Intel makes faster chips than ARM. So far their mobile efforts have been hamstrung by power consumption, but that's changing the year. Faster plus less power means a competitive advantage for anyone with the willingness and experience to handle a processor shift.
I hope you're right, but we've heard that a lot of times over the past few years. If and when it happens, Apple won't have any problem switching over. Even the application problems will be minimal.
Wasn't there an article here recently that Intel was planning on making a tablet of its own? Not sure I trust them.
I don't see any sign that Intel wants to be anything other than a supplier to tablet OEMs. At most, maybe a reference design that they license but never sell.
But even if Intel wanted to get into the tablet market, I'd still trust them 1,000 times more than Samsung. It is clear from the trial that Samsung's chip division gives inside information to the consumer products division. I don't think Intel has ever been accused of that.
What would be the advantage to Apple, or the iPad buyers, of switching CPI architecture -- if not to allow the iPad to run OSX/
Intel makes faster chips than ARM. So far their mobile efforts have been hamstrung by power consumption, but that's changing the year. Faster plus less power means a competitive advantage for anyone with the willingness and experience to handle a processor shift.
I understand that Intel is changing, but ,AFAICT, they have yet to release chips competitive in performance/power to ARM.
Also, since Apple designs its own chips it can tailor them to the specific needs of the hardware and iOS. I doubt they would have this capability with Intel, unles they contracted Intel to design custom chips for iDevices.
[QUOTE] Irrelevant. It is very unlikely that Apple would use an Intel design when they have their own. All they need is fab space. I don't know how long it takes to get an existing design transferred to a new fab, but that's the time frame - not SoC design.
There would undoubtedly be some minor designs to the existing design to make it work better with Intel tech. Intel would own those design changes (unless their agreement said something different), but would not gain access to Apple's SoC design.[/QUOTE]
Let me state it more clearly.
You dont put a design of SoC from Samsung to Intel and expect it to work. No. It doesn't work that way. And it is not all they need is "Fab Space". You cant view Fab Space as a warehouse. Every SoC Design is specifically for that process node with that process technology in mind. The Ax Chip being designed with Samsung's Fab in mind could be ported to other Samsung like ( IBM Technology Alliance Partners ) such as Global Foundries with relatively short time. While i say short time this could means of 3 months and up to 6 months minimum to get the yield Apple needs. So no, this is not a easy task and not minor changes. Not to mention GF doesn't have the Fab capacity Apple needs.
So for Apple to have their next SoC Fabbed from Intel would means Apple have had time to design their SoC around the Intel's Fab tools. Intel would have sealed the deal two years ago to cooperate with Apple on the design of A7. Or in a shorted time frame they could throw their design to Intel and ask them to get it up to yield ASAP. Both solution would have taken a year at least given how completely different Samsung's Fab tech and Intel are.
What about TSMC ?
All the tools for designing with TSMC Fab in mind are easily available. Apple could have A7 with two design suited for 2 Fabs, this is hugely expensive for most but since Apple doesn't rely on making money selling SoC this problem doesn't really apply to them. I would LOVE to be proven wrong by Apple, but realistically the A6x or what ever SoC coming from iPhone 5s will properly be 28nm made by Sammy, And then Apple could pick on which one to choose for A7, Intel or TSMC.
I go by the fact that they are near identical to existing co-Samsung designs and are still made by Samsung.
I see little has changed since Apple got an ARM license though Apple are now employing some Samsung engineers. Most info here is quite made up from very small marketing snippets so am only going by what I technically see.
As for Intrinsity, they collaborated with Samsung in actual Samsung designs. Now they are trying to help Apple stand alone.
Quote:
Originally Posted by wizard69
Absolutely none of Apples recent processors have been Samsung designs. How could you be so misinformed??? More importantly many of Samsungs designs have Apple IP in them via Apples purchase of Intrinsity. You are off by 180 degrees here.
