The bigger problem is the extension of the settlement beyond e-books to TV, music, etc. How the hell is that supposed to work? Must Apple run all contracts with all content providers everywhere past Google, Amazon, Samsung, MS, B&N, etc. first to see if they think it's fair? It's the single most anti-competitive, anti-business BS I have ever seen. It's as if the DOJ wants to put Apple out of business entirely!
Exactly. And what about apps? Are they required to encourage their app vendors to write for Android and Windows Mobile, as well?
Itunes on PC is perfect example of why apple should not do as suggest above.
From what I hear, Apple has done a less-than-satisfactory job of porting iTunes to PCs. A lot of folks I know complain about bloatware (I don't know this first-hand since I am not a PC user). In making my point, I am assuming that Apple will do a decent job of it.
Moreover, you appear to have missed the main point of my post, which really was that Apple's software -- done right -- would be the gateway for its hardware.
Just another example of government sticking its nose where it doesn't belong. If Amazon and Barnes and Noble want the business and have a less expensive product then let them market it on their own. No difference in this and obamaphones. The payers for the service have to subsidize the moochers.
The bigger problem is the extension of the settlement beyond e-books to TV, music, etc. How the hell is that supposed to work? Must Apple run all contracts with all content providers everywhere past Google, Amazon, Samsung, MS, B&N, etc. first to see if they think it's fair? It's the single most anti-competitive, anti-business BS I have ever seen. It's as if the DOJ wants to put Apple out of business entirely!
Seems a bit expansive to me as well. Perhaps it's in the same vein as the recent Google settlement where the government wanted to preemptively deal with some other potential issues in other market areas rather than slogging thru everything again in the near future.
If the DOJ really wanted to do something for the book-buying consumer, they would mandate that the ebook files had to be cross-compatible between devices. Of course, that's not why they're doing this; they're doing this to advance the careers of lawyers at the DOJ.
Whats up.. Doj is is now amazons crony ? One way settelments to benifit others and hurt apple. Thus is insane. Apple should apeal... If apple shlud put links so should every other book seller .. I including amazon .
And hiw did this even get to music deals? Absoultly insane... Doj and itc are both in bed with someone out there..!
BEST SOLUTION IS, APPLE SHOULD REJECT THE AMAZON APP
Except, that would likely hurt apple's bottom line. How much money does apple make from restricting people from buying books through amazon? I'm sure it's quite a bit, but compared to the money apple makes selling ipads and iphones, it's nothing.
Now consider a consumer's perspective. Many consumers have invested quite a bit into buying amazon ebooks in the past. Many of these same consumers are also apple customers. If apple blocks amazon's apps, do you think these people would want to buy an ipad in the future? They'd think about how apple screwed them over, leaving them with a $500+ device that they can't view THEIR content on. Additionally people without a tablet but with amazon ebooks would seriously think twice before buying an ipad, and would look much more favorably on competing tablets.
Let's say there's ~1 million people in this category, and half of them would decide to not buy an ipad in the future. The cost would then be $500*500,000*40%=$100,000,000 or so (assuming a 40% margin) over a couple year time period. Definitely not huge, but not chump change.
But at the same time, apple is making money on ebooks from the 500,000 or so people that now decided to buy their ebooks from apple instead of amazon (so they can use apple devices). Lets assume each one would buy 10 books over the same time period... this would yield $15*10*500,000*30%=$22,500,000. Sounds like apple would make the right decision in attempting to screw amazon over like this... I'm sure apple's accountants would agree.
Sure, this is an overly simplistic model, as I'm guessing on margins, the number of people, number of ebooks purchased and percent that would stay/leave apple, but, this analysis would be the exact same regardless of how many people are involved. obviously if the percentage of people affected was different, the number of people would vary, but even if only 10% defected, that would mean $50,000,000 in lost ipad profits, and a gain of ~$40,000,000 profit in ebook sales. That still wouldn't make it worthwhile. That still means a loss of $10,000,000 in profits by trying to stick it to amazon.
Yeah, acting vengeful might sound great when you're an angry apple zealot, but apple doesn't give a shit what you think, all they care about is making the most money they can.
Well, english is a second language to me, was born and raise in french and still work in french too. So there are some glitches. Thanks to pointing it out, so I can improve myself. Funny thing is when I wrote that word I hesitated and knew something was wrong, but could not figure out what.
Not a problem. That happens to me quite often. I'll use a phrase or a word that I think is correct but, for some reason, just feels wrong ... what to do? ... Sometimes we should go with our "gut feeling" ... and keep our fingers crossed. Anyway, cheers and have a great day. ...btw, I'll bet your English is a lot better than my French.
