Part of me is wondering if Apple might pull an about-face on this one and end up re-releasing the current Mac Pro if/when the new design is rejected by people who aren't satisfied with the new design.
This is the classic second stage symptoms. First stage is 'they can't possibly get rid of PCIe slots, Thunderbolt isn't fast enough and internal HDDs are necessary'. Second stage is 'oh, they got rid of PCIe slots and HDDs well, they're going to have to go and put them back in'. The third stage is the realisation that the only options are to buy one or buy something else. People can hang onto older Mac Pros until there's a Thunderbolt solution for anything PCIe-based they depend on.
The new Mac Pro seems to me to be very similar to the Mac Mini in its product concept, which will be great for 95% of users, but Im not sure if it'll be the best option for my studio, and pretty much every audio professional I know has expressed similar fears.
There's a bunch of audio equipment for Thunderbolt.
Here's the video of the Magma chassis with some cards:
and here's a bunch of tests with Thunderbolt audio equipment on a rMBP:
[VIDEO]
[VIDEO]
[VIDEO]
Apogee is even using the new Mac Pro in their marketing:
Here's DJ Jazzy Jeff in his Studio with his Macbook Pro, Mac Pro and equipment:
[VIDEO]
He mentions 12TB internal storage at one point. Storage shouldn't be that big of a problem on the new one. I expect people will keep the internal SSD small for now and just connect something like the following over USB 3:
It could be expensive making the transition for some but if they are stuck on using a Mac, it's a decision that has to be made. SSD storage will come down in price. It's at around $0.60/GB, although Apple's at around double that. Say that people would be looking for 12TB for $1000, it has to break $0.10/GB. I'd give it 6 or 7 years. The lack of HDDs means that people who can afford the larger SSDs will help drive down the price by not having an option to just go with HDD.
Part of me is wondering if Apple might pull an about-face on this one and end up re-releasing the current Mac Pro if/when the new design is rejected by people who aren't satisfied with the new design.
I'm withholding my own judgement until I see what the price point will be, and especially if they'll be providing a reasonably priced solution for PCIe/expandability. Right now and external chassis that would allow current-gen Mac Pro expandability via Thunderbolt is pretty expensive and not very elegant compared to it just being part of the box. I'm also wondering how much space will be needed above the unit to allow for heat dissipation - my Mac currently sits in a soundproof case with ventilation ducts going out the back and it'll be interesting to see if the new design will be kosher with that, especially if I have to cram in a bunch of external devices for extra hard drives, PCIe, etc.
The new Mac Pro seems to me to be very similar to the Mac Mini in its product concept, which will be great for 95% of users, but Im not sure if it'll be the best option for my studio, and pretty much every audio professional I know has expressed similar fears.
I'm very happy with the current Mac Pro's form factor and expandability options, and really if they had re-released it with an updated processor, bus and hard drive options, i would probably continue buying a new one every 5-6 years (have already gone through 2 and upgraded hard drives &memory multiple times on each - nothing but positive experiences while upgrading and replacing them).
Just like the Matrix! There is no going back! LOL! That is not going to happen!
As with everything.. it all depends on the price... the value equation of cost and performance. If it outperforms the the current MacPro, without a significant added cost for design.. its a winner...Pros will buy multiple machines. While I understand expansion is critical, wait to see what this machine brings. It is a quantum leap in performance for storage, which is a major bottle neck. Still, its all about the price. To predict it DOA before its out is premature... I know I am in for at least 3.
I'm curious how this device will do, because I just don't see a big market for it. I expect it will be cancelled before the next update
Again … it's not a consumer machine, so the size of the market isn't really relevant like it would be for an iMac. This is not competing with Windows boxes from WallMart.
When you read comments threads on articles about the new Mac Pro, it also becomes pretty clear that almost everyone who says "no f*cking way" (or the equivalent), is basically a dilettante/hobbyist user and *not* actually a professional at all.
It's just the same old conservative/progressive or glass half-empty/half-full situation all over again. Some people look at a black cylinder and see a trashcan, some see a rocket. It's the mindset you bring to the table that determines what you see. If you are a conservative, all you see is that it's different and you don't like it because you don't like change. If you are a progressive, you see possibilities.
Part of me is wondering if Apple might pull an about-face on this one and end up re-releasing the current Mac Pro if/when the new design is rejected by people who aren't satisfied with the new design.
