Toyota doesn't give me free advice or service for my out of warranty vehicle. Why should Apple?
Apple didn't promise lifetime product support.
And let's face it. A problem apple has is that their well designed products keep working or years. They have to hold back on services and security upgrades and such to encourage old customers to buy their new stuff.
I don't know if you have noticed this but that 'problem' you mention is actually a feature well and truly paid for by the consumer and they have every right to expect longevity. You make it sound like it's a generous Apple freebie.
I don't think there should be any time limit on security upgrades - well 10 years maybe. If the door locks on your Toyota were under software control and an exploit was developed to render them ineffective at some point via say a phone app, do you think Toyota should not be morally obliged to provide a fix?
Most companies that offer a fee to talk about the problem will refund that amount if it's found that the problem is their issue. I had this happen a few times when contacting Microsoft support on a development project. However, I don't believe that a company should be expected to support a product indefinitely. 1 year, yes. Two years, yes. But at some point it's the responsibility of the consumer to agree that the product works to their specification.
I agree with you that a problem created by an operating system upgrade should be covered by a separate warranty, not under the warrantee of the hardware it's installed on. So in this case, they *should* offer help on Mavericks, but they shouldn't send you a new DVD drive since the hardware is out of warranty.
There's a BIG different between the cost of components of a Chinese-made flashlight and a Macbook Pro. I don't think that's something you can expect on all products.
Apple have $150 billion and more every day under the current policy of not charging people for this support. I believe they should continue that policy.
Apple is not charging people for support. They've always provided support under warranty but if you're not under warranty, you were basically out of luck. What they're doing is extending support beyond the normal warranty period. You honestly can't expect a company to continue support indefinitely on a product.
What resentment? So now we are blaming Apple for not raising everyone's salary? Did Apple stop raises for its employees? I don't think so. The average Joes doesn't know or care how much Apple has in its horde.
Please don't reframe my argument like that. I never blamed Apple for not raising everyone's salary or even mention the salaries that Apple pays it's employees. I was speaking more broadly - certainly in my country the average person's wage has not kept up with increases in inflation for quite some time. I have been told the same applies in America and that the middle class has been hit the hardest there, however I can't speak from Stateside experience.
The average Joe/Joanne (did you like that? ) may or may not be aware of the size of Apples cash pile, but they are aware of the Apple cachet and that is what they are buying into in ever greater numbers. It is also the reason for the maddening double standard we see when comparing Apple with lesser (Android) phones - they expect Apple to be better. I certainly wouldn't expect any great support from a crappy BOGO free phone sporting Gingerbread. But I (and many others) would expect Apple to go above and beyond the rest. Thus, I believe my original post still stands - charging people $20 for support calls just seems cheap. Of course a balance has to be made - I am not suggesting that someone should expect much help for an antique iPhone 3G for instance, but a least a 4S or perhaps even 4 could be reasonable.
Please don't reframe my argument like that. I never blamed Apple for not raising everyone's salary or even mention the salaries that Apple pays its employees. I was speaking more broadly - certainly in my country the average person's wage has not kept up with increases in inflation for quite some time. I have been told the same applies in America and that the middle class has been hit the hardest there, however I can't speak from Stateside experience.
The average Joe/Joanne (did you like that? ) may or may not be aware of the size of Apples cash pile, but they are aware of the Apple cachet and that is what they are buying into in ever greater numbers. It is also the reason for the maddening double standard we see when comparing Apple with lesser (Android) phones - they expect Apple to be better. I certainly wouldn't expect any great support from a crappy BOGO free phone sporting Gingerbread. But I (and many others) would expect Apple to go above and beyond the rest. Thus, I believe my original post still stands - charging people $20 for support calls just seems cheap. Of course a balance has to be made - I am not suggesting that someone should expect much help for an antique iPhone 3G for instance, but a least a 4S or perhaps even 4 could be reasonable.
Comments
Toyota doesn't give me free advice or service for my out of warranty vehicle. Why should Apple?
Apple didn't promise lifetime product support.
And let's face it. A problem apple has is that their well designed products keep working or years. They have to hold back on services and security upgrades and such to encourage old customers to buy their new stuff.
I don't know if you have noticed this but that 'problem' you mention is actually a feature well and truly paid for by the consumer and they have every right to expect longevity. You make it sound like it's a generous Apple freebie.
I don't think there should be any time limit on security upgrades - well 10 years maybe. If the door locks on your Toyota were under software control and an exploit was developed to render them ineffective at some point via say a phone app, do you think Toyota should not be morally obliged to provide a fix?
Most companies that offer a fee to talk about the problem will refund that amount if it's found that the problem is their issue. I had this happen a few times when contacting Microsoft support on a development project. However, I don't believe that a company should be expected to support a product indefinitely. 1 year, yes. Two years, yes. But at some point it's the responsibility of the consumer to agree that the product works to their specification.
I agree with you that a problem created by an operating system upgrade should be covered by a separate warranty, not under the warrantee of the hardware it's installed on. So in this case, they *should* offer help on Mavericks, but they shouldn't send you a new DVD drive since the hardware is out of warranty.
There's a BIG different between the cost of components of a Chinese-made flashlight and a Macbook Pro. I don't think that's something you can expect on all products.
Apple have $150 billion and more every day under the current policy of not charging people for this support. I believe they should continue that policy.
Come off it.
We'll never know; he died in 2011.
You could ask Judge Cote, she presumes to know.
What resentment? So now we are blaming Apple for not raising everyone's salary? Did Apple stop raises for its employees? I don't think so. The average Joes doesn't know or care how much Apple has in its horde.
Please don't reframe my argument like that. I never blamed Apple for not raising everyone's salary or even mention the salaries that Apple pays it's employees. I was speaking more broadly - certainly in my country the average person's wage has not kept up with increases in inflation for quite some time. I have been told the same applies in America and that the middle class has been hit the hardest there, however I can't speak from Stateside experience.
The average Joe/Joanne (did you like that?
) may or may not be aware of the size of Apples cash pile, but they are aware of the Apple cachet and that is what they are buying into in ever greater numbers. It is also the reason for the maddening double standard we see when comparing Apple with lesser (Android) phones - they expect Apple to be better. I certainly wouldn't expect any great support from a crappy BOGO free phone sporting Gingerbread. But I (and many others) would expect Apple to go above and beyond the rest. Thus, I believe my original post still stands - charging people $20 for support calls just seems cheap. Of course a balance has to be made - I am not suggesting that someone should expect much help for an antique iPhone 3G for instance, but a least a 4S or perhaps even 4 could be reasonable.
Please don't reframe my argument like that. I never blamed Apple for not raising everyone's salary or even mention the salaries that Apple pays its employees. I was speaking more broadly - certainly in my country the average person's wage has not kept up with increases in inflation for quite some time. I have been told the same applies in America and that the middle class has been hit the hardest there, however I can't speak from Stateside experience.
The average Joe/Joanne (did you like that?
) may or may not be aware of the size of Apples cash pile, but they are aware of the Apple cachet and that is what they are buying into in ever greater numbers. It is also the reason for the maddening double standard we see when comparing Apple with lesser (Android) phones - they expect Apple to be better. I certainly wouldn't expect any great support from a crappy BOGO free phone sporting Gingerbread. But I (and many others) would expect Apple to go above and beyond the rest. Thus, I believe my original post still stands - charging people $20 for support calls just seems cheap. Of course a balance has to be made - I am not suggesting that someone should expect much help for an antique iPhone 3G for instance, but a least a 4S or perhaps even 4 could be reasonable.
Gah! Double post.