It's a lot of fun trying to get OS 9 to run on OS X, the programs to use are Mini vmac or Sheepshaver if you're interested. That OS had a fun factor (whimsical icons etc) which encourages creativity I think, which modern OSes (even Apple ones) lack somewhat.
That said I would not trade it for the security you need on today's Internet that only OS X provides. But it would be nice if Jony Ive would bring the fun factor back to OS X (he is the new iOS/OS X gui designer) but I fear he will be stark and minimalistic.
I think Apple and Microsoft are moving away from all the chrome in the OS until all that is left is your content. Controls popup/fly out when needed, then disappear again. Even the normally ever-present OS X menu bar is hidden in full screen mode. In other words, the OS won't have much of a GUI itself. There are still a few holdovers from the desktop metaphor of the 80s still left, but it's clear what the direction will be in the near future: a launch pad / start screen showing all your applications, a file manager (finder, explorer) for accessing storage media (while traditional directory-based file systems are still in use, but even that will evolve into some other paradigm).
Years ago, Steve Jobs said to Walt Mossberg that someday, the Finder will be an app that just the pros use, and everyone else will use Spotlight to find content, even launch apps. While habits are slower to change, I'm convinced Steve was way ahead of his time when it said that. Why not search our computers' file systems that way we search the web? My point is that, if the Finder becomes just another app for file management, rather than the "underlying desktop surface" on which sit layers of open windows, then Mac OS X will not have any GUI "personality" at all.
Years ago, Steve Jobs said to Walt Mossberg that someday, the Finder will be an app that just the pros use, and everyone else will use Spotlight to find content, even launch apps. While habits are slower to change, I'm convinced Steve was way ahead of his time when it said that. Why not search our computers' file systems that way we search the web? My point is that, if the Finder becomes just another app for file management, rather than the "underlying desktop surface" on which sit layers of open windows, then Mac OS X will not have any GUI "personality" at all.
Ooh. Link?
I definitely believe the filesystem will just be something we (us) use, while new users (starting, oh… 2016?) won't have a clue how to navigate a folder tree. They won't need to.
I definitely believe the filesystem will just be something we (us) use, while new users (starting, oh… 2016?) won't have a clue how to navigate a folder tree. They won't need to.
I don't have a link, but do remember that as well. Don't even remember who he said that to, but that's unimportant. Bit like the Finder, although I would sorely miss it as I tend to remember where I put things. Yet at the same time, I must confess that with so many things Apple does; if you just let go of the old notion and habits, they often figured stuff out. Like:
Spotlight
File management in iTunes / Aperture
Backups through TM
Manually copying stuff over; we now have iCloud for (a part of) the stuff that we used to copy over to make it available
10.6 was a meaningful upgrade over 10.4. I suppose 10.8 is fine. But get real, nothing has really changed since 10.6. Nothing that matters, anyway. And that's fine - but the notion of upgrading these days is devoid of really any meaning.
10.6 was a meaningful upgrade over 10.4. I suppose 10.8 is fine. But get real, nothing has really changed since 10.6. Nothing that matters, anyway. And that's fine - but the notion of upgrading these days is devoid of really any meaning.
What?! That just sounds like crazy talk. Think about what has changed between SL and ML. Now consider the cost for these upgrades. Unless there was some specific PPC app [or some other apps that don't work well or at all under newer version of OS X] that you just have to have I don't see how anyone can say it's not worth it.
edit: Added data in brackets to further encapsulate what I think are legitimate reasons for it not being worth it.
My main work station has ML, but #2 is still on SL for the use of three programs. One, used rarely, cost $200 to upgrade. The other, used more frequently, is a $1500 upgrade. And then, there's QuickBooks 2008. Stable under SL and flakey with ML. So it's not always about shiny new features.
…2 is still on SL for the use of three programs. One, used rarely, cost $200 to upgrade. The other, used more frequently, is a $1500 upgrade. And then, there's QuickBooks 2008. Stable under SL and flakey with ML.
Yep, that's a valid point. Whatever they are, wherever they are, keep checking places like this to see if there's a modern alternative.
New features since 10.6 are so minor that they would scarcely qualify as a single point release back in the days of 10.2 or 10.3. Those were big bumps in usability and features, back then. Today? I'd call it maybe perceptible, but given that Apple is the most powerful hype machine globally, that's an impossible thing to really test. I use Parallels, SAS, Adobe, FCP, Office 2011, Stata among my regular tools. I'm happy. Maybe 10.8 has a new feature or two; don't know, don't care. As for this cloud stuff, I'd gladly pay an extra $50 to be sure my files are NOT going in any cloud, ever.
New features since 10.6 are so minor that they would scarcely qualify as a single point release back in the days of 10.2 or 10.3. Those were big bumps in usability and features, back then. Today? I'd call it maybe perceptible, but given that Apple is the most powerful hype machine globally, that's an impossible thing to really test. I use Parallels, SAS, Adobe, FCP, Office 2011, Stata among my regular tools. I'm happy. Maybe 10.8 has a new feature or two; don't know, don't care. As for this cloud stuff, I'd gladly pay an extra $50 to be sure my files are NOT going in any cloud, ever.
