Sorry dude but you can't do that with a publicly traded company. It is insider trading, same goes for telling you Mom or you 2nd cousin from BFE. If you don't think the SEC will find out about it, well enjoy that new Federal Country club you'll be staying in. Maybe you are to young to remember Martha Stewart and her troubles. She stood to lose $228K if the stock went to zero - she lost a whole hell of a lot more than that.
The irony was that the stock then went up considerably.
It is fully in their right to sell stock if things look like they are going south.
Um, nope. Not once they are publicly traded. I work for a huge company and we experience a quarterly "freeze" during which we are not permitted to sell any of the company stock we own. To do so is an SEC violation. Further, we are also specifically warned during non-freeze periods we are not permitted to act on even the slightest notion of insider information. It's a huge no-no.
The truth hurts, as your reaction so eminently demonstrates.
Said like the little the pitiful troll that you are. Yeah, the fact that I'm upset by your practise of always pretending to know what a dead guy would/wouldn't do, and obsessively dragging Steve Jobs out of his grave in almost every one of your posts in order to bash Cook and Apple, means "the truth hurts". There isn't an iota of "truth" in your post, because you're not stating any actual facts. Your fantasies of what would or wouldn't have happened under Jobs, 4 years after his death, does not count as the "truth" or as any kind of empirical "fact". A 4 year old understands this, but clearly not you.
What my reaction "demonstrates" is that I think your filthy practise of using the dead Steve Jobs consistently to baselessly bash Apple is a filthy, dishonest, cowardly, and moronic thing to do. Since you feel you're so intimate with Jobs, I wonder if you've thought of what he would think of you, someone who has consistently exploited his death in order to smear and bash his hand picked successor, and the company he founded? Maybe chew on that between your trolls.
But no, it must be because I'm terrified of the "TRUTH", which you hilariously define your consistently empty, hypothetical, baseless drivel.
One day, you'll learn that the truth is made up of more than facts. Having said that, some facts are worth getting right:
Jobs died three years ago, not four.
Here's some more truth for you:
People like Pazuzu and I are the real Apple lovers, not yes-men like you. The reason Apple achieved such success was because Jobs was good at saying "No"; in other words, he was a perfectionist and was profoundly critical of anything less than ideal.
It's because Pazuzu and I hold Apple up to such lofty ideals that we are inclined to criticise Apple for the smallest mis-step, because these things matter. It's very important that Cook never loses sight of this, otherwise they will descend into mediocrity.
It's people like you who forced Apple to their knees in the 90s, until Jobs came along and started to say "No."
It's a shame that you use such odious language in reference to the late Steve Jobs; I can't imagine that Mrs. Jobs would be too happy with your lurid descriptions of dragging people from graves and the like.
Have a think about why people criticise Apple here. AI don't really have any real trolls, due to the good moderation, so one can assume that criticism is genuine.
No-one wants Cook to spoil the broth, but he should be mindful that the Apple magic that Jobs concocted may turn into the cauldron of despair if the vision and focus of Jobs is bent out of shape.
I don't think GTAT executives are crooks and frauds, I think they significantly over-estimated what they needed to make their dreams a reality. It sounds as if the process for getting the Mesa facility up and running was likely more expensive, and ran into more problems, than they anticipated. This put delivery deadlines in jeopardy, put them behind schedule, and therefore they failed to receive payments from Apple on time to continue operations. My guess is that they were not fully forthcoming to Apple about the problems, because Apple would have been willing to help them in order to keep the delivery schedule on track. But do you really want to help someone who isn't telling you the truth (or all of it)?
So you seriously think GTAT had no idea they would not get the final payment from Apple until Oct 6th (day of their bankruptcy filing)?
If so they were obligated to inform investors. Even if they did so on Oct 3rd that would be sufficient time for investors to make a decision to sell.
Presumably they knew there was a very high risk that they would not get payment. But, creating a run in the stock would destroy any chance in getting funding, which would eliminate a chance of maximizing shareholder value. Their fiduciary responsibility is for timely disclosure. That is not real-time.
