In theory, i think the 5C was a good idea but it seems to have caused a high amount confusion among buyers. Even many people who read and post about tech on the internet seem to keep comparing the 5C sales to the 5S instead of comparing it to previous gen iPhone sales going into their second year. If you're going to run out to buy an iPhone opening weekend it was never likely going to the 5C with 2012 HW. For those reasons I wouldn't be surprised if Apple kills it and simply does one new iPhone per year (for a given display size).
You could be right, but I feel that it's too early to say. After all, this is the first year that Apple has adopted a new strategy, so to finish it so soon might be seen as panicking.
Last year's tech in a cheaper encasing—imagine the 5s in a plastic case this year; I think it would sell well. And if they do a wearable, it would be easy to sell two models—one for the 6 and one for the 6c.
Looking at the Mac line, Apple used to do three of a kind, whereas they tend to do two these days. Two sizes of iMac, two of MacBook Air, two MacBook Pro. Admittedly, I'm looking at screen size as the differentiator.
i think people who see the 5c as a failure seem to already have forgotten how apple handled the iPod when that segment matured. no one considered the iPod shuffle a failure because it failed to reach the growth of the regular iPod or iPod mini/nano.
Yup, My wife just upgraded a 5c (from a 4). I was encouraging her to get the 5s making the argument it was only $100 more explaining it's motion sensor 64 bit ness and fingerprint unlock, when she looked at me (with a face that only married men understand) and said "well if I was spending more I would rather have the 32GB 5c"
And that's precisely what she got... in kermit green.
Its funny, the 5c is thriving despite the fact that the press has been relentlessly trying to convince people they don't want it (and that nobody wants it)
In theory, i think the 5C was a good idea but it seems to have caused a high amount confusion among buyers. Even many people who read and post about tech on the internet seem to keep comparing the 5C sales to the 5S instead of comparing it to previous gen iPhone sales going into their second year. If you're going to run out to buy an iPhone opening weekend it was never likely going to the 5C with 2012 HW. For those reasons I wouldn't be surprised if Apple kills it and simply does one new iPhone per year (for a given display size).
There's no confusion. Those that want the latest and greatest buy the 5S. Those that are on the fence, cost may be a deciding factor.
There's no confusion. Those that want the latest and greatest buy the 5S. Those that are on the fence, cost may be a deciding factor.
I don't know. People here seem to expect the 5C to have the same demand as the 5S. Anecdotally everyone I know that has a 5C bought it without actually realizing that it was newly released or they knew it was newly released but didn't know it wasn't the top of the line iPhone. For the latter, these people didn't know about TouchID. It seems these 5C buyers were just told what to buy from the retail employees at the carrier stores, which were without any real 5S supply for months.
It felt like a doomed campaign from the start, based on my experience getting one in Sept. This was, IIRC, when the first crop of 5s's were shipped and people who didn't get on that bunch had to order and wait for more, so that wasn't in stock. First, the salesperson couldn't have been more enthusiastic pitching the 5s yet we couldn't get any solid info about exactly what the deal was with the 5c from them. Had to get all of that from Apple news sites, which wasn't unexpected, but they answered any question about the 5c with a disinterested grunt with literally no answer, waiting to take orders for a 5s. It was just too obvious they didn't even want to sell it to me, I practically had to convince her to.
Second, not only did that Verizon store not have any cases for it aside from the ridiculous overpriced Apple ones, but no one had more than a few cheesy ugly (and overpriced ones) for weeks. It barely got any better up through now. I get it that case makers didn't think 5c owners would spend a lot of money on a case, but the result was hardly any being available. Even the major manufacturers that offered a few of them didn't appear to offer them in stores.
It did have the feeling of being tainted marketing-wise from the get go. A shame.
As I've pointed out before, the 5c is more of a supply chain play than anything. One of the production bottlenecks with the iPhone 5 was the CNC-machined aluminum shell. Even though Apple eventually expanded capacity enough to handle the iPhone 5 demand, ramping up the 5s AND keeping the 5 would have required a substantial increase in aluminum machining capacity. Introducing the 5c allowed Apple to use less expensive plastic shells and stamped steel internals that can be produced much faster than the 5/5s.
