If apple knows what it's doing then why is the stock at 430? I beg to differ with you regarding their cash stockpile & knowledge in regards to knowing what to do. It's clear that they don't know what their doing based on the simple fact that they won't say anything to us that we can hold onto or that will give us hope they will stop the stock from further decline.
Each dollar becomes worth less and less? Oh really emrul? Inflation for 2012 was... drum roll ...
1.7%!!! Dollars kept for strategic purposes only seem like a brilliant idea when they get used. What will everyone say when Apple buys Corning (makers of Gorilla Glass), for example, which has a market of $18.5 billion and would probably cost at least $30 billion. I think Cook et. al. actually do know what they're doing.
If apple knows what it's doing then why is the stock at 430?
Let's spin that around.
"If Apple doesn't know what it's doing, why are they selling millions more of every product in every quarter and increasing their profit and revenue accordingly? Why are they able to turn their inventory around every week, and why are they still able to release products that are desirable worldwide?"
It's clear that they don't know what their doing based on the simple fact that they won't say anything to us that we can hold onto or that will give us hope they will stop the stock from further decline.
And from this statement, it's clear you don't have a clue what you're talking about.
You completely miss the point, they don't know what they are doing in regards to being a publicly traded company. & it's cash pile period. Did you even read the article?
If you think doing & saying nothing is "knowing what to do," I disagree. When Tim cook said "we're seriously thinking about returning cash to shareholders," he might as well said nothing! When, how much, in what manner will you distribute it? These unanswered questions is one of the reasons the stock is falling. In order to stop some of the decline he needs to create some sense of certainty & do it quickly.
…they don't know what they are doing in regards to being a publicly traded company. & it's cash pile period.
Yes, it's clear this isn't the case.
When Tim cook said "we're seriously thinking about returning cash to shareholders," he might as well said nothing!
Sounds like he's seriously thinking about returning cash to the shareholders.
When, how much, in what manner will you distribute it?
What reason (right?) do you have to know this? Should he have said absolutely nothing at all until he could tell you exactly what you want? Then you'd whine that he isn't saying anything at all. Either complain about nothing or complain about everything, but don't claim they're saying nothing when they're doing exactly what you want them to do.
In order to stop some of the decline he needs to create some sense of certainty & do it quickly.
It's a certainty that they'll keep making products people want, keep selling out of all of their products, and keep making boatloads of money.
"If Apple doesn't know what it's doing, why are they selling millions more of every product in every quarter and increasing their profit and revenue accordingly? Why are they able to turn their inventory around every week, and why are they still able to release products that are desirable worldwide?"
And from this statement, it's clear you don't have a clue what you're talking about.
Lets keep things real. They are selling more products but they are not "increasing their profit and revenue accordingly." EPS will be way down this qtr versus a year ago and it is unlikely earnings will increase on an annual basis versus last year.
I'd be careful calling people out for not knowing what they are talking about when you are clearly wrong about profit growth. Not happening this quarter, I can guarantee you that.
Selling lower ASP products with lower margins is a tough thing to battle, top line growth slows/stalls/goes negative and the impact to bottom line is even worse.
Well magman, all ya have to do is make sure you have your MBA, top 5% of your class, preferably from Harvard, Yale, Wharton, University of Chicago, or Stanford, be a junior analyst at one of the smaller firms for about 5 years or so, then you are in! Oh, and to make the big bucks, make sure and be rated at the top of the Institutional Investor survey a few years in a row might get you one of the top spots.
The fact is they don't really know what they are doing until they reveal it. They have implemented a buy back, they started paying dividends after many years of refusing to do so. I think Steve had the right idea. Don't give them anything. Give an inch and they want a mile. Give them nothing and they are content with that. Notice, the stock started tanking after they started pandering to stock holders.
"They have implemented a buy back"
Complete and utter garbage that Cook likes to shove down the throats of people who aren't smart or diligent enough to read the fine print. As the company has stated, the buyback was instituted for one reason only, to offset dilution from employee stock options. There is no net benefit to shareholders, the share count stays the same, shareholders get no bigger slice of the earnings pie.
