Odd timing for the Pro. Most businesses don't spend much money on IT between November and early February due to their budget cycles. Small shops might for tax reasons, but it seems to be sub-optimal.
Still holding out hope that it will come in at $2k in order to try and expand its market appeal; the market for a "tower" has dropped a lot since the G5 enclosure debuted.
1) it was preannounced in June to be a 2013 delivery, so the timing of your timing comment is odd;-)
2) 'most businesses' don't use a Mac Pro as a desktops... this is a niche product in a niche market.
3) businesses that do use Mac Pros have been keeping $$ in the budget since before June;-)... even large businesses have their 4th quarter spending splurges to make sure they don't make 'too much' money in a particular quarter [less about taxes, and more about keeping expectations in line])
4) We all want Apple to lower their prices as consumers... but we have to look as 'investors' and think product line placement.
I do agree, that the 'workstation' market is ripe for a disruption.... and a $1999 highly functional base system would be great
Where are the mac mini rumors? Man I'm starting to worry I won't see a haswell mini in 2013.
Just curious- what are you expecting out of a Haswell mini vs an Ivy Bridge mini outside of a minor power consumption savings and Wireless AC? Performance-wise, it will be identical to the 2012 (if the iMac is any indication)- unless you go SSD.
Haswell is the most underwhelming desktop processor "upgrade" that has ever come out. For Laptops it is arguably the best, but for desktop its inconsequential.
Well a topped out iMac is current 2800BP(with VAT) or $4500USD before state sales taxes.
It's in Mac Pro territory.
and really, I think that's what Apple wants (or it thinks it's largest set of High End consumers want).
We are budgeting $10k for each of our Mac Pros. That is in line with the near topped out previous Pro prices. $2500 will get you a nice home computer, but most of us spend much more.
Just curious- what are you expecting out of a Haswell mini vs an Ivy Bridge mini outside of a minor power consumption savings and Wireless AC? Performance-wise, it will be identical to the 2012 (if the iMac is any indication)- unless you go SSD.
Haswell is the most underwhelming desktop processor "upgrade" that has ever come out. For Laptops it is arguably the best, but for desktop its inconsequential.
I expect a much improved GPU. And finally, the new wireless system.
We are budgeting $10k for each of our Mac Pros. That is in line with the near topped out previous Pro prices.
Pretty much what I was thinking.
Intel's latest IB 12 core Xeons are nearly 3k each, and even the lower end firepros(that are worth anything in performance anyway) will add nearly $1000-$1500 for the cost, never mind the higher end options.
Edit: Can't forget, that PCIe Flash especially does not come cheap either.
...and if you want the DVD (which used to be included...IN the price...) you have to pay £60+ extra.
Don't be stingy, Apple...put an external in the box.
Apple. Overpriced for what you get.
Lemon Bon Bon.
Should we send you a box is tissues because Apple releases something you can't afford? Go buy your 200£ Dell then and if that makes you happy then so be it.
One Pro Can. Fill it with your specs. Done. One studio monitor. One can with your 'part susan' specs.
Not likely. And frankly I prefer they not do that unless the mac pro is as inexpensive as the mini. Since that isn't going to happen this would be a loss for everyone. Plus the Mac Pro is too huge to use as a HTPC.
Quote:
But no...they'd rather charge £500 for a computer with no keyboard, mouse or monitor. Or £2045 inc VAT for an out of date and mediocre quad core with crap gpu and no monitor...or push up the prices of their AIO.
Lemon Bon Bon.
Mac Mini 2.5 Ghz i5 (dual core) 4GB RAM, 500GB HDD - £463
Still holding out hope that it will come in at $2k in order to try and expand its market appeal; the market for a "tower" has dropped a lot since the G5 enclosure debuted.
The key thing about the pricing is how much Apple accountants estimate they will save on shipping.
Assuming that the U.S. robots build them as cheaply as China would, Apple saves on shipping both because of the distance-to-market, and because of the new smaller form factor.
Whether that savings is as high as $500 is anyone's guess, but I think that would be pushing it.
