So, with the Transport for London deal, can you just setup an Oyster card on it, or do you need a credit card? I ask because I don't have a UK or US credit card, but I do have an Oyster card for when I'm visiting London. (And a Clipper card for when I'm visiting the Bay Area, and a Metro card for DC, and...)
Doubtful until Apple releases an additional API for contactless cards that aren't credit/debit, but TFL accepts contactless in place of Oyster, so you would be able to use your credit/debit cards in place of Oyster. That might end up costing extra in international transaction fees if you don't have local cards.
Fingers crossed Tim & Eddie do announce this for UK. I find Contactless so much more convenient. Like others, my iPhone is more accessible than my wallet & cards. Presently the limit for Contactless payments in the UK is £20 (GBP). This is due to increase to £30 from September 2015. I assume in large due to uptake of contactless in the UK. I understand the limit is set by The Payments Council (or similar titled body) which is made up of banks, card issuers (AMEX, M'card & Visa in the UK). As Apple Pay is a virtual contactless card, I would imagine that it would have to stick to the imposed payment limit (I don't believe the POS terminals allow for more).
I feel your post warrants some additional explanation for people that may not know the detail of the European system (my apologies):
First, Apple Pay does not replace credit cards and debit cards - you still use the same companies and banks, only that you use them via the iPhone instead of having to take out your actual card.
Second, Chip and PIN and Contactless are two different things:
- Chip and PIN means you stick the card into the reader instead of swiping it, and you punch a PIN into the reader instead of signing a piece of paper. Transactions are done much faster and more secure as PINs are harder to steal than signatures which, hail the genius that came up with this, are on the back of the card.
- Contactless means that for transactions under a certain amount (£ 30 in the UK) you just tap the card - no sticking nor swiping, no signature nor PIN, i.e. even faster transactions. You cannot use Contactless & PIN; Contactless is purely for small transactions.
Third, ApplePay brings three additional functions that I believe are significant and that I really look forward to:
- Paying with Apple Watch means I don't have to take out my wallet to take the tube - I can just tap my Watch on the Oyster reader - that's super convenient
- Hopefully, merchants will start allowing higher value transactions using Contactless with ApplePay, and not restrict them to £ 30
- Most importantly, ApplePay means my transactions are encrypted. While I have nothing to hide, I would feel a bit better knowing that my purchases are private, it will encourage me to use the card much more often (which enables me to keep a better view on what I spend my money on)
Thank you, very informative and useful for those of us not familiar with recent changes over there. I will be revisiting several place in Europe this year for the first time in a very long time, so I certainly appreciated the update.
The bad news is my jar stuffed with a lot of notes and coins from many European countries is not worth taking I am told. Apparently my Lira, Deutsche Marks, Drachma and Pesos have been replaced by something else I am told, darn it.
The major difference Apple pay is bringing to the table is the fact that there's a layer of security in the users fingerprint. As it currently stands you just tap the card and you're away, Apple's entrance might ecourage the users who are uncomfortable with zero security but for everyone else, Apple pay is actually clunkier and more time consuming than just tapping a card. I certainly won't use it instead of my contactless card but it'll be a nice backup to have.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sflagel
...
Third, ApplePay brings three additional functions that I believe are significant and that I really look forward to:
- Paying with Apple Watch means I don't have to take out my wallet to take the tube - I can just tap my Watch on the Oyster reader - that's super convenient
- Hopefully, merchants will start allowing higher value transactions using Contactless with ApplePay, and not restrict them to £ 30
- Most importantly, ApplePay means my transactions are encrypted. While I have nothing to hide, I would feel a bit better knowing that my purchases are private, it will encourage me to use the card much more often (which enables me to keep a better view on what I spend my money on)
To add just a little bit more:
1) There is a huge security issue with "regular" contactless cards, as they can be easily read by custom devices while still in your wallet/purse. Lots of YouTube videos on this topic (showing a guy with a computer bumping into people and getting their credit card information). Clearly with Apple Pay, this is not possible as it requires a user action & authentication to send any data, and that in itself is encrypted and uses a tokenization process.
