Microsoft CEO Steve Ballmer calls it quits, to retire within a year

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Comments

  • Reply 201 of 330
    pmzpmz Posts: 3,433member
    Until they ditch Windows 8 scheme and Metro entirely, they are still hosed.
  • Reply 202 of 330
    tallest skiltallest skil Posts: 43,388member

    Originally Posted by pmz View Post


    Until they ditch Windows 8 scheme and Metro entirely, they are still hosed.


     


    When's 8.1 supposed to come out, again? image

  • Reply 203 of 330
    freerangefreerange Posts: 1,595member
    woodbine wrote: »
    Elop on the way up maybe......?

    Not likely - he is next to go on the chopping block!
  • Reply 204 of 330
    rayzrayz Posts: 814member
    soloman wrote: »
    Ok, so what will work?

    Stop trying to copy Apple's strategy and instead copy Apple's philosophy: Don't be afraid to burn everything you've built in exchange for a better future.

    Microsoft is where it is today because they couldn't bring themselves to look beyond Windows. If they had stuck with the Courier concept then I'm pretty sure that the iPad would never have cornered the market.

    Tech companies goes through the same life cycle: a shot at changing the world, huge profits, a series of hubris-charged management blunders and then a quiet, comfortable retirement milking existing products or selling services and consultancy.

    The only companies that escape this fate are the ones with the courage to remake themselves.

    All this talk about becoming a devices and services company is all very well, but what they really mean is that they want to become a Windows device and services company. They are already limiting themselves in order to hang on to a legacy.
  • Reply 205 of 330
    Proctor & Gamble called. They want him back.
  • Reply 206 of 330
    When's 8.1 supposed to come out, again? <img alt="1tongue.gif" id="user_yui_3_10_0_1_1377310341339_1320" src="http://forums-files.appleinsider.com/images/smilies/1tongue.gif" style="line-height:1.231;" name="user_yui_3_10_0_1_1377310341339_1320">

    Windows 7 is still available.
  • Reply 207 of 330
    ratsgratsg Posts: 53member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Suddenly Newton View Post





    Windows 7 is still available.


     


    Don't anyone fool yourselves here.  It peaked at win 95.  Even Bill G. said so.

     

  • Reply 208 of 330
    nikiloknikilok Posts: 383member
    ascii wrote: »
    still work full time and there's no realistic alternative to MS Office in the workplace. Universities are different - I did a masters (part time) a few years ago and everyone just used whatever office suite they wanted and the academics didn't care. Perhaps Apple could make inroads there, if enough people share your evaluation (and not mine) of the product.

    That is not true, iWorks can go mainstream in corporations were iPads are in big numbers.
  • Reply 209 of 330
    philboogiephilboogie Posts: 7,674member
    gazoobee wrote: »
    philboogie wrote: »

    I think those are great ads but they're really ads for a camera.  

    If Apple can make a better camera for the iPhone (and you know they are working on it), then all of a sudden Nokia has nothing.  

    Indeed. And MegaPixels don't count anymore. A larger aperture does, and if the f2.0 in the new phone is true, I'll be a happy camper.
    mhikl wrote: »
    The Muse Does Call Upon These Times

    Interesting is the story then
    To tell if the reign of error do end.
    So Steve, to a retirement home,
    And there to chew upon a bone.

    MS when he bids adieu,
    Fifty-fifty say renew.
    But many doubts some shall have,
    That Stevie's lips might rest, at last.

    Nice! Is this also yours?

    1000


    SpreadSheet Jockey?

    LOL

    AFAICT, Only a few features are absent from the iCloud Beta and the iDevice apps... Things like Bezier Curves, Categories/Pivot Tables... I don't believe most people use these...

    Don't forget charts:

    700
  • Reply 210 of 330
    nikon133nikon133 Posts: 2,600member
    rogifan wrote: »
    What are you talking about? Microsoft is the 3rd or 4th most valuable company in the world. They basically own the enterprise. Microsoft is FAR from being run in to the ground.

