Osborne Effect, then add this gratuitous silliness. Sure, technically, there is a possibility that the iPhone, iPad, and Mac are dead so that Apple can concentrate on iPods. However, like the dead Mini idea, the possibility is so remote that's silly to bring it up. The Mac Mini will be dead when either the Mac is dead or desktops are dead. Apple will not kill the Mini just because it doesn't meet the needs of one curmudgeonly wizard.
An interesting read to be sure, some of the comments where hilarious. The problem is that Intel might have a very good desktop processor there but Apple has a history of putting crap into the Mini. Further the Mini simply doesn't meet the requirements of common desktop users thus the struggling sales.
Haswell could go a very long way to correcting the Mini but I still see it as a failed design that needs to be completely rethought. It needs to be turned into a desktop that no one feels embarrassed to own as their primary machine. Technology wise we are very close to being able to put a respectable computer into a Mini sized box. I just hope that Apple can get over its need to make sure the Mini is the worst performer in their entire lineup of Mac systems.
Comments
Hard to know where to start with an abomination like the Mini. First thing Apple needs to do is wipe the slate clean and design a desktop computer to replace what is actually a headless iBook.
Start by building the new Mini around a desktop quad core Ivy Bridge i5 with CTO option for a quad core i7 with hyperthreading. Add three PCIe slots, with one occupied by a full length video card. Build the case so that access to the drive bays is as simple and quick as with the Mac Pro, and add two full sized drive bays. Boot drive is a mini-PCIe SSD similar to what's used on the MacBooks, so those two drive bays can be used for data, time machine, backups, etc.
Just because it isn't small doesn't mean it can't be cool. Ive can work his magic on the case, but above all keep the components standard issue desktop parts so the cost remains low and Apple gets their phat profit margins. Keep the ports accessable. That means USB ports in front so users don't have to turn the damn thing around to plug in a flash drive. Use enough fans to keep it quiet without running the CPU at ungodly temperatures.
The current Mini is worthless, terminate it with extreme prejudice.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Winter
Suppose there is no new mini this year. When do the Haswell mobile processors come out? Q2 2013 or Q1?
They are most likely late Q2 2013. Lack of a mini is extremely unlikely. This would put it on a 2 year refresh when the current hardware should be pin compatible. It costs them very little to keep it up to date. It's not like we're in October with Haswell coming out in January or February. There is an imminent refresh due here.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Junkyard Dawg
Start by building the new Mini around a desktop quad core Ivy Bridge i5 with CTO option for a quad core i7 with hyperthreading. Add three PCIe slots, with one occupied by a full length video card. Build the case so that access to the drive bays is as simple and quick as with the Mac Pro, and add two full sized drive bays. Boot drive is a mini-PCIe SSD similar to what's used on the MacBooks, so those two drive bays can be used for data, time machine, backups, etc.
I'd expect embedded graphics to become more prevalent in future years. I don't see a mini being built to accommodate such a gpu.
Quote:
Originally Posted by wizard69
Further coming high speed RAM standard don't support anything but soldering to the motherboard to assure signal integrity.
Funny but I seldom here of documented RAM failures from respectable RAM vendors.
as to RAM upgrades these days you can buy a machine up front with enough RAM. By the time you need a justifiable RAM upgrade it makes more sense to buy a new machine.
This is a Mac Forum where we are talking about Mac OS. I really don't care about the problems with Windows.
I've been looking for information on future standards, but I haven't turned up much. Typically if you're purchasing quality ram, it's unlikely to go bad. It's still possible to end up with a bad stick out of the box, which is why I suggest memtest after installation. Some brands do consistently receive more complaints at some of the typical outlets.
Originally Posted by Junkyard Dawg
Hard to know where to start with an abomination like the Mini. First thing Apple needs to do is wipe the slate clean and design a desktop computer to replace what is actually a headless iBook.
Or maybe they've kept it around and in the form it has been since its creation because it sells well like that and serves the needs of a large number of people who understand why it exists, unlike you.
Start by building the new Mini around a desktop quad core Ivy Bridge i5 with CTO option for a quad core i7 with hyperthreading. Add three PCIe slots, with one occupied by a full length video card. Build the case so that access to the drive bays is as simple and quick as with the Mac Pro, and add two full sized drive bays.
Mac Pro. Buy one. Or a PC.
Quote:
Originally Posted by wizard69
What anecdotal evidence? Beyond that proprietary evidence isn't needed, much is publicly known about the science of reliability.
As to the perfection of solder, nothing is perfect! However industry has reached a high level of perfection when it comes to soldering. Baring some well know failures, surface mount technology and soldering in general has dramatically increased the general reliability of electronics.
The vast majority of electronic failures occur very early in a products life, so you are extremely likely to have a device run for a very long time if it doesn't fail during the warranty period.
Dealing with uneconomical repairs is a daily reality. It happens with automobiles, TVs refrigerators and a bunch of other things. An automobile has one hell of a lot more parts too.
It isn't lost it is rather not of a concern. One of the guys I work with repairs computers on the side. On many occasions he has had people decline simple repairs to instead give him the old machine to be replaced with a new one. You look on repair ability as an important consideration while others don't even bother.