Some marketing on this fact will increase uptake of more secure solutions, lead by Apple Pay.
2) To the point of limitations on amounts that can be used in contactless payments, this is the area where Apple Pay can impact user convenience the most vs. the cards themselves. As Apple Pay matures, hopefully this comes about. My fingerprint or other bio-signature is more secure, and thus contactless limits can be raised while simultaneously increasing security.
3) Apple Pay works for on-line app purchases as well. Use of TouchID authentication provides a "card presence" rate possibility, which means a lower cost for merchant and reduction in fraud. This should drive further adoption of Apple devices for online shopping.
4) Those that have used Apple Pay with Apple Watch really rave about it.
So to sum up for Shev - I think you will find that Apple Pay is going to quickly become beneficial even to those countries where contactless payments are well established. I am in Canada, and eagerly await Apple Pay, even though I use my contactless VISA card every day.
Ya, I would have thought that if anything, Canada would have been up and going by now. My guess is the Banks have been fighting Apple or maybe Canada's it's self a little pissed off with the almost death of Blackberry? Something has been stopping Apple.
Fingers crossed Tim & Eddie do announce this for UK. I find Contactless so much more convenient. Like others, my iPhone is more accessible than my wallet & cards.
Presently the limit for Contactless payments in the UK is £20 (GBP). This is due to increase to £30 from September 2015. I assume in large due to uptake of contactless in the UK.
I understand the limit is set by The Payments Council (or similar titled body) which is made up of banks, card issuers (AMEX, M'card & Visa in the UK). As Apple Pay is a virtual contactless card, I would imagine that it would have to stick to the imposed payment limit (I don't believe the POS terminals allow for more).
Hopefully it is finally arriving!
I shouldn't be surprised that there is a limit on Contactless Payments in the UK. It makes some sense.
There is no such limit in the US or Canada. What I do find is that the limits are either set by the merchant or the merchant's bank.
In Canada for example, IGA in Montréal allows Contactless Payment up to CDN$100. Other places have different limits. The most I've charged on contactless so far was CDN$250.
In the USA, I have seen no standard limits. I actually used Apple Pay to pay the downpayment on my car - USD$5,500. (Got to love ApplePay and American Express....) Then again, I did have to sign. The downside of Apple Pay with US cards is that you end up signing for anything over USD$50 or so.
Comments
So, with the Transport for London deal, can you just setup an Oyster card on it, or do you need a credit card? I ask because I don't have a UK or US credit card, but I do have an Oyster card for when I'm visiting London. (And a Clipper card for when I'm visiting the Bay Area, and a Metro card for DC, and...)
Doubtful until Apple releases an additional API for contactless cards that aren't credit/debit, but TFL accepts contactless in place of Oyster, so you would be able to use your credit/debit cards in place of Oyster. That might end up costing extra in international transaction fees if you don't have local cards.
Presently the limit for Contactless payments in the UK is £20 (GBP). This is due to increase to £30 from September 2015. I assume in large due to uptake of contactless in the UK.
I understand the limit is set by The Payments Council (or similar titled body) which is made up of banks, card issuers (AMEX, M'card & Visa in the UK). As Apple Pay is a virtual contactless card, I would imagine that it would have to stick to the imposed payment limit (I don't believe the POS terminals allow for more).
Hopefully it is finally arriving!
Isn't the terminal the Greek Government would need to go to in Germany?
Thank you, very informative and useful for those of us not familiar with recent changes over there. I will be revisiting several place in Europe this year for the first time in a very long time, so I certainly appreciated the update.
The bad news is my jar stuffed with a lot of notes and coins from many European countries is not worth taking I am told. Apparently my Lira, Deutsche Marks, Drachma and Pesos have been replaced by something else I am told, darn it.
