Is it me or is apple running scared from the whole world of 3D?
When I first used macs 3D was it (I used an ancient package that ran on a mac plus!!). then for a while I used Strata and infinidi. At the higher end was electric image.
In recent years the mac has become invisible in 3D - especially at the high end with no Soft Image, Houdini, 3DS MAX etc. I know that Maya has been ported over but apple's crappy hardware can hardly take market share from wintel or sgi terrain can it?
In recent years the mac has become invisible in 3D - especially at the high end with no Soft Image, Houdini, 3DS MAX etc. I know that Maya has been ported over but apple's crappy hardware can hardly take market share from wintel or sgi terrain can it?
so what gives?</strong><hr></blockquote>
That's what I am thinking too. The software is "here" but the hardware isn't
In lieu of increasing marketshare and growing horizontally ('a la classic MS), I guess Apple is trying to create a vertical monopoly...or rather not monopoly, but a vertical parallel universe and grow from top to bottom.
If this really is the case, and it's not just Jobs wanting to have Macs run his pet projects, then this is a very long term, somewhat risky proposition. You may alienate longtime software friends hoping your Prohub technology gives you the ability to grow horizontally in the future.
Apple needs to create a larger company structure.
...one hub to bring them all and in Cupertino, bind them.
[quote] Who says they want to compete with Digidesign? Didn't you notice that the new |HD system is strictly mac, at least for now? If that doesn't show that Apple hardware already dominates the audio indudtry, I don't know what does. <hr></blockquote>
The new system isnt strictly mac....it is planned for PC already. But that is besides the point. Apple wants to be able to make a unified system, audio video, and compositing all easily transferable. I am fearful of them competing with PT, cause i think its hard to beat for audio. But i think the price is rediculous for what its limitations are. I personally run Pro Tools 24 MIX at home, and love it. Although I would love to be able to run it on OSX before 2003 which is the expected earliest date. Apple needs Pro Audio on OSX before then, and now with Apogee Firewire card for their 888/24 outboard rack DA they have a great pro converter. If they can do what they did with FCP vs AVID for the audio world i think it would be great. We will see. On the topic of shake, alot of the reason apple had interest in NR shake was for its development of the IFF file format that maya uses and NR developed in house. Being able to edit IFF sequences in FCP without changing formats would be nice. I just hope they dont kill the Nothing Real community, by killing the origional app and making it more GUI based and less scriptable.
I doubt it would be less scriptable, but as for more GUI-based, don't be too surprised. But remember we are in the days of OS X and the *nixhead Terminal so there should be plenty of the nitty gritty stuff too.
Apple buys Raycer, presumably for their high-end 3d graphics expertise.
Apple works out a deal with Nvidia so that Macs get the highest of the high end cards, at the same time as Wintels.
Apple buys a high end modeling software developer.
The G5 is rumored to be scary-fast, and is coming soon.
OS X is infinitely better suited to high end 3d modeling than was OS 9.
Combine all this with Apple emerging presence in DV editing due to FCP, DVDpro, and the superdrive. Macs are now a presence in Hollywood!
Conclusion: Wouldn't it be cool if a Powermac could be used to create movies, used for editing DV, for creating intense 3d special effects, for modeling Jar-Jar Binks type characters, all on the same system for under $5000?
Jobs is a genius...he knows Apple's strength is their ability to create new niches previously unknown to computing. He want's to recapture the magic for Apple that accompanied the creation of desktop publishing. This time it's going to be in the field Jobs is familiar with: Movie production. I'm sure Jobs would LOVE to have Pixar do all of their movie production on Macs.
It's a brilliant strategy, because dominating Hollywood would not only give Apple good business, but it would do something that Wintels would not be able to copy: It would make Macs "cool" again! If Macs are doing hip movie production things that Wintels cannot do, they will become coveted once again. People will see that there is more to do with a home computer than gaming, which brings up another point:
By embracing the high end modeling and video production market, Apple will be making hardware that is actually good for gaming, maybe even better than Wintel hardware! Imagine a G5 with the top Nvidia chipset, paired with a Cinema display! Wintel droids would be creaming their pants at the thought of running Doom 3 on a Mac! And yes, Carmack is making Doom 3 for Windows and OS X at the same time, and Id has a decent amount of expertise at optimizing their software for PPC. If Doom 3 benchmarks show it running fastest on a G5 powermac, then Apple can just kick back and watch the market share skyrocket. Game dweebs will buy whatever is fastest, they don't care about cost!
