Apple's Eddy Cue speaks out on iBooks price fixing ruling: 'It's just not right'

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Comments

  • Reply 21 of 69
    cpsrocpsro Posts: 3,200member

    Even Amazon has no profits. Good deal!

  • Reply 22 of 69
    canukstorm wrote: »
    In the ebook space, Amazon is and operates as a monopoly.  

    Sorry, but dominant, even if due to underselling, does not equal monopolistic. Complete ownership of the market is monopolistic and there are clearly alternatives available.
  • Reply 23 of 69
    rogifanrogifan Posts: 10,669member
    I must say I'm not terribly impressed with Cue. Outside of ?Pay (which looks to be fantastic though I haven't had the opportunity to use it yet) it seems like everything under his domain needs work or is languishing a bit. Either he has too much on his plate or if not maybe he needs to be replaced?
  • Reply 24 of 69
    iaeeniaeen Posts: 588member
    Sorry, but dominant, even if due to underselling, does not equal monopolistic. Complete ownership of the market is monopolistic and there are clearly alternatives available.

    Before Apple stepped in, what alternatives were there? Amazon's predatory pricing was putting the competition out of business; Borders had already succumbed and the Nook was a sinking ship.
  • Reply 25 of 69

    Eddy Cue is wrong.  DoJ got Apple at "collusion" with book publishers.  So it does not matter Apple or Amazon has a monopoly or not.  If Apple even hinted during the negotiations that all other publishers are switching to the agency model, Apple is guilty.

  • Reply 26 of 69
    dabedabe Posts: 99member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by winstein2010 View Post

     

    Eddy Cue is wrong.  DoJ got Apple at "collusion" with book publishers.  So it does not matter Apple or Amazon has a monopoly or not.  If Apple even hinted during the negotiations that all other publishers are switching to the agency model, Apple is guilty.




    Hiinting that other "customers/clients" are interested in the business proposal that I'm pitching is collusion? Wow! That's just incredible. 

  • Reply 27 of 69
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by winstein2010 View Post

     

    Eddy Cue is wrong.  DoJ got Apple at "collusion" with book publishers.  So it does not matter Apple or Amazon has a monopoly or not.  If Apple even hinted during the negotiations that all other publishers are switching to the agency model, Apple is guilty.




    Except there is nothing wrong with an agency model...

     

    other than Amazon doesn't like it...

  • Reply 28 of 69
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Dabe View Post

     



    Hiinting that other "customers/clients" are interested in the business proposal that I'm pitching is collusion? Wow! That's just incredible. 




    This.

  • Reply 29 of 69
    gtrgtr Posts: 3,231member
    rogifan wrote: »
    I must say I'm not terribly impressed with Cue. Outside of ?Pay (which looks to be fantastic though I haven't had the opportunity to use it yet) it seems like everything under his domain needs work or is languishing a bit. Either he has too much on his plate or if not maybe he needs to be replaced?

    I agree.

    I'm also not particularly impressed by him. Never have been.

    However, like you said, he is wearing an awful lot of hats right now.

    And don't forget he can't even remember that stupid secret handshake that allows staff to move freely within Apple. If there's ever been a warning sign of trouble then there it is.
  • Reply 30 of 69
    dasanman69dasanman69 Posts: 13,002member
    iaeen wrote: »
    Before Apple stepped in, what alternatives were there? Amazon's predatory pricing was putting the competition out of business; Borders had already succumbed and the Nook was a sinking ship.

    Sony had a store, Barnes & Noble did as well. Only a small selection of books were sold at, or below cost. Amazon's devices, and then app became the choice for ebook readers.
  • Reply 31 of 69

    So... Amazon cuts a deal with publishers to sell books a certain way using a certain business model favorable to Amazon and publishers. And it's Ok with the DOJ.

     

    Apple cuts a deal with publishers to sell books a certain way that's favorable to Apple and publishers... and all of a sudden it's "collusion", "price fixing", etc. according to the DOJ.

     

    Thanks DOIJ... That really clears up the ethics of fairness in business competition.

  • Reply 32 of 69
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post



    I must say I'm not terribly impressed with Cue. Outside of ?Pay (which looks to be fantastic though I haven't had the opportunity to use it yet) it seems like everything under his domain needs work or is languishing a bit. Either he has too much on his plate or if not maybe he needs to be replaced?



    I thought that was Cue's job.

     

    The reason you see him in areas that are languishing, etc. is because he is Apple's "fixer."

     

    When something important falls apart or languishes, he is the Apple go to guy to straighten it out.

     

    At least that's how I have understood it over the years.

  • Reply 33 of 69
    tundraboytundraboy Posts: 1,885member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post





    Sorry, but dominant, even if due to underselling, does not equal monopolistic. Complete ownership of the market is monopolistic and there are clearly alternatives available.



