For my example, I live in Canada but travel a lot for work. I have an iPhone contract with a Canadian provider and when the iPhone 4 came out, instead of upgrading with them and getting a locked, subsidized phone, I purchased an unlocked one from Apple. I use my Canadian SIM and have all the iPhone specific features (data plan, visual voice mail etc...) and pay the monthly bill. I also have an ATT pay and go SIM for the US. I top it up when needed and when I arrive in the US, I just pop in that SIM. My phone number changes, which may be an issue for some, but I save hundreds of $$ not paying the truly exorbitant roaming charges.
I have a similar situation however I need to carry two phones when I travel. One that is roaming from the US and the other is using a local SIM. I used to use a cheap feature phone for local SIM but now since AT&T will unlock my old iPhone I can use that instead even though I will still have my iPhone 5 with me. I still need to get my incoming calls from the US. Then I just call the person back using Skype as soon as I find a WiFi thus avoiding long call times while roaming. I also have a Skype phone number that is supposed to ring on my iPhone but that doesn't always work so well as most of the time the caller gets sent to voice mail after a couple rings on their end where as it never rings on my end.
In that case the Canadian phone would be cheaper as the Canadian dollar is worth more than the US greenback right now
You are correct about the Cdn $ being a bit stronger than the US $ right now, however the price of an iPhone 5 (unlocked) in Canada purchased from Apple is $699 + taxes. Sales tax varies by province, in Ontario you will pay 13% sales tax for a total of $789.87. The unlocked iPhone 5 isn't available yet in the US, however indications are that it will sell there for $649 (+ taxes). Depending on region, you could end up saving $100 or more by buying in the US.
I had the option of purchasing my iPhone 5's from either Canada or the US, but because the unlocked version isn't yet available in the US (and the fact that I'm impatient!) I ended up ordering mine from Apple's Canadian store.
The iPhone 5 is making it a bit more tricky because there are multiple versions - a GSM version and two CDMA versions - and each version supports different LTE bands. You will need to ensure you get the GSM version of the iPhone 5 and not the CDMA versions, which work on Verizon and Sprint. Your only option for LTE in the USA is AT&T if you use the GSM iPhone 5, and most likely you won't have access to LTE outside of the USA. There might be a few markets, but most won't seem to work. What will work is HSPA+ and DC-HSPA, which currently have comparable performance to most LTE implementations. LTE definitely has higher upward limits (100Mbps versus HSPA+ 42Mbps) but the current networks aren't supporting that top end yet.
Isn't it two GSM versions and one CDMA version?
Along the same lines, any guesses as to which version will be compatible with TD-LTE on China Mobile? Or will they introduce another variant just for China Mobile?
Nothing that a bit of sandpaper can't solve. And I'll be able to reuse that sandpaper for when I get an iPad mini.
All kidding aside, my concern is if I try cutting a micro-SIM (actually I'll be starting with a regular SIM that has already been cut to micro-SIM size), will I end up cutting into the chip inside? I guess there's only one way to find out. Good thing that getting a replacement SIM is dirt cheap over here.
Rumours are that China Mobile will start offering nano-SIM's as early as the end of this month!
Not an odd policy at all. Apple's supply is tightly constrained when the new model is launched. In the US, most people buy the phones subsidized through a carrier. In fact, Apple itself only sells a very small portion of the phones sold. Carriers and places like Best Buy make up most of the sales. All those places sell locked phones. Only Apple sells unlocked phones in the US. So, Apple is struggling to meet initial demand for locked phones.
Meanwhile, some Countries only allow the sale of unlocked phones. So, Apple reserves the small allocation of initial unlocked phones for those markets until demand levels out.
My question was whether it's really any different enough of a device that it actually makes a difference. Isn't it just a configuration but somewhere that makes it an unlocked phone? I'm just asking if it really makes any difference. I know there are some circuitry differences because of the LTE bands, but an iPhone that rolls off the line is still an iPhone, whether it is locked or unlocked, isn't it?
My question was whether it's really any different enough of a device that it actually makes a difference. Isn't it just a configuration but somewhere that makes it an unlocked phone? I'm just asking if it really makes any difference. I know there are some circuitry differences because of the LTE bands, but an iPhone that rolls off the line is still an iPhone, whether it is locked or unlocked, isn't it?
There's no physical difference in a factory-unlocked iPhone; that's correct. It's all in the software (low-level, but software).
More than likely, the Canadian premium is because technical support costs are higher in Canada than in the US (plus any additional profit the Canadian company is looking to make.)
You should be so lucky. Here in Australia (where our currency has gimped the USD for over a year now) the 64GB is $1000 (we pay a special "Apple Tax").
You can thank the Australian government for that in making sure that Apple pays more in legal fees and marketing costs to ensure that the Australian government protects the public from not misreading LTE marketing ...
