I don't want Tim Cook and Co. LISTENING TO ANYONE but themselves.
I see no indication they are listening to anyone but themselves, for better or worse. It would be nice if they communicated with someone besides themselves, if only in maintenance of their brand and mindshare. At this time it looks like a year of silence to wait for a plastic down scale iPhone and a minor iPad update. I hope there is more.
2) At 3.5" that seems like an issue since Apple is no longer accepting such apps that are only designed for the 3.5" UI, and I don't thin require you to build for the 3.5" UI. That doesn't sound like a good plan if they are to introduce 3.5" back into the market.
Well first, why would anyone design an app only for the 3.5 UI and cut themselves out of the iPhone 5 market? That's just common sense.
Second, of course they don't require you to build for the 3.5 UI. Despite the fact the 4 & 4S are still being sold, and if there's no low one-size-fits-all low budget entry level iPhone, the 4S will continue to sold, (and likely will anyway), a developer leaving out the 3.5UI does so again at their own peril.
Third, what "introduce 3.5" back into the market"? It never left. New apps everyday are being released that are compatible with 3.5. Are there even any that currently only run on the iPhone 5?
I really don't see the problem here. In fact I'm in favor of it, as I prefer my mobile phones get smaller, not larger.
"They did this with their iPods, offering all different sizes and capacities to reach as broad of an audience as they could. "
the ipod mini and then nano were NEVER a cheap product
they were great product in their own market, you could say they were the most expensive in their own price bracket of the market.
The point is, nano was well designed, good material, rich-feature, sold as a GREAT tiny ipod.
and if you wanted what only a bigger design allowed (big screen, huge storage and so on) then: iPod.
- a "cheaper" iphone is bad for Apple. But a significant different iphone with an other INTERESTING value proposition could be nice. But it still has to be a GREAT device. Even if it is still expensive for its value.
One you would ask yourself "hmm.. I want what the iphone can do, but still.. that new device is great.. ho my !"
Looks like a flattened 3G/3GS to me. This may or may not be fake, but it wouldn't surprise me at all if this is the new low end iPhone this summer.
BTW -- the people saying it looks fake sound a lot like the same people who said the 3G, 4 and 5 leaked pictures looked fake too. I think it's pretty clear that there are a lot of people who have a bad track record at recognizing real leaked photos vs faked ones here.
What do you expect? This is what you get when you try to make something cheap....which is why I don't think Apple needs to make a cheap phone. If you can't afford it then oh well. You can't always get everything you want. Apple has always said they aren't going to be in a race to the bottom and this is exactly what a cheap phone does. They're starting to compete on price, which is exactly what you don't want to do.
This is what happens when you start to listen to shareholders, customers, analysts, etc and lose focus on just creating great products.
Is this where we get the same old tired old arguments we got last year prior to the iPad mini?
Apple is unlikely to go ahead with one model iPhone for ever and ever - they don't do that any where else.
As for the iPhone 4S, a fine machine, but it comes with one years OS support if it becomes the low end model.
This phone has to work well, but it also needs to look a bit cheaper than the top end model. The problem with the iPad mini is it looked better than the iPad ( and felt better too, which is why Apple are scrambling to make the bigger iPad lighter, as well as make it look like the mini in styling).
Apple will, no doubt, have features on the high end ( fingerprint, NFC?) which will appeal to some, but they need to make people who can afford the high end model have a compelling reason to buy it ( and design counts) unlike the iPad vs iPad mini. Retina wasn't a differential enough.
So this will be cheap. And cheaper looking. As long as it runs the latest OS really well, it won't matter in the markets they are targeting.
Third, what "introduce 3.5" back into the market"?
What NEW iPhone has had a 3.5" display since the iPhone 5? Zero. Zilch. Zip. What you're stating is that because they are currently still selling older handsets (like they have done since the iPhone 3GS release when they continued to sell the iPhone 3G) that they will continue to move into new more models with a 3.5" display. While that is technically possible (yet I think it's in improbable given Apple's history) it's silly to assume that the iPhone 4 on the market means that new models will be brought back into the market to prop up the 3.5" device. Apple has a long history of controlled, systematic obsolescence that makes it easy on the developer and consumer. Sticking with 3.5 for a brand new device limit the ease in which they can add another size display.