Please take the time to learn the difference between... there and their ... it will make you appear to be more intelligent and will make your posts seem more relevent. Just sayin' ...
Well, english is a second language to me, was born and raise in french and still work in french too. So there are some glitches. Thanks to pointing it out, so I can improve myself. Funny thing is when I wrote that word I hesitated and knew something was wrong, but could not figure out what.
Keep cool herbapou. English is a foreign language to most Americans ;-)
Whats up.. Doj is is now amazons crony ?
One way settelments to benifit others and hurt apple.
Thus is insane.
Apple should apeal... !
They already did.
However, it's worth nothing that there's a major misunderstanding in this thread. The requirement being proposed is what the DOJ asked for. The court has not ordered it.
The DOJ settlement would also go beyond e-books, prohibiting Apple from entering agreements with suppliers of "music, movies, television shows or other content that are likely to increase the prices at which Apple's competitor retailers may sell that content."
The DOJ's settlement proposal didn't say the above, Apple's response did.
I am not in favor of restricting "music, movies, television shows or other content" deals with regards to this settlement. It can also be debated whether the DOJ proposal includes it, but I do find it wrong to imply that the DOJ included that statement in their settlement proposal.
Corrupt and anticompetitive offer from a corrupt administration. We all know that Jeff Bezos, Eric Schmidt and Google employees helped get this administration elected. This is just payback time. it's so obvious why the Obama administration hates Apple. Amazon and Google give their products away and all their constituents benefit from it. Amazon is the worst. It is just like a big and controlling government. It is rapidly taking over industry after industry and selling everything at cost. Amazon makes no money and will continue to make no money. They are loved by the Obama administration because they give everything away at cost or below cost. It is crowding out all other businesses like Apple who want to make a profit. I don't believe Amazon will ever make money....it is just an arm of government taking over every industry and giving the products away at the detriment of every other business. In the short run, it is great for consumers and that's whisper this administration is so friendly to them. In the long term, it is killing competition with predatory pricing. The DOJ will never investigate them for this because Obamas followers all benefit.
I can't believe the replies in this thread. People would be furious if Microsoft disallowed iTunes on Windiows and only allowed content purchased through their own media store. Amazon, BN and other ebook resellers ought to be allowed to put their own stores back into their apps. It is more convenient for those of us using those apps and costs Apple nothing while generating bad will, bad press and legal judgements.
Apple is not required to put Amazon or any other links into their iBook store. They are being requested to simply compete and allow everyone else to do what they do which is hit a button and go to a store to buy a book within their respective apps.
I can't believe the replies in this thread. People would be furious if Microsoft disallowed iTunes on Windiows and only allowed content purchased through their own media store. Amazon, BN and other ebook resellers ought to be allowed to put their own stores back into their apps. It is more convenient for those of us using those apps and costs Apple nothing while generating bad will, bad press and legal judgements.
Apple is not required to put Amazon or any other links into their iBook store. They are being requested to simply compete and allow everyone else to do what they do which is hit a button and go to a store to buy a book within their respective apps.
Apple does not have a monopoly in cell phones. It doesn't even have a majority. So if you don't want iBookstore or iTunes, you're free to try your luck with Android.
The only people thinks this is a good idea are DOJ and Android/Amazon fanbois. DOJ is overreaching into Apple's business models. What then after 2-yrs? Are they studying the effects and then go after Amazon? This is one of the silliest lawsuit in tech in recent years.
Comments
Exactly. And what about apps? Are they required to encourage their app vendors to write for Android and Windows Mobile, as well?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maestro64
Itunes on PC is perfect example of why apple should not do as suggest above.
From what I hear, Apple has done a less-than-satisfactory job of porting iTunes to PCs. A lot of folks I know complain about bloatware (I don't know this first-hand since I am not a PC user). In making my point, I am assuming that Apple will do a decent job of it.
Moreover, you appear to have missed the main point of my post, which really was that Apple's software -- done right -- would be the gateway for its hardware.
Don't want to pay 30%? Release it for free. Don't be greedy.
What do you mean servers, maintenance, and credit card transactions cost money?
Seems a bit expansive to me as well. Perhaps it's in the same vein as the recent Google settlement where the government wanted to preemptively deal with some other potential issues in other market areas rather than slogging thru everything again in the near future.
If the DOJ really wanted to do something for the book-buying consumer, they would mandate that the ebook files had to be cross-compatible between devices. Of course, that's not why they're doing this; they're doing this to advance the careers of lawyers at the DOJ.
One way settelments to benifit others and hurt apple.
Thus is insane.
Apple should apeal...
