"The fob can be used alone, where it completes transactions with a default card and no security. "
????.?...?
seriously?
So if someone steals the phone and removes the dongle... Or even easier just steals the dongle - they've just done [b]even better/[b] than stealing a credit card. No security? Just take the dongle you've just ripped off a device and buy whatever you want, no pin code no security? Awesome. /s
Since this isn't based on Apple's implementation (i.e. NFC and tokenization) how are they ripping Apple off? And if they're ripping off Apple are they ripping off Google Wallet too?
It's not so much ripping off Apple as coasting off their Apple Pay momentum. They would've never decided to delve into this area if Apple hadn't already paved the way.
I doubt that. First, all the latest POSTs I've seen have Both contactless and magnetic card readers, and that legacy provision is likely going to remain in all new POST purchases made prior to the 2015 mandate. Banks aren't going to switch all of the customers to chip and pin immediately after the mandate deadline. It's going to take time, and there will still be holdouts who haven't upgraded their systems. My guess is that people will still be swiping cards in some fashion for at least a decade to come ... I don't see gift cards in particular moving to more expensive chip and pin anytime soon, and that's plenty of time for Samsung to adapt their system.
A decade? I highly doubt that.
Not too far after Chip & Pin replaced magnetic swipe in the UK, all banks forced retailers to use chip and pin. Every terminal in the UK will refuse a chip and pin enabled card from using swipe, if chip and pin wasnt tried first.
oh this is going to be a failure, you know it, they are somehow trying to tap into the mag stip reader in the POS, yeah that is going to work great across all the POS systems out there unlike using a NFC which is proven standard which just works.
I doubt that. First, all the latest POSTs I've seen have Both contactless and magnetic card readers, and that legacy provision is likely going to remain in all new POST purchases made prior to the 2015 mandate. Banks aren't going to switch all of the customers to chip and pin immediately after the mandate deadline. It's going to take time, and there will still be holdouts who haven't upgraded their systems. My guess is that people will still be swiping cards in some fashion for at least a decade to come ... I don't see gift cards in particular moving to more expensive chip and pin anytime soon, and that's plenty of time for Samsung to adapt their system.
Not so sure about that. These changes can happen pretty quick. They have at least in western Europe. For example: In the US you can swipe your card through the paying systems that each employee has in his / her hands. In Europe these readers have been deactivated for years, until they were able to read chip + pin (about a year ago). Still, gift cards always worked. So in Europe, if you have a card with a magnetic strip as well as chip an pin, you have to use
Quote:
Originally Posted by MazeCookie
A decade? I highly doubt that.
Not too far after Chip & Pin replaced magnetic swipe in the UK, all banks forced retailers to use chip and pin. Every terminal in the UK will refuse a chip and pin enabled card from using swipe, if chip and pin wasnt tried first.
Same thing here in Switzerland. The US might be slower though...
I doubt that. First, all the latest POSTs I've seen have Both contactless and magnetic card readers, and that legacy provision is likely going to remain in all new POST purchases made prior to the 2015 mandate. Banks aren't going to switch all of the customers to chip and pin immediately after the mandate deadline. It's going to take time, and there will still be holdouts who haven't upgraded their systems. My guess is that people will still be swiping cards in some fashion for at least a decade to come ... I don't see gift cards in particular moving to more expensive chip and pin anytime soon, and that's plenty of time for Samsung to adapt their system.
I expect that we'll come to a point where liability for CC fraud will be on the merchants who allow their customers to pay with swipe. When that happens, and I expect it to take a lot less than 10 years, merchants will suddenly be in a hurry to switch as many people to chip as possible. The magnetic swipe might only be available for gift cards and the like.
The idea here is that Samsung would build this into the phone, not use a key fob or attachment module to the phone. Its actually great in terms of getting the most people to adopt because it works everywhere that you slide a card. Besides Gas station pumps and similar style sliders. The security isn't the best because it isn't tokenized, but the card is stored digitally on the phone and hopefully would be encrypted or protected from theft, unlike losing your wallet with your actual card inside.
I saw this tech on kickstarter awhile back and it is great, just not Apple quality.
I doubt that. First, all the latest POSTs I've seen have Both contactless and magnetic card readers, and that legacy provision is likely going to remain in all new POST purchases made prior to the 2015 mandate. Banks aren't going to switch all of the customers to chip and pin immediately after the mandate deadline. It's going to take time, and there will still be holdouts who haven't upgraded their systems. My guess is that people will still be swiping cards in some fashion for at least a decade to come ... I don't see gift cards in particular moving to more expensive chip and pin anytime soon, and that's plenty of time for Samsung to adapt their system.
