The Retina display is a luxury and I don't think it's essential for iOS 7. The iPad Mini has the same PPI as a non-Retina iPhone and apparently iOS 7 still looks great on it.
Also how else would Apple be able to shave 40-60% off the price of the phone? A plastic case alone would barely shave off 10% of the cost.
A non-Retina display would mean cheaper screen, smaller battery, it would use less GPU so a cheaper processor could be used as well.
Unless Apple is using magic there is no other way I see them making a cheaper iPhone actually cheaper. Also forgoing Retina would add a value factor to the 5S preventing cannibalization and likely increasing upsale which equals PROFITS.
Right now Apple is selling the iPhone 4 as the cheaper iPhone option in many countries. So they're going to replace it with a plastic phone that doesn't have a retina display? And charge $400 or more for it (most people agree it won't be any cheaper). I can already see people making fun asking "does it deserve to exist?" There is absolutely nothing you describe that sounds premium. And I've always thought of Apple as a premium brand. In fact this sounds like something cheap you'd get from an Android OEM, except the price will be a lot more. :no:
Right now Apple is selling the iPhone 4 as the cheaper iPhone option in many countries. So they're going to replace it with a plastic phone that doesn't have a retina display? And charge $400 or more for it (most people agree it won't be any cheaper). I can already see people making fun asking "does it deserve to exist?" There is absolutely nothing you describe that sounds premium. And I've always thought of Apple as a premium brand. In fact this sounds like something cheap you'd get from an Android OEM, except the price will be a lot more.
I guess you completely forgot about the iPhone 3G & 3GS...
You mean... "Designed by Apple in California Assembled in China"
Oops - that's what I meant. Could have looked at my iPhone before typing that. But you knew what I meant. Pics are from a prototype for a knock off would be my guess.
Right now Apple is selling the iPhone 4 as the cheaper iPhone option in many countries. So they're going to replace it with a plastic phone that doesn't have a retina display? And charge $400 or more for it (most people agree it won't be any cheaper). I can already see people making fun asking "does it deserve to exist?" There is absolutely nothing you describe that sounds premium. And I've always thought of Apple as a premium brand. In fact this sounds like something cheap you'd get from an Android OEM, except the price will be a lot more.
For one the iPhone 4 has 3 year old internals, hence why it could be sold for $449.
We're talking about a phone that will have a 4 inch screen and last years internals. How can Apple cut 40-60% off the price while retaining margins for this new phone. That's why I'm postulating Apple could resort to a non-Retina screen in order to cut cost and increase the desirability of the 5S.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan
No. And they certainly were an anomaly that didn't last long.
I wouldn't consider the 3G/3GS anomolies considering Apple sold the form factor for 4 years from 2008-2012.
Oops - that's what I meant. Could have looked at my iPhone before typing that. But you knew what I meant. Pics are from a prototype for a knock off would be my guess.
I've heard they are going to change the wording to simply, "Made in California Motherfuckers!" with a little emoticon of a hand giving the middle finger underneath.
I remember when the iBook first came out. I got one of the neon lime green ones. It was fun at the time.
Bingo. Besides the claim shell iBooks, Apple also had lime Green (and orange) iMacs as well. Also who could forget the Dalmatian and Flower Power iMacs. You are right at the time they really stood out.
For one the iPhone 4 has 3 year old internals, hence why it could be sold for $449.
We're talking about a phone that will have a 4 inch screen and last years internals. How can Apple cut 40-60% off the price while retaining margins for this new phone. That's why I'm postulating Apple could resort to a non-Retina screen in order to cut cost and increase the desirability of the 5S.
What type of margins are we taking about? One reason Apple was able to justify $329 for the iPad mini (that had iPad 2 specs) was it was still a premium product in other ways. Thin and light sluminum and glass with amazing build quality and battery life. Even though it didn't have a retina display it was still desirable and gave off that premium feel. And now the rumors are the flagship iPad will be taking design cues from the mini. But Apple admitted that the margins on the mini were significantly lower than the average for Apple products.