Small cap stocks are a high risk game for a number of reasons. You got burned... learn from it and move on, unless you now own 10% of the stock ($5MM), in which case you might do well to learn about making sapphires. Whatever you have left is not going to recover. Someone will take over their assets at bargain-basement prices and maybe salvage a viable business from the ashes.
I don't understand the scandal here. If I work at my company and I see it tanking, I'm going to sell my stock before it's worth nothing.
A note of caution: do outsiders know what you know? If not then, even if you're a low-level employee, you would be trading on "insider knowledge". That's illegal. The insider-trading rules aren't just for high-level executives, but apply to anyone who has non-public knowledge about the financial situation of the company.
tl;dr if morale is low and people are leaving then you can sell your shares. That info is sort-of public. But if someone leaves a copy of next week's press release with bad financials sitting on the photocopier - and you look at it - you have inside knowledge and can't sell.
It's not always about what you can get. It sometimes needs to be about what you can provide. I don't think Apple is interested in running factories, so why not help GTAT with what would essentially be chump change for Apple so that GTAT can right their ship. Apple is always going to win, but one looks like a bigger winner when they help someone else win.
Well said. Apple was in the "run a factory" business before and knows what it entails. They don't want to do that. It's not their specialty. They want others to do that and focus on it, for that is their specialty.
The development of iPhone 4 illustrates the point well. Foxconn built prototypes for Apple using specialty, prototype-style milling machines. These weren't intended for large-scale production but just for small numbers of special, custom pieces during development. Apple decided that this design was a "go" and approved it for production. Foxconn said something like "wait a minute - this is a prototype, the production has to be simpler machining". To which Apple replied - "this is what we want". So Foxconn bought up the entire world's supply of these milling machines, including all that were to be built for the next year or two. No-one else could buy one - they were "unobtainium". And it was because they talked to Apple and Apple fronted the money for them.
I guess that this would have been from the "international" money.
Sorry dude but you can't do that with a publicly traded company. It is insider trading, same goes for telling you Mom or you 2nd cousin from BFE. If you don't think the SEC will find out about it, well enjoy that new Federal Country club you'll be staying in. Maybe you are to young to remember Martha Stewart and her troubles. She stood to lose $228K if the stock went to zero - she lost a whole hell of a lot more than that.
Right. We're not privy to everything going on here, but this is starting to look like a serious case of fraud and insider trading. Prison sentences may follow.
Right. We're not privy to everything going on here, but this is starting to look like a serious case of fraud and insider trading. Prison sentences may follow.
If Martha Stewart can get sent to the slammer for chiseling a couple hundred grand, these guys could be good to go. Where people really get in trouble is by lying to federal investigators or a grand jury. That's when they get charged with perjury and obstruction on top of everything else.
Difference is these Executives who sold the stock had inside information that they did not release to the shareholders.
Thats the whole deal. If GTAT was honest and forthright regarding the bad position they were in than no one would go after the CEO. But the CEO lied and withheld information from shareholders until they went BANKRUPT. Once that happenned shareholders lost 95% of their investment. When material events occur (like not be able to pay your bills) the CEO/CFO is obligated to make that information PUBLIC so shareholders can make an informed decision.
Instead GTAT executives continued to spew LIES that the company was doing great while selling MILLIONS of shares to the public.
For those who doubt my conclusion please keep in mind I have literally read dozens of hours of GTAT documents, SEC reports, analysis reports, financial statements, ect. In the last 6 months NEVER had the CEO/CFO even hinted that the company was in danger of going bankrupt. IN fact the CEO RAISED PROFIT GUIDANCE a mere 6 weeks before filing for bankruptcy.
The 50mil fine for the suppliers would seem hard to prove in my opinion. How could you prove who leaked supplier information? Whether it was a Apple insider or GT insider. Same goes for all the suppliers. Apple just assumes their peoples mouths are always airtight?
Comments
The irony was that the stock then went up considerably.
It is fully in their right to sell stock if things look like they are going south.
