Sorry if I offended you. But, I truly believe that without competition no manufacturer would go out of their way to innovate. Yes even including Apple. Now did Google and Samsung have to use 'similar' names? No. They were certainly hanging onto the coattails of Apple. But, this too can be a good thing. It keeps Apple pushing forward. I prefer Apple products and believe they are superior to other brands. But they need to keep 'pushing the envelope' to stay relevant and at the top.
Apple doesn't need competition to "push forward". It does that on its own.
Not this statement again. Competion is always good but everyone else seems to follow Apple. Apple shouldn't be the world's R&D department. It's frakking shameless that these competitors ape the Apple naming conventions.
YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND¡ Because competition is good, it makes it perfectly acceptable to blatantly steal from others so you can compete with them. The Chinese know this with their large black market of inferior but nearly identical looking knockoffs. Without these KIRFs there is no competition. These thieves are the glue that keep the economy going¡
Contactless cards ? mobile payments. Contactless cards don't really add to much security. They only make it harder to clone a card, but I don't think it's impossible to clone a chipped card.
Fair point. For me, Contactless cards were never so much about adding security - indeed they remove for smaller amounts for need of PIN input in the UK and France at least - but it brings the convenience which ?Pay also makes use of - if we didn't have contactless norms we wouldn't be able to have ?Pay. The underlying Contactless payment standard is the same - you only have to look at the 'wave to pay' industry icon.
What's great about the next generation of 'smart' solutions whether a smartphone, a powered smart fob etc - is their ability to provide the changing token numbers, which a traditional chip dumb card can't self-generate. I have a 'tokenised' credit card generator from Visa and my french bank which dates back probably about a decade for online payments but it was a clunky experience.
My point is in all of this is that Apple, just as the others, are co-dependent on the titans of the financial world which have been marching this forward - banks, Visa etc, the merchants to have the terminals, etc. Google and Samsung and almost certainly Microsoft, are all going to be in this before too long. And let's not forget when we say that Apple is 'first' with ?Pay that the world is bigger than the US! They, like anybody else, need to wait for Visa, MasterCard etc to finalise their next gen solutions
The typical Appleinsider forum blanket crapping on the competition.
Appleinsider typical comment synopsis:
1. Apple is awesome and does no wrong
2. Everyone else is crap and stupid
When Apple is wrong or not perfect: remain silent and pretend it didn't happen
When competition is correct or does something good, remain silent or dismiss the competition as stupid/wrong/incompetent/inferior.
Have a nice day! (And Android suck in every way, didn't you know?)
Yeah let's all praise the iPhoney and iKnockoff manufacturers!! And screw Nike and Jordan's! I'm rocking Mike and Lordons!!
My point is in all of this is that Apple, just as the others, are co-dependent on the titans of the financial world which have been marching this forward - banks, Visa etc, the merchants to have the terminals, etc. Google and Samsung and almost certainly Microsoft, are all going to be in this before too long. And let's not forget when we say that Apple is 'first' with ?Pay that the world is bigger than the US! They, like anybody else, need to wait for Visa, MasterCard etc to finalise their next gen solutions
This is why ?Pay and Samsung Pay are superior to Google Wallet and Android Pay. They put the control in the hands of the financial institutions. Even with Android Pay Google is going through the carriers. Remember when the carriers wanted songs and ringtones to go through them as a requirement for selling the iPhone? Remember when a ringtone cost a lot of money to rent from a carrier?
PS: This is what I see when I hit reply on your posts. I have to go to you original post to copy the text to in-between the markup quote in order to keep your original formatting. I think this is easily corrected by changing a single option in the forum preferences at the top of this page. You can still use HTML if you want, but the default will be the forum markup, not HTML.
Every smartphone should have a way to securely pay. It is up to the banks, retailers and payment gateways to get them all working. It is not like Apple was ever going to have an exclusive in this market.
It would be like now, me saying to someone, 'Thanks for offering to take me out to lunch but if you are going to pay with a MasterCard, forget it. I only use American Express.'
Repeat this mantra: Competition is good. Now take a deep breath and remember that this forces innovation from everyone (including Apple).
Oh, GTFO with that shit. It's the lines trolls use whenever anyone raises eye brows against slavish copying.
Noone is against "competition". Google has had Android wallet for years. NFC has been in most Android phones for years, including Samsung ones. You really support the cynical way in which these companies act? It's always the same pattern. Within a few months of Apple announcing Apple Pay, we have Samsung Pay, and Android Pay, both not only being identical in concept, but identical in branding. Competition? All these companies are doing is cloning the branding, to leech off the branding power of Apple Pay, and make people assume that what they have is pretty much the same thing. There's no honor in that, and it should not be praised.