To me this plastic cheaper iPhone goes against Apple's ethos of wanting to make great products and Tim Cook's comment that making money is not their "North Star". If Apple is going to play in the cheaper space it will be harder to command a premium price if people think the device itself isn't premium. That's why I hope these leaks are wrong and this is just some cheap knockoff based on rumors.
I wouldn't consider the 3G/3GS anomolies considering Apple sold the form factor for 4 years from 2008-2012.
I think it was an anomaly in terms of Apple's design language. Honestly I'd love to ask Steve or J.Ive what the thought was behind going from aluminum to plastic and now we're back to aluminum again.
Right now Apple is selling the iPhone 4 as the cheaper iPhone option in many countries. So they're going to replace it with a plastic phone that doesn't have a retina display? And charge $400 or more for it (most people agree it won't be any cheaper). I can already see people making fun asking "does it deserve to exist?" There is absolutely nothing you describe that sounds premium. And I've always thought of Apple as a premium brand. In fact this sounds like something cheap you'd get from an Android OEM, except the price will be a lot more.
Yes, except the phone is meant for people who do not know what a Retina Screen is or do not care that much. Apple brought the iPad Mini out without Retina and it quickly became the best selling iPad. Retina is nice, but not necessary. With that said, considering the iPod Touch has Retina at a much lower price point, I am not convinced Apple will discard Retina.
I guess Apple, however, will use the iPhone 4S internals because of lawsuit matters tied to the iPhone 4.
What type of margins are we taking about? One reason Apple was able to justify $329 for the iPad mini (that had iPad 2 specs) was it was still a premium product in other ways. Thin and light sluminum and glass with amazing build quality and battery life. Even though it didn't have a retina display it was still desirable and gave off that premium feel. And now the rumors are the flagship iPad will be taking design cues from the mini. But Apple admitted that the margins on the mini were significantly lower than the average for Apple products.
To me this plastic cheaper iPhone goes against Apple's ethos of wanting to make great products and Tim Cook's comment that making money is not their "North Star". If Apple is going to play in the cheaper space it will be harder to command a premium price if people think the device itself isn't premium. That's why I hope these leaks are wrong and this is just some cheap knockoff based on rumors.
I think it was an anomaly in terms of Apple's design language. Honestly I'd love to ask Steve or J.Ive what the thought was behind going from aluminum to plastic and now we're back to aluminum again.
At the time of the 3G release Apple also still sold the plastic MacBooks so there was less of negative vibes toward plastic at Apple. I don't think Steve or Ive would regret that design.
Anyway as far as the new phone I do agree that I would prefer it not be plastic. Apple should find other ways to save on cost to bring the price down.
I think most people would prefer a beautiful product with high end materials even if the phone doesn't have a Retina display. For the price range I don't think a Retina display is make or break considering Samdung also uses low res screens in the low to mid tier price smartphones.
At the time of the 3G release Apple also still sold the plastic MacBooks so there was less of negative vibes toward plastic at Apple. I don't think Steve or Ive would regret that design.
Anyway as far as the new phone I do agree that I would prefer it not be plastic. Apple should find other ways to save on cost to bring the price down.
I think most people would prefer a beautiful product with high end materials even if the phone doesn't have a Retina display. For the price range I don't think a Retina display is make or break considering Samdung also uses low res screens in the low to mid tier price smartphones.
So let's think about this... It's ok for Samsung's FLAGSHIP phone to use plastic, but Apple's cheap phone can't?
Yes, except the phone is meant for people who do not know what a Retina Screen is or do not care that much. Apple brought the iPad Mini out without Retina and it quickly became the best selling iPad. Retina is nice, but not necessary. With that said, considering the iPod Touch has Retina at a much lower price point, I am not convinced Apple will discard Retina.
I guess Apple, however, will use the iPhone 4S internals because of lawsuit matters tied to the iPhone 4.
I agree. This phone is for a different market and a different subset of buyer. The entire premise of this phone is its for people that have never had an iPhone or a smartphone before. They're expectations are different from current iPhone owners.