    What people here refuse to accept s quite simple; Microsoft cannot go down. Not today, not in the next 10 years. And since no one seems to be able and/or willing to invest money and effort to build alternative ecosystem, you can just as well add couple of more decades to that. If Microsoft would really be on their way to oblivion, US and pretty much every other developed country would jump in with billions of dollars and ask if they can give more.

    And the reason is really simple. Regardless of what people think of MS's consumer products, they are one of pillars of enterprise world, with large corporations and governments being their most loyal customers. In some occasion, replacing their products on that level - servers, services and applications - at worst would not be possible with existing alternatives, at best would be possible but not worth it - keeping MS afloat would be easier, regardless of price.

    It is different in consumer segment, and I actually think MS should receive some good drubbing in years to come. Less dominant they find themselves in consumer desktop/laptop markets, more competitive they will be, and more willing to listen to customers.

    But regardless, their future is quite safe. They are not trying to enter new (for them) markets because it is make-it-or-break-it for them, but because they basically have nowhere to grow in enterprise, and hardly anywhere in home segments. Even if apple would decide to retreat from PC market completely, what would Microsoft get? Extra 5% worldwide? Hardly front page worth material. Thus they are pushing into segments they have low presence. But opposite to Blackberries and Nokias of the world, it is not their last chance to survive. Maybe it is last chance to become relevant in those markets (though I'm doubtful about that as well), but even if they completely flop, their survival is pretty much given. And in a few years, something new will emerge and race will start again.

    It is pity no one can really challenge MS on corporate level, and it is not so because no one can come out with good product for that market, but because of legacy nature of that segment. This, I cannot see to change any time soon.
  • Reply 211 of 330
    nikon133nikon133 Posts: 2,600member
    nikilok wrote: »
    That is not true, iWorks can go mainstream in corporations were iPads are in big numbers.

    It can't. Every medium to large business already have gigabytes if not terabytes of existing documents, and many will send and receive documents to their partners, customers, associates, contractors. In corporate space, it is all about compatibility and legacy support.

    Undeniably there are other scenarios, but most our customers who are using iPads are using them for non-document tasks - emails, calendar, other means of communication (Lync etc.). Some PDF viewing at best. Anything document-intensive is still locked to desktops and laptops. You should be able to RDS to terminal server and run document-editing application from there (depending on security rules for each site), but you still need Office on terminal server, and you still need to have enough Office licenses to cover for all users or devices.

    Volume licensing is Microsoft's bread & butter for a reason.
  • Reply 212 of 330
    nikon133nikon133 Posts: 2,600member
    rayz wrote: »
    Stop trying to copy Apple's strategy and instead copy Apple's philosophy: Don't be afraid to burn everything you've built in exchange for a better future.

    Microsoft is where it is today because they couldn't bring themselves to look beyond Windows. If they had stuck with the Courier concept then I'm pretty sure that the iPad would never have cornered the market.

    Tech companies goes through the same life cycle: a shot at changing the world, huge profits, a series of hubris-charged management blunders and then a quiet, comfortable retirement milking existing products or selling services and consultancy.

    The only companies that escape this fate are the ones with the courage to remake themselves.

    All this talk about becoming a devices and services company is all very well, but what they really mean is that they want to become a Windows device and services company. They are already limiting themselves in order to hang on to a legacy.

    Legacy is requirement of huge majority of MS customers, and most dependable ones as well. Legacy is also what prevents those customers to look elsewhere. It is Microsoft's lifeline, and their insurance. Cutting it off would be equivalent of shooting yourself in head and hoping that, instead of killing you, trauma will activate dormant part of your brain and give you special mental powers.

    Nor do they have to cut it. No matter what they do, they will not gather much in servers/desktops/laptops markets. Microsoft does not care how much money OEM makes of each sold computer, because Microsoft makes money of windows (and Office) licensing, not of hardware sold. Even if every OEM is making expensive premium machines like Apple does, Microsoft would make same money. Probably less as people would replace their machines even less frequently.