Comments
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I hope you're right, but we've heard that a lot of times over the past few years. If and when it happens, Apple won't have any problem switching over. Even the application problems will be minimal.
Somewhere around 2073
ARM is miles from supplanting the Xeon in the Mac Pro.
I don't see any sign that Intel wants to be anything other than a supplier to tablet OEMs. At most, maybe a reference design that they license but never sell.
But even if Intel wanted to get into the tablet market, I'd still trust them 1,000 times more than Samsung. It is clear from the trial that Samsung's chip division gives inside information to the consumer products division. I don't think Intel has ever been accused of that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum
InDo you have any idea when it would be possible for the Mac Pro?
Somewhere around 2073
ARM is miles from supplanting the Xeon in the Mac Pro.
I was asking when the new Intel chips, that @wizard69 was describing, would be available for the Mac Pro?
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacRulez
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum
What would be the advantage to Apple, or the iPad buyers, of switching CPI architecture -- if not to allow the iPad to run OSX/
Intel makes faster chips than ARM. So far their mobile efforts have been hamstrung by power consumption, but that's changing the year. Faster plus less power means a competitive advantage for anyone with the willingness and experience to handle a processor shift.
I understand that Intel is changing, but ,AFAICT, they have yet to release chips competitive in performance/power to ARM.
Also, since Apple designs its own chips it can tailor them to the specific needs of the hardware and iOS. I doubt they would have this capability with Intel, unles they contracted Intel to design custom chips for iDevices.
Irrelevant. It is very unlikely that Apple would use an Intel design when they have their own. All they need is fab space. I don't know how long it takes to get an existing design transferred to a new fab, but that's the time frame - not SoC design.
There would undoubtedly be some minor designs to the existing design to make it work better with Intel tech. Intel would own those design changes (unless their agreement said something different), but would not gain access to Apple's SoC design.[/QUOTE]
Let me state it more clearly.
You dont put a design of SoC from Samsung to Intel and expect it to work. No. It doesn't work that way. And it is not all they need is "Fab Space". You cant view Fab Space as a warehouse. Every SoC Design is specifically for that process node with that process technology in mind. The Ax Chip being designed with Samsung's Fab in mind could be ported to other Samsung like ( IBM Technology Alliance Partners ) such as Global Foundries with relatively short time. While i say short time this could means of 3 months and up to 6 months minimum to get the yield Apple needs. So no, this is not a easy task and not minor changes. Not to mention GF doesn't have the Fab capacity Apple needs.
So for Apple to have their next SoC Fabbed from Intel would means Apple have had time to design their SoC around the Intel's Fab tools. Intel would have sealed the deal two years ago to cooperate with Apple on the design of A7. Or in a shorted time frame they could throw their design to Intel and ask them to get it up to yield ASAP. Both solution would have taken a year at least given how completely different Samsung's Fab tech and Intel are.
What about TSMC ?
All the tools for designing with TSMC Fab in mind are easily available. Apple could have A7 with two design suited for 2 Fabs, this is hugely expensive for most but since Apple doesn't rely on making money selling SoC this problem doesn't really apply to them. I would LOVE to be proven wrong by Apple, but realistically the A6x or what ever SoC coming from iPhone 5s will properly be 28nm made by Sammy, And then Apple could pick on which one to choose for A7, Intel or TSMC.
I go by the fact that they are near identical to existing co-Samsung designs and are still made by Samsung.
I see little has changed since Apple got an ARM license though Apple are now employing some Samsung engineers. Most info here is quite made up from very small marketing snippets so am only going by what I technically see.
As for Intrinsity, they collaborated with Samsung in actual Samsung designs. Now they are trying to help Apple stand alone.
Quote:
Originally Posted by wizard69
Absolutely none of Apples recent processors have been Samsung designs. How could you be so misinformed??? More importantly many of Samsungs designs have Apple IP in them via Apples purchase of Intrinsity. You are off by 180 degrees here.