Apple to collect swipe fees from banks for Apple Pay transactions - report

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  • Reply 61 of 229
    melgross wrote: »
    Yeah. Cook said that there were 200 million people who could already use this. Maybe we're wrong, and the iPhone 5S is usable.

    I'm saying over the next 12 months there will be about that many sold on the new iPhones.

    Does the 5S contain this so-called Secure Element? Without that Apple Pay will not work.

    No. But more importantly there is no NFC so no way of communicating with that protocol.
  • Reply 62 of 229
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by melgross View Post





    Well, I don't really want to get into a political and economic war here, but Germany is directly responsible for many of the problems the EU is having. And it's interesting that every decision that Germany has made that has resulted in deeper recession everywhere else in the EU, has benefitted them. Everyone e who understands economics knows that when economic times are bad, you spend your way out of it, and you don't tell countries to tighten up, which just results in more recession. And spending does not increase inflation. That's been shown to be a red herring. Right now, Europe is in danger of deflation, which is far worse than inflation, because no one knows how to back out of that, whereas we do know how to back out of inflation.

    This^^...  very broadly speaking and within limits... as with all things. I like to think of it in terms of control theory- Old gasoline engine(chug, chug, spit and spew), similar to 1800's economy and boom and bust, it was unregulated. New modern engines, computer control fuel input etc, no spit and spew... similar to Fed reserve etc ensuring appropriate money flow (problem is we have a congress muck things up, one way or another). Its interesting there are counter-intuitive things in macro economics vs micro economics as there are counter intuitive items in say... general physics to quantum physics.  But trying to get counter-intuitive thought into the general population... not easy.

  • Reply 63 of 229
    eauvive wrote: »
    Uh. Don’t tell me in the US you don’t have chip cards?
    Mine, which is two years old, has an embedded NFC as evidenced by the ‘wavy’ symbol on it
    <img alt="" class="lightbox-enabled" data-id="48474" data-type="61" src="http://forums.appleinsider.com/content/type/61/id/48474/width/200/height/400/flags/LL" style="; width: 125px; height: 400px">
    y

    Uh. Who cares? With Apple Pay there will essentially NO cards--at least none being carried around.
  • Reply 64 of 229
    gatorguygatorguy Posts: 24,594member
    danielsw wrote: »
    y

    Uh. Who cares? With Apple Pay there will essentially NO cards--at least none being carried around.

    In the US it will be some time before NFC is widely available at checkout. Don't cut your cards up quite yet.
  • Reply 65 of 229
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,600member
    melgross wrote: »
    Yeah. Cook said that there were 200 million people who could already use this. Maybe we're wrong, and the iPhone 5S is usable.
    melgross wrote: »
    Yeah. Cook said that there were 200 million people who could already use this. Maybe we're wrong, and the iPhone 5S is usable.

    Does the 5S contain this so-called Secure Element? Without that Apple Pay will not work.

    Bah! I just looked at Apple's site for Apple Pay (two words). Apparently I mistook what was said. As I did say before, the iWatch is usable on phones back to the 5, but Apple Pay is only usable on those phones through iWatch, and only through store purchases, it seems, at least, right now. Maybe when iOS 8 is available for the older phones in app purchases and online purchases may work.

    http://www.apple.com/apple-pay/
  • Reply 66 of 229
    solipsismx wrote: »

    2) Based on last year's iPhone purchases there will be a couple hundred million iPhones 6/6+ sold over the year.

    That's global figures. Anything more specific for Europe?

    I just chanced on an article here saying that iOS market share in France is 15% (Android 75%) and slowly sliding.
    melgross wrote: »
    It will also work using the iWatch through the old iPhone 5, and 5S. But by the end of next year, we'll see a lot of iPhones sold that will use this directly. I believe my numbers are fairly close.

    Well, remind me to bring this up at the end of next year! :)
  • Reply 67 of 229
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,600member
    Does the 5S contain this so-called Secure Element? Without that Apple Pay will not work.

    The A7 containers the secure enclave, since it's a part of every new higher end ARM based chip. But possibly there is a newer version on the A8 and the S1 SoC in iWatch. We should know that shortly.

    One thing I can say that's known to be true about Apple, and that's that they won't announce something until it's done. So even if the older phones support this in some way without iWatch, even with ios8, they may not say so until it's out. And I think they said that Apple Pay won't be available until October.
  • Reply 68 of 229
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,600member
    solipsismx wrote: »
    I'm saying over the next 12 months there will be about that many sold on the new iPhones.
    No. But more importantly there is no NFC so no way of communicating with that protocol.

    But Apple said that this will work with some online stores. At least, I'm pretty sure I heard that said. And it will work for in app purchases.
  • Reply 69 of 229
    ksecksec Posts: 1,569member

    Apple are getting 15-25bps ( 0.15-0.25% ) from those banks.