If Apple really plans to make a cheap iPhone model, I can see them only releasing it in countries like India, Brazil, SE Asian countries, etc. I don't think they would release a cheap phone in North America or other western countries. If true, hopefully that's not what the low cost iPhone looks like. That looks extremely plain and boring.
If this is true I'll be curious to see how Apple announces this and markets it. Especially if the primary audience is consumers in India and China. Would Apple make a low cost phone that's only sold in certain markets?
There might be very solid business reasons for Apple to start selling a cheaper off contract phone. But I have to admit there's nothing exciting about it and I can't see people getting excited about basically an iPhone 3GS that maybe comes in colors. Also begs the question if this is it, why did it take Apple so long to do it? Why wasn't there a "cheaper" iPhone off contract 2 years ago?
Is this where we get the same old tired old arguments we got last year prior to the iPad mini?
It is, isn't it?
No, not at all. The iPad Mini is in no way cheap. It doesn't look cheap, feel cheap, operate cheap, and its really not that cheap if you want to compete on price.
"They did this with their iPods, offering all different sizes and capacities to reach as broad of an audience as they could. "
the ipod mini and then nano were NEVER a cheap product
they were great product in their own market, you could say they were the most expensive in their own price bracket of the market.
The point is, nano was well designed, good material, rich-feature, sold as a GREAT tiny ipod.
and if you wanted what only a bigger design allowed (big screen, huge storage and so on) then: iPod.
-
a "cheaper" iphone is bad for Apple. But a significant different iphone with an other INTERESTING value proposition could be nice. But it still has to be a GREAT device. Even if it is still expensive for its value.
One you would ask yourself "hmm.. I want what the iphone can do, but still.. that new device is great.. ho my !"
Exactly.
A cheaper version of the already existing iPhone is not something they would do. People forget that the iPods are all different sizes but they all do different things, and fit different use-cases while at the same time maintaining the basic killer function, in this case ... portable music.
The "killer" or central function of an iPhone (or any smartphone) is not actually making calls. A cheaper iPhone without the ability to play apps for instance (in the same way that the cheaper iPods can't access the store) would be a failure. A cheaper iPhone that didn't do WiFi would be a similar failure. There simply aren't any features or things that you could remove from an iPhone and have it still remain an iPhone in the same way that an iPod nano is still an iPod.
IMO there are only three scenarios that make any kind of sense:
1) It's something completely different and new that makes it's own use case.
2) It replaces the selling of "last year's iPhone" by putting last year's iPhone guts in a cheap plastic case, and somehow this saves enough money that it can basically be given away at the same price as the "year before last year's" iPhone.
3) It isn't happening at all.
The 3.5" screen on this leak would seem to argue very strongly for number 3.
The holes on the side look wrong, it looks as if the silence toggle has moved to underneath the volume buttons. It's going to be fake anyway, although I am not as opposed to a cheaper iPhone as some seem to be. As others have pointed out, Apple has done this before and most recently with the iPad mini. Nothing wrong with cannablising some high end iPhone sales if the alternative is losing masses of market share to Samsung.
No, not at all. The iPad Mini is in no way cheap. It doesn't look cheap, feel cheap, operate cheap, and its really not that cheap if you want to compete on price.
What's funny is that the Galaxy Note 8.0 starts at $70 more than the iPad mini at $399 yet the reviews say it looks and feels considerably less quality than the iPad mini. It's display size is 0.1" more than the iPad mini but it's a smaller display in area and unless you're really only using it to watch videos it's not as ideal as the iPad mini's display. It also weighs more and is bigger in every dimension than the iPad mini which went on sale in 2012.
It does have at least one feature I wish Apple would adopt; namely, the Wacom digitizer, which also accounts for some additional costs across the board, but I doubt that even comes close to balancing out the weight, size, and cost issues compared to the iPad mini.