Bull. A decade? As soon as a merchant gets stuck with the bill for a fraudulent purchase because they have an old terminal they're going to very quickly decide to get a new terminal. It doesn't matter if the banks take longer to issue chip/PIN cards - merchants will be upgrading hardware immediately to eliminate the risk of liability for fraud.
And LoopPay will NOT be as secure as Apple Pay. In fact, any system that claims to work at "millions" of retailers/banks (like Google Wallet can) CAN'T be as secure. The only reason they work at so many merchants is because they're using an older, inferior system to process their transactions. Financial institutions have to make updates to support Apple Pay and the latest tokenization technology developed by EMVco.
LoopPay and other ApplePay competitors can't have their cake and eat it too. Either you use an inferior, less secure and less private system and get wide acceptance, or you upgrade to the latest (like Apple Pay) and have lower (initial) support.
It's not so much ripping off Apple as coasting off their Apple Pay momentum. They would've never decided to delve into this area if Apple hadn't already paved the way.
Except ?Pay is in its infancy and mobile payments is something that has been talked about for years. If this was typical Samsung they would have brought out an (inferror) mobile payments solution BEFORE ?Pay just so they could claim they were "first". If we want to talk about copying lets talk about Huawei who just announced new phone called Honor 6 Plus. Now that's blatent copying.
Did Apple invent payment systems? I didn't think so.
This is obviously just a natural progression for a fine and honorable company such as Samsung.
I see two problems with it though, off the top of my head.
First, there is the issue of trust and security. Who really trusts Scamsung?
And second, there's the issue of cheap Fandroid bums. I believe that many Android users do not have any credit cards to their name. I haven't looked into any of the finer details for this new payment system yet, but hopefully there's a way to input EBT card data into the phone." src="http://forums-files.appleinsider.com/images/smilies//lol.gif" />
This Scamsung Pay scheme is going to go nowhere.
I also heard that Scamsung is going to adopt a new company logo. It will be a pear. Again, this is totally coincidental, and is in no way connected to any other company, in any way, shape or form. Do you think that Apple invented and owns all fruits?
I like how companies are content to "catch up." Why don't you ever see a CEO of an Apple competitor come out and say, "We want to SURPASS Apple, not catch up to them."?
Unless Samsung is getting a "piece of the action" for each use of "LoopPay", like Apple does with ApplePay, I don't see why Samsung would bother. After all, it seems a lot easier (and more secure) for Samsung phone users to just use Google Wallet. Unless, Samsung is planning to dump Android in the near future and start selling phones with their own mobile OS.
The first chart is a joke. As soon as retailers switch to chip and pin, LoopPay will cease to work and the percentages will be inverted because every chip and pin - enabled reader that has come out in the last two years is NFC-enabled.
So Samsung once again bets on the wrong horse in their pursuit to out-Apple Apple.
I've noticed that the newer terminals at Walmart have chip readers that don't have NFC. I sort of expected that from Walmart who is actively trying to destroy ApplePay, but then I noticed the same terminal in my local grocery store.
Though I do believe Samsung is betting on the wrong horse. Those digital credit cards that have been popping up recently look like a better solution to me.
Motorola Atrix had fingerprint scanner before Apple or Samsung. Google Wallet existed before ?Pay Apple isn't usually the first to something, but they're usually the first to get the UX right. Mobile payments isn't an Apple invention and I'll make a wager right now that whatever Samsung rolls out it won't be as elegant and user friendly as ?Pay.
No one is claiming Apple Pay is the first to deploy a fingerprint sensor. Samsung could have done it after the Atrix but why didn't they? Why did they have to wait till their next product after Apple debuted it?
This is a thing between Apple and Samsung. Samsung is clearly using a Apple iPhone as a guiding light on the next direction to go on their next products.
Except ?Pay is in its infancy and mobile payments is something that has been talked about for years. If this was typical Samsung they would have brought out an (inferror) mobile payments solution BEFORE ?Pay just so they could claim they were "first". If we want to talk about copying lets talk about Huawei who just announced new phone called Honor 6 Plus. Now that's blatent copying.
Mobile payments (in U.S.) is something that has been talked about for years...until now. Billions are being spent because Apple has stepped into this market just a few months ago. Here's the copy breakdown so far. Huawei copies Apple products. Samsung copies Apple features/services. Xiaomi just wants to be Apple.