Tell me, why couldn't Google, or any of thr 67,291 Android OEMs come up with that name before Apple did, who took it's sweet time developing their payment solution? We can we ALWAYS expect this kind of shameless rebranding every time Apple launches a successful new service? And why can we always expect people like you who mock anyone who has a problem with this, with this meaningless "competition is good" line, as if this is how "competition" should be defined? It's absolutely pathetic, and gutless.
I was making the point, and I apologise if it wasn't clear, that we shouldn't be childish by contributing nothing to this planet but petty jabbing at Google (and Samsung). Re the coping of the name - I said it's a copy which isn't great ( but then again PayPal, Loop pay and others may well not be so happy with ?Pay if you really it's such a big problem). I also said I don't think it's a serious issue, and won't damage Apple in any measurable way. Sometimes you call a spade a spade. When you pay for something you can call it something to do with Pay and move on without having a hernia.
At the end of the day these technologies - tokenisation, NFC contactless solutions etc - are all being brought about with or without Apple, Google and Samsung. Contactless cards, fobs etc have been around for a while (at least outside the US). Apple is also arguably 'piggybacking' if we're going to play that game. But so they should. They've added considerable value with TouchID and a slick UX. perhaps - god forbid - google does something interesting which could prove helpful for all (like the API layer i gather they'v put out to provide a more open solution for China and other countries)
To be clear: I didn't mean to be dismissive - sorry if I was. I just find it utterly childish (and infuriating) to read endless comments which would deb better placed in a playground of an infant school.
Consider that because you do not think strong reactions to repeated copying is childish does not, in fact, make it so. Apple is a hardware/software/platform/experiences company that pushes forward by integrating design into everything it does. A big part of that is its marketing effort. When you look at the history of Apple, it consistently has been copied, most recently by the Google/Samsung guys.
(Side Note: It's so funny when I hear from Android fans, "Android already had that feature." Meanwhile, the entire concept of a multitouch UI smartphone was Apple's.)
Having said that, repeating statements suggesting others' concerns are "better placed in a playground of an infant school" does little to elevate your own point or the overall discourse. Interestingly, you apologized for being dismissive, but went ahead and added another dismissive statement. Anyway, nothing personal and no need to apologize.
First they have to make a Microsoft Wallet, THEN Windows Pay.
Actually that existed years ago in Windows 2000.
The problem I see with the Google implementation is that they are leaving it up to developers to implement it. In other words they don't even seem to have a set of APIs to allow apps to make use of the system. That right there is going to be a failure.
Even Windows' system worked pretty well in the day except for the fact no one used it because they didn't know what it did.
I'd vote for the Windows system over the Google system any day of the week but I can't wait until ApplePay comes to New Zealand because it's going to be pretty sweet ride from the get go considering the major retailers that could benefit from ApplePay more or less already have the equipment.
LOL. Android Pay? What does that mean for all the other cockroaches...
Samsung Pay
HTC Pay
Lenovo Pay
Motorola Pay
LG Pay
Xiaomi Pay
Sony Pay
Acer Pay
Amazonr Pay
Meizur Pay
ZTE Pay
Panasonic Pay
Dell Pay
HP Pay
Asus Pay
Alcatel Pay
Panthec Pay
Toshiba Pay
Samsung cannot write software for it's life. Samsung should let Google do it since that magnetic swipe technology is a cheesy hack anyway. This could become another huge mess for Android if Google does not take the bull by the horn.
Time will tell.
This reactionary, me-too behavior is typical of an immature markets. Over time the market will stabilize on a small number of players who can deliver value and make a profit. Of the three and soon to be four with Microsoft I'd say the Samsung is the odd man out. I wouldn't trust Samsung with my dirty laundry much less financial transactions. The words trust and Samsung will never go together in a credible way. Google I'm not sure of either but I don't see them selling their soul to the extent that Samsung will for a quick profit. Google has enough revenue from selling services that annoy the hell out of most real consumers, or as Google calls them - The Product, that they wouldn't screw up a payment system. I'm ok with Apple and Microsoft.
The big losers here until all this shakes out are consumers. Having a glut of payment systems each of which has a different set of supported backing credit and financial sources is going to create confusion and complexity for consumers and payment infrastructure providers. You can probably assume that current providers of payment technology like ATM vendors and wire transfer systems aren't going to sit idly by while "gadget" vendors eat their lunch. I suspect things will get a hell of a lot more confusing and fragmented before they get better. Until it all shakes out consumers will have to make smart choices based on values like trust, integrity, honesty, and respect. Some of the aforementioned companies like Apple possess and exhibit all of these qualities while Samsung possesses and exhibits none of them. I'm sure we'll see plenty of wannabe players who possess some of the required qualities.