As with everything.. it all depends on the price... the value equation of cost and performance. If it outperforms the the current MacPro, without a significant added cost for design.. its a winner...Pros will buy multiple machines. While I understand expansion is critical, wait to see what this machine brings. It is a quantum leap in performance for storage, which is a major bottle neck. Still, its all about the price. To predict it DOA before its out is premature... I know I am in for at least 3.
True. This worries me a bit though as they have chosen what is typically their most expensive product, made a lot of changes that are bound to make itmore expensive, and then decided to make it even more expensive again, by manufacturing it in the USA, just based on some phoney ideology.
No matter whether it's Apple or anyone else doing that, it's worrisome.
IMO ideology shouldn't have anything to do with computer manufacturing other than being simply ethical with the production. Using their flagship product to pande to a lot of rabid xenophobes just doesn't seem like a good idea to me. The 1.0 version is almost certain to be only slightly better than the previous old version, and will likely cost a huge amount more. I'm thinking this is at least a $3,000 computer, stock, and the options will probably drive it up to $4,000 (and that's not including the monitor, the external storage array, etc.).
Again … it's not a consumer machine, so the size of the market isn't really relevant like it would be for an iMac. This is not competing with Windows boxes from WallMart.
When you read comments threads on articles about the new Mac Pro, it also becomes pretty clear that almost everyone who says "no f*cking way" (or the equivalent), is basically a dilettante/hobbyist user and *not* actually a professional at all.
It's just the same old conservative/progressive or glass half-empty/half-full situation all over again. Some people look at a black cylinder and see a trashcan, some see a rocket. It's the mindset you bring to the table that determines what you see. If you are a conservative, all you see is that it's different and you don't like it because you don't like change. If you are a progressive, you see possibilities.
Again … it's not a consumer machine, so the size of the market isn't really relevant like it would be for an iMac. This is not competing with Windows boxes from WallMart.
When you read comments threads on articles about the new Mac Pro, it also becomes pretty clear that almost everyone who says "no f*cking way" (or the equivalent), is basically a dilettante/hobbyist user and *not* actually a professional at all.
It's just the same old conservative/progressive or glass half-empty/half-full situation all over again. Some people look at a black cylinder and see a trashcan, some see a rocket. It's the mindset you bring to the table that determines what you see. If you are a conservative, all you see is that it's different and you don't like it because you don't like change. If you are a progressive, you see possibilities.
I am a conservative and i love the new machine... I would say your need to classify people is disturbing.
Whatever you call it and think of it, it will be quick, it will be very useable, it will be expensive and it will sell better than the previous model. Plus in the next year you will get PC manufacturer(s) copying the design.
The lack of PCI slots is the biggest concern for me. I have a number of customers who use fiber channel in their Mac Pros for raw HD editing. With the new 4K video coming I see a need for more speed, not less. I will concede that high end video is a niche market, it is a niche that Apple has typically had a strong following in. While very few will need Fiber Channel expandability on the new Mac Pros, each Pro market probably has its own speciality cards that can no longer be installed. Thunderbolt looks great but it is not ready for these very high throughput markets yet. Hopefully Apple does what they did with the MacBook Pros and FinalCut X / FinalCut Pro and leave the previous Generation on the market. If they bring the price of the New Mac Pro down (I admit unlikely) it could fill the needs of those calling for a Mac Minitower, while leaving the Original MacPro to serve the truly high end users.
Otherwise this is another indication that Apple is ignoring the Professional Video / Audio / Graphics communities that arguably kept Apple alive during the lean years.
My biggest concern with this machine is price of storage. PCIe flash is more than ten times the price of an equivalent sized hard disk.
Yes Thinking of 40 gigs per second specs. For a Devices (let's just say bottom 512 gb.) will take only 12.8 seconds to take your whole memory. And a average size (costing 3x regular) 2 TB still takes in less than minute 51.2 seconds (extremely convienent but $$ for little in it) and a extremely doubtful model (maybe $12-$20000) 5 TB taking just over 2 minutes 128 seconds for it at 40 gb a second.
Don't care well say a simular price HDD (obviously to slow for it still) 5 TB start, 20 TB high end(unreal storage) in minutes (8.53) to handle a 40 gb per second. I use to 12 Meg's (a little to slow after 50) think shipping the whole entire icloud data center in days (10,000 TB per 3 days) is extreme for 40 gb!