Maybe maybe not. Comments are rather worthless unless they are quoting service reports. However HP is not the first nor the last to suffer a process failure.
How many iPhone failures involve RAM?
Because it is a waste of money, isn't reliable, connectors waste space and generally goes against the trend in shrinking electronics. Further coming high speed RAM standard don't support anything but soldering to the motherboard to assure signal integrity.
Funny but I seldom here of documented RAM failures from respectable RAM vendors.
as to RAM upgrades these days you can buy a machine up front with enough RAM. By the time you need a justifiable RAM upgrade it makes more sense to buy a new machine.
This is a Mac Forum where we are talking about Mac OS. I really don't care about the problems with Windows.
Are you really that obtuse? Bloatware takes away performance on any platform. It is not a problem unique to
Windows,now that you bring up the subject of Windows. Microsoft has simply been the dominant vendor of "office productivity suites". Without Microsoft's support of the Mac platform some years ago there is considerable doubt that Apple would have survived.
You dissemble in a meaningless way to no good end.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Junkyard Dawg
Start by building the new Mini around a desktop quad core Ivy Bridge i5 with CTO option for a quad core i7 with hyperthreading. Add three PCIe slots, with one occupied by a full length video card. Build the case so that access to the drive bays is as simple and quick as with the Mac Pro, and add two full sized drive bays. Boot drive is a mini-PCIe SSD similar to what's used on the MacBooks, so those two drive bays can be used for data, time machine, backups, etc.
I would rather have last year's Mini.
Who here was discussing bloat ware? The discussion was about hardware and soldered in RAM.
Being a constant promoter of XMac even I see that as a bit extreme, it is a machine that has its place. When talking about XMac I'm not thinking tower either, that is the Mac Pros place. Frankly I see full size slots as a thing of the past though slots are still needed. In this case though there might be a division between internal and external slots with internal slots supporting fast SSD storage cards built around a new industry standard.
I have done my part to get the new mini to come out. I finally broke down and ordered upgrade parts (SSD, RAM, etc) for my old mini instead of waiting for any new machines.
Therefore we should get new desktops macs this tuesday.
Originally Posted by Winter
That's part of what is making me grow some disdain for Apple. It would be nice for them to drop just a few vague hints every once in a while. To go to Apple.com and have them say "We have something cool planned for the fall for our Mac line. Stay tuned."
Your disdain is completely foolish. You really want them to just give up sales?
Apple already does that. Every time there is a keynote and every time there is a quarterly earnings call, the executives will say "great new products coming up soon". They don't need to say diddly squat about anything more specific than that, nor should they.
Between those hints and the actual, known release dates of the chips themselves, we know that things are coming down the pike.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
Between those hints and the actual, known release dates of the chips themselves, we know that things are coming down the pike.
They've really been pushing it this time. The mini shares a lot of parts with the macbook pro. It should be available by now. Either way expect another somewhat long refresh after this as you're unlikely to see a haswell mini prior to the second half of next year.
I guess I admit I'm being impatient. It's probably because I don't have a whole lot going on in my life right thus I'm clamoring just to see an update so I can say "Oh cool that's what is in it and those are the options." Not to mention the lawsuit garbage with Samsung just pisses me off because it's almost like tabloid trash to me at the grocery store. I get that sites are obligated to report on it but is anyone actually interested in the day to day developments of he said she said?
Take a vacation or find a loose woman. Seriously don't get wrapped in trivial things regarding a fruit company.
Frankly I'm extremely disappointed that Apple is jerking the Mini community around the way it is but I don't get overly involved in that reality. I realize that many things could be behind the delays including allocation from Intel. There is also the possibility that the Mini is dead.
Skip those articles then!
Your situation is no different than the clowns from the past that would read the negative articles in newspapers and then declare that the world is going to hell and the end is near. Obviously it isn't and if you want there are more positive things to be concerned with. It is unfortunate that we have a publication environment where money equals negative imagery. Even political success revolves around negativity these days. You as an individual can resist though.
I sure hope not, because I'm afraid my fascination with Apple will end. Tis a shame.
Quote:
Originally Posted by wizard69
There is also the possibility that the Mini is dead.
Sigh... You hit the nail on the head regarding the Osborne Effect, then add this gratuitous silliness. Sure, technically, there is a possibility that the iPhone, iPad, and Mac are dead so that Apple can concentrate on iPods. However, like the dead Mini idea, the possibility is so remote that's silly to bring it up. The Mac Mini will be dead when either the Mac is dead or desktops are dead. Apple will not kill the Mini just because it doesn't meet the needs of one curmudgeonly wizard.
An interesting read to be sure, some of the comments where hilarious. The problem is that Intel might have a very good desktop processor there but Apple has a history of putting crap into the Mini. Further the Mini simply doesn't meet the requirements of common desktop users thus the struggling sales.
Haswell could go a very long way to correcting the Mini but I still see it as a failed design that needs to be completely rethought. It needs to be turned into a desktop that no one feels embarrassed to own as their primary machine. Technology wise we are very close to being able to put a respectable computer into a Mini sized box. I just hope that Apple can get over its need to make sure the Mini is the worst performer in their entire lineup of Mac systems.