Apple, Inc's double digit U.S. Mac growth contradicts IDC & Gartner reports of a Mac sales slump

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  • Reply 41 of 119
    macxpressmacxpress Posts: 4,998member

    So where are all the naysayers supporting the IDC article pissing and moaning about the prices of Apple's products and how the price is affecting Mac sales? Hmmm...where are you people? Why are Mac sales up if their products are perceived in your eyes as being too expensive for the general consumer? Please, I'd love to hear your story. :)

  • Reply 42 of 119
    aussiepaulaussiepaul Posts: 144member
    Great article.
  • Reply 43 of 119
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Constable Odo View Post

     

    Why is it that Apple doesn't explain this to shareholders or potential investors?  Why doesn't Apple attempt to confront these research agencies if they're actually lying about the data.  I know that Apple doesn't have to explain anything because quarterly earnings speak for themselves, but if these research agencies are fraudulent then they need to be exposed.  Why is that Windows tablets are being counted but not iPads?  iPads now run Windows Office so it isn't as though they can be considered toys if Microsoft is giving them acknowledgement as viable business computers.  These research agencies shouldn't be allowed to skew the numbers unless they're giving reasons why one device is counted but not another.  If I were part of Apple's marketing department I would definitely confront these agencies for giving out false information and demand a retraction or something.  Bad market data may not be hurting Apple to any major degree but it certainly could be taking away potential investors who might be interested in Apple if they were being told the whole truth.  I hate to see crooks get away with crimes but I suppose nothing can be done about it.


    Why would Apple want to do this? They've been spending billions of dollars doing record stock buy-backs at awesome prices. To be quite honest, Apple has (and is making) far more money than they know what to do with and don't need investors hence the stock buy-back. They don't mind the inaccurate bad press one bit. Tim Cook is one smart COOKie.

  • Reply 44 of 119
    aaronjaaronj Posts: 1,595member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by GadgetCanadaV2 View Post

     

    Why would Apple want to do this? They've been spending billions of dollars doing record stock buy-backs at awesome prices. They don't mind the inaccurate bad press one bit. Tim Cook is one smart COOKie.


     

    Oh, man.  *shakes head*

     

    :)

  • Reply 45 of 119
    steven n.steven n. Posts: 1,127member
    frood wrote: »
    Lol since my interpretation includes both the possibility that there was or was not double digit growth its hard for me to believe there's no support for it.

    I'd be happy to move into the US double digit growth camp with any data whatsoever.

    Then you need to learn English. Your interpretation is simply wrong.
  • Reply 46 of 119
    paxmanpaxman Posts: 4,615member
    If Apple were to begin refuting what others say about it, this would present an opportunity for many to simply invent stories and numbers expressly designed to draw Apple's refutations and to thereby draw information out of Apple that Apple prefers to not reveal. The game would be to come out with a cleverly designed bit of misinformation that would place Apple in the position where the misinformation could only be refuted through revelation of some secret Apple would not otherwise reveal. If Apple chose not to respond to this bit of misinformation after having responded to other misinformation, then the market would take this lack of response as meaning the misinformation represented the truth. Through this Apple could be damaged in the market much worse than it has been through its policy of never commenting beyond occasionally adding some color around information it deliberately chooses to divulge.
    I love that Apple does not stoop to try and 'correct' this information in any other way than releasing their own numbers. I also wonder if the misinformation actually serves Apple well. The people in the know surely must see right through it, and for the rest of the world... Well, Apple has always thrived on the underdog status and maybe these kind of reports prolongs that illusion.
  • Reply 47 of 119
    fracfrac Posts: 480member
    ceek74 wrote: »
    Both Gartner and IDC have been and always will be puppets of Microsoft.
    Of course, but for those less inclined to believe, here are some past IDC "predictions"
    2011: IDC said by 2015, the smartphone market would be 39.5% Android, WindowsPhone 20.9% and iPhone 15.7%.
    2012 Update: IDC said by 2016, Android 52.9%, WindowsPhone 19.2% and iPhone 19%.

    Apart from seemingly changing their numbers retrospectively, I have to ask...is it even possible to be more spectacularly wrong?
    If people are buying this stuff, then they deserve to be fooled.
  • Reply 48 of 119
    I'm just waiting for HAMETA to chime in on this. :)
  • Reply 49 of 119

    It scares me when people start talking about Apple moving away from Intel chips in their Macs. The move to Intel was the reason I started investing in Apple. I am a frequent VMWare user for some key Windows only software that is not available for the Mac. Unless Apple has their own Intel compatible chip in the works, it would be a very bad idea to produce a Mac that is not capable of running Windows software. 

  • Reply 50 of 119
    euphoniouseuphonious Posts: 303member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

    However, apart from the truth, the primary victims of this sort of sycophant market data appears to be Microsoft, Google and their Windows and Android licensees, who have been lulled into passive slumber by soothing praise that tells them they are winning when they actually are not.

     

    Windows isn't 'winning'. Windows has won.  It has 90%+ market share for desktop operating systems. How is that 'not winning'?

  • Reply 51 of 119
    asdasdasdasd Posts: 5,330member
    frac wrote: »
    Of course, but for those less inclined to believe, here are some past IDC "predictions"
    2011: IDC said by 2015, the smartphone market would be 39.5% Android, WindowsPhone 20.9% and iPhone 15.7%.
    2012 Update: IDC said by 2016, Android 52.9%, WindowsPhone 19.2% and iPhone 19%.