    Actually "monopolistic" is not the same as "monopoly".  You can have a monopolistic market even without a monopoly.  And both theoretically and in practice there is not much difference in the market outcomes of an overwhelmingly dominant firm and a monopoly.   I would describe Amazon's position in the eBook market as overwhelmingly or close to overwhelmingly dominant, especially after the DoJ handed them the keys to the kingdom.

  • Reply 34 of 69
    radarthekatradarthekat Posts: 3,843moderator

    I've read the entire Appeal document submitted by Apple and I am very confident Apple will, and should, walk away totally exonerated.
     


    The many arguments Apple puts forth in its appeal shows prejudice on the part of the court, several major departures from established precedent on application of the Sherman Act, legally disallowable application of inference, barring of defense expert witness, allowing the Justice department to withdraw testimony from at least one of Apple's expert witnesses when they didn't like the answer given to the Justice department's own questioning, then allowing testimony from the government's own witness when asked substantially the same question, etc.


     


    The details are too extensive to impart here and I wholly recommend a full reading of the document, but here is one example of the court's behavior: Anti-trust law does not allow a judgement of conspiracy where the actions, negotiations, and ultimate agreements between the accused parties is consistent with those same actions, negotiations, and agreements being carried out without resorting to conspiracy. The court must view these as non-conspiratorial unless there is direct evidence of a conspiracy. The supreme court's example of what would constitute direct evidence is that of a CEO confessing that the chairman of the board directed him to meet with a competing CEO in order to fix prices. But the judge in this case offered nothing other than circumstantial evidence of a conspiracy based upon her confidence one existed. What she presented, in a single paragraph of her ruling, would not meet any precedent and directly conflicts with many previous rulings. I could go on...


     


    I have a high school education. Let's see if that has afforded me a clearer view of the facts versus Judge Cote. The answer will come with the Federal Appeals court's eventual ruling.


     

  • Reply 35 of 69
    pazuzupazuzu Posts: 1,728member
    Waghhh!
    It is right- and I the consumer wins.
  • Reply 36 of 69
    pazuzupazuzu Posts: 1,728member
    9secondko wrote: »
    So... Amazon cuts a deal with publishers to sell books a certain way using a certain business model favorable to Amazon and publishers. And it's Ok with the DOJ.

    Apple cuts a deal with publishers to sell books a certain way that's favorable to Apple and publishers... and all of a sudden it's "collusion", "price fixing", etc. according to the DOJ.

    Thanks DOIJ... That really clears up the ethics of fairness in business competition.

    Remember the deal Apple cut with the music industry to "save" it? Same thing.
  • Reply 37 of 69
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post





    ...and please click away! image



    Adblock. Don't let them profit off you.

  • Reply 38 of 69
    rogifanrogifan Posts: 10,669member
    gtr wrote: »
    I agree.

    I'm also not particularly impressed by him. Never have been.

    However, like you said, he is wearing an awful lot of hats right now.

    And don't forget he can't even remember that stupid secret handshake that allows staff to move freely within Apple. If there's ever been a warning sign of trouble then there it is.

    Haha Apple's attempt at humor isn't always that great (though I did get a laugh at eating chili at the campfire using one of Jony's custom built aluminium spoons). I do think Cue has too much and perhaps his role should be spilt. I'd love to see Cook poach someone really cloud savvy and peel off iCloud, maps and Siri to him/her. Cue would still have plenty on his plate with App Store, iTunes, iBooks, ?TV and ?Pay.
  • Reply 39 of 69
    rogifanrogifan Posts: 10,669member
    9secondko wrote: »

    I thought that was Cue's job.

    The reason you see him in areas that are languishing, etc. is because he is Apple's "fixer."

    When something important falls apart or languishes, he is the Apple go to guy to straighten it out.

    At least that's how I have understood it over the years.

    But what is he fixing? Is there one service of Apple's (apart from the newly launched ?Pay) that you could say is best in class? I don't think so. Where is Apple's equivalent to Spotify & YouTube? Why is ?TV so out of date (and now being disrupted by things like Chromecast and Fire Stick)? Why is Siri good but not as great as it could be? And then there's issues with maps...

    http://tinyurl.com/mkzh8tk

    http://tinyurl.com/mrvdykk

    Like I said earlier perhaps he has too much on his plate and some stuff should be offloaded elsewhere. Cook hiring someone to specifically run cloud services would be a good idea.
  • Reply 40 of 69
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by TheWhiteFalcon View Post

     
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post





    Let us know when your book goes on sale, I enjoy your comments.



    As for when, it depends on my motivation. :) I don't want to stop writing new stuff, but I need to go back and fix some continuity and flow errors in the completed stuff. I'll get to it soon though, it won't be too bad as there aren't any grammar or spelling mistakes to correct.


     

     

    Strictly speaking, you should have used a semi-colon instead of a comma in your last sentence. ????

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