Apple wants current iPhone owners to upgrade to the more profitable 5S so this new cheaper phone probably won't include any features that will entice current owners to downgrade to it.
I don't know if the phone will have retina or not but it seems like a feasible feature to cut that would save Apple money on the screen, processor and battery easily. But as you said since the iPod touch has retina this new phone very well may have a retina screen.
Of course, but the original statement was "leaving (non-lightning, non-retina) behind." Not manufacturing the devices anymore certainly qualifies IMO. Additionally, because they are (hypothetically/presumably) switching to this new manufacturing model, they won't be selling last year's or the year before's products anymore either. It would be (hypothetically/presumably), the iPhone, and the "cheap" variant each year instead.
Also, the iPad mini is already lightning equipped as is the iPad 4. The iPad 4 and the iPad 3 are both already retina. The iPhone 4 and the iPhone 4s are similarly retina (despite being 30 pin), but the iPhone 4 would fall into officially unsupported territory this cycle anyway.
So overall, there would be no more manufacturing of non-retina and non-lightning devices and other than the original iPad mini. All available devices, even ones so old as to be worthless at this point, would be retina. The iPhone 4s and the iPad 2 & 3 would be the last of the 30 pin stock, but other than second hand, they wouldn't have a single non-retina, non-lightning product for sale right from the moment they switched to this new strategy with the cheap phone.
Yep.
I'm guessing they'll still have remaining stock of the 5 for sale for a while too. Pretty hard to wind down inventory perfectly. But if this uses the same basic internals as the 5, that would allow production to continue (just the case would be different).
I wonder if NAND prices have fallen. It's been a while since 16GB was set as the floor. Perhaps the 5S will start at 32GB, while the "lite" will only be sold at 16GB. That would shave a bit off the selling price, considering how Apple prices storage.
I know, I just think it's funny. It's also a slam against Samsung in a way.
True!
But I will say the plastic Samdung uses in the S4 looks nicer than the plastic on these supposed iPhone Lites.
I'm sincerely hoping these are fake. I don't doubt the rumor a cheap iPhone is coming this year, but I'm hoping for a more inspired design even if they are plastic.
Comments
I remember tons of people online saying the iPhone 4 leaks were fake, and Apple would NEVER make something like that...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan
Right now Apple is selling the iPhone 4 as the cheaper iPhone option in many countries. So they're going to replace it with a plastic phone that doesn't have a retina display? And charge $400 or more for it (most people agree it won't be any cheaper). I can already see people making fun asking "does it deserve to exist?" There is absolutely nothing you describe that sounds premium. And I've always thought of Apple as a premium brand. In fact this sounds like something cheap you'd get from an Android OEM, except the price will be a lot more.
I guess you completely forgot about the iPhone 3G & 3GS...
Quote:
Originally Posted by ddawson100
Can't be actual products. They don't say "Made in California".
You mean... "Designed by Apple in California Assembled in China"
Quote:
Originally Posted by RedGeminiPA
You mean... "Designed by Apple in California Assembled in China"
Oops - that's what I meant. Could have looked at my iPhone before typing that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan
Right now Apple is selling the iPhone 4 as the cheaper iPhone option in many countries. So they're going to replace it with a plastic phone that doesn't have a retina display? And charge $400 or more for it (most people agree it won't be any cheaper). I can already see people making fun asking "does it deserve to exist?" There is absolutely nothing you describe that sounds premium. And I've always thought of Apple as a premium brand. In fact this sounds like something cheap you'd get from an Android OEM, except the price will be a lot more.
For one the iPhone 4 has 3 year old internals, hence why it could be sold for $449.
We're talking about a phone that will have a 4 inch screen and last years internals. How can Apple cut 40-60% off the price while retaining margins for this new phone. That's why I'm postulating Apple could resort to a non-Retina screen in order to cut cost and increase the desirability of the 5S.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan
No. And they certainly were an anomaly that didn't last long.
I wouldn't consider the 3G/3GS anomolies considering Apple sold the form factor for 4 years from 2008-2012.