The lack of PCI slots is the biggest concern for me. I have a number of customers who use fiber channel in their Mac Pros for raw HD editing. With the new 4K video coming I see a need for more speed, not less.
Thunderbolt is fast enough for FC, there are TB-FC interfaces.
AV stream and disk-based mass storage only utilize a fraction of TB's throughput particularly with 4 (IIRC) independent TB busses that don't share bandwidth.
The worst part about external TB expansion is the clutter and additional failure modes due to non-locking connectors which are more pro-sumer than pro quality. (There's a reason old computer plugs were screw down connectors and pro-audio uses locking XLR plugs)
However performance and functionality is not a concern I have with this machine.
As for OpenCL: some ppl here don't realize that the whole point of OpenCL/GCD is to be CPU independent. The same code can run on an x86 CPU or on a (GP)GPU, just with obvious performance differences.
So Apple and app developers can use it all over the place and resulting code will on all Macs, just with widely varying performance levels. The main CPUs become increasingly auxiliary in their roles in high-performance computing, so a single 12-core main CPU should be perfectly adequate for a well balanced setup in this machine.
From all I can tell this is one if the most brilliant pieces of hardware to hit the market in quite some time.
And yes, it's made for an niche market, so it won't sell like hot cakes, and nobody expects any differently. This is a machine for content creators, not for consumers; there are also less people buying assembly lines than there are people buying cars; that doesn't make selling assembly lines a bad business just because one's not selling millions of them.
Again … it's not a consumer machine, so the size of the market isn't really relevant like it would be for an iMac. This is not competing with Windows boxes from WallMart.
When you read comments threads on articles about the new Mac Pro, it also becomes pretty clear that almost everyone who says "no f*cking way" (or the equivalent), is basically a dilettante/hobbyist user and *not* actually a professional at all.
It's just the same old conservative/progressive or glass half-empty/half-full situation all over again. Some people look at a black cylinder and see a trashcan, some see a rocket. It's the mindset you bring to the table that determines what you see. If you are a conservative, all you see is that it's different and you don't like it because you don't like change. If you are a progressive, you see possibilities.
I am a conservative and i love the new machine... I would say your need to classify people is disturbing.
I'm an Independent... I drank the water
I just want to point out that this thing is tiny -- smaller than an adult's head!
Or, imagine 4 iPads, standing up in portrait mode forming a hollow box -- the new Mac Pro will fit inside, with room to spare. It is smaller than a Promise Pegasus 12 RAID.
This is the classic second stage symptoms. First stage is 'they can't possibly get rid of PCIe slots, Thunderbolt isn't fast enough and internal HDDs are necessary'. Second stage is 'oh, they got rid of PCIe slots and HDDs well, they're going to have to go and put them back in'. The third stage is the realisation that the only options are to buy one or buy something else. People can hang onto older Mac Pros until there's a Thunderbolt solution for anything PCIe-based they depend on.
There's a bunch of audio equipment for Thunderbolt.
I realize there's a lot of audio equipment for Thunderbolt in the pipeline, but replacing a $20,000 Protools HD system with an Apogee or UA set up isn't something I or most other professional studios will do any time soon.
No professionals I know of have any trust in Apogee - their support has been atrocious, and basically every time there is an OSX update, they are the 2nd last (TC Electronic is always the last) to "unbreak" their firmware/software, which is crazy considering they're an Apple-focused company. UA is not currently a serious player in the professional market (besides their software modeling and hardware clones of classic products), although they have the people working for them to make headway at some point.
I think i the "new Mac Pro" is indeed all that will be available from Apple, you'll see most professional studios (i'm not talking small project studios or basement/bedroom jobs) forced to switch to Windows machines just from a cost/simplicity perspective, as weird as that sounds. While this is a microscopic market share for Apple, it's worth noting that the "prosumer" and project studio market are driven greatly by what they see in high-end studios. Honestly, my initial switch to Mac from PC about 14 years ago came specifically because I started noticing pretty much every studio was Mac-powered, and I know a ton of musicians who had "trusted by the musicians/studios they trust" as a final selling point for shelling out for and making the switch to OSX.