    But there are a lot of new possibilities for them, regardless of their legacy nature. Actually, because of them. Realistically, if you think about what smartphones and tablets have best potential to work flawlessly with Microsoft "legacy" - Exchange, SharePoint, Lync, AD? - I think most will agree that Microsoft tablets and smartphones are the ones. It is really not different from iPhone/iPad/iTunes/AppStore ecosystem, only on corporate instead of consumer level. I was told that latest Exchange server already has some nice management features for Windows Phone devices, and Windows 8 Pro tablets are completely applicable to corporate requirements in AD, group policies, management software and fundamental files and services compatibility. I think that especially Google is aware and worried with that potential, thus trying to slow down or stop those platforms growth by denying them (quality) access to their services like YouTube or Google Maps.
  • Reply 213 of 330
    blackbookblackbook Posts: 1,361member
    nikon133 wrote: »
    What people here refuse to accept s quite simple; Microsoft cannot go down. Not today, not in the next 10 years. And since no one seems to be able and/or willing to invest money and effort to build alternative ecosystem, you can just as well add couple of more decades to that. If Microsoft would really be on their way to oblivion, US and pretty much every other developed country would jump in with billions of dollars and ask if they can give more.

    And the reason is really simple. Regardless of what people think of MS's consumer products, they are one of pillars of enterprise world, with large corporations and governments being their most loyal customers. In some occasion, replacing their products on that level - servers, services and applications - at worst would not be possible with existing alternatives, at best would be possible but not worth it - keeping MS afloat would be easier, regardless of price.

    It is different in consumer segment, and I actually think MS should receive some good drubbing in years to come. Less dominant they find themselves in consumer desktop/laptop markets, more competitive they will be, and more willing to listen to customers.

    But regardless, their future is quite safe. They are not trying to enter new (for them) markets because it is make-it-or-break-it for them, but because they basically have nowhere to grow in enterprise, and hardly anywhere in home segments. Even if apple would decide to retreat from PC market completely, what would Microsoft get? Extra 5% worldwide? Hardly front page worth material. Thus they are pushing into segments they have low presence. But opposite to Blackberries and Nokias of the world, it is not their last chance to survive. Maybe it is last chance to become relevant in those markets (though I'm doubtful about that as well), but even if they completely flop, their survival is pretty much given. And in a few years, something new will emerge and race will start again.

    It is pity no one can really challenge MS on corporate level, and it is not so because no one can come out with good product for that market, but because of legacy nature of that segment. This, I cannot see to change any time soon.

    Yup.

    Microsoft is in no danger and they're still a highly profitable company.

    As you said they aren't going anywhere and will remain a pretty large force in the market for decades to come.

    Even with their open failures under Ballmer, during this time we've seen their most ingenious product yet. Office 365.

    Now Microsoft will have a consistent cash cow that will keep their coffers full every month of the year.

    With their strangle hold on corporations already in place I'm surprised no one else at Redmond thought of a subscription service model until now.

    Microsofts profits are sure to go up with every corporation and government moving to the subscription based 365 service, so we'll see Microsoft around at least as a corporate player for decades to come.

    But 365 will be good for iOS as well. Microsoft is bring 365 support to iOS devices so people no longer need to clamor for Microsoft to make a native office app.

    IMO 365 for iOS also relegates iWork on iCloud to a consumer niche and not a business tool
  • Reply 214 of 330
    jragostajragosta Posts: 10,473member
    nikon133 wrote: »
    It can't. Every medium to large business already have gigabytes if not terabytes of existing documents, and many will send and receive documents to their partners, customers, associates, contractors. In corporate space, it is all about compatibility and legacy support.

    Undeniably there are other scenarios, but most our customers who are using iPads are using them for non-document tasks - emails, calendar, other means of communication (Lync etc.). Some PDF viewing at best. Anything document-intensive is still locked to desktops and laptops. You should be able to RDS to terminal server and run document-editing application from there (depending on security rules for each site), but you still need Office on terminal server, and you still need to have enough Office licenses to cover for all users or devices.

    Volume licensing is Microsoft's bread & butter for a reason.