Looking at the 5c sales, the only measure that matters is how its year-over-year sales compare to the midlevel iPhone from the year before. Comparing 5c sales with the 5s, or even other flagship Android models, is absurd, disingenuous, idiotic, etc. The 5c is this year's midlevel iPhone. It might count as a new product, but it's not a new product category or even a new price point, and should not be analyzed as such. Analysts who choose to do so obviously have their own agenda to pursue.
I don't know. People here seem to expect the 5C to have the same demand as the 5S. Anecdotally everyone I know that has a 5C bought it without actually realizing that it was newly released or they knew it was newly released but didn't know it wasn't the top of the line iPhone. For the latter, these people didn't know about TouchID. It seems these 5C buyers were just told what to buy from the retail employees at the carrier stores, which were without any real 5S supply for months.
How different are these consumers from those that would have purchased the 4s at this time last year, or any of Apple's midprice level phones in prior years? The 5c is $100 less than the 5s, and at launch it was more widely available. Aside from more color options and its own marketing campaign at launch, the 5c is basically another midlevel iPhone.
How different are these consumers from those that would have purchased the 4s at this time last year, or any of Apple's midprice level phones in prior years? The 5c is $100 less than the 5s, and at launch it was more widely available. Aside from more color options and its own marketing campaign at launch, the 5c is basically another midlevel iPhone.
I assume the buyers aren't very different at all. The color could be an attractive quality to a minor extent, but I think most that want the older tech because it's less expensive, or, rather, don't care enough to consider what is the latest tech, would have probably bought the iPhone 5 at about the same rate as the 5C once the 5S was introduced.
As I've pointed out before, the 5c is more of a supply chain play than anything. One of the production bottlenecks with the iPhone 5 was the CNC-machined aluminum shell. Even though Apple eventually expanded capacity enough to handle the iPhone 5 demand, ramping up the 5s AND keeping the 5 would have required a substantial increase in aluminum machining capacity. Introducing the 5c allowed Apple to use less expensive plastic shells and stamped steel internals that can be produced much faster than the 5/5s.
Looking at the 5c sales, the only measure that matters is how its year-over-year sales compare to the midlevel iPhone from the year before. Comparing 5c sales with the 5s, or even other flagship Android models, is absurd, disingenuous, idiotic, etc. The 5c is this year's midlevel iPhone. It might count as a new product, but it's not a new product category or even a new price point, and should not be analyzed as such. Analysts who choose to do so obviously have their own agenda to pursue.
it was a different category as it.
1) looked different from the 5
2) was released in the same year as the 5S (which matters to software upgrades)
3) did in fact have different internals.
That's not the same as the 2 year old 4S which had none of this.
If it walks like a duck, talks like a duck, it's a duck.
2) was released in the same year as the 5S (which matters to software upgrades)
3) did in fact have different internals.
That's not the same as the 2 year old 4S which had none of this.
If it walks like a duck, talks like a duck, it's a duck.
It's not a new category because the 5c occupies the same midlevel price point, and follows the same previous strategy of offering the previous year's technology at a lower price. The internals are different only so much as they bypass the production bottlenecks associated with the 5/5s' aluminum shell. The processors and the vast majority of the actual circuits inside the 5c are identical those used in the 5.
Yes, it's a duck, but so is the 5. -- and if you compare benchmarks and functional capabilities, you'd see that the 5c and 5 are basically identical. The differences that you cite are superficial, at best.
Not only do I not know anyone that has one, I have never seen anyone with one.
I don't know anyone who has ever bought a Miley Cyrus album/CD and I have never seen anyone with a Miley Cyrus album/CD. I don't even know anyone who listens to Miley Cyrus on the radio. What does this mean? Other than it suggesting that I don't know anyone who listens to or buys crappy pop-tart music, not much. She's probably sold a lot more CDs than Apple has sold iPhone 5Cs, and yet I have never seen a Miley fan in the wild.
I absolutely mean no offense to you. But it always amuses me when people offer this sort of anecdote, as if it has any bearing on whether or not a product is popular or not. Maybe it is indicative of the popularity of a product. Or maybe it just means that the person making the claim needs to get out of the house more... or travel to more & different places.
Who knows? But it certainly doesn't pass the test for even the most basic form of sampling.