Anyways, hopefully i'm wrong and we'll see Apple release a professional and cost-effective solution if there's a backlash - remember when they pulled Final Cut Pro?
This is the classic second stage symptoms. First stage is 'they can't possibly get rid of PCIe slots, Thunderbolt isn't fast enough and internal HDDs are necessary'. Second stage is 'oh, they got rid of PCIe slots and HDDs well, they're going to have to go and put them back in'. The third stage is the realisation that the only options are to buy one or buy something else. People can hang onto older Mac Pros until there's a Thunderbolt solution for anything PCIe-based they depend on.
There's a bunch of audio equipment for Thunderbolt.
I realize there's a lot of audio equipment for Thunderbolt in the pipeline, but replacing a $20,000 Protools HD system with an Apogee or UA set up isn't something I or most other professional studios will do any time soon.
No professionals I know of have any trust in Apogee - their support has been atrocious, and basically every time there is an OSX update, they are the 2nd last (TC Electronic is always the last) to "unbreak" their firmware/software, which is crazy considering they're an Apple-focused company. UA is not currently a serious player in the professional market (besides their software modeling and hardware clones of classic products), although they have the people working for them to make headway at some point.
I think i the "new Mac Pro" is indeed all that will be available from Apple, you'll see most professional studios (i'm not talking small project studios or basement/bedroom jobs) forced to switch to Windows machines just from a cost/simplicity perspective, as weird as that sounds. While this is a microscopic market share for Apple, it's worth noting that the "prosumer" and project studio market are driven greatly by what they see in high-end studios. Honestly, my initial switch to Mac from PC about 14 years ago came specifically because I started noticing pretty much every studio was Mac-powered, and I know a ton of musicians who had "trusted by the musicians/studios they trust" as a final selling point for shelling out for and making the switch to OSX.
Anyways, hopefully i'm wrong and we'll see Apple release a professional and cost-effective solution if there's a backlash - remember when they pulled Final Cut Pro?
Here are some interesting quotes from Larry Jordan and Lou Borella (emphasis mine):
Did you really need that expansion in your Mac Pro?
Incidentally, according to Jordon’s blog, 80% of Mac Pro users don’t have any PCI cards in their system, aside from the graphics card. Perhaps the fuss about expansion options is fuss over nothing.
Borella admits that he probably won't miss the expansion options. "I have a Kona LHe that has been in my 2008 MP for five years but hasn't been used in the last two," he writes.
This echoes the admission of Macworld editor Dan Frakes who wrote: "I loved that I could upgrade pretty much everything, but in reality, I rarely swapped out more than hard drives, RAM, and the occasional video card or optical drive. Only once did I ever use an additional PCI slot. And yet because of their extensive expandability, the pre–2013 Mac Pro models use lots of floor space and lots of electricity, and they generate a lot of heat."
Thanks to Thunderbolt, those people who do need expansion are no longer limited by the number of card slots the computer has available. Borella admits: "As an editor I probably will not need any cards and I'd bet that all of my future needs will be satisfied via Thunderbolt."
“Apple essentially provided a virtually unlimited number of card slots for users that need the maximum in expandability," writes Jordon.
Apple’s will still have a challenge proving that Thunderbolt 2 isn’t only an alternative to the old fashioned expansion offered by PCI Express cards, but a better solution. Presumably this lesson will be easier to teach when a few more companies have got behind Thunderbolt 1, let alone Thunderbolt 2.
However there's still likely to be a few complications in certain industries. Borella points out: "I know the audio guys have a lot to complain about especially those using ProTools… I believe that most of the external hardware needed for Protools is sold by Protools/Avid right?... We are talking about a company in Avid that pretty much refuses to innovate. They hold on to old tech forever and rarely optimize their code to take advantage of any new hardware."
"The new Mac Pro depends on third parties abandoning the older technologies," said Borella.
Changing the way pros work
Borella admits that the new Mac Pro will change everything about his workflow, but writes that he is "more intrigued and excited than scared and perturbed".
"This machine will change the way my peripherals sit on my desk. It will cause me to take a hard look at my current monitor situation. It will cause me to rethink the gear I bring on remote edits. It will cause me to re-evaluate my home network and my NAS devices. It might even cause me to give a harder look to FCPX," he writes.