It's up to consumers and subscribers like retailers to choose who they trust. All companies who have demonstrated time and time again that they are not worthy of trust will not gain consumer confidence and their efforts in this area will whither and die. Like Samsung, who crapped all over their largest and most valuable customer. Do you expect they'll treat you any better?
"Google seems to be planning to take a backseat with its payments initiative, instead depending on developers and individual brands to implement it."
I think they will figure it out soon enough. What choice do they have. Even Samsung is in the right track, which jusy hurts Android-based devices for other OEMs.
Every smartphone should have a way to securely pay. It is up to the banks, retailers and payment gateways to get them all working. It is not like Apple was ever going to have an exclusive in this market.
It would be like now, me saying to someone, 'Thanks for offering to take me out to lunch but if you are going to pay with a MasterCard, forget it. I only use American Express.'
Comments
Apple doesn't need competition to "push forward". It does that on its own.
YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND¡ Because competition is good, it makes it perfectly acceptable to blatantly steal from others so you can compete with them. The Chinese know this with their large black market of inferior but nearly identical looking knockoffs. Without these KIRFs there is no competition. These thieves are the glue that keep the economy going¡
Contactless cards ? mobile payments. Contactless cards don't really add to much security. They only make it harder to clone a card, but I don't think it's impossible to clone a chipped card.
Fair point. For me, Contactless cards were never so much about adding security - indeed they remove for smaller amounts for need of PIN input in the UK and France at least - but it brings the convenience which ?Pay also makes use of - if we didn't have contactless norms we wouldn't be able to have ?Pay. The underlying Contactless payment standard is the same - you only have to look at the 'wave to pay' industry icon.
What's great about the next generation of 'smart' solutions whether a smartphone, a powered smart fob etc - is their ability to provide the changing token numbers, which a traditional chip dumb card can't self-generate. I have a 'tokenised' credit card generator from Visa and my french bank which dates back probably about a decade for online payments but it was a clunky experience.
My point is in all of this is that Apple, just as the others, are co-dependent on the titans of the financial world which have been marching this forward - banks, Visa etc, the merchants to have the terminals, etc. Google and Samsung and almost certainly Microsoft, are all going to be in this before too long. And let's not forget when we say that Apple is 'first' with ?Pay that the world is bigger than the US! They, like anybody else, need to wait for Visa, MasterCard etc to finalise their next gen solutions
Android PAY
F***ing lame and pathetic. What happened to google WALLET?
Yeah let's all praise the iPhoney and iKnockoff manufacturers!! And screw Nike and Jordan's! I'm rocking Mike and Lordons!!
Plus, the BlackBerry Pay ...
" src="http://forums-files.appleinsider.com/images/smilies//lol.gif" />
You mean BlackBerry Pray? :P
This is why ?Pay and Samsung Pay are superior to Google Wallet and Android Pay. They put the control in the hands of the financial institutions. Even with Android Pay Google is going through the carriers. Remember when the carriers wanted songs and ringtones to go through them as a requirement for selling the iPhone? Remember when a ringtone cost a lot of money to rent from a carrier?
PS: This is what I see when I hit reply on your posts. I have to go to you original post to copy the text to in-between the markup quote in order to keep your original formatting. I think this is easily corrected by changing a single option in the forum preferences at the top of this page. You can still use HTML if you want, but the default will be the forum markup, not HTML.
Every smartphone should have a way to securely pay. It is up to the banks, retailers and payment gateways to get them all working. It is not like Apple was ever going to have an exclusive in this market.
It would be like now, me saying to someone, 'Thanks for offering to take me out to lunch but if you are going to pay with a MasterCard, forget it. I only use American Express.'
Repeat this mantra: Competition is good. Now take a deep breath and remember that this forces innovation from everyone (including Apple).
Oh, GTFO with that shit. It's the lines trolls use whenever anyone raises eye brows against slavish copying.
Noone is against "competition". Google has had Android wallet for years. NFC has been in most Android phones for years, including Samsung ones. You really support the cynical way in which these companies act? It's always the same pattern. Within a few months of Apple announcing Apple Pay, we have Samsung Pay, and Android Pay, both not only being identical in concept, but identical in branding. Competition? All these companies are doing is cloning the branding, to leech off the branding power of Apple Pay, and make people assume that what they have is pretty much the same thing. There's no honor in that, and it should not be praised.
Tell me, why couldn't Google, or any of thr 67,291 Android OEMs come up with that name before Apple did, who took it's sweet time developing their payment solution? We can we ALWAYS expect this kind of shameless rebranding every time Apple launches a successful new service? And why can we always expect people like you who mock anyone who has a problem with this, with this meaningless "competition is good" line, as if this is how "competition" should be defined? It's absolutely pathetic, and gutless.
Google unveils 'Android Pay'
Yo! San Andreas fault! Get cracking.