I'm sure Cook/Apple is disappointed in the 5C sales. At best, it seems to be doing nothing more than picking up a few incremental sales at the margin. It's not the complete flop that some try to make it out to be, but it's not a success either. Hopefully Apple will introduce a phone this fall to take its place that has a more clear cut (and successful) strategy.
I don't know anyone who has ever bought a Miley Cyrus album/CD and I have never seen anyone with a Miley Cyrus album/CD. I don't even know anyone who listens to Miley Cyrus on the radio. What does this mean? Other than it suggesting that I don't know anyone who listens to or buys crappy pop-tart music, not much.
Or perhaps you don't know your friends' musical tastes as well as you think!
In theory, i think the 5C was a good idea but it seems to have caused a high amount confusion among buyers. Even many people who read and post about tech on the internet seem to keep comparing the 5C sales to the 5S instead of comparing it to previous gen iPhone sales going into their second year. If you're going to run out to buy an iPhone opening weekend it was never likely going to the 5C with 2012 HW. For those reasons I wouldn't be surprised if Apple kills it and simply does one new iPhone per year (for a given display size).
According to past practice there should be a new form factor this year. Does the 5s then get the plastic back? Do they stick with the plastic 5c, or get rid of it and keep the 4S? It's definitely going to be a interesting year.
My carrier has introduced 4G connectivity at 3G rate plans, but only for the 5c and 5s. Since my wife has the 5s and is pretty much always connected to Wifi, it looks like I'll end up buying the 5c finally! As long as the internals compare to my 5, it is good.
The only step back would be going from 64GB to 32GB, but over the years the number of apps I actually use has reduced so hopefully I should manage.
According to past practice there should be a new form factor this year. Does the 5s then get the plastic back? Do they stick with the plastic 5c, or get rid of it and keep the 4S? It's definitely going to be a interesting year.
Strong arguments either way. Since the iPhone 6 is going to a brand new design, keeping the 5s does not pose the same potential supply chain constraints that keeping the 5 would have had for this year's production cycle. Compared to keeping the 5s, moving the 5s internals into a "6c" plastic shell would streamline the production and probably raise the margins.
But, what kind of effect would that move have on the year-over-year sales trend? Would more consumers buy a year-old 5s or a plastic "6c"? This year, the 5c had novelty in its favor, and it served a purpose in the supply chain management by removing a potential production bottleneck for the 5s. Next year, those factors would not apply with the "6c."
I don't see any reason to keep the 4s. It does not use the Lightning connector, and moving the 5c into the entry level slot would complete that migration for the iPhone lineup. Plus, I suspect that the other A5-based models (iPad2, iPad mini, and iPod touch 5th gen) will get phased out by year's end, so there's that consideration as well.
I think it can go either way. Since the iPhone 6 is going to a brand new design, keeping the 5s does not pose the same potential supply chain constraints that keeping the 5 would have for this year's production cycle. Compared to keeping the 5s, moving the 5s internals into a "6c" plastic shell would streamline the production and probably raise the margins.
But, what kind of effect would that move have on the year-over-year sales trend? Would more consumers buy a year-old 5s or a plastic "6c"? This year, the 5c had novelty in its favor, and it served a purpose in the supply chain management by removing a potential production bottleneck for the 5s. Next year, those factors would not apply with the "6c."
I don't see any reason to keep the 4s. It does not use the Lightning connector, and moving the 5c into the entry level slot would complete that migration for the iPhone lineup. Plus, I suspect that the other A5-based models (iPad2, iPad mini, and iPod touch 5th gen) will get phased out by year's end, so there's that consideration as well.
Are you saying that they'll go away from using aluminum? I can only see them going with Liquid Metal if that's the case, and I'm not sure that'll be a cost effective material yet.
Comments
You could be right, but I feel that it's too early to say. After all, this is the first year that Apple has adopted a new strategy, so to finish it so soon might be seen as panicking.
Last year's tech in a cheaper encasing—imagine the 5s in a plastic case this year; I think it would sell well. And if they do a wearable, it would be easy to sell two models—one for the 6 and one for the 6c.
Looking at the Mac line, Apple used to do three of a kind, whereas they tend to do two these days. Two sizes of iMac, two of MacBook Air, two MacBook Pro. Admittedly, I'm looking at screen size as the differentiator.
i think people who see the 5c as a failure seem to already have forgotten how apple handled the iPod when that segment matured. no one considered the iPod shuffle a failure because it failed to reach the growth of the regular iPod or iPod mini/nano.