I know, I'm basking in Jobs' RDF, but it's real nice here! I see a bright future for Apple!
That guys should read up on his history a little better. Apple and Adobe have butted heads every since Adobe got large enough to swing it's weight. One only needs to look at the infamous Truetype vs Postcript(and Quickdraw GX for that matter) this was a thinly veiled attempt to rid Apple of Postscript licensing fees. Apple is NOT afraid to piss Adobe off and vice versa. I think Apple is doing the right thing..there are no guarantees that competing developers are going to keep programming for the Mac Platform anyways so you might as well hedge your bets. Ole Jobsy is taking a cue from Microsoft who was deft at slowly crafting the Office Suite and then making it an indespensible part of everyday business computing. Apple has the same challenge with Desktop Video.
hmurchison: I agree that historically the Adobe-Apple marriage was a one of convenience and self-service and they have butted heads before, but this is a different world now. There are not dozens of start ups in garages making marketable stuff anymore. The market is maturing to the point that there are only a few PC box makers and the hardware and software are getting so optimized that only the really really niche products are coming from garages or those fleeing MS and other big companies.
This means that if you slip, you don't have the luxury of starting over anymore. There won't be a NeXt for Jobs to go to, or BeOS or any number of other places. With fewer players in the game, there are fewer alliances that are possible and it gets closer to a cold war situation.
Now obviously Linux is a wild-card and Apple has wisely allied it's future with the wild-card. New ideas and new companies will form to take care of market needs, but it isn't the Wild West anymore. Fences have been laid out and you have to live with your neighbors.
As the article elluded, this is pretty high-stakes and even more high-stakes than Apple is letting on. It maybe a necessary step to survive, it certainly is an innovative step that will benefit all of us who like Macs and the innovations they inspire, but I think it is really risky.
Apple now more than ever will have to change they way it runs. I wrote this on another thread, but Jobs is trying to move to something bigger and that something bigger may have to be bigger than the Macintosh. He appears to be entering the realms of George Lucas and Speilberg. Industrial Light and Magic is a great company, but it works for companies other than Lucas companies. It has to support and industry that is competing against Lucas. Jobs will have to support companies other than Pixar and perhaps (at least in the short term) platforms other than Macintoshes, using hardware other than Apple's.
That is going to be immense.
And I wonder how Peter Jackson sleeps at night, knowing that now the next two Lord of the Rings movies will be depending upon Steve Jobs....in Mordor, where the shadows lie....at least we know the trailers are going to be killer!
Comments
When I first used macs 3D was it (I used an ancient package that ran on a mac plus!!). then for a while I used Strata and infinidi. At the higher end was electric image.
In recent years the mac has become invisible in 3D - especially at the high end with no Soft Image, Houdini, 3DS MAX etc. I know that Maya has been ported over but apple's crappy hardware can hardly take market share from wintel or sgi terrain can it?
so what gives?
<strong>
In recent years the mac has become invisible in 3D - especially at the high end with no Soft Image, Houdini, 3DS MAX etc. I know that Maya has been ported over but apple's crappy hardware can hardly take market share from wintel or sgi terrain can it?
so what gives?</strong><hr></blockquote>
That's what I am thinking too. The software is "here" but the hardware isn't
In lieu of increasing marketshare and growing horizontally ('a la classic MS), I guess Apple is trying to create a vertical monopoly...or rather not monopoly, but a vertical parallel universe and grow from top to bottom.
If this really is the case, and it's not just Jobs wanting to have Macs run his pet projects, then this is a very long term, somewhat risky proposition. You may alienate longtime software friends hoping your Prohub technology gives you the ability to grow horizontally in the future.
Apple needs to create a larger company structure.
...one hub to bring them all and in Cupertino, bind them.
The new system isnt strictly mac....it is planned for PC already. But that is besides the point. Apple wants to be able to make a unified system, audio video, and compositing all easily transferable. I am fearful of them competing with PT, cause i think its hard to beat for audio. But i think the price is rediculous for what its limitations are. I personally run Pro Tools 24 MIX at home, and love it. Although I would love to be able to run it on OSX before 2003 which is the expected earliest date. Apple needs Pro Audio on OSX before then, and now with Apogee Firewire card for their 888/24 outboard rack DA they have a great pro converter. If they can do what they did with FCP vs AVID for the audio world i think it would be great. We will see. On the topic of shake, alot of the reason apple had interest in NR shake was for its development of the IFF file format that maya uses and NR developed in house. Being able to edit IFF sequences in FCP without changing formats would be nice. I just hope they dont kill the Nothing Real community, by killing the origional app and making it more GUI based and less scriptable.