Finally, the display has a slightly higher PPI but not enough to account for the price and it's still well enough being Retina-quality. If it came with 1920x1080 it would be Retina-quality and make that price point more justifiable. I suspect the next model will resolve a lot of these issues if Samsung is truly serious about selling a better quality device.
The Apple that I know and love is now making third rate phones for third world people. Maybe all of those people whining about cheap phones finally got to them.
I used to look forward to the keynotes and new product announcements, but what is there to look forward to now, if this is the kind of products they'll be making?
It looks pretty real to me. It also makes sense that if Apple decided to make a more affordable iPhone they would use 3.5" to further differentiate it from their more expensive version. I also think if they release such a phone it would come in a variety of colors as other rumors have suggested. Apple's best 2 iPhone quarters are always the ones right after a new iPhone is released and then sales slow down in anticipation of the next version and also from competition as many flagship Android phones start arriving in the Spring. Both the S4 and HTC one will be out later this month. Assuming a cheaper iPhone is in the works it would make sense to release it several months apart from the other iPhone. I think they will try and get the 5S released as soon as possible, probably around June/July. Then about 3 or 4 month later release the cheaper iPhone, then if they also plan on a larger iPhone release that version about 3 or 4 months after that. Staggered releases throughout the year would maintain some excitement and interest throughout the year. The release date of the larger iPhone around the same time as the flagship Android phone would also take the wind out of their sales and allow Apple to directly compete in that market head on with both a larger screen and what would be perceived as a new model instead of one that was released 7 or more months ago as will be the case when the S4 arrives next week.
Three models released throughout the year with different screen sizes is my prediction. The largest iPhone would also likely get the next generation CPU first. All phones would have lightning. I doubt the cheaper iPhone would be $300, my guess would be around $379 or $99 on contract. They would also likely charge a premium for a larger screen version, likely $299 on contract. That would be a very attractive product matrix moving forward since it could potentially quadruple iPhone sales in a year. The cheaper iPhone would sell like gangbusters in China and other countries and would likely be popular here in the U.S. as well for parents looking to save a little money on their kids phones as well as other price conscious consumers. The larger iPhone could also stop the momentum of Android as well and finally give them some competition in that sector.
Comments
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
I don't want Tim Cook and Co. LISTENING TO ANYONE but themselves.
I see no indication they are listening to anyone but themselves, for better or worse. It would be nice if they communicated with someone besides themselves, if only in maintenance of their brand and mindshare. At this time it looks like a year of silence to wait for a plastic down scale iPhone and a minor iPad update. I hope there is more.
Well first, why would anyone design an app only for the 3.5 UI and cut themselves out of the iPhone 5 market? That's just common sense.
Second, of course they don't require you to build for the 3.5 UI. Despite the fact the 4 & 4S are still being sold, and if there's no low one-size-fits-all low budget entry level iPhone, the 4S will continue to sold, (and likely will anyway), a developer leaving out the 3.5UI does so again at their own peril.
Third, what "introduce 3.5" back into the market"? It never left. New apps everyday are being released that are compatible with 3.5. Are there even any that currently only run on the iPhone 5?
I really don't see the problem here. In fact I'm in favor of it, as I prefer my mobile phones get smaller, not larger.
the ipod mini and then nano were NEVER a cheap product
they were great product in their own market, you could say they were the most expensive in their own price bracket of the market.
The point is, nano was well designed, good material, rich-feature, sold as a GREAT tiny ipod.
and if you wanted what only a bigger design allowed (big screen, huge storage and so on) then: iPod.
-
a "cheaper" iphone is bad for Apple. But a significant different iphone with an other INTERESTING value proposition could be nice. But it still has to be a GREAT device. Even if it is still expensive for its value.
One you would ask yourself "hmm.. I want what the iphone can do, but still.. that new device is great.. ho my !"
It looks awful, But strangely enough it still stands positively out against any of Sammy's Smartphones.
So maybe it's worth they try it.