The dividend was instituted a year ago and the stock went higher. It started dropping when competitors upped their games and concurrently Apple released weak products such as maps. One thing Steve did have right was don't release products that aren't best in class and can be universally mocked. Tim would have been well served to follow that lead. Maps was the canary in the coal that caused the stock to start dropping, not instituting a dividend.
That stock buyback/dividend program is 45 billion.
Plus they are increasing R&D by almost 60% in 2013.
Its just that the cash pile is so big those increases hardly make a dent.
To put the size of the pile in perspective.
Apple made more profit last quarter than amazon has in there entire existence. LOL Last quarter!
Maybe people that expect apple to spend there horde should specify what constitutes there idea of spending. Or just say I dont think that spending 60 billion in the next 3 years on stock buy backs and dividends and R&D and New Retail stores is enough.
So they are doing a lot with there money just not what you think they should.
As an addition, the other problem is that they make so damn much money every year that the cash horde even with there expenditures gets larger lol.
When, how much, in what manner will you distribute it?
Some of that was answered last year in there dividend/ stock buy back program announcement.
From Apples announcement last year:
Quote:
CUPERTINO, California—March 19, 2012—Apple® today announced plans to initiate a dividend and share repurchase program commencing later this year.
Subject to declaration by the Board of Directors, the Company plans to initiate a quarterly dividend of $2.65 per share sometime in the fourth quarter of its fiscal 2012, which begins on July 1, 2012.
Additionally, the Company’s Board of Directors has authorized a $10 billion share repurchase program commencing in the Company’s fiscal 2013, which begins on September 30, 2012. The repurchase program is expected to be executed over three years, with the primary objective of neutralizing the impact of dilution from future employee equity grants and employee stock purchase programs.
I think that thats pretty definitive on distribution and when. Maybe the real sentiment from stock holders is that they are not satisfied with the amounts and think it ought to be more, which of course serves there position that they think they deserve that money. Lol. I have even heard it said that a lot of stock holders really think that money is theres like they made it. What utter nonsense. Apple made that money. Stockholders are just lucky Steve Jobs is not alive. Because if he was there would be no Dividend at all. He disliked them vehemently, and would never pay a dividend to any stock holder. He did not give a rats ass what the stock was doing, He focused on giving customers the best product that Apple could give and in his words "let the stock take care of itself"
If apple knows what it's doing then why is the stock at 430? I beg to differ with you regarding their cash stockpile & knowledge in regards to knowing what to do. It's clear that they don't know what their doing based on the simple fact that they won't say anything to us that we can hold onto or that will give us hope they will stop the stock from further decline.
Has Apple ever said anything prior to any transaction? 4th most profitable qtr ever. Record selling iDevices.
Complete and utter garbage that Cook likes to shove down the throats of people who aren't smart or diligent enough to read the fine print. As the company has stated, the buyback was instituted for one reason only, to offset dilution from employee stock options. There is no net benefit to shareholders, the share count stays the same, shareholders get no bigger slice of the earnings pie.
The dividend was instituted a year ago and the stock went higher. It started dropping when competitors upped their games and concurrently Apple released weak products such as maps. One thing Steve did have right was don't release products that aren't best in class and can be universally mocked. Tim would have been well served to follow that lead. Maps was the canary in the coal that caused the stock to start dropping, not instituting a dividend.
Jobs released MobileMe, the Cube, the HiFi and Apple Socks. Maps may not be perfect but neither is Google Maps.
I predict apple will increase the dividend to between $13 and $15 per share. Probably closer to the 13 than the 15. Boost the buyback by 10B over 3 years so another 3B per year or so.
How will the market react? Big sell off in the stock. It is going to hit new 52 week lows once they announce. There is no way apple will pay anything aggressive out to nameless and faceless shareholders. Cook and the board honestly do not care about random people holding shares in their company. They want the cash to keep the company afloat should it fall on hard times. This will never change while Cook and this board are running the show.