So your gripe is that Mac OS X is a full, feature rich OS as opposed to the days when it was still trying to solidify itself? That doesn't sound like a reasonable argument to me.
You might want to check out the differences between 10.1 to 10.2 and 10.2 to 10.3. Note there was only 11 months and 13 months between them, respectively. A reason for the fast turnover then was because it was very new and there were a lot of ironing out to be made. I'm very happy that now we get robust features added with a lot of polishing for a very low price. Mountain Lion is the best version of Mac OS that Apple has ever produced.
Sounds like someone has done a bunch of stuff beyond their ken to make their Macs not function properly and then they're turning around and blaming Apple for it. There is no way a modern with ML and 4GB RAM is "slow to near on being unusable" without the user not comprehending something important..
I disagree. On some systems, there appears to be a memory leak in Safari which uses up all available RAM and eventually slows the system significantly. I would suggest quitting and relaunching Safari periodically (every couple of days is probably enough if you're an average user). Since you can set it to reopen your tabs, you don't lose your place.
I disagree. On some systems, there appears to be a memory leak in Safari which uses up all available RAM and eventually slows the system significantly.
I am experiencing this bug wih one specific website so it might be some loop Safari gets stuck into due to poor programming from the designer of that site...
New features since 10.6 are so minor that they would scarcely qualify as a single point release back in the days of 10.2 or 10.3. Those were big bumps in usability and features, back then. Today? I'd call it maybe perceptible, but given that Apple is the most powerful hype machine globally, that's an impossible thing to really test. I use Parallels, SAS, Adobe, FCP, Office 2011, Stata among my regular tools. I'm happy. Maybe 10.8 has a new feature or two; don't know, don't care. As for this cloud stuff, I'd gladly pay an extra $50 to be sure my files are NOT going in any cloud, ever.
Forget about the few hundred new features, better mail, iCloud, gestures, notifications, etc
How about security and encryption? Keep in mind the only computers hit so far have been those running SL or earlier. And let's also not forget the automatic security patches in ML behind the scenes.
Why must you incessantly mock people who have a contrary opinion…
Because his opinion isn't based on anything in reality. When you form an opinion based on incorrect information, it's your fault, not anyone else's, when you're called out on it.
And for the record....I still use OS 9 (and 7.6.1 and 8.1 and 8.6) - you know the best releases from each era.
What reason could you have for actually using those?
I disagree. On some systems, there appears to be a memory leak in Safari which uses up all available RAM and eventually slows the system significantly. I would suggest quitting and relaunching Safari periodically (every couple of days is probably enough if you're an average user). Since you can set it to reopen your tabs, you don't lose your place.
It shouldn't happen, but it sometimes does.
That is an app issue, not something where ML is slow to unusual from the get go. Also note that his system(s) also isn't reporting serial number(s) which is why he can't use iCloud. This is a common with Mackintoshes but it's simple enough to generate a serial. Ever heard of a proper Mac not having a serial?
I disagree. On some systems, there appears to be a memory leak in Safari which uses up all available RAM and eventually slows the system significantly. I would suggest quitting and relaunching Safari periodically (every couple of days is probably enough if you're an average user). Since you can set it to reopen your tabs, you don't lose your place.
It shouldn't happen, but it sometimes does.
I had this problem. Safari would use all available RAM and VM. I disabled the MS Office plugins (I'm not even sure what they were supposed to do) and the problem went away immediately.
I had this problem. Safari would use all available RAM and VM. I disabled the MS Office plugins (I'm not even sure what they were supposed to do) and the problem went away immediately.
Comments
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfanning
and one was purchased overseas, so Apple will wipe their hands of them I am afraid.
Apple's warranties are worldwide. You should not have a problem servicing an Apple device bought overseas in the US.
I think Apple and Microsoft are moving away from all the chrome in the OS until all that is left is your content. Controls popup/fly out when needed, then disappear again. Even the normally ever-present OS X menu bar is hidden in full screen mode. In other words, the OS won't have much of a GUI itself. There are still a few holdovers from the desktop metaphor of the 80s still left, but it's clear what the direction will be in the near future: a launch pad / start screen showing all your applications, a file manager (finder, explorer) for accessing storage media (while traditional directory-based file systems are still in use, but even that will evolve into some other paradigm).
Years ago, Steve Jobs said to Walt Mossberg that someday, the Finder will be an app that just the pros use, and everyone else will use Spotlight to find content, even launch apps. While habits are slower to change, I'm convinced Steve was way ahead of his time when it said that. Why not search our computers' file systems that way we search the web? My point is that, if the Finder becomes just another app for file management, rather than the "underlying desktop surface" on which sit layers of open windows, then Mac OS X will not have any GUI "personality" at all.
Originally Posted by Suddenly Newton
Years ago, Steve Jobs said to Walt Mossberg that someday, the Finder will be an app that just the pros use, and everyone else will use Spotlight to find content, even launch apps. While habits are slower to change, I'm convinced Steve was way ahead of his time when it said that. Why not search our computers' file systems that way we search the web? My point is that, if the Finder becomes just another app for file management, rather than the "underlying desktop surface" on which sit layers of open windows, then Mac OS X will not have any GUI "personality" at all.
