I can get Lenovos with a quad-core Haswell CPU and discrete 755m SLI GPUs, 1080p display, 15", 2.7kgs for less than 1200 euros. Do I want to pay 2600 euros for a similar setup in the form of a late 2013 MBP 15" but little less weight and better display?
Lenovo has about 12% gross margins so even for an identical build in a 1200 euro machine, Apple would charge about 1500 euros. Apple charges about 300 euros for 256GB of SSD (this SSD operates at over 700MB/s) and the higher-end Lenovo uses one of those hybrid SSDs.
If it's a gaming laptop you want, the new rMBP is not great value. For that, you'd be better off with a refurb of the old model with the 650M (the 750M is just a rebadge):
those are sitting around 30% off the old price, which I assume on the Finnish store would be under 1400 euros. They seem to have hosed out refurbs from every store, possibly to update pricing.
Glad I've never liked Laptops. I wouldn't want to be limited to a 1TB PCI-E SSD drive, no matter how `cool' it is to have reduced that read/write gap.
Limited to 16GB of RAM is a non-starter for myself. Make it 4x8GB DDR3 1866 RAM upgradeable and they'd own the laptop world, top-to-bottom.
Glad you've never liked laptops either since clearly you seem to enjoys throwing around high-end desktop specs on a notebook thread. If 16GB is a non-starter then the notebook world is obviously not for you. I hate to be baited, but I'm curious - what do you think you need that much and that fast RAM for? And why would you even comment on the MBP when it's obviously not for you?
There’s nothing wrong with wanting a 32GB option, particularly since there isn’t one.
Wait… there isn’t one?! How can they justify that? It doesn’t have to be user-accessible at all, just GIVE US 32 GB! Wh… it’s the MacBook Pro. It has to have… look, do they want people doing pro stuff on the thing at all? Yeah, it would be expensive; that’s the point! At least right now.
I’m not for user-accessible RAM, but I am for a 32GB option. Weird…
Wait… there isn’t one?! How can they justify that? It doesn’t have to be user-accessible at all, just GIVE US 32 GB!
32GB will come with higher density DDR4. Laptops that support it now have 4 RAM slots. You can see the RAM chips in the middle here:
There's no room to double the number of chips. Higher density is the only option. Maybe with the dedicated GPU out the way they could shuffle things around to fit in another row to get 24GB in the 15" but DDR4 is round the corner anyway. They go from 8gbit DDR3 chips to 16gbit DDR4:
<span style="line-height:1.4em;">32GB will come with higher density DDR4. </span>
There's no room to double the number of chips.
So DDR3 has a hard (architectural?) limitation to its density? Or they’re just not interested in making denser chips?
I'd say it's more likely the latter. The advantage to changing the standard is that everyone who wants the higher density option has to upgrade. If they just made higher density DDR3, a lot of manufacturers would stick to DDR3 and offer higher density chips for the few that need them, which isn't very cost-effective for RAM manufacturers wanting to push DDR4 and its other benefits.
Glad I've never liked Laptops. I wouldn't want to be limited to a 1TB PCI-E SSD drive, no matter how `cool' it is to have reduced that read/write gap.
Limited to 16GB of RAM is a non-starter for myself. Make it 4x8GB DDR3 1866 RAM upgradeable and they'd own the laptop world, top-to-bottom.
I can't tell if this post is serious or not. If it is, what the **** do you use your computer for, in that you're "limited" by 1TB of storage and 16GB RAM? I am honestly curious. I'm a designer and work with huge Illustrator/Photoshop files, with like 20 apps open, and my 4GB/256GB Macbook Air handles almost everything perfectly. So I really want to know what kind of work you're doing in that 16GB of RAM is "limiting" for you on a laptop. My suspicion is that you're simply a spec whore for the sake of it, and don't really do anything that requires any sort of power.
I can't tell if this post is serious or not. If it is, what the **** do you use your computer for, in that you're "limited" by 1TB of storage and 16GB RAM? I am honestly curious. I'm a designer and work with huge Illustrator/Photoshop files, with like 20 apps open, and my 4GB/256GB Macbook Air handles almost everything perfectly. So I really want to know what kind of work you're doing in that 16GB of RAM is "limiting" for you on a laptop. My suspicion is that you're simply a spec whore for the sake of it, and don't really do anything that requires any sort of power.
16GB is a decent amount but there are apps that can use all of it. Design apps have a single process; software like After Effects, Final Cut etc have two or more. So you can be working on a project with layers and exceed 8GB, which seems ok but then to export, the render process can load up another 8GB of data and max out the RAM, especially if there's an IGP using 1GB for video memory, the OS etc using 2GB. Same deal if you run just 3 apps using 6GB each e.g Photoshop with multiple comps, AE with those layers plus the render output.
All that happens is it uses virtual memory so it's not the end of the world and some apps can be shut down to free memory but the internal might be a low capacity SSD and that can create some problems.
However, the idea that 32GB in a laptop is necessary for Apple's laptop line to be more successful is not based in reality. This is just the same false notion that people who benefit from the highest spec somehow make up a large number of people when in fact they make up a tiny fractional share of the target audience.
When 32GB comes in 1-2 years with DDR4, the same people will move onto saying '64GB is now a minimum for any serious work and their sales would double instantly if they had the option guaranteed' and so on.
Comments
This is the price of truly exceptional hardware and software.
You'd be comparing these:
http://shop.lenovo.com/us/en/laptops/ideapad/y-series/y510p/
Lenovo has about 12% gross margins so even for an identical build in a 1200 euro machine, Apple would charge about 1500 euros. Apple charges about 300 euros for 256GB of SSD (this SSD operates at over 700MB/s) and the higher-end Lenovo uses one of those hybrid SSDs.