If they do any kind of raise as I suggest above it is merely a PR attempt to shut people up so they can try to change the conversation a bit. With Cook at the helm this just isn't going to happen. He is a supply chain man, not a CEO for a major consumer brand that 100% requires a visionary and charismatic CEO. Nobody will ever replace Jobs but Cook appears to be an example of one that could not fall any further from the Apple tree
The dividend will never be that high per share. Cook helmed the most profitable year in corporate history. Cook is doing fine. Jobs didn't reinvent markets every year. Get over it.
Comments
Originally Posted by skleiniv
If apple knows what it's doing then why is the stock at 430?
Let's spin that around.
"If Apple doesn't know what it's doing, why are they selling millions more of every product in every quarter and increasing their profit and revenue accordingly? Why are they able to turn their inventory around every week, and why are they still able to release products that are desirable worldwide?"
It's clear that they don't know what their doing based on the simple fact that they won't say anything to us that we can hold onto or that will give us hope they will stop the stock from further decline.
And from this statement, it's clear you don't have a clue what you're talking about.
Originally Posted by skleiniv
…they don't know what they are doing in regards to being a publicly traded company. & it's cash pile period.
Yes, it's clear this isn't the case.
When Tim cook said "we're seriously thinking about returning cash to shareholders," he might as well said nothing!
Sounds like he's seriously thinking about returning cash to the shareholders.
When, how much, in what manner will you distribute it?
What reason (right?) do you have to know this? Should he have said absolutely nothing at all until he could tell you exactly what you want? Then you'd whine that he isn't saying anything at all. Either complain about nothing or complain about everything, but don't claim they're saying nothing when they're doing exactly what you want them to do.
In order to stop some of the decline he needs to create some sense of certainty & do it quickly.
It's a certainty that they'll keep making products people want, keep selling out of all of their products, and keep making boatloads of money.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
Let's spin that around.
"If Apple doesn't know what it's doing, why are they selling millions more of every product in every quarter and increasing their profit and revenue accordingly? Why are they able to turn their inventory around every week, and why are they still able to release products that are desirable worldwide?"
And from this statement, it's clear you don't have a clue what you're talking about.
Lets keep things real. They are selling more products but they are not "increasing their profit and revenue accordingly." EPS will be way down this qtr versus a year ago and it is unlikely earnings will increase on an annual basis versus last year.
I'd be careful calling people out for not knowing what they are talking about when you are clearly wrong about profit growth. Not happening this quarter, I can guarantee you that.
Selling lower ASP products with lower margins is a tough thing to battle, top line growth slows/stalls/goes negative and the impact to bottom line is even worse.
Quote:
Originally Posted by genovelle
The fact is they don't really know what they are doing until they reveal it. They have implemented a buy back, they started paying dividends after many years of refusing to do so. I think Steve had the right idea. Don't give them anything. Give an inch and they want a mile. Give them nothing and they are content with that. Notice, the stock started tanking after they started pandering to stock holders.
"They have implemented a buy back"
Complete and utter garbage that Cook likes to shove down the throats of people who aren't smart or diligent enough to read the fine print. As the company has stated, the buyback was instituted for one reason only, to offset dilution from employee stock options. There is no net benefit to shareholders, the share count stays the same, shareholders get no bigger slice of the earnings pie.
The dividend was instituted a year ago and the stock went higher. It started dropping when competitors upped their games and concurrently Apple released weak products such as maps. One thing Steve did have right was don't release products that aren't best in class and can be universally mocked. Tim would have been well served to follow that lead. Maps was the canary in the coal that caused the stock to start dropping, not instituting a dividend.
They already have more than enough cash to buy Intel and raise Steve Jobs from the dead.
Originally Posted by jdnc123
…profit growth. Not happening this quarter, I can guarantee you that.
Oh? You're sure?
That's one of the silliest statements ever on AI - and that's saying a lot.
So it's impossible that Apple knows what they're doing - but just hasn't gotten around to telling you?
Originally Posted by jragosta
That's one of the silliest statements ever on AI - and that's saying a lot.