The major difference Apple pay is bringing to the table is the fact that there's a layer of security in the users fingerprint. As it currently stands you just tap the card and you're away, Apple's entrance might ecourage the users who are uncomfortable with zero security but for everyone else, Apple pay is actually clunkier and more time consuming than just tapping a card. I certainly won't use it instead of my contactless card but it'll be a nice backup to have.
...
Third, ApplePay brings three additional functions that I believe are significant and that I really look forward to:
- Paying with Apple Watch means I don't have to take out my wallet to take the tube - I can just tap my Watch on the Oyster reader - that's super convenient
- Hopefully, merchants will start allowing higher value transactions using Contactless with ApplePay, and not restrict them to £ 30
- Most importantly, ApplePay means my transactions are encrypted. While I have nothing to hide, I would feel a bit better knowing that my purchases are private, it will encourage me to use the card much more often (which enables me to keep a better view on what I spend my money on)
To add just a little bit more:
1) There is a huge security issue with "regular" contactless cards, as they can be easily read by custom devices while still in your wallet/purse. Lots of YouTube videos on this topic (showing a guy with a computer bumping into people and getting their credit card information). Clearly with Apple Pay, this is not possible as it requires a user action & authentication to send any data, and that in itself is encrypted and uses a tokenization process.
Some marketing on this fact will increase uptake of more secure solutions, lead by Apple Pay.
2) To the point of limitations on amounts that can be used in contactless payments, this is the area where Apple Pay can impact user convenience the most vs. the cards themselves. As Apple Pay matures, hopefully this comes about. My fingerprint or other bio-signature is more secure, and thus contactless limits can be raised while simultaneously increasing security.
3) Apple Pay works for on-line app purchases as well. Use of TouchID authentication provides a "card presence" rate possibility, which means a lower cost for merchant and reduction in fraud. This should drive further adoption of Apple devices for online shopping.
4) Those that have used Apple Pay with Apple Watch really rave about it.
So to sum up for Shev - I think you will find that Apple Pay is going to quickly become beneficial even to those countries where contactless payments are well established. I am in Canada, and eagerly await Apple Pay, even though I use my contactless VISA card every day.
Uh, what about Canada? Hello?
Ya, I would have thought that if anything, Canada would have been up and going by now. My guess is the Banks have been fighting Apple or maybe Canada's it's self a little pissed off with the almost death of Blackberry? Something has been stopping Apple.
Fingers crossed Tim & Eddie do announce this for UK. I find Contactless so much more convenient. Like others, my iPhone is more accessible than my wallet & cards.
Presently the limit for Contactless payments in the UK is £20 (GBP). This is due to increase to £30 from September 2015. I assume in large due to uptake of contactless in the UK.
I understand the limit is set by The Payments Council (or similar titled body) which is made up of banks, card issuers (AMEX, M'card & Visa in the UK). As Apple Pay is a virtual contactless card, I would imagine that it would have to stick to the imposed payment limit (I don't believe the POS terminals allow for more).
Hopefully it is finally arriving!
I shouldn't be surprised that there is a limit on Contactless Payments in the UK. It makes some sense.
There is no such limit in the US or Canada. What I do find is that the limits are either set by the merchant or the merchant's bank.
In Canada for example, IGA in Montréal allows Contactless Payment up to CDN$100. Other places have different limits. The most I've charged on contactless so far was CDN$250.
In the USA, I have seen no standard limits. I actually used Apple Pay to pay the downpayment on my car - USD$5,500. (Got to love ApplePay and American Express....) Then again, I did have to sign. The downside of Apple Pay with US cards is that you end up signing for anything over USD$50 or so.
Very true! But the Germans need to use Apple Pay in Greece to give the Greeks a pile of money so the Greeks can pay them.
So technically we need it in both countries!
Doubtful until Apple releases an additional API for contactless cards that aren't credit/debit
Well how about that!