I'm still hoping for a Mac mini redesign (A shrunken like version of the new Mac Pro in iPod Touch anodized colours) and Aperture X. But I suspect both are unlikely to happen.
You'd think on an Apple news site there would be joy lol.
It's anxious anticipation for me. I only have $2500 to spend on a machine to replace my evil Windows disaster PC and I want it to be a Mac Pro. I'm not too confident that it'll be in that range, and I'm not at all confident that the configuration I'll need will be within that range.
I'm also hoping Apple announces a retina-style high-PPI desktop display, since I'm still working with an old 21" CRT that wastes a ton of desk space and isn't really that impressive (except for its "better than LCD" contrast ratio). Even if they do release a high-PPI display, it'll probably be another $1000+ expense I cannot afford.
I'm fed up with the Windows insanity I've suffered since 1992. My transition to Mac for audio and photography won't be complete without a desktop powered machine. Especially since my 15" MacBook Pro 3,1 now has a dead nvidia GPU.
You want us to shout with happiness and glee... I'm nervously awaiting the facts that will determine whether or not I'm stuck with what I have for another year (or two). Mac Pro with decent RAM/storage configuration & retina-class-ready output at $2500? I'll be shooting rainbows out my butt.
Wishes he could afford a Mac Pro...I'm very curious as to what the price of this awesome Mac will be. I'm sure it will be through the roof and people will whine and complain like they were going to buy one but now aren't. I'm expecting it to be in the $2500+ range.
Remember folks...this is a professional workstation. Its not meant to for normal everyday Mac users like most of us.
We are budgeting $10k for each of our Mac Pros. That is in line with the near topped out previous Pro prices.
Pretty much what I was thinking.
Intel's latest IB 12 core Xeons are nearly 3k each, and even the lower end firepros(that are worth anything in performance anyway) will add nearly $1000-$1500 for the cost, never mind the higher end options.
Edit: Can't forget, that PCIe Flash especially does not come cheap either.
The top end model wholesale should be:
E5-2697v2 12-core $2614
8GB RAM $100 (I'll leave this at the base because it can be bought cheaper elsewhere)
dual W9000 (or 2013 equivalent) - this depends on AMD and not the retail prices at all. Since AMD is in bad shape, I reckon they will have got a two for one deal and the retail price of dual W9000 will be ~$3000-4000 so wholesale about $2500
1TB SSD = $900 ($0.90/GB wholesale)
the rest of the parts I estimate at $300
$6400 plus 40% margins = $10,690 and 64GB RAM $800 from a 3rd party so maxed out could be ~$11.5k. The big unknown here is AMD's GPUs as it could make it go as high as $15k but AMD has $359m in assets after deducting liabilities. They made a loss of $74m the last reported quarter. If that keeps up for another 4 quarters or so, they could start to have liabilities that exceed their assets and it doesn't mean immediate bankruptcy but it's the start of it. If Apple sells 250k Mac Pros in the quarter and the average wholesale price they pay AMD between all the GPU options is $800 (the lower end options are always the higher volume so the average comes way down) and AMD has a gross margin of 40%, they'd make $80m profit just from one customer. That alone would counter all their losses and keep them pretty healthy for the next year.
<span style="line-height:1.4em;">1. Release of Mavericks</span>
2. Sufficient supply of the new Intex Xeon chips
3. Thunderbolt 2- which as far as I know isn't anywhere yet
Definitely 2 and 3. I doubt 1 is that important to them.
Mavericks is key to the new Mac Pro -- and I suspect a new set of Mac Pro apps to drop at the same time!
Comments
Odd timing for the Pro. Most businesses don't spend much money on IT between November and early February due to their budget cycles. Small shops might for tax reasons, but it seems to be sub-optimal.
Still holding out hope that it will come in at $2k in order to try and expand its market appeal; the market for a "tower" has dropped a lot since the G5 enclosure debuted.
1) it was preannounced in June to be a 2013 delivery, so the timing of your timing comment is odd;-)
2) 'most businesses' don't use a Mac Pro as a desktops... this is a niche product in a niche market.