So LoopPay requires special hardware (dongle) to inject a facsimile of a magnetic card swipe signal wirelessly. Interesting concept for greatest compatibility, but unless there's some serious security measures going on behind the scenes, someone can sniff this signal from afar. Looks like Samsung is going for widespread adoption in a bid to catch up to the industry.
Comments
????.?...?
seriously?
So if someone steals the phone and removes the dongle... Or even easier just steals the dongle - they've just done [b]even better/[b] than stealing a credit card. No security? Just take the dongle you've just ripped off a device and buy whatever you want, no pin code no security?
Awesome. /s
Since this isn't based on Apple's implementation (i.e. NFC and tokenization) how are they ripping Apple off? And if they're ripping off Apple are they ripping off Google Wallet too?
It's not so much ripping off Apple as coasting off their Apple Pay momentum. They would've never decided to delve into this area if Apple hadn't already paved the way.
I doubt that. First, all the latest POSTs I've seen have Both contactless and magnetic card readers, and that legacy provision is likely going to remain in all new POST purchases made prior to the 2015 mandate. Banks aren't going to switch all of the customers to chip and pin immediately after the mandate deadline. It's going to take time, and there will still be holdouts who haven't upgraded their systems. My guess is that people will still be swiping cards in some fashion for at least a decade to come ... I don't see gift cards in particular moving to more expensive chip and pin anytime soon, and that's plenty of time for Samsung to adapt their system.
A decade? I highly doubt that.
Not too far after Chip & Pin replaced magnetic swipe in the UK, all banks forced retailers to use chip and pin. Every terminal in the UK will refuse a chip and pin enabled card from using swipe, if chip and pin wasnt tried first.
oh this is going to be a failure, you know it, they are somehow trying to tap into the mag stip reader in the POS, yeah that is going to work great across all the POS systems out there unlike using a NFC which is proven standard which just works.
I doubt that. First, all the latest POSTs I've seen have Both contactless and magnetic card readers, and that legacy provision is likely going to remain in all new POST purchases made prior to the 2015 mandate. Banks aren't going to switch all of the customers to chip and pin immediately after the mandate deadline. It's going to take time, and there will still be holdouts who haven't upgraded their systems. My guess is that people will still be swiping cards in some fashion for at least a decade to come ... I don't see gift cards in particular moving to more expensive chip and pin anytime soon, and that's plenty of time for Samsung to adapt their system.
Not so sure about that. These changes can happen pretty quick. They have at least in western Europe. For example: In the US you can swipe your card through the paying systems that each employee has in his / her hands. In Europe these readers have been deactivated for years, until they were able to read chip + pin (about a year ago). Still, gift cards always worked. So in Europe, if you have a card with a magnetic strip as well as chip an pin, you have to use
A decade? I highly doubt that.
Not too far after Chip & Pin replaced magnetic swipe in the UK, all banks forced retailers to use chip and pin. Every terminal in the UK will refuse a chip and pin enabled card from using swipe, if chip and pin wasnt tried first.
Same thing here in Switzerland. The US might be slower though...
I expect that we'll come to a point where liability for CC fraud will be on the merchants who allow their customers to pay with swipe. When that happens, and I expect it to take a lot less than 10 years, merchants will suddenly be in a hurry to switch as many people to chip as possible. The magnetic swipe might only be available for gift cards and the like.
The idea here is that Samsung would build this into the phone, not use a key fob or attachment module to the phone. Its actually great in terms of getting the most people to adopt because it works everywhere that you slide a card. Besides Gas station pumps and similar style sliders. The security isn't the best because it isn't tokenized, but the card is stored digitally on the phone and hopefully would be encrypted or protected from theft, unlike losing your wallet with your actual card inside.
I saw this tech on kickstarter awhile back and it is great, just not Apple quality.
I doubt that. First, all the latest POSTs I've seen have Both contactless and magnetic card readers, and that legacy provision is likely going to remain in all new POST purchases made prior to the 2015 mandate. Banks aren't going to switch all of the customers to chip and pin immediately after the mandate deadline. It's going to take time, and there will still be holdouts who haven't upgraded their systems. My guess is that people will still be swiping cards in some fashion for at least a decade to come ... I don't see gift cards in particular moving to more expensive chip and pin anytime soon, and that's plenty of time for Samsung to adapt their system.
Bull. A decade? As soon as a merchant gets stuck with the bill for a fraudulent purchase because they have an old terminal they're going to very quickly decide to get a new terminal. It doesn't matter if the banks take longer to issue chip/PIN cards - merchants will be upgrading hardware immediately to eliminate the risk of liability for fraud.