"For good or bad this Mac Pro will change everything and cause a ripple effect in my entire computing life. And its probably about time," he writes, adding: "When I look at the existing tech that is sitting on and under my desk I realize that I have been looking at pretty much the same picture for the last 20 years. Its probably about time that some company takes me to the next step."
I'm almost positive that Schiller announced a "Fall" release, along with Mavericks and iOS 7. And I think that the engineers showing the 'can off in the lobby of Moscone were saying the same thing.
I'd love to be misremembering. A Summer release would be killer.
And I know several people who are drooling for this kit. It's a small sample size, to be sure. But if the price points are right, this is going to be a big seller. The number crunching claims for this thing are stupid fast.
The new has a fraction of the chassis materials of the old. The new has a fraction of the components of the old (no CD, HD, cables and a single cooling fan). The new has a smaller foot print of the old thereby Apple will save on shipping to stores/warehouse and be able to stock more units in stores. The new should have a fraction of the assembly labor time of the old. The new has an inexpensively produced design, the beer can shell. The new should be less expensive to update compared to the old because it use three small boards instead of one large board. The new will have practically no warranty repair of the old because of no mechanical drives.
The new should sell for much less than the old considering. It makes me believe because of its small design that Apple may be thinking of eventually replacing the Mac Mini and even the iMac with this Mac Pro if they price it right. It will reduce their product line but instead offer consumers a powerful yet affordable unit that they can expanded and be a computer, server, media server etc. If Apple goes the other way and sells it for more than the old units it will sell few and make people turn to the hackintosh community.
Comments
This is the classic second stage symptoms. First stage is 'they can't possibly get rid of PCIe slots, Thunderbolt isn't fast enough and internal HDDs are necessary'. Second stage is 'oh, they got rid of PCIe slots and HDDs well, they're going to have to go and put them back in'. The third stage is the realisation that the only options are to buy one or buy something else. People can hang onto older Mac Pros until there's a Thunderbolt solution for anything PCIe-based they depend on.
There's a bunch of audio equipment for Thunderbolt.
Here's the video of the Magma chassis with some cards:
and here's a bunch of tests with Thunderbolt audio equipment on a rMBP:
[VIDEO]
[VIDEO]
[VIDEO]
Apogee is even using the new Mac Pro in their marketing:
http://www.apogeedigital.com/products/symphony-io.php#thunderbridge
Here's DJ Jazzy Jeff in his Studio with his Macbook Pro, Mac Pro and equipment:
[VIDEO]
He mentions 12TB internal storage at one point. Storage shouldn't be that big of a problem on the new one. I expect people will keep the internal SSD small for now and just connect something like the following over USB 3:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00CH94GMK
http://www.amazon.com/LaCie-Quadra-External-Drive-9000351U/dp/B009KMQPKS
Thunderbolt drives are pricier but 8TB is here for just under $800:
http://www.amazon.com/G-Technology-Thunderbolt-Powerful-Transfer-0G02272/dp/B00846Z4YY
It could be expensive making the transition for some but if they are stuck on using a Mac, it's a decision that has to be made. SSD storage will come down in price. It's at around $0.60/GB, although Apple's at around double that. Say that people would be looking for 12TB for $1000, it has to break $0.10/GB. I'd give it 6 or 7 years. The lack of HDDs means that people who can afford the larger SSDs will help drive down the price by not having an option to just go with HDD.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Superbass
Part of me is wondering if Apple might pull an about-face on this one and end up re-releasing the current Mac Pro if/when the new design is rejected by people who aren't satisfied with the new design.
I'm withholding my own judgement until I see what the price point will be, and especially if they'll be providing a reasonably priced solution for PCIe/expandability. Right now and external chassis that would allow current-gen Mac Pro expandability via Thunderbolt is pretty expensive and not very elegant compared to it just being part of the box. I'm also wondering how much space will be needed above the unit to allow for heat dissipation - my Mac currently sits in a soundproof case with ventilation ducts going out the back and it'll be interesting to see if the new design will be kosher with that, especially if I have to cram in a bunch of external devices for extra hard drives, PCIe, etc.
The new Mac Pro seems to me to be very similar to the Mac Mini in its product concept, which will be great for 95% of users, but Im not sure if it'll be the best option for my studio, and pretty much every audio professional I know has expressed similar fears.