Yup, My wife just upgraded a 5c (from a 4). I was encouraging her to get the 5s making the argument it was only $100 more explaining it's motion sensor 64 bit ness and fingerprint unlock, when she looked at me (with a face that only married men understand) and said "well if I was spending more I would rather have the 32GB 5c"
And that's precisely what she got... in kermit green.
Its funny, the 5c is thriving despite the fact that the press has been relentlessly trying to convince people they don't want it (and that nobody wants it)
Then all phones that can't outsell the 5S are failures.
There's no confusion. Those that want the latest and greatest buy the 5S. Those that are on the fence, cost may be a deciding factor.
I don't know. People here seem to expect the 5C to have the same demand as the 5S. Anecdotally everyone I know that has a 5C bought it without actually realizing that it was newly released or they knew it was newly released but didn't know it wasn't the top of the line iPhone. For the latter, these people didn't know about TouchID. It seems these 5C buyers were just told what to buy from the retail employees at the carrier stores, which were without any real 5S supply for months.
It felt like a doomed campaign from the start, based on my experience getting one in Sept. This was, IIRC, when the first crop of 5s's were shipped and people who didn't get on that bunch had to order and wait for more, so that wasn't in stock. First, the salesperson couldn't have been more enthusiastic pitching the 5s yet we couldn't get any solid info about exactly what the deal was with the 5c from them. Had to get all of that from Apple news sites, which wasn't unexpected, but they answered any question about the 5c with a disinterested grunt with literally no answer, waiting to take orders for a 5s. It was just too obvious they didn't even want to sell it to me, I practically had to convince her to.
Second, not only did that Verizon store not have any cases for it aside from the ridiculous overpriced Apple ones, but no one had more than a few cheesy ugly (and overpriced ones) for weeks. It barely got any better up through now. I get it that case makers didn't think 5c owners would spend a lot of money on a case, but the result was hardly any being available. Even the major manufacturers that offered a few of them didn't appear to offer them in stores.
It did have the feeling of being tainted marketing-wise from the get go. A shame.
The 5c is the last plastic iPhone from Apple.
As I've pointed out before, the 5c is more of a supply chain play than anything. One of the production bottlenecks with the iPhone 5 was the CNC-machined aluminum shell. Even though Apple eventually expanded capacity enough to handle the iPhone 5 demand, ramping up the 5s AND keeping the 5 would have required a substantial increase in aluminum machining capacity. Introducing the 5c allowed Apple to use less expensive plastic shells and stamped steel internals that can be produced much faster than the 5/5s.
Looking at the 5c sales, the only measure that matters is how its year-over-year sales compare to the midlevel iPhone from the year before. Comparing 5c sales with the 5s, or even other flagship Android models, is absurd, disingenuous, idiotic, etc. The 5c is this year's midlevel iPhone. It might count as a new product, but it's not a new product category or even a new price point, and should not be analyzed as such. Analysts who choose to do so obviously have their own agenda to pursue.
I don't know. People here seem to expect the 5C to have the same demand as the 5S. Anecdotally everyone I know that has a 5C bought it without actually realizing that it was newly released or they knew it was newly released but didn't know it wasn't the top of the line iPhone. For the latter, these people didn't know about TouchID. It seems these 5C buyers were just told what to buy from the retail employees at the carrier stores, which were without any real 5S supply for months.
How different are these consumers from those that would have purchased the 4s at this time last year, or any of Apple's midprice level phones in prior years? The 5c is $100 less than the 5s, and at launch it was more widely available. Aside from more color options and its own marketing campaign at launch, the 5c is basically another midlevel iPhone.
I assume the buyers aren't very different at all. The color could be an attractive quality to a minor extent, but I think most that want the older tech because it's less expensive, or, rather, don't care enough to consider what is the latest tech, would have probably bought the iPhone 5 at about the same rate as the 5C once the 5S was introduced.
it was a different category as it.
1) looked different from the 5
2) was released in the same year as the 5S (which matters to software upgrades)
3) did in fact have different internals.
That's not the same as the 2 year old 4S which had none of this.