So it's impossible that Apple knows what they're doing - but just hasn't gotten around to telling you?
I'm willing to think he got muddied in the pronouns.
The fact is they (shareholders) don't really know what they (Apple) are doing until they (Apple) reveal it.
Apple should buy Vodafone.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Buzzz
They should start a stock buy back.
They are currently in the middle of a 45 billion dollar stock buy back/dividend program started last year.
Here is the press release: http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2012/03/19Apple-Announces-Plans-to-Initiate-Dividend-and-Share-Repurchase-Program.html
Quote:
Originally Posted by majjo
well, currently they're not doing anything with it, which is quite frustrating to shareholders.
Stock buyback/dividend program: http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2012/03/19Apple-Announces-Plans-to-Initiate-Dividend-and-Share-Repurchase-Program.html
That stock buyback/dividend program is 45 billion.
Plus they are increasing R&D by almost 60% in 2013.
Its just that the cash pile is so big those increases hardly make a dent.
To put the size of the pile in perspective.
Apple made more profit last quarter than amazon has in there entire existence. LOL Last quarter!
Maybe people that expect apple to spend there horde should specify what constitutes there idea of spending. Or just say I dont think that spending 60 billion in the next 3 years on stock buy backs and dividends and R&D and New Retail stores is enough.
So they are doing a lot with there money just not what you think they should.
As an addition, the other problem is that they make so damn much money every year that the cash horde even with there expenditures gets larger lol.
Quote:
Originally Posted by skleiniv
When, how much, in what manner will you distribute it?
Some of that was answered last year in there dividend/ stock buy back program announcement.
From Apples announcement last year:
Quote:
CUPERTINO, California—March 19, 2012—Apple® today announced plans to initiate a dividend and share repurchase program commencing later this year.
Subject to declaration by the Board of Directors, the Company plans to initiate a quarterly dividend of $2.65 per share sometime in the fourth quarter of its fiscal 2012, which begins on July 1, 2012.
Additionally, the Company’s Board of Directors has authorized a $10 billion share repurchase program commencing in the Company’s fiscal 2013, which begins on September 30, 2012. The repurchase program is expected to be executed over three years, with the primary objective of neutralizing the impact of dilution from future employee equity grants and employee stock purchase programs.
I think that thats pretty definitive on distribution and when. Maybe the real sentiment from stock holders is that they are not satisfied with the amounts and think it ought to be more, which of course serves there position that they think they deserve that money. Lol. I have even heard it said that a lot of stock holders really think that money is theres like they made it. What utter nonsense. Apple made that money. Stockholders are just lucky Steve Jobs is not alive. Because if he was there would be no Dividend at all. He disliked them vehemently, and would never pay a dividend to any stock holder. He did not give a rats ass what the stock was doing, He focused on giving customers the best product that Apple could give and in his words "let the stock take care of itself"
Has Apple ever said anything prior to any transaction? 4th most profitable qtr ever. Record selling iDevices.
Jobs released MobileMe, the Cube, the HiFi and Apple Socks. Maps may not be perfect but neither is Google Maps.
Originally Posted by jdnc123
Maps was the canary in the coal that caused the stock to start dropping…
Ha! No.
I predict apple will increase the dividend to between $13 and $15 per share. Probably closer to the 13 than the 15. Boost the buyback by 10B over 3 years so another 3B per year or so.
How will the market react? Big sell off in the stock. It is going to hit new 52 week lows once they announce. There is no way apple will pay anything aggressive out to nameless and faceless shareholders. Cook and the board honestly do not care about random people holding shares in their company. They want the cash to keep the company afloat should it fall on hard times. This will never change while Cook and this board are running the show.
If they do any kind of raise as I suggest above it is merely a PR attempt to shut people up so they can try to change the conversation a bit. With Cook at the helm this just isn't going to happen. He is a supply chain man, not a CEO for a major consumer brand that 100% requires a visionary and charismatic CEO. Nobody will ever replace Jobs but Cook appears to be an example of one that could not fall any further from the Apple tree