BTW -- the people saying it looks fake sound a lot like the same people who said the 3G, 4 and 5 leaked pictures looked fake too. I think it's pretty clear that there are a lot of people who have a bad track record at recognizing real leaked photos vs faked ones here.
Quote:
Originally Posted by macxpress
What do you expect? This is what you get when you try to make something cheap....which is why I don't think Apple needs to make a cheap phone. If you can't afford it then oh well. You can't always get everything you want. Apple has always said they aren't going to be in a race to the bottom and this is exactly what a cheap phone does. They're starting to compete on price, which is exactly what you don't want to do.
This is what happens when you start to listen to shareholders, customers, analysts, etc and lose focus on just creating great products.
Is this where we get the same old tired old arguments we got last year prior to the iPad mini?
It is, isn't it?
Originally Posted by JollyPaul
I see no indication they are listening to anyone but themselves…
I do.
I sat five minutes after typing that trying to remember instances to list, because there have been more than one. I think I'm… going to leave for now.
That's ugly... but it reminds me of the old plastic macbooks.
Apple is unlikely to go ahead with one model iPhone for ever and ever - they don't do that any where else.
As for the iPhone 4S, a fine machine, but it comes with one years OS support if it becomes the low end model.
This phone has to work well, but it also needs to look a bit cheaper than the top end model. The problem with the iPad mini is it looked better than the iPad ( and felt better too, which is why Apple are scrambling to make the bigger iPad lighter, as well as make it look like the mini in styling).
Apple will, no doubt, have features on the high end ( fingerprint, NFC?) which will appeal to some, but they need to make people who can afford the high end model have a compelling reason to buy it ( and design counts) unlike the iPad vs iPad mini. Retina wasn't a differential enough.
So this will be cheap. And cheaper looking. As long as it runs the latest OS really well, it won't matter in the markets they are targeting.
Also, the blue version might look better :-P
What NEW iPhone has had a 3.5" display since the iPhone 5? Zero. Zilch. Zip. What you're stating is that because they are currently still selling older handsets (like they have done since the iPhone 3GS release when they continued to sell the iPhone 3G) that they will continue to move into new more models with a 3.5" display. While that is technically possible (yet I think it's in improbable given Apple's history) it's silly to assume that the iPhone 4 on the market means that new models will be brought back into the market to prop up the 3.5" device. Apple has a long history of controlled, systematic obsolescence that makes it easy on the developer and consumer. Sticking with 3.5 for a brand new device limit the ease in which they can add another size display.
Originally Posted by asdasd
As for the iPhone 4S, a fine machine, but it comes with one years OS support if it becomes the low end model.
Just like every other low-end iPhone. What's the big deal?
If Apple really plans to make a cheap iPhone model, I can see them only releasing it in countries like India, Brazil, SE Asian countries, etc. I don't think they would release a cheap phone in North America or other western countries. If true, hopefully that's not what the low cost iPhone looks like. That looks extremely plain and boring.
There might be very solid business reasons for Apple to start selling a cheaper off contract phone. But I have to admit there's nothing exciting about it and I can't see people getting excited about basically an iPhone 3GS that maybe comes in colors. Also begs the question if this is it, why did it take Apple so long to do it? Why wasn't there a "cheaper" iPhone off contract 2 years ago?
Quote:
Originally Posted by asdasd
Is this where we get the same old tired old arguments we got last year prior to the iPad mini?
It is, isn't it?
No, not at all. The iPad Mini is in no way cheap. It doesn't look cheap, feel cheap, operate cheap, and its really not that cheap if you want to compete on price.
Quote:
Originally Posted by oomu
"They did this with their iPods, offering all different sizes and capacities to reach as broad of an audience as they could. "
the ipod mini and then nano were NEVER a cheap product
they were great product in their own market, you could say they were the most expensive in their own price bracket of the market.
The point is, nano was well designed, good material, rich-feature, sold as a GREAT tiny ipod.
and if you wanted what only a bigger design allowed (big screen, huge storage and so on) then: iPod.