  • Reply 70 of 229
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,600member
    boeyc15 wrote: »
    This^^...  very broadly speaking and within limits... as with all things. I like to think of it in terms of control theory- Old gasoline engine(chug, chug, spit and spew), similar to 1800's economy and boom and bust, it was unregulated. New modern engines, computer control fuel input etc, no spit and spew... similar to Fed reserve etc ensuring appropriate money flow (problem is we have a congress muck things up, one way or another). Its interesting there are counter-intuitive things in macro economics vs micro economics as there are counter intuitive items in say... general physics to quantum physics.  But trying to get counter-intuitive thought into the general population... not easy.

    Because the general population is unsophisticated, and certain groups are VERY good at getting their ideas out there, unopposed, because the other side has this crazy idea that people will know the truth.
  • Reply 71 of 229
    melgross wrote: »
    But Apple said that this will work with some online stores. At least, I'm pretty sure I heard that said. And it will work for in app purchases.

    My assumption was with other NFC capable devices, mostly running Android, would be able to use those 220,000 NFC terminals.
  • Reply 72 of 229
    MacProMacPro Posts: 19,822member
    solipsismx wrote: »
    My assumption was with other NFC capable devices, mostly running Android, would be able to use those 220,000 NFC terminals.

    Part of me wishes Apple had a proprietary set up that was fast heading to being ubiquitous. If what you say is true the also rans will simply copy ?Pay and cash in as per usual, pun intended.
  • Reply 73 of 229
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,600member
    eauvive wrote: »
    That's global figures. Anything more specific for Europe?

    I just chanced on an article here saying that iOS market share in France is 15% (Android 75%) and slowly sliding.
    Well, remind me to bring this up at the end of next year! :)

    You think I'll remember a year from now? I'll be lucky to remember next month.
  • Reply 74 of 229
    melgross wrote: »
    You think I'll remember a year from now? I'll be lucky to remember next month.

    That's because your a kingpin here with a lot of things to churn out each day. I have a set a reminder in my agenda :)
  • Reply 75 of 229
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,600member
    solipsismx wrote: »
    My assumption was with other NFC capable devices, mostly running Android, would be able to use those 220,000 NFC terminals.

    They can use the terminals. My point is that with just that small number, Google's Wallet failed. Android owners also spend little using their devices, so there was little incentive for retailers to expand the use. I also suspect that very few Android users who have this on their phones are even aware of what it can do, or have any interest in doing it even if they do know.

    I don't know too much about Google Wallet, though I know they did modify it to use Apple's iBeacons. I'm curious to know just how it works, which credit cards it takes, which bank insurers, retailers, etc., as well as how security works, maximum purchase size, and whatever the other differences and similarities are.

    What I can say is that every article I've ever read about mobile payments and NFC has said that it won't take off until Apple does it.
  • Reply 76 of 229
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,600member
    eauvive wrote: »
    That's because your a kingpin here with a lot of things to churn out each day. I have a set a reminder in my agenda :)

    Nah. I just don't remember much.
  • Reply 77 of 229
    gatorguygatorguy Posts: 24,594member
    melgross wrote: »
    My point is that with just that small number, Google's Wallet failed.

    What I can say is that every article I've ever read about mobile payments and NFC has said that it won't take off until Apple does it.

    That's fairly obvious. Half the mobile market in the US is Apple devices. Now with Apple on board other mobile payment options have a much better chance at wide acceptance, Google's included. As I said earlier, a rising tide. . .
  • Reply 78 of 229
    eauvive wrote: »
    Uh. Don’t tell me in the US you don’t have chip cards?
    Mine, which is two years old, has an embedded NFC as evidenced by the ‘wavy’ symbol on it
    <img alt="" class="lightbox-enabled" data-id="48474" data-type="61" src="http://forums.appleinsider.com/content/type/61/id/48474/width/200/height/400/flags/LL" style="; width: 125px; height: 400px">
    Does your chipped card seamlessly integrate into apps to pay for items? Because that's also an extension of Apple Pay. I'm guessing that functionality will be enabled through Safari at some point too. That's what else you are getting.
  • Reply 79 of 229
    melgross wrote: »
    Because the general population is unsophisticated, and certain groups are VERY good at getting their ideas out there, unopposed, because the other side has this crazy idea that people will know the truth.

    You're getting political again... ????
  • Reply 80 of 229
    Does your chipped card seamlessly integrate into apps to pay for items? Because that's also an extension of Apple Pay. I'm guessing that functionality will be enabled through Safari at some point too. That's what else you are getting.

    Well, I must confess I never bought over Internet using Passbook. Over here, all you can do with it is buying plane tickets. I use my Mac for buying things, and Safari has my credit card numbers memorized. I do too, know all the numbers by heart, since I haven't changed for years.
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