REX
Apple buys Raycer, presumably for their high-end 3d graphics expertise.
Apple works out a deal with Nvidia so that Macs get the highest of the high end cards, at the same time as Wintels.
Apple buys a high end modeling software developer.
The G5 is rumored to be scary-fast, and is coming soon.
OS X is infinitely better suited to high end 3d modeling than was OS 9.
Combine all this with Apple emerging presence in DV editing due to FCP, DVDpro, and the superdrive. Macs are now a presence in Hollywood!
Conclusion: Wouldn't it be cool if a Powermac could be used to create movies, used for editing DV, for creating intense 3d special effects, for modeling Jar-Jar Binks type characters, all on the same system for under $5000?
Jobs is a genius...he knows Apple's strength is their ability to create new niches previously unknown to computing. He want's to recapture the magic for Apple that accompanied the creation of desktop publishing. This time it's going to be in the field Jobs is familiar with: Movie production. I'm sure Jobs would LOVE to have Pixar do all of their movie production on Macs.
It's a brilliant strategy, because dominating Hollywood would not only give Apple good business, but it would do something that Wintels would not be able to copy: It would make Macs "cool" again! If Macs are doing hip movie production things that Wintels cannot do, they will become coveted once again. People will see that there is more to do with a home computer than gaming, which brings up another point:
By embracing the high end modeling and video production market, Apple will be making hardware that is actually good for gaming, maybe even better than Wintel hardware! Imagine a G5 with the top Nvidia chipset, paired with a Cinema display! Wintel droids would be creaming their pants at the thought of running Doom 3 on a Mac! And yes, Carmack is making Doom 3 for Windows and OS X at the same time, and Id has a decent amount of expertise at optimizing their software for PPC. If Doom 3 benchmarks show it running fastest on a G5 powermac, then Apple can just kick back and watch the market share skyrocket. Game dweebs will buy whatever is fastest, they don't care about cost!
I know, I'm basking in Jobs' RDF, but it's real nice here! I see a bright future for Apple!
<strong><a href="http://www.digitalproducer.com/cgi-bin/getframeletter.cgi?/2002/02_feb/editorials/02_04/apple_nothingreal.htm"; target="_blank">Article</a> looking at Apple's recent moves with software.</strong><hr></blockquote>
That guys should read up on his history a little better. Apple and Adobe have butted heads every since Adobe got large enough to swing it's weight. One only needs to look at the infamous Truetype vs Postcript(and Quickdraw GX for that matter) this was a thinly veiled attempt to rid Apple of Postscript licensing fees. Apple is NOT afraid to piss Adobe off and vice versa. I think Apple is doing the right thing..there are no guarantees that competing developers are going to keep programming for the Mac Platform anyways so you might as well hedge your bets. Ole Jobsy is taking a cue from Microsoft who was deft at slowly crafting the Office Suite and then making it an indespensible part of everyday business computing. Apple has the same challenge with Desktop Video.
This means that if you slip, you don't have the luxury of starting over anymore. There won't be a NeXt for Jobs to go to, or BeOS or any number of other places. With fewer players in the game, there are fewer alliances that are possible and it gets closer to a cold war situation.
Now obviously Linux is a wild-card and Apple has wisely allied it's future with the wild-card. New ideas and new companies will form to take care of market needs, but it isn't the Wild West anymore. Fences have been laid out and you have to live with your neighbors.
As the article elluded, this is pretty high-stakes and even more high-stakes than Apple is letting on. It maybe a necessary step to survive, it certainly is an innovative step that will benefit all of us who like Macs and the innovations they inspire, but I think it is really risky.
Apple now more than ever will have to change they way it runs. I wrote this on another thread, but Jobs is trying to move to something bigger and that something bigger may have to be bigger than the Macintosh. He appears to be entering the realms of George Lucas and Speilberg. Industrial Light and Magic is a great company, but it works for companies other than Lucas companies. It has to support and industry that is competing against Lucas. Jobs will have to support companies other than Pixar and perhaps (at least in the short term) platforms other than Macintoshes, using hardware other than Apple's.
That is going to be immense.
And I wonder how Peter Jackson sleeps at night, knowing that now the next two Lord of the Rings movies will be depending upon Steve Jobs....in Mordor, where the shadows lie....at least we know the trailers are going to be killer!