3) businesses that do use Mac Pros have been keeping $$ in the budget since before June;-)... even large businesses have their 4th quarter spending splurges to make sure they don't make 'too much' money in a particular quarter [less about taxes, and more about keeping expectations in line])
4) We all want Apple to lower their prices as consumers... but we have to look as 'investors' and think product line placement.
I do agree, that the 'workstation' market is ripe for a disruption.... and a $1999 highly functional base system would be great
What about IGZO for new RMBP? We were waiting this update so long... I guess we deserve it
Where are the mac mini rumors? Man I'm starting to worry I won't see a haswell mini in 2013.
Just curious- what are you expecting out of a Haswell mini vs an Ivy Bridge mini outside of a minor power consumption savings and Wireless AC? Performance-wise, it will be identical to the 2012 (if the iMac is any indication)- unless you go SSD.
Haswell is the most underwhelming desktop processor "upgrade" that has ever come out. For Laptops it is arguably the best, but for desktop its inconsequential.
the iMac used to cost £595 here in the UK. It now costs £1145 inc VAT.
'Only Apple.'
Lemon Bon Bon.
The Mustang used to cost $2,368 here in the US. It now costs $22,200 not inc TTL.
'Only Ford.'
Andysol.
Maybe Apple should push the iMac's price up into Mac Pro territory. Afterall, they're a premium company, right?
Lemon Bon Bon.
Well a topped out iMac is current 2800BP(with VAT) or $4500USD before state sales taxes.
It's in Mac Pro territory.
and really, I think that's what Apple wants (or it thinks it's largest set of High End consumers want).
Well a topped out iMac is current 2800BP(with VAT) or $4500USD before state sales taxes.
It's in Mac Pro territory.
and really, I think that's what Apple wants (or it thinks it's largest set of High End consumers want).
We are budgeting $10k for each of our Mac Pros. That is in line with the near topped out previous Pro prices. $2500 will get you a nice home computer, but most of us spend much more.
Just curious- what are you expecting out of a Haswell mini vs an Ivy Bridge mini outside of a minor power consumption savings and Wireless AC? Performance-wise, it will be identical to the 2012 (if the iMac is any indication)- unless you go SSD.
Haswell is the most underwhelming desktop processor "upgrade" that has ever come out. For Laptops it is arguably the best, but for desktop its inconsequential.
I expect a much improved GPU. And finally, the new wireless system.
We are budgeting $10k for each of our Mac Pros. That is in line with the near topped out previous Pro prices.
Pretty much what I was thinking.
Intel's latest IB 12 core Xeons are nearly 3k each, and even the lower end firepros(that are worth anything in performance anyway) will add nearly $1000-$1500 for the cost, never mind the higher end options.
Edit: Can't forget, that PCIe Flash especially does not come cheap either.
...and if you want the DVD (which used to be included...IN the price...) you have to pay £60+ extra.
Don't be stingy, Apple...put an external in the box.
Apple. Overpriced for what you get.
Lemon Bon Bon.
Should we send you a box is tissues because Apple releases something you can't afford? Go buy your 200£ Dell then and if that makes you happy then so be it.
I expect a much improved GPU. And finally, the new wireless system.
Oh ya- duh! Forgot about the Intel 5000 and that the mini is integrated. Sorry!
Just trash the iMac and the mini.
One Pro Can. Fill it with your specs. Done. One studio monitor. One can with your 'part susan' specs.
Not likely. And frankly I prefer they not do that unless the mac pro is as inexpensive as the mini. Since that isn't going to happen this would be a loss for everyone. Plus the Mac Pro is too huge to use as a HTPC.
But no...they'd rather charge £500 for a computer with no keyboard, mouse or monitor. Or £2045 inc VAT for an out of date and mediocre quad core with crap gpu and no monitor...or push up the prices of their AIO.
Lemon Bon Bon.