If apple shlud put links so should every other book seller .. I including amazon .
And hiw did this even get to music deals?
Absoultly insane... Doj and itc are both in bed with someone out there..!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chandra69
BEST SOLUTION IS, APPLE SHOULD REJECT THE AMAZON APP
Except, that would likely hurt apple's bottom line. How much money does apple make from restricting people from buying books through amazon? I'm sure it's quite a bit, but compared to the money apple makes selling ipads and iphones, it's nothing.
Now consider a consumer's perspective. Many consumers have invested quite a bit into buying amazon ebooks in the past. Many of these same consumers are also apple customers. If apple blocks amazon's apps, do you think these people would want to buy an ipad in the future? They'd think about how apple screwed them over, leaving them with a $500+ device that they can't view THEIR content on. Additionally people without a tablet but with amazon ebooks would seriously think twice before buying an ipad, and would look much more favorably on competing tablets.
Let's say there's ~1 million people in this category, and half of them would decide to not buy an ipad in the future. The cost would then be $500*500,000*40%=$100,000,000 or so (assuming a 40% margin) over a couple year time period. Definitely not huge, but not chump change.
But at the same time, apple is making money on ebooks from the 500,000 or so people that now decided to buy their ebooks from apple instead of amazon (so they can use apple devices). Lets assume each one would buy 10 books over the same time period... this would yield $15*10*500,000*30%=$22,500,000. Sounds like apple would make the right decision in attempting to screw amazon over like this... I'm sure apple's accountants would agree.
Sure, this is an overly simplistic model, as I'm guessing on margins, the number of people, number of ebooks purchased and percent that would stay/leave apple, but, this analysis would be the exact same regardless of how many people are involved. obviously if the percentage of people affected was different, the number of people would vary, but even if only 10% defected, that would mean $50,000,000 in lost ipad profits, and a gain of ~$40,000,000 profit in ebook sales. That still wouldn't make it worthwhile. That still means a loss of $10,000,000 in profits by trying to stick it to amazon.
Yeah, acting vengeful might sound great when you're an angry apple zealot, but apple doesn't give a shit what you think, all they care about is making the most money they can.
Phil
Well, english is a second language to me, was born and raise in french and still work in french too. So there are some glitches. Thanks to pointing it out, so I can improve myself. Funny thing is when I wrote that word I hesitated and knew something was wrong, but could not figure out what.
Not a problem. That happens to me quite often. I'll use a phrase or a word that I think is correct but, for some reason, just feels wrong ... what to do? ... Sometimes we should go with our "gut feeling" ... and keep our fingers crossed. Anyway, cheers and have a great day. ...btw, I'll bet your English is a lot better than my French.Quote:
Originally Posted by herbapou
Quote:
Originally Posted by newbee
Please take the time to learn the difference between... there and their ... it will make you appear to be more intelligent and will make your posts seem more relevent. Just sayin' ...
Well, english is a second language to me, was born and raise in french and still work in french too. So there are some glitches. Thanks to pointing it out, so I can improve myself. Funny thing is when I wrote that word I hesitated and knew something was wrong, but could not figure out what.
Keep cool herbapou. English is a foreign language to most Americans ;-)
They already did.
However, it's worth nothing that there's a major misunderstanding in this thread. The requirement being proposed is what the DOJ asked for. The court has not ordered it.
The DOJ settlement would also go beyond e-books, prohibiting Apple from entering agreements with suppliers of "music, movies, television shows or other content that are likely to increase the prices at which Apple's competitor retailers may sell that content."
The DOJ's settlement proposal didn't say the above, Apple's response did.
I am not in favor of restricting "music, movies, television shows or other content" deals with regards to this settlement. It can also be debated whether the DOJ proposal includes it, but I do find it wrong to imply that the DOJ included that statement in their settlement proposal.
Then demand Amazon etc match them as per the DoJ agreements.
It would only cost a few Billion and drive sales of iOS devices.
Strangle this rotten abuse of justice at the roots.
In a price war between Amazon and Apple, Apple will win - Amazon is a money losing operation.
Sort of.
Amazon is losing money, but they do have positive cash flow. Still, the share price is vastly inflated regardless of which multiple you choose.
They just announced that they're hiring thousands of employees - which will reduce their margins even more. Should make my AMZN puts perform nicely.
Apple is not required to put Amazon or any other links into their iBook store. They are being requested to simply compete and allow everyone else to do what they do which is hit a button and go to a store to buy a book within their respective apps.
Apple does not have a monopoly in cell phones. It doesn't even have a majority. So if you don't want iBookstore or iTunes, you're free to try your luck with Android.