Where is the leagalese? If these were for production, the fine print would be there...right?
Quote:
Originally Posted by ddawson100
Oops - that's what I meant. Could have looked at my iPhone before typing that.
I've heard they are going to change the wording to simply, "Made in California Motherfuckers!" with a little emoticon of a hand giving the middle finger underneath.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Atashi
I remember when the iBook first came out. I got one of the neon lime green ones. It was fun at the time.
Bingo. Besides the claim shell iBooks, Apple also had lime Green (and orange) iMacs as well. Also who could forget the Dalmatian and Flower Power iMacs. You are right at the time they really stood out.
To me this plastic cheaper iPhone goes against Apple's ethos of wanting to make great products and Tim Cook's comment that making money is not their "North Star". If Apple is going to play in the cheaper space it will be harder to command a premium price if people think the device itself isn't premium. That's why I hope these leaks are wrong and this is just some cheap knockoff based on rumors.
I think it was an anomaly in terms of Apple's design language. Honestly I'd love to ask Steve or J.Ive what the thought was behind going from aluminum to plastic and now we're back to aluminum again.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan
Right now Apple is selling the iPhone 4 as the cheaper iPhone option in many countries. So they're going to replace it with a plastic phone that doesn't have a retina display? And charge $400 or more for it (most people agree it won't be any cheaper). I can already see people making fun asking "does it deserve to exist?" There is absolutely nothing you describe that sounds premium. And I've always thought of Apple as a premium brand. In fact this sounds like something cheap you'd get from an Android OEM, except the price will be a lot more.
Yes, except the phone is meant for people who do not know what a Retina Screen is or do not care that much. Apple brought the iPad Mini out without Retina and it quickly became the best selling iPad. Retina is nice, but not necessary. With that said, considering the iPod Touch has Retina at a much lower price point, I am not convinced Apple will discard Retina.
I guess Apple, however, will use the iPhone 4S internals because of lawsuit matters tied to the iPhone 4.
At the time of the 3G release Apple also still sold the plastic MacBooks so there was less of negative vibes toward plastic at Apple. I don't think Steve or Ive would regret that design.
Anyway as far as the new phone I do agree that I would prefer it not be plastic. Apple should find other ways to save on cost to bring the price down.
I think most people would prefer a beautiful product with high end materials even if the phone doesn't have a Retina display. For the price range I don't think a Retina display is make or break considering Samdung also uses low res screens in the low to mid tier price smartphones.
So let's think about this... It's ok for Samsung's FLAGSHIP phone to use plastic, but Apple's cheap phone can't?
I agree. This phone is for a different market and a different subset of buyer. The entire premise of this phone is its for people that have never had an iPhone or a smartphone before. They're expectations are different from current iPhone owners.
Apple wants current iPhone owners to upgrade to the more profitable 5S so this new cheaper phone probably won't include any features that will entice current owners to downgrade to it.
I don't know if the phone will have retina or not but it seems like a feasible feature to cut that would save Apple money on the screen, processor and battery easily. But as you said since the iPod touch has retina this new phone very well may have a retina screen.
Yep.
I'm guessing they'll still have remaining stock of the 5 for sale for a while too. Pretty hard to wind down inventory perfectly. But if this uses the same basic internals as the 5, that would allow production to continue (just the case would be different).
I wonder if NAND prices have fallen. It's been a while since 16GB was set as the floor. Perhaps the 5S will start at 32GB, while the "lite" will only be sold at 16GB. That would shave a bit off the selling price, considering how Apple prices storage.
Well of course it's "ok" for Apple to do whatever the heck they want.
I personally would prefer they avoid plastic in order strengthen their current brand ethos of using aluminum and glass exclusively.
I know, I just think it's funny. It's also a slam against Samsung in a way.
True!
But I will say the plastic Samdung uses in the S4 looks nicer than the plastic on these supposed iPhone Lites.
I'm sincerely hoping these are fake. I don't doubt the rumor a cheap iPhone is coming this year, but I'm hoping for a more inspired design even if they are plastic.