I'm very happy with the current Mac Pro's form factor and expandability options, and really if they had re-released it with an updated processor, bus and hard drive options, i would probably continue buying a new one every 5-6 years (have already gone through 2 and upgraded hard drives &memory multiple times on each - nothing but positive experiences while upgrading and replacing them).
Just like the Matrix! There is no going back! LOL! That is not going to happen!
This is true and hopefully Apple can drive down the price of solid state drives ASAP.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ifij775
I'm curious how this device will do, because I just don't see a big market for it. I expect it will be cancelled before the next update
Again … it's not a consumer machine, so the size of the market isn't really relevant like it would be for an iMac. This is not competing with Windows boxes from WallMart.
When you read comments threads on articles about the new Mac Pro, it also becomes pretty clear that almost everyone who says "no f*cking way" (or the equivalent), is basically a dilettante/hobbyist user and *not* actually a professional at all.
It's just the same old conservative/progressive or glass half-empty/half-full situation all over again. Some people look at a black cylinder and see a trashcan, some see a rocket. It's the mindset you bring to the table that determines what you see. If you are a conservative, all you see is that it's different and you don't like it because you don't like change. If you are a progressive, you see possibilities.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Superbass
Part of me is wondering if Apple might pull an about-face on this one and end up re-releasing the current Mac Pro if/when the new design is rejected by people who aren't satisfied with the new design.
Not a chance.
Quote:
Originally Posted by xZu
As with everything.. it all depends on the price... the value equation of cost and performance. If it outperforms the the current MacPro, without a significant added cost for design.. its a winner...Pros will buy multiple machines. While I understand expansion is critical, wait to see what this machine brings. It is a quantum leap in performance for storage, which is a major bottle neck. Still, its all about the price. To predict it DOA before its out is premature... I know I am in for at least 3.
True. This worries me a bit though as they have chosen what is typically their most expensive product, made a lot of changes that are bound to make it more expensive, and then decided to make it even more expensive again, by manufacturing it in the USA, just based on some phoney ideology.
No matter whether it's Apple or anyone else doing that, it's worrisome.
IMO ideology shouldn't have anything to do with computer manufacturing other than being simply ethical with the production. Using their flagship product to pande to a lot of rabid xenophobes just doesn't seem like a good idea to me. The 1.0 version is almost certain to be only slightly better than the previous old version, and will likely cost a huge amount more. I'm thinking this is at least a $3,000 computer, stock, and the options will probably drive it up to $4,000 (and that's not including the monitor, the external storage array, etc.).
Color me progressive
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gazoobee
Again … it's not a consumer machine, so the size of the market isn't really relevant like it would be for an iMac. This is not competing with Windows boxes from WallMart.
When you read comments threads on articles about the new Mac Pro, it also becomes pretty clear that almost everyone who says "no f*cking way" (or the equivalent), is basically a dilettante/hobbyist user and *not* actually a professional at all.
It's just the same old conservative/progressive or glass half-empty/half-full situation all over again. Some people look at a black cylinder and see a trashcan, some see a rocket. It's the mindset you bring to the table that determines what you see. If you are a conservative, all you see is that it's different and you don't like it because you don't like change. If you are a progressive, you see possibilities.
I am a conservative and i love the new machine... I would say your need to classify people is disturbing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ifij775
I'm curious how this device will do, because I just don't see a big market for it. I expect it will be cancelled before the next update
Canceling the future? That's Microsoft's job.
Plus in the next year you will get PC manufacturer(s) copying the design.
Otherwise this is another indication that Apple is ignoring the Professional Video / Audio / Graphics communities that arguably kept Apple alive during the lean years.
Don't care well say a simular price HDD (obviously to slow for it still) 5 TB start, 20 TB high end(unreal storage) in minutes (8.53) to handle a 40 gb per second. I use to 12 Meg's (a little to slow after 50) think shipping the whole entire icloud data center in days (10,000 TB per 3 days) is extreme for 40 gb!
Thunderbolt is fast enough for FC, there are TB-FC interfaces.
AV stream and disk-based mass storage only utilize a fraction of TB's throughput particularly with 4 (IIRC) independent TB busses that don't share bandwidth.