Mac Mini 2.5 Ghz i5 (dual core) 4GB RAM, 500GB HDD - £463
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Apple-Dual-Core-2-5GHz-Processor-Graphics/dp/B009XCJ4QM/ref=sr_1_1?s=computers&ie=UTF8&qid=1381850765&sr=1-1&keywords=Mac+Mini
Intel NUC 1.8 Ghz i5 (dual core) Barebones with Win8 - £319
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Intel-BOXDC53427HYE-Desktop-PC-Integrated/dp/B00C9KMNUO/ref=sr_1_3?s=computers&ie=UTF8&qid=1381850712&sr=1-3&keywords=Intel+NUC#productDetails
No keyboard, mouse, monitor, ram, hdd, or power cord. For a £144 more I'd rather have OSX and a mini.
So bugger off to Win8 land if you think Apple pricing is so extortionate. You've been whinging on AI for years.
Oh ya- duh! Forgot about the Intel 5000 and that the mini is integrated. Sorry!
Yah, that's a huge improvement. Even if it doesn't get the Iris Pro it'll be better.
Still holding out hope that it will come in at $2k in order to try and expand its market appeal; the market for a "tower" has dropped a lot since the G5 enclosure debuted.
The key thing about the pricing is how much Apple accountants estimate they will save on shipping.
Assuming that the U.S. robots build them as cheaply as China would, Apple saves on shipping both because of the distance-to-market, and because of the new smaller form factor.
Whether that savings is as high as $500 is anyone's guess, but I think that would be pushing it.
Not expensive either, really:
240GB $460
480GB $720
960GB $1294
http://eshop.macsales.com/search/pcie+ssd
It's anxious anticipation for me. I only have $2500 to spend on a machine to replace my evil Windows disaster PC and I want it to be a Mac Pro. I'm not too confident that it'll be in that range, and I'm not at all confident that the configuration I'll need will be within that range.
I'm also hoping Apple announces a retina-style high-PPI desktop display, since I'm still working with an old 21" CRT that wastes a ton of desk space and isn't really that impressive (except for its "better than LCD" contrast ratio). Even if they do release a high-PPI display, it'll probably be another $1000+ expense I cannot afford.
I'm fed up with the Windows insanity I've suffered since 1992. My transition to Mac for audio and photography won't be complete without a desktop powered machine. Especially since my 15" MacBook Pro 3,1 now has a dead nvidia GPU.
You want us to shout with happiness and glee... I'm nervously awaiting the facts that will determine whether or not I'm stuck with what I have for another year (or two). Mac Pro with decent RAM/storage configuration & retina-class-ready output at $2500? I'll be shooting rainbows out my butt.
Perspective...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Macintosh_128K
http://www.davemanuel.com/inflation-calculator.php
The top end model wholesale should be:
E5-2697v2 12-core $2614
8GB RAM $100 (I'll leave this at the base because it can be bought cheaper elsewhere)
dual W9000 (or 2013 equivalent) - this depends on AMD and not the retail prices at all. Since AMD is in bad shape, I reckon they will have got a two for one deal and the retail price of dual W9000 will be ~$3000-4000 so wholesale about $2500
1TB SSD = $900 ($0.90/GB wholesale)
the rest of the parts I estimate at $300
$6400 plus 40% margins = $10,690 and 64GB RAM $800 from a 3rd party so maxed out could be ~$11.5k. The big unknown here is AMD's GPUs as it could make it go as high as $15k but AMD has $359m in assets after deducting liabilities. They made a loss of $74m the last reported quarter. If that keeps up for another 4 quarters or so, they could start to have liabilities that exceed their assets and it doesn't mean immediate bankruptcy but it's the start of it. If Apple sells 250k Mac Pros in the quarter and the average wholesale price they pay AMD between all the GPU options is $800 (the lower end options are always the higher volume so the average comes way down) and AMD has a gross margin of 40%, they'd make $80m profit just from one customer. That alone would counter all their losses and keep them pretty healthy for the next year.
To Approximate Scale:
[IMG ALT=""]http://forums.appleinsider.com/content/type/61/id/33436/width/500/height/1000[/IMG]
Mavericks is key to the new Mac Pro -- and I suspect a new set of Mac Pro apps to drop at the same time!