Ooh. Link?
I definitely believe the filesystem will just be something we (us) use, while new users (starting, oh… 2016?) won't have a clue how to navigate a folder tree. They won't need to.
I don't have a link, but do remember that as well. Don't even remember who he said that to, but that's unimportant. Bit like the Finder, although I would sorely miss it as I tend to remember where I put things. Yet at the same time, I must confess that with so many things Apple does; if you just let go of the old notion and habits, they often figured stuff out. Like:
- Spotlight
- File management in iTunes / Aperture
- Backups through TM
- Manually copying stuff over; we now have iCloud for (a part of) the stuff that we used to copy over to make it available
and so on and so forth...What?! That just sounds like crazy talk. Think about what has changed between SL and ML. Now consider the cost for these upgrades. Unless there was some specific PPC app [or some other apps that don't work well or at all under newer version of OS X] that you just have to have I don't see how anyone can say it's not worth it.
edit: Added data in brackets to further encapsulate what I think are legitimate reasons for it not being worth it.
Originally Posted by bwik
…the notion of upgrading these days is devoid of really any meaning.
Why aren't you still on your Altair?
Originally Posted by rrobr
…2 is still on SL for the use of three programs. One, used rarely, cost $200 to upgrade. The other, used more frequently, is a $1500 upgrade. And then, there's QuickBooks 2008. Stable under SL and flakey with ML.
Yep, that's a valid point. Whatever they are, wherever they are, keep checking places like this to see if there's a modern alternative.
New features since 10.6 are so minor that they would scarcely qualify as a single point release back in the days of 10.2 or 10.3. Those were big bumps in usability and features, back then. Today? I'd call it maybe perceptible, but given that Apple is the most powerful hype machine globally, that's an impossible thing to really test. I use Parallels, SAS, Adobe, FCP, Office 2011, Stata among my regular tools. I'm happy. Maybe 10.8 has a new feature or two; don't know, don't care. As for this cloud stuff, I'd gladly pay an extra $50 to be sure my files are NOT going in any cloud, ever.
So your gripe is that Mac OS X is a full, feature rich OS as opposed to the days when it was still trying to solidify itself? That doesn't sound like a reasonable argument to me.
You might want to check out the differences between 10.1 to 10.2 and 10.2 to 10.3. Note there was only 11 months and 13 months between them, respectively. A reason for the fast turnover then was because it was very new and there were a lot of ironing out to be made. I'm very happy that now we get robust features added with a lot of polishing for a very low price. Mountain Lion is the best version of Mac OS that Apple has ever produced.
I disagree. On some systems, there appears to be a memory leak in Safari which uses up all available RAM and eventually slows the system significantly. I would suggest quitting and relaunching Safari periodically (every couple of days is probably enough if you're an average user). Since you can set it to reopen your tabs, you don't lose your place.
It shouldn't happen, but it sometimes does.
I am experiencing this bug wih one specific website so it might be some loop Safari gets stuck into due to poor programming from the designer of that site...
How about security and encryption? Keep in mind the only computers hit so far have been those running SL or earlier. And let's also not forget the automatic security patches in ML behind the scenes.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
Wonder how many people still run Mac OS 9. Wonder if you'll feel like them in three years.
Why must you incessantly mock people who have a contrary opinion to how super duper awesome everything Apple does?
SL is by far the most stable of the OS X releases. There's a reason there's still a large percentage of people using it.
And for the record....I still use OS 9 (and 7.6.1 and 8.1 and 8.6) - you know the best releases from each era.
Originally Posted by pondosinatra
Why must you incessantly mock people who have a contrary opinion…
Because his opinion isn't based on anything in reality. When you form an opinion based on incorrect information, it's your fault, not anyone else's, when you're called out on it.
And for the record....I still use OS 9 (and 7.6.1 and 8.1 and 8.6) - you know the best releases from each era.
What reason could you have for actually using those?
That is an app issue, not something where ML is slow to unusual from the get go. Also note that his system(s) also isn't reporting serial number(s) which is why he can't use iCloud. This is a common with Mackintoshes but it's simple enough to generate a serial. Ever heard of a proper Mac not having a serial?
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta
I disagree. On some systems, there appears to be a memory leak in Safari which uses up all available RAM and eventually slows the system significantly. I would suggest quitting and relaunching Safari periodically (every couple of days is probably enough if you're an average user). Since you can set it to reopen your tabs, you don't lose your place.
It shouldn't happen, but it sometimes does.
I had this problem. Safari would use all available RAM and VM. I disabled the MS Office plugins (I'm not even sure what they were supposed to do) and the problem went away immediately.
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse
I had this problem. Safari would use all available RAM and VM. I disabled the MS Office plugins (I'm not even sure what they were supposed to do) and the problem went away immediately.
Just the plugins? (rhetorical question)
Sorry, I forgot about this thread. You might want to go and read those Apple warranty documents again, not all Apple warranties are world wide.