    Apart from seemingly changing their numbers retrospectively, I have to ask...is it even possible to be more spectacularly wrong?
    If people are buying this stuff, then they deserve to be fooled.

    I often wonder why they can't be sued by investors who naively took that as a valid prognosis? Where's the class action suit.
  • Reply 52 of 119
    asdasdasdasd Posts: 5,330member
    euphonious wrote: »
    Windows isn't 'winning'. Windows has won.  It has 90%+ market share for desktop operating systems. How is that 'not winning'?

    Because. Post PC world. Keep up.
  • Reply 53 of 119
    asdasdasdasd Posts: 5,330member
    Kudos to Apple. I think they are leaving some money on the table at the moment with fairly tepid updates. I want a 15 inch mac book pro with a flash drive and Touch ID. Preferably thinner. My existing 2012 model will do until that happens. It's pretty good. They can push the upgrade cycle by adding these kinds of functionality.
  • Reply 54 of 119
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Euphonious View Post

     

    Windows isn't 'winning'. Windows has won.  It has 90%+ market share for desktop operating systems. How is that 'not winning'?


     

    Did you not read the article at all?  Or do you just not understand it? You seem to have drunk the KoolAid from IDC and Gartner.  The PC market is shrinking, but Apple's selling MORE Macs. Therefore it's share of the PC market is increasing. And Microsoft is LOSING share.  Losing.  Microsoft is doomed™.

  • Reply 55 of 119
    michael scripmichael scrip Posts: 1,912member
    euphonious wrote: »
    Windows isn't 'winning'. Windows has won.  It has 90%+ market share for desktop operating systems. How is that 'not winning'?

    Windows has the bigger number for sure. But does that mean Apple is losing?

    Look at how many PC manufacturers have disappeared from the market. IBM, Compaq, Sony, Gateway, etc. They sold themselves to other companies because they couldn't cut it on their own. BTW... all those companies were selling "Windows" computers.

    Hell... HP and Dell were thinking about exiting the consumer PC market too because the market was becoming too saturated and they were barely making money.

    You can blame it on the fact that all those companies were selling garbage PCs with almost no margin. But that was their decision.

    And then there's Apple who found a niche market and is one of the most, if not THE most, successful PC manufacturers.

    "Windows" is "winning" but it's not quite the victory you think it is.
  • Reply 56 of 119
    kenckenc Posts: 186member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post





    How can they be proven fraudulent? These are projections and in no way are considered to be actual numbers

    "Projections" are normally estimates of the future, while these are of the past. I don't think "projections" is the correct term for what they do. 

     

    Further if this data isn't supposed to imply "actual numbers", then that is typically done with rounding, but IDC gives data down to the SINGLE UNITS.  That's called false precision if that's an estimate. It's ludicrous to estimate down to the single digits. Given that IDC is data driven, and have numerous statisticians on their payroll, the use of data down to the single digits has to be intentional, which means the implied precision is intentional, which of course is misleading.

  • Reply 57 of 119
    kenckenc Posts: 186member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Euphonious View Post

     

     

    Windows isn't 'winning'. Windows has won.  It has 90%+ market share for desktop operating systems. How is that 'not winning'?


    90+% marketshare when Apple has greater than 50% profitshare is "not winning". When Lenovo makes less than $10 a PC, that's "not winning". When HP and Dell are abandoning the consumer PC market, that's "not winning". When Leo Apotheker tries to sell the PC business, that's a sure sign they're "not winning". When Dell takes the business private, so as not to have to report their sales, that's a sure sign they're "not winning".

     

    http://www.asymco.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/07/Screen-Shot-2014-07-23-at-7-23-5.22.59-PM1.png

     

    Take a look at the bottom two charts from Horace Dediu at Asymco. Windows is "not winning", contrary to what you may have heard. Without profits, a business cannot reinvest in the future.

  • Reply 58 of 119
    crowleycrowley Posts: 6,057member

    Lenovo, HP and Dell don't make Windows.  Windows is winning in its game, which is generating profit from software ubiquity.  Apple is winning its game, which is generating profit from hardware.  Windows seems to be winning less than it was last year, and Apple is winning more, but they're both still winning.

  • Reply 59 of 119
    georgeip5georgeip5 Posts: 225member
    On and on about this. The reason sales have decreased is because people want to get the new stuff that comes in. Not get the current model and then tomorrow a new one comes out. Also after WWDC's announcement people are definitely going to wait a little bit.
  • Reply 60 of 119
    sacto joesacto joe Posts: 796member
    pringsmuth wrote: »
    It scares me when people start talking about Apple moving away from Intel chips in their Macs. The move to Intel was the reason I started investing in Apple. I am a frequent VMWare user for some key Windows only software that is not available for the Mac. Unless Apple has their own Intel compatible chip in the works, it would be a very bad idea to produce a Mac that is not capable of running Windows software. 
    Hmm. Seems to me nearly everyone I know is using Parallels to run PC software, not BootCamp. So it might not be all that big a deal in the last analysis. Also, Macs are now only 15% of Apple's revenue stream.
    The times, they are achangin'....
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