    None of that disproves the statement that iWorks can catch on based on the success of the iPad.

    While there are exceptions, iPads are generally used for content consumption more than content creation. And iWorks will read most of those gigabytes or terabytes of files you're talking about. More importantly, the vast majority of those files are not something that would likely be accessed remotely, anyway. If you're at a level in the organization (CFO, perhaps) where you need access to all that data, you're probably not going to be using an iPad for your remote access. iPads will generally be used by sales people, service people, support people, and so on - and they need a much more limited set of those documents. Since iWorks can read Word and Excel and PowerPoint documents, that will be more than sufficient for most people.

    Of course, one could argue that if you're simply using iWorks to read and write in Office format that it doesn't have a major impact on the MS Office monopoly, but that's a different argument.
  • Reply 215 of 330
    MacProMacPro Posts: 19,523member
    rayz wrote: »
    Stop trying to copy Apple's strategy and instead copy Apple's philosophy: Don't be afraid to burn everything you've built in exchange for a better future.

    Microsoft is where it is today because they couldn't bring themselves to look beyond Windows. If they had stuck with the Courier concept then I'm pretty sure that the iPad would never have cornered the market.

    Tech companies goes through the same life cycle: a shot at changing the world, huge profits, a series of hubris-charged management blunders and then a quiet, comfortable retirement milking existing products or selling services and consultancy.

    The only companies that escape this fate are the ones with the courage to remake themselves.

    All this talk about becoming a devices and services company is all very well, but what they really mean is that they want to become a Windows device and services company. They are already limiting themselves in order to hang on to a legacy.

    You are 100% correct. Poor Microsoft had little choice though. There entire history relied upon using Apple as their R&D department, right up until OS X and iOS and they were simply left outside in the rain after that.
  • Reply 216 of 330
    MacProMacPro Posts: 19,523member
    jragosta wrote: »
    None of that disproves the statement that iWorks can catch on based on the success of the iPad.

    While there are exceptions, iPads are generally used for content consumption more than content creation. And iWorks will read most of those gigabytes or terabytes of files you're talking about. More importantly, the vast majority of those files are not something that would likely be accessed remotely, anyway. If you're at a level in the organization (CFO, perhaps) where you need access to all that data, you're probably not going to be using an iPad for your remote access. iPads will generally be used by sales people, service people, support people, and so on - and they need a much more limited set of those documents. Since iWorks can read Word and Excel and PowerPoint documents, that will be more than sufficient for most people.

    Of course, one could argue that if you're simply using iWorks to read and write in Office format that it doesn't have a major impact on the MS Office monopoly, but that's a different argument.

    I agree, people couldn't really care less what the application is called if it opens their legacy files and works well. Put that on vastly superior and more flexible hardware with mobile and cloud, all working seamlessly and you have a winner. Apple should consider a version of iWorks for pros as with Garage Band and Logic Pro.
  • Reply 217 of 330

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by nikon133 View Post





    What people here refuse to accept s quite simple; Microsoft cannot go down.


     


    "What people" would that be?


     


    I read through this entire thing and I didn't see anyone refusing to accept that Microsoft cannot go down (for lack of a better term).


     


    I give the board much more credit than that.


     


    Microsoft will be around for a long time. Without a proper mobile strategy, though, in 10 years they will be 2/3 of what they are today and 1/2 in 20 years... maybe less.

  • Reply 218 of 330
    MacProMacPro Posts: 19,523member
    nikon133 wrote: »
    What people here refuse to accept s quite simple; Microsoft cannot go down. Not today, not in the next 10 years. And since no one seems to be able and/or willing to invest money and effort to build alternative ecosystem, you can just as well add couple of more decades to that. If Microsoft would really be on their way to oblivion, US and pretty much every other developed country would jump in with billions of dollars and ask if they can give more.

    And the reason is really simple. Regardless of what people think of MS's consumer products, they are one of pillars of enterprise world, with large corporations and governments being their most loyal customers. In some occasion, replacing their products on that level - servers, services and applications - at worst would not be possible with existing alternatives, at best would be possible but not worth it - keeping MS afloat would be easier, regardless of price.