The exchange rate between the US and Canadian dollars is very volatile. In the past year, it has flipped back and forth between both sides of parity several times, and it is reasonable to assume that it will continue to do so.
Retailers, on the other hand, strive to have prices that remain stable for the medium-term. They are (justifiably) not willing to assume too much risk in the event that the exchange rate goes too far south. So, they (understandably) build in a safety margin, to improve the chance that the price they set now will probably remain profitable until their next scheduled round of price adjustments a few months from now.
Don't forget, too, that currency exchanges are subject to entropy. Every conversion will likely be subject to brokerage fees of, say, 1.5% or so. Then, the remaining funds would be converted to the foreign currency at the prevailing exchange rate. Going from CAD to USD, and then immediately going from USD back to CAD again at the exact same exchange rate would always result in a net loss.
Say the exchange rate was 1.00, and you started out with $100 CAD. Your broker would take $1.50 up front, leaving you with only $98.50 for conversion at the applicable exchange rate. Your remaining $98.50 CAD would be converted into $98.50 USD, for an overall loss of $1.50. Apple may get more favorable brokerage fees - because they could probably aggregate many individual sales together into much larger overall conversion transactions - but the same principle would have to apply.
All reasonable and cogent arguments. You could even add increased shipping costs. All of that would easily justify an extra $10-15 per unit. Maybe even $20. But FIDDY BONES?! That's called taking the express train to Gougetown. Apple should be ashamed.
All reasonable and cogent arguments. You could even add increased shipping costs. All of that would easily justify an extra $10-15 per unit. Maybe even $20. But FIDDY BONES?! That's called taking the express train to Gougetown. Apple should be ashamed.
Indeed, a $50 safety margin on a $650 product would imply that they are forecasting the possibility of the Canadian dollar falling as low as $0.93 USD or so within the next few months
I've just read some forecasts of the next 5 months which suggest the exchange rate could sink to a low of around $0.98 USD around November, with an 80% confidence interval ranging from 0.95 to 1.01. That kind of exchange rate forecast, on its own, would justify a defensive price of around $685 or so. The remaining $15 price difference would still have to be attributed some other factors (perhaps your aforementioned extra shipping costs???).
Indeed, a $50 safety margin on a $650 product would imply that they are forecasting the possibility of the Canadian dollar falling as low as $0.93 USD or so within the next few months
If the Canuck buck falls below USD$0.95 in the next five months I'll eat my iPhone. I have a forecast of my own: Apple will make so much money in Q42012 that they will buy the moon, declare it a new country and move their headquarters there to avoid taxes. They'll even blow a big chunk out of the side (think Star Wars Death Star) to make it look more like the Apple logo. Kinda far-fetched, I'll grant you, but no less preposterous than trying to predict currency fluctuations!
Heck, one could even argue that with the giganormous profits Apple reaps they could perhaps afford to eat a point or two if the dollar really did tank, but I recognize that to shareholders that's an even stupider idea than the moon base.
The real answer to the question of why Apple charges so much more for the iPhone in Canada is the same as to why Canadian carriers demand a three-year contract to get a subsidized iPhone: Because they can.
For those of us in the U.S. I use my iPhone on Straight Talk with an AT&T sim. When you prepay for a year (which I did for two phones) the price per month is $41 for unlimited talk, text, data and of course no contract.
That and it is sort of nice to only have to deal with my cell bill once a year.
For those of us in the U.S. I use my iPhone on Straight Talk with an AT&T sim. When you prepay for a year (which I did for two phones) the price per month is $41 for unlimited talk, text, data and of course no contract.
What about overages? Tethering? "Misuse" of plan? I've heard they're crazy strict on that and will simply cut your service and give away your number.
I want to but new iphone5 from america...its price is $199..Which one to buy locked or unlocked....!!
It's $199 only if you sign up for a rather expensive two year contract with data plan. Otherwise it's full price and you can get an unlocked phone.
As for the better choice for using outside the USA, Verizon will usually unlock the GSM side pretty quickly, because they're a CDMA carrier and don't care what you do outside the US. Ironically, AT&T, a GSM carrier, will not do so until the contract is fulfilled
As for the better choice for using outside the USA, Verizon will usually unlock the GSM side pretty quickly, because they're a CDMA carrier and don't care what you do outside the US. Ironically, AT&T, a GSM carrier, will not do so until the contract is fulfilled
The contract Verizon model of the iPhone 5 is sold with the GSM unlocked for use anywhere.
Comments
Quote:
Originally Posted by rcomeau
For my example, I live in Canada but travel a lot for work. I have an iPhone contract with a Canadian provider and when the iPhone 4 came out, instead of upgrading with them and getting a locked, subsidized phone, I purchased an unlocked one from Apple. I use my Canadian SIM and have all the iPhone specific features (data plan, visual voice mail etc...) and pay the monthly bill. I also have an ATT pay and go SIM for the US. I top it up when needed and when I arrive in the US, I just pop in that SIM. My phone number changes, which may be an issue for some, but I save hundreds of $$ not paying the truly exorbitant roaming charges.