And LoopPay will NOT be as secure as Apple Pay. In fact, any system that claims to work at "millions" of retailers/banks (like Google Wallet can) CAN'T be as secure. The only reason they work at so many merchants is because they're using an older, inferior system to process their transactions. Financial institutions have to make updates to support Apple Pay and the latest tokenization technology developed by EMVco.
LoopPay and other ApplePay competitors can't have their cake and eat it too. Either you use an inferior, less secure and less private system and get wide acceptance, or you upgrade to the latest (like Apple Pay) and have lower (initial) support.
Except ?Pay is in its infancy and mobile payments is something that has been talked about for years. If this was typical Samsung they would have brought out an (inferror) mobile payments solution BEFORE ?Pay just so they could claim they were "first". If we want to talk about copying lets talk about Huawei who just announced new phone called Honor 6 Plus. Now that's blatent copying.
Did Apple invent payment systems? I didn't think so.
This is obviously just a natural progression for a fine and honorable company such as Samsung.
I see two problems with it though, off the top of my head.
First, there is the issue of trust and security. Who really trusts Scamsung?
And second, there's the issue of cheap Fandroid bums. I believe that many Android users do not have any credit cards to their name. I haven't looked into any of the finer details for this new payment system yet, but hopefully there's a way to input EBT card data into the phone.
" src="http://forums-files.appleinsider.com/images/smilies//lol.gif" />
This Scamsung Pay scheme is going to go nowhere.
I also heard that Scamsung is going to adopt a new company logo. It will be a pear. Again, this is totally coincidental, and is in no way connected to any other company, in any way, shape or form. Do you think that Apple invented and owns all fruits?
Apple users need to get over themselves.
I like how companies are content to "catch up." Why don't you ever see a CEO of an Apple competitor come out and say, "We want to SURPASS Apple, not catch up to them."?
Unless Samsung is getting a "piece of the action" for each use of "LoopPay", like Apple does with ApplePay, I don't see why Samsung would bother. After all, it seems a lot easier (and more secure) for Samsung phone users to just use Google Wallet. Unless, Samsung is planning to dump Android in the near future and start selling phones with their own mobile OS.
It is more of a "me too" than "rip off".
I've noticed that the newer terminals at Walmart have chip readers that don't have NFC. I sort of expected that from Walmart who is actively trying to destroy ApplePay, but then I noticed the same terminal in my local grocery store.
Though I do believe Samsung is betting on the wrong horse. Those digital credit cards that have been popping up recently look like a better solution to me.
Groan. Such shameless, blatant thievery.
(I eagerly await a bunch of posts from the Tech guy about why it would be the best time to buy Samsung stock).
Motorola Atrix had fingerprint scanner before Apple or Samsung. Google Wallet existed before ?Pay Apple isn't usually the first to something, but they're usually the first to get the UX right. Mobile payments isn't an Apple invention and I'll make a wager right now that whatever Samsung rolls out it won't be as elegant and user friendly as ?Pay.
No one is claiming Apple Pay is the first to deploy a fingerprint sensor. Samsung could have done it after the Atrix but why didn't they? Why did they have to wait till their next product after Apple debuted it?
This is a thing between Apple and Samsung. Samsung is clearly using a Apple iPhone as a guiding light on the next direction to go on their next products.
Except ?Pay is in its infancy and mobile payments is something that has been talked about for years. If this was typical Samsung they would have brought out an (inferror) mobile payments solution BEFORE ?Pay just so they could claim they were "first". If we want to talk about copying lets talk about Huawei who just announced new phone called Honor 6 Plus. Now that's blatent copying.
Mobile payments (in U.S.) is something that has been talked about for years...until now. Billions are being spent because Apple has stepped into this market just a few months ago. Here's the copy breakdown so far. Huawei copies Apple products. Samsung copies Apple features/services. Xiaomi just wants to be Apple.
....If this was typical Samsung they would have brought out an (inferror) mobile payments solution BEFORE ?Pay just so ..... blah blah...
That's nonsense.
Did you read the two key examples cited in the article, or did you, in your usual fashion, post first and read later?
So LoopPay requires special hardware (dongle) to inject a facsimile of a magnetic card swipe signal wirelessly. Interesting concept for greatest compatibility, but unless there's some serious security measures going on behind the scenes, someone can sniff this signal from afar. Looks like Samsung is going for widespread adoption in a bid to catch up to the industry.
http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/news/2014/09/virtual-wallet-review-apple-pay-google-wallet-softcard-and-loop-wallet/index.htm