People like you are the reason human civilization is on the brink of destruction.
I was making the point, and I apologise if it wasn't clear, that we shouldn't be childish by contributing nothing to this planet but petty jabbing at Google (and Samsung). Re the coping of the name - I said it's a copy which isn't great ( but then again PayPal, Loop pay and others may well not be so happy with ?Pay if you really it's such a big problem). I also said I don't think it's a serious issue, and won't damage Apple in any measurable way. Sometimes you call a spade a spade. When you pay for something you can call it something to do with Pay and move on without having a hernia.
At the end of the day these technologies - tokenisation, NFC contactless solutions etc - are all being brought about with or without Apple, Google and Samsung. Contactless cards, fobs etc have been around for a while (at least outside the US). Apple is also arguably 'piggybacking' if we're going to play that game. But so they should. They've added considerable value with TouchID and a slick UX. perhaps - god forbid - google does something interesting which could prove helpful for all (like the API layer i gather they'v put out to provide a more open solution for China and other countries)
To be clear: I didn't mean to be dismissive - sorry if I was. I just find it utterly childish (and infuriating) to read endless comments which would deb better placed in a playground of an infant school.
Consider that because you do not think strong reactions to repeated copying is childish does not, in fact, make it so. Apple is a hardware/software/platform/experiences company that pushes forward by integrating design into everything it does. A big part of that is its marketing effort. When you look at the history of Apple, it consistently has been copied, most recently by the Google/Samsung guys.
(Side Note: It's so funny when I hear from Android fans, "Android already had that feature." Meanwhile, the entire concept of a multitouch UI smartphone was Apple's.)
Having said that, repeating statements suggesting others' concerns are "better placed in a playground of an infant school" does little to elevate your own point or the overall discourse. Interestingly, you apologized for being dismissive, but went ahead and added another dismissive statement. Anyway, nothing personal and no need to apologize.
Ugh. ???? Apple is the leader, all of the rest are cockroaches.
LOL. Android Pay? What does that mean for all the other cockroaches...
Samsung Pay
HTC Pay
Lenovo Pay
Motorola Pay
LG Pay
Xiaomi Pay
Sony Pay
Acer Pay
Amazonr Pay
Meizur Pay
ZTE Pay
Panasonic Pay
Dell Pay
HP Pay
Asus Pay
Alcatel Pay
Panthec Pay
Toshiba Pay
Samsung cannot write software for it's life.
Samsung should let Google do it since that magnetic swipe technology is a cheesy hack anyway.
This could become another huge mess for Android if Google does not take the bull by the horn.
Time will tell.
First they have to make a Microsoft Wallet, THEN Windows Pay.
Actually that existed years ago in Windows 2000.
The problem I see with the Google implementation is that they are leaving it up to developers to implement it. In other words they don't even seem to have a set of APIs to allow apps to make use of the system. That right there is going to be a failure.
Even Windows' system worked pretty well in the day except for the fact no one used it because they didn't know what it did.
I'd vote for the Windows system over the Google system any day of the week but I can't wait until ApplePay comes to New Zealand because it's going to be pretty sweet ride from the get go considering the major retailers that could benefit from ApplePay more or less already have the equipment.
spray 'n pay?
"Android Pay"
"Samsung Pay"
Come on guys, aren't you even a little bit embarrassed? Come up with your own name at least.
The big losers here until all this shakes out are consumers. Having a glut of payment systems each of which has a different set of supported backing credit and financial sources is going to create confusion and complexity for consumers and payment infrastructure providers. You can probably assume that current providers of payment technology like ATM vendors and wire transfer systems aren't going to sit idly by while "gadget" vendors eat their lunch. I suspect things will get a hell of a lot more confusing and fragmented before they get better. Until it all shakes out consumers will have to make smart choices based on values like trust, integrity, honesty, and respect. Some of the aforementioned companies like Apple possess and exhibit all of these qualities while Samsung possesses and exhibits none of them. I'm sure we'll see plenty of wannabe players who possess some of the required qualities.
It's up to consumers and subscribers like retailers to choose who they trust. All companies who have demonstrated time and time again that they are not worthy of trust will not gain consumer confidence and their efforts in this area will whither and die. Like Samsung, who crapped all over their largest and most valuable customer. Do you expect they'll treat you any better?
In Sammy's defense, they only have access to "copy/paste" and not "edit". ????
"Google seems to be planning to take a backseat with its payments initiative, instead depending on developers and individual brands to implement it."
I think they will figure it out soon enough. What choice do they have. Even Samsung is in the right track, which jusy hurts Android-based devices for other OEMs.
@mstone
I notice that your location is Republic Of Panama ...
Have you moved from Southern Calif -- or just dual citizenshiP?
^^^ Best post!