If it's a gaming laptop you want, the new rMBP is not great value. For that, you'd be better off with a refurb of the old model with the 650M (the 750M is just a rebadge):
http://store.apple.com/fi/browse/home/specialdeals/clearance/mac
those are sitting around 30% off the old price, which I assume on the Finnish store would be under 1400 euros. They seem to have hosed out refurbs from every store, possibly to update pricing.
Glad you've never liked laptops either since clearly you seem to enjoys throwing around high-end desktop specs on a notebook thread. If 16GB is a non-starter then the notebook world is obviously not for you. I hate to be baited, but I'm curious - what do you think you need that much and that fast RAM for? And why would you even comment on the MBP when it's obviously not for you?
Oh screw it, I don't really care...
Don’t the Mac Pro and MacBook Pro (and MacBook Air) now use the same storage?
Same type of storage, yes, but mdriftmeyer wants 32GB of RAM (upgradable of course!) in a notebook.
I was focusing more on his inane 2nd paragraph and less on his pointless 1st one. Sorry for the confusion.
There’s nothing wrong with wanting a 32GB option, particularly since there isn’t one.
Wait… there isn’t one?! How can they justify that? It doesn’t have to be user-accessible at all, just GIVE US 32 GB! Wh… it’s the MacBook Pro. It has to have… look, do they want people doing pro stuff on the thing at all? Yeah, it would be expensive; that’s the point! At least right now.
I’m not for user-accessible RAM, but I am for a 32GB option. Weird…
32GB will come with higher density DDR4. Laptops that support it now have 4 RAM slots. You can see the RAM chips in the middle here:
There's no room to double the number of chips. Higher density is the only option. Maybe with the dedicated GPU out the way they could shuffle things around to fit in another row to get 24GB in the 15" but DDR4 is round the corner anyway. They go from 8gbit DDR3 chips to 16gbit DDR4:
http://www.micron.com/products/dram/ddr3-to-ddr4
8gbit = 1gbyte and the MBP has 16 x 8gbit chips.
http://www.crucial.com/promo/DDR4.aspx
This will allow the iMac to go to 64GB and the Mac Pro to go to 128GB etc. Should be next year but maybe the year after.
So DDR3 has a hard (architectural?) limitation to its density? Or they’re just not interested in making denser chips?
I'd say it's more likely the latter. The advantage to changing the standard is that everyone who wants the higher density option has to upgrade. If they just made higher density DDR3, a lot of manufacturers would stick to DDR3 and offer higher density chips for the few that need them, which isn't very cost-effective for RAM manufacturers wanting to push DDR4 and its other benefits.
Just out of curiosity, what's the release date on this? Or would I be better off just picking up last year's model and saving a few bucks?
Yesterday.
No.
Yesterday.
No.
Thanks! This will be my first Mac I've ever picked up, so wasn't too sure on the specifics.
Glad I've never liked Laptops. I wouldn't want to be limited to a 1TB PCI-E SSD drive, no matter how `cool' it is to have reduced that read/write gap.
Limited to 16GB of RAM is a non-starter for myself. Make it 4x8GB DDR3 1866 RAM upgradeable and they'd own the laptop world, top-to-bottom.
I can't tell if this post is serious or not. If it is, what the **** do you use your computer for, in that you're "limited" by 1TB of storage and 16GB RAM? I am honestly curious. I'm a designer and work with huge Illustrator/Photoshop files, with like 20 apps open, and my 4GB/256GB Macbook Air handles almost everything perfectly. So I really want to know what kind of work you're doing in that 16GB of RAM is "limiting" for you on a laptop. My suspicion is that you're simply a spec whore for the sake of it, and don't really do anything that requires any sort of power.
16GB is a decent amount but there are apps that can use all of it. Design apps have a single process; software like After Effects, Final Cut etc have two or more. So you can be working on a project with layers and exceed 8GB, which seems ok but then to export, the render process can load up another 8GB of data and max out the RAM, especially if there's an IGP using 1GB for video memory, the OS etc using 2GB. Same deal if you run just 3 apps using 6GB each e.g Photoshop with multiple comps, AE with those layers plus the render output.
All that happens is it uses virtual memory so it's not the end of the world and some apps can be shut down to free memory but the internal might be a low capacity SSD and that can create some problems.
However, the idea that 32GB in a laptop is necessary for Apple's laptop line to be more successful is not based in reality. This is just the same false notion that people who benefit from the highest spec somehow make up a large number of people when in fact they make up a tiny fractional share of the target audience.
When 32GB comes in 1-2 years with DDR4, the same people will move onto saying '64GB is now a minimum for any serious work and their sales would double instantly if they had the option guaranteed' and so on.
Quote:
Apple's legacy 13-inch non-Retina MacBook continues to be available, now as the only Apple laptop that does not feature a high-resolution display.
APPLE DISCONTINUED THE AIR?!
how much usable space as delivered for the mbp 256 ssd
trying to figure out how much of my present macbook to offload to external on my new timecapsule
thank you
If I had to guess, I would probably say 8-12 GB, so you have 244-248 GB for yourself.
thanks
i'm moving my two MB c2d iPhoto and iTunes to external connected to my time capsule
i thought about using wireless with a tm backup, since ac is on TC and my new MBP
shouldn't take that long can't find any reference except using "n" network which was said to be painfully slow
or
use an ethernet connection to both computers
can't wait will get them today
suggestions?? anyone try the wireless route using AC
what i'm thinking since much of my HD on my old mb shows "other" i may just transfer just the absolute needed
then see what happens then if i need something else connect my old mb and transfer those
trying to transfer the minimum to make this work
also after transferring iTunes (organized, all data) to my external sync worked just as well as my main hd
that was a pleasant surprise