I have a similar situation however I need to carry two phones when I travel. One that is roaming from the US and the other is using a local SIM. I used to use a cheap feature phone for local SIM but now since AT&T will unlock my old iPhone I can use that instead even though I will still have my iPhone 5 with me. I still need to get my incoming calls from the US. Then I just call the person back using Skype as soon as I find a WiFi thus avoiding long call times while roaming. I also have a Skype phone number that is supposed to ring on my iPhone but that doesn't always work so well as most of the time the caller gets sent to voice mail after a couple rings on their end where as it never rings on my end.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sookite
In that case the Canadian phone would be cheaper as the Canadian dollar is worth more than the US greenback right now
You are correct about the Cdn $ being a bit stronger than the US $ right now, however the price of an iPhone 5 (unlocked) in Canada purchased from Apple is $699 + taxes. Sales tax varies by province, in Ontario you will pay 13% sales tax for a total of $789.87. The unlocked iPhone 5 isn't available yet in the US, however indications are that it will sell there for $649 (+ taxes). Depending on region, you could end up saving $100 or more by buying in the US.
I had the option of purchasing my iPhone 5's from either Canada or the US, but because the unlocked version isn't yet available in the US (and the fact that I'm impatient!) I ended up ordering mine from Apple's Canadian store.
Quote:
Originally Posted by focher
The iPhone 5 is making it a bit more tricky because there are multiple versions - a GSM version and two CDMA versions - and each version supports different LTE bands. You will need to ensure you get the GSM version of the iPhone 5 and not the CDMA versions, which work on Verizon and Sprint. Your only option for LTE in the USA is AT&T if you use the GSM iPhone 5, and most likely you won't have access to LTE outside of the USA. There might be a few markets, but most won't seem to work. What will work is HSPA+ and DC-HSPA, which currently have comparable performance to most LTE implementations. LTE definitely has higher upward limits (100Mbps versus HSPA+ 42Mbps) but the current networks aren't supporting that top end yet.
Isn't it two GSM versions and one CDMA version?
Along the same lines, any guesses as to which version will be compatible with TD-LTE on China Mobile? Or will they introduce another variant just for China Mobile?
Quote:
Originally Posted by AIA
Nothing that a bit of sandpaper can't solve. And I'll be able to reuse that sandpaper for when I get an iPad mini.
All kidding aside, my concern is if I try cutting a micro-SIM (actually I'll be starting with a regular SIM that has already been cut to micro-SIM size), will I end up cutting into the chip inside? I guess there's only one way to find out.
Rumours are that China Mobile will start offering nano-SIM's as early as the end of this month!
http://www.chineseindustrynews.com/china-mobile-has-began-purchase-of-nano-sim-card-and-will-start-selling-in-the-near-future/
My question was whether it's really any different enough of a device that it actually makes a difference. Isn't it just a configuration but somewhere that makes it an unlocked phone? I'm just asking if it really makes any difference. I know there are some circuitry differences because of the LTE bands, but an iPhone that rolls off the line is still an iPhone, whether it is locked or unlocked, isn't it?
Originally Posted by JeffDM
My question was whether it's really any different enough of a device that it actually makes a difference. Isn't it just a configuration but somewhere that makes it an unlocked phone? I'm just asking if it really makes any difference. I know there are some circuitry differences because of the LTE bands, but an iPhone that rolls off the line is still an iPhone, whether it is locked or unlocked, isn't it?
There's no physical difference in a factory-unlocked iPhone; that's correct. It's all in the software (low-level, but software).
More than likely, the Canadian premium is because technical support costs are higher in Canada than in the US (plus any additional profit the Canadian company is looking to make.)
Quote:
Originally Posted by hentaiboy
You should be so lucky. Here in Australia (where our currency has gimped the USD for over a year now) the 64GB is $1000 (we pay a special "Apple Tax").
You can thank the Australian government for that in making sure that Apple pays more in legal fees and marketing costs to ensure that the Australian government protects the public from not misreading LTE marketing ...
Quote:
Originally Posted by lfmorrison
The exchange rate between the US and Canadian dollars is very volatile. In the past year, it has flipped back and forth between both sides of parity several times, and it is reasonable to assume that it will continue to do so.
Retailers, on the other hand, strive to have prices that remain stable for the medium-term. They are (justifiably) not willing to assume too much risk in the event that the exchange rate goes too far south. So, they (understandably) build in a safety margin, to improve the chance that the price they set now will probably remain profitable until their next scheduled round of price adjustments a few months from now.