The worst part about external TB expansion is the clutter and additional failure modes due to non-locking connectors which are more pro-sumer than pro quality. (There's a reason old computer plugs were screw down connectors and pro-audio uses locking XLR plugs)
However performance and functionality is not a concern I have with this machine.
As for OpenCL: some ppl here don't realize that the whole point of OpenCL/GCD is to be CPU independent. The same code can run on an x86 CPU or on a (GP)GPU, just with obvious performance differences.
So Apple and app developers can use it all over the place and resulting code will on all Macs, just with widely varying performance levels. The main CPUs become increasingly auxiliary in their roles in high-performance computing, so a single 12-core main CPU should be perfectly adequate for a well balanced setup in this machine.
From all I can tell this is one if the most brilliant pieces of hardware to hit the market in quite some time.
And yes, it's made for an niche market, so it won't sell like hot cakes, and nobody expects any differently. This is a machine for content creators, not for consumers; there are also less people buying assembly lines than there are people buying cars; that doesn't make selling assembly lines a bad business just because one's not selling millions of them.
I'm an Independent... I drank the water
I just want to point out that this thing is tiny -- smaller than an adult's head!
Or, imagine 4 iPads, standing up in portrait mode forming a hollow box -- the new Mac Pro will fit inside, with room to spare. It is smaller than a Promise Pegasus 12 RAID.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin
This is the classic second stage symptoms. First stage is 'they can't possibly get rid of PCIe slots, Thunderbolt isn't fast enough and internal HDDs are necessary'. Second stage is 'oh, they got rid of PCIe slots and HDDs well, they're going to have to go and put them back in'. The third stage is the realisation that the only options are to buy one or buy something else. People can hang onto older Mac Pros until there's a Thunderbolt solution for anything PCIe-based they depend on.
There's a bunch of audio equipment for Thunderbolt.
I realize there's a lot of audio equipment for Thunderbolt in the pipeline, but replacing a $20,000 Protools HD system with an Apogee or UA set up isn't something I or most other professional studios will do any time soon.
No professionals I know of have any trust in Apogee - their support has been atrocious, and basically every time there is an OSX update, they are the 2nd last (TC Electronic is always the last) to "unbreak" their firmware/software, which is crazy considering they're an Apple-focused company. UA is not currently a serious player in the professional market (besides their software modeling and hardware clones of classic products), although they have the people working for them to make headway at some point.
I think i the "new Mac Pro" is indeed all that will be available from Apple, you'll see most professional studios (i'm not talking small project studios or basement/bedroom jobs) forced to switch to Windows machines just from a cost/simplicity perspective, as weird as that sounds. While this is a microscopic market share for Apple, it's worth noting that the "prosumer" and project studio market are driven greatly by what they see in high-end studios. Honestly, my initial switch to Mac from PC about 14 years ago came specifically because I started noticing pretty much every studio was Mac-powered, and I know a ton of musicians who had "trusted by the musicians/studios they trust" as a final selling point for shelling out for and making the switch to OSX.
Anyways, hopefully i'm wrong and we'll see Apple release a professional and cost-effective solution if there's a backlash - remember when they pulled Final Cut Pro?
Here are some interesting quotes from Larry Jordan and Lou Borella (emphasis mine):
http://www.macworld.co.uk/mac/news/?newsid=3453334
I'd love to be misremembering. A Summer release would be killer.
And I know several people who are drooling for this kit. It's a small sample size, to be sure. But if the price points are right, this is going to be a big seller. The number crunching claims for this thing are stupid fast.
The new has a fraction of the chassis materials of the old.
The new has a fraction of the components of the old (no CD, HD, cables and a single cooling fan).
The new has a smaller foot print of the old thereby Apple will save on shipping to stores/warehouse and be able to stock more units in stores.
The new should have a fraction of the assembly labor time of the old.
The new has an inexpensively produced design, the beer can shell.
The new should be less expensive to update compared to the old because it use three small boards instead of one large board.
The new will have practically no warranty repair of the old because of no mechanical drives.
The new should sell for much less than the old considering. It makes me believe because of its small design that Apple may be thinking of eventually replacing the Mac Mini and even the iMac with this Mac Pro if they price it right. It will reduce their product line but instead offer consumers a powerful yet affordable unit that they can expanded and be a computer, server, media server etc. If Apple goes the other way and sells it for more than the old units it will sell few and make people turn to the hackintosh community.