-
a "cheaper" iphone is bad for Apple. But a significant different iphone with an other INTERESTING value proposition could be nice. But it still has to be a GREAT device. Even if it is still expensive for its value.
One you would ask yourself "hmm.. I want what the iphone can do, but still.. that new device is great.. ho my !"
Exactly.
A cheaper version of the already existing iPhone is not something they would do. People forget that the iPods are all different sizes but they all do different things, and fit different use-cases while at the same time maintaining the basic killer function, in this case ... portable music.
The "killer" or central function of an iPhone (or any smartphone) is not actually making calls. A cheaper iPhone without the ability to play apps for instance (in the same way that the cheaper iPods can't access the store) would be a failure. A cheaper iPhone that didn't do WiFi would be a similar failure. There simply aren't any features or things that you could remove from an iPhone and have it still remain an iPhone in the same way that an iPod nano is still an iPod.
IMO there are only three scenarios that make any kind of sense:
1) It's something completely different and new that makes it's own use case.
2) It replaces the selling of "last year's iPhone" by putting last year's iPhone guts in a cheap plastic case, and somehow this saves enough money that it can basically be given away at the same price as the "year before last year's" iPhone.
3) It isn't happening at all.
The 3.5" screen on this leak would seem to argue very strongly for number 3.
What's funny is that the Galaxy Note 8.0 starts at $70 more than the iPad mini at $399 yet the reviews say it looks and feels considerably less quality than the iPad mini. It's display size is 0.1" more than the iPad mini but it's a smaller display in area and unless you're really only using it to watch videos it's not as ideal as the iPad mini's display. It also weighs more and is bigger in every dimension than the iPad mini which went on sale in 2012.
It does have at least one feature I wish Apple would adopt; namely, the Wacom digitizer, which also accounts for some additional costs across the board, but I doubt that even comes close to balancing out the weight, size, and cost issues compared to the iPad mini.
Finally, the display has a slightly higher PPI but not enough to account for the price and it's still well enough being Retina-quality. If it came with 1920x1080 it would be Retina-quality and make that price point more justifiable. I suspect the next model will resolve a lot of these issues if Samsung is truly serious about selling a better quality device.
This is disappointing, if true.
The Apple that I know and love is now making third rate phones for third world people. Maybe all of those people whining about cheap phones finally got to them.
I used to look forward to the keynotes and new product announcements, but what is there to look forward to now, if this is the kind of products they'll be making?
It looks pretty real to me. It also makes sense that if Apple decided to make a more affordable iPhone they would use 3.5" to further differentiate it from their more expensive version. I also think if they release such a phone it would come in a variety of colors as other rumors have suggested. Apple's best 2 iPhone quarters are always the ones right after a new iPhone is released and then sales slow down in anticipation of the next version and also from competition as many flagship Android phones start arriving in the Spring. Both the S4 and HTC one will be out later this month. Assuming a cheaper iPhone is in the works it would make sense to release it several months apart from the other iPhone. I think they will try and get the 5S released as soon as possible, probably around June/July. Then about 3 or 4 month later release the cheaper iPhone, then if they also plan on a larger iPhone release that version about 3 or 4 months after that. Staggered releases throughout the year would maintain some excitement and interest throughout the year. The release date of the larger iPhone around the same time as the flagship Android phone would also take the wind out of their sales and allow Apple to directly compete in that market head on with both a larger screen and what would be perceived as a new model instead of one that was released 7 or more months ago as will be the case when the S4 arrives next week.
Three models released throughout the year with different screen sizes is my prediction. The largest iPhone would also likely get the next generation CPU first. All phones would have lightning. I doubt the cheaper iPhone would be $300, my guess would be around $379 or $99 on contract. They would also likely charge a premium for a larger screen version, likely $299 on contract. That would be a very attractive product matrix moving forward since it could potentially quadruple iPhone sales in a year. The cheaper iPhone would sell like gangbusters in China and other countries and would likely be popular here in the U.S. as well for parents looking to save a little money on their kids phones as well as other price conscious consumers. The larger iPhone could also stop the momentum of Android as well and finally give them some competition in that sector.