Don't forget, too, that currency exchanges are subject to entropy. Every conversion will likely be subject to brokerage fees of, say, 1.5% or so. Then, the remaining funds would be converted to the foreign currency at the prevailing exchange rate. Going from CAD to USD, and then immediately going from USD back to CAD again at the exact same exchange rate would always result in a net loss.
Say the exchange rate was 1.00, and you started out with $100 CAD. Your broker would take $1.50 up front, leaving you with only $98.50 for conversion at the applicable exchange rate. Your remaining $98.50 CAD would be converted into $98.50 USD, for an overall loss of $1.50. Apple may get more favorable brokerage fees - because they could probably aggregate many individual sales together into much larger overall conversion transactions - but the same principle would have to apply.
All reasonable and cogent arguments. You could even add increased shipping costs. All of that would easily justify an extra $10-15 per unit. Maybe even $20. But FIDDY BONES?! That's called taking the express train to Gougetown. Apple should be ashamed.
Quote:
Originally Posted by v5v
All reasonable and cogent arguments. You could even add increased shipping costs. All of that would easily justify an extra $10-15 per unit. Maybe even $20. But FIDDY BONES?! That's called taking the express train to Gougetown. Apple should be ashamed.
Indeed, a $50 safety margin on a $650 product would imply that they are forecasting the possibility of the Canadian dollar falling as low as $0.93 USD or so within the next few months
I've just read some forecasts of the next 5 months which suggest the exchange rate could sink to a low of around $0.98 USD around November, with an 80% confidence interval ranging from 0.95 to 1.01. That kind of exchange rate forecast, on its own, would justify a defensive price of around $685 or so. The remaining $15 price difference would still have to be attributed some other factors (perhaps your aforementioned extra shipping costs???).
Quote:
Originally Posted by lfmorrison
Indeed, a $50 safety margin on a $650 product would imply that they are forecasting the possibility of the Canadian dollar falling as low as $0.93 USD or so within the next few months
If the Canuck buck falls below USD$0.95 in the next five months I'll eat my iPhone. I have a forecast of my own: Apple will make so much money in Q42012 that they will buy the moon, declare it a new country and move their headquarters there to avoid taxes. They'll even blow a big chunk out of the side (think Star Wars Death Star) to make it look more like the Apple logo. Kinda far-fetched, I'll grant you, but no less preposterous than trying to predict currency fluctuations!
Heck, one could even argue that with the giganormous profits Apple reaps they could perhaps afford to eat a point or two if the dollar really did tank, but I recognize that to shareholders that's an even stupider idea than the moon base.
The real answer to the question of why Apple charges so much more for the iPhone in Canada is the same as to why Canadian carriers demand a three-year contract to get a subsidized iPhone: Because they can.
when the unlock iphone5 will b available on stores with these prices 649$ ,749$,849$ respectively for 16 32 &64 gb
Originally Posted by pawan
when the unlock iphone5 will b available on stores with these prices 649$ ,749$,849$ respectively for 16 32 &64 gb
Okay, I want something definitive now. None of this pussyfooting around, and I'm nowhere near any Apple or telecom store to confirm myself.
Aren't they already available? I've heard of people going to their telecom's stores and buying one, unlocked, at full price.
For those of us in the U.S. I use my iPhone on Straight Talk with an AT&T sim. When you prepay for a year (which I did for two phones) the price per month is $41 for unlimited talk, text, data and of course no contract.
That and it is sort of nice to only have to deal with my cell bill once a year.
Originally Posted by trumptman
For those of us in the U.S. I use my iPhone on Straight Talk with an AT&T sim. When you prepay for a year (which I did for two phones) the price per month is $41 for unlimited talk, text, data and of course no contract.
What about overages? Tethering? "Misuse" of plan? I've heard they're crazy strict on that and will simply cut your service and give away your number.
I want to but new iphone5 from america...its price is $199..Which one to buy locked or unlocked....!!
US locked phones only work with the carrier it's tied to. If you want it to work outside the US without any hacking, unlocked.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aman Rochani
I want to but new iphone5 from america...its price is $199..Which one to buy locked or unlocked....!!
It's $199 only if you sign up for a rather expensive two year contract with data plan. Otherwise it's full price and you can get an unlocked phone.
As for the better choice for using outside the USA, Verizon will usually unlock the GSM side pretty quickly, because they're a CDMA carrier and don't care what you do outside the US. Ironically, AT&T, a GSM carrier, will not do so until the contract is fulfilled
Originally Posted by KDarling
As for the better choice for using outside the USA, Verizon will usually unlock the GSM side pretty quickly, because they're a CDMA carrier and don't care what you do outside the US. Ironically, AT&T, a GSM carrier, will not do so until the contract is fulfilled
The contract Verizon model of the iPhone 5 is sold with the GSM unlocked for use anywhere.