    It is different in consumer segment, and I actually think MS should receive some good drubbing in years to come. Less dominant they find themselves in consumer desktop/laptop markets, more competitive they will be, and more willing to listen to customers.

    But regardless, their future is quite safe. They are not trying to enter new (for them) markets because it is make-it-or-break-it for them, but because they basically have nowhere to grow in enterprise, and hardly anywhere in home segments. Even if apple would decide to retreat from PC market completely, what would Microsoft get? Extra 5% worldwide? Hardly front page worth material. Thus they are pushing into segments they have low presence. But opposite to Blackberries and Nokias of the world, it is not their last chance to survive. Maybe it is last chance to become relevant in those markets (though I'm doubtful about that as well), but even if they completely flop, their survival is pretty much given. And in a few years, something new will emerge and race will start again.

    It is pity no one can really challenge MS on corporate level, and it is not so because no one can come out with good product for that market, but because of legacy nature of that segment. This, I cannot see to change any time soon.

    I hate to disagree with such a well written and argued post but I think you vastly over estimate Microsofts staying power as well as, and probably more importantly, the speed things can change. It was seemingly only months ago (in fact years now) folks were arguing on this very forum about Apple entering the phone market … tectonic shifts have occurred since. They can occur any time and do so more often these days, especially in technology.

    Entire countries can undergo vast changes in what seems like the blink of an eye, look at Germany in 1930's or Russia before that and more recently, South Africa, Eastern Europe and so on … the world economy can be tanked by one country's political decisions, just check out America 2001 - 2009.

    To believe one company is somehow so solid, even without taking into account its drastic demise in so many ways over the last decade, is 'head in the sand' thinking. Microsoft can become TWA, Pan Am or Kodak faster than you can say Vista or Zune and it will, my guess 10 years or so.

    p.s. I was a Nikon guy, now solidly Canon … no wonder we disagree … ;)
  • Reply 219 of 330

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post





    I hate to disagree with such a well written and argued post but I think you vastly over estimate Microsofts staying power as well as, and probably more importantly, the speed things can change. It was seemingly only months ago (in fact years now) folks were arguing on this very forum about Apple entering the phone market … tectonic shifts have occurred since. They can occur any time and do so more often these days, especially in technology.



    Entire countries can undergo vast changes in what seems like the blink of an eye, look at Germany in 1930's or Russia before that and more recently, South Africa, Eastern Europe and so on … the world economy can be tanked by one country's political decisions, just check out America 2001 - 2009.



    To believe one company is somehow so solid, even without taking into account its drastic demise in so many ways over the last decade, is 'head in the sand' thinking. Microsoft can become TWA, Pan Am or Kodak faster than you can say Vista or Zune and it will, my guess 10 years or so.



    p.s. I was a Nikon guy, now solidly Canon … no wonder we disagree … image




    Personally, I think Microsoft will become a company like IBM. A large company that is a shadow of its former self* but still relevant in the corporate world because of its services.


     


    [ ... but Ballmer doesn't want Microsoft to be IBM... or Apple ]

    http://news.cnet.com/8301-10805_3-57599909-75/ballmer-microsoft-doesnt-want-to-be-ibm-or-apple/


     


    * addendum - IBM is actually doing quite well... not a shadow of its former self at all. Maybe they will buy Microsoft in 10 years.  image

  • Reply 220 of 330
    MacProMacPro Posts: 19,523member

    Personally, I think Microsoft will become a company like IBM. A large company that is a shadow of its former self but still relevant in the corporate world because of its services.

    I know that's seen as their only hope but several other companies have the same idea, even, Dell I think under one plan, HP maybe? I suspect that market is already well served and the sudden rush to escape their failures in the consumer market by these companies will be the beginning of the end for them as they fail to make the move and get caught in-between with no market.

    IBM is one of a hell a company, really the Apple of the enterprise world, making hardware and software as well as bleeding edge supercomputers. Microsoft become like that? In this dimension? Really … :D
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