Um, nope. Not once they are publicly traded. I work for a huge company and we experience a quarterly "freeze" during which we are not permitted to sell any of the company stock we own. To do so is an SEC violation. Further, we are also specifically warned during non-freeze periods we are not permitted to act on even the slightest notion of insider information. It's a huge no-no.
One day, you'll learn that the truth is made up of more than facts. Having said that, some facts are worth getting right:
Jobs died three years ago, not four.
Here's some more truth for you:
People like Pazuzu and I are the real Apple lovers, not yes-men like you. The reason Apple achieved such success was because Jobs was good at saying "No"; in other words, he was a perfectionist and was profoundly critical of anything less than ideal.
It's because Pazuzu and I hold Apple up to such lofty ideals that we are inclined to criticise Apple for the smallest mis-step, because these things matter. It's very important that Cook never loses sight of this, otherwise they will descend into mediocrity.
It's people like you who forced Apple to their knees in the 90s, until Jobs came along and started to say "No."
It's a shame that you use such odious language in reference to the late Steve Jobs; I can't imagine that Mrs. Jobs would be too happy with your lurid descriptions of dragging people from graves and the like.
Have a think about why people criticise Apple here. AI don't really have any real trolls, due to the good moderation, so one can assume that criticism is genuine.
No-one wants Cook to spoil the broth, but he should be mindful that the Apple magic that Jobs concocted may turn into the cauldron of despair if the vision and focus of Jobs is bent out of shape.
Small cap stocks are a high risk game for a number of reasons. You got burned... learn from it and move on, unless you now own 10% of the stock ($5MM), in which case you might do well to learn about making sapphires. Whatever you have left is not going to recover. Someone will take over their assets at bargain-basement prices and maybe salvage a viable business from the ashes.
This whole situation WREAKS of insider trading and fraud!
"Reeks"
If you're going to capitalize it, you may as well use the correct word.
I don't understand the scandal here. If I work at my company and I see it tanking, I'm going to sell my stock before it's worth nothing.
A note of caution: do outsiders know what you know? If not then, even if you're a low-level employee, you would be trading on "insider knowledge". That's illegal. The insider-trading rules aren't just for high-level executives, but apply to anyone who has non-public knowledge about the financial situation of the company.
tl;dr if morale is low and people are leaving then you can sell your shares. That info is sort-of public. But if someone leaves a copy of next week's press release with bad financials sitting on the photocopier - and you look at it - you have inside knowledge and can't sell.
It's not always about what you can get. It sometimes needs to be about what you can provide. I don't think Apple is interested in running factories, so why not help GTAT with what would essentially be chump change for Apple so that GTAT can right their ship. Apple is always going to win, but one looks like a bigger winner when they help someone else win.
Well said. Apple was in the "run a factory" business before and knows what it entails. They don't want to do that. It's not their specialty. They want others to do that and focus on it, for that is their specialty.
The development of iPhone 4 illustrates the point well. Foxconn built prototypes for Apple using specialty, prototype-style milling machines. These weren't intended for large-scale production but just for small numbers of special, custom pieces during development. Apple decided that this design was a "go" and approved it for production. Foxconn said something like "wait a minute - this is a prototype, the production has to be simpler machining". To which Apple replied - "this is what we want". So Foxconn bought up the entire world's supply of these milling machines, including all that were to be built for the next year or two. No-one else could buy one - they were "unobtainium". And it was because they talked to Apple and Apple fronted the money for them.
I guess that this would have been from the "international" money.
Right. We're not privy to everything going on here, but this is starting to look like a serious case of fraud and insider trading. Prison sentences may follow.
"Reeks"
If you're going to capitalize it, you may as well use the correct word.
As in - if you tear the joint apart, you WREAK havoc.
But you REEK if you cut a huge fart in the middle of a corded dance floor!
Right. We're not privy to everything going on here, but this is starting to look like a serious case of fraud and insider trading. Prison sentences may follow.
If Martha Stewart can get sent to the slammer for chiseling a couple hundred grand, these guys could be good to go. Where people really get in trouble is by lying to federal investigators or a grand jury. That's when they get charged with perjury and obstruction on top of everything else.