If it walks like a duck, talks like a duck, it's a duck.
it was a different category as it.
1) looked different from the 5
2) was released in the same year as the 5S (which matters to software upgrades)
3) did in fact have different internals.
That's not the same as the 2 year old 4S which had none of this.
If it walks like a duck, talks like a duck, it's a duck.
It's not a new category because the 5c occupies the same midlevel price point, and follows the same previous strategy of offering the previous year's technology at a lower price. The internals are different only so much as they bypass the production bottlenecks associated with the 5/5s' aluminum shell. The processors and the vast majority of the actual circuits inside the 5c are identical those used in the 5.
Yes, it's a duck, but so is the 5. -- and if you compare benchmarks and functional capabilities, you'd see that the 5c and 5 are basically identical. The differences that you cite are superficial, at best.
But is the 5.
But, as it has the 5’s hardware, will not be receiving updates alongside the 5S.
“Marginally increased battery life” does not matter as internals go. That won’t let it magically see iOS 10.
Not only do I not know anyone that has one, I have never seen anyone with one.
I don't know anyone who has ever bought a Miley Cyrus album/CD and I have never seen anyone with a Miley Cyrus album/CD. I don't even know anyone who listens to Miley Cyrus on the radio. What does this mean? Other than it suggesting that I don't know anyone who listens to or buys crappy pop-tart music, not much. She's probably sold a lot more CDs than Apple has sold iPhone 5Cs, and yet I have never seen a Miley fan in the wild.
I absolutely mean no offense to you. But it always amuses me when people offer this sort of anecdote, as if it has any bearing on whether or not a product is popular or not. Maybe it is indicative of the popularity of a product. Or maybe it just means that the person making the claim needs to get out of the house more... or travel to more & different places.
Who knows? But it certainly doesn't pass the test for even the most basic form of sampling.
I'm sure Cook/Apple is disappointed in the 5C sales. At best, it seems to be doing nothing more than picking up a few incremental sales at the margin. It's not the complete flop that some try to make it out to be, but it's not a success either. Hopefully Apple will introduce a phone this fall to take its place that has a more clear cut (and successful) strategy.
I don't know anyone who has ever bought a Miley Cyrus album/CD and I have never seen anyone with a Miley Cyrus album/CD. I don't even know anyone who listens to Miley Cyrus on the radio. What does this mean? Other than it suggesting that I don't know anyone who listens to or buys crappy pop-tart music, not much.
Or perhaps you don't know your friends' musical tastes as well as you think!
According to past practice there should be a new form factor this year. Does the 5s then get the plastic back? Do they stick with the plastic 5c, or get rid of it and keep the 4S? It's definitely going to be a interesting year.
My carrier has introduced 4G connectivity at 3G rate plans, but only for the 5c and 5s. Since my wife has the 5s and is pretty much always connected to Wifi, it looks like I'll end up buying the 5c finally! As long as the internals compare to my 5, it is good.
The only step back would be going from 64GB to 32GB, but over the years the number of apps I actually use has reduced so hopefully I should manage.
I'm eyeing the blue one or the green one...
According to past practice there should be a new form factor this year. Does the 5s then get the plastic back? Do they stick with the plastic 5c, or get rid of it and keep the 4S? It's definitely going to be a interesting year.
Strong arguments either way. Since the iPhone 6 is going to a brand new design, keeping the 5s does not pose the same potential supply chain constraints that keeping the 5 would have had for this year's production cycle. Compared to keeping the 5s, moving the 5s internals into a "6c" plastic shell would streamline the production and probably raise the margins.
But, what kind of effect would that move have on the year-over-year sales trend? Would more consumers buy a year-old 5s or a plastic "6c"? This year, the 5c had novelty in its favor, and it served a purpose in the supply chain management by removing a potential production bottleneck for the 5s. Next year, those factors would not apply with the "6c."
I don't see any reason to keep the 4s. It does not use the Lightning connector, and moving the 5c into the entry level slot would complete that migration for the iPhone lineup. Plus, I suspect that the other A5-based models (iPad2, iPad mini, and iPod touch 5th gen) will get phased out by year's end, so there's that consideration as well.
Are you saying that they'll go away from using aluminum? I can only see them going with Liquid Metal if that's the case, and I'm not sure that'll be a cost effective material yet.