Leaked Intel Skylake-U roadmap reveals CPUs likely bound for MacBook Air

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  • Reply 21 of 38
    zoolookzoolook Posts: 657member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by cy_starkman View Post

     

    /blah blah blah

     

    The Air has nothing to offer.

     

     


     

    The MBA is the best selling Mac... by miles. What a ridiculous post.

  • Reply 22 of 38
    toddzrxtoddzrx Posts: 235member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by NormM View Post

     

     

    One problem I have with the Macbook, compared to the Air, is that it has no edge to hold it by.  I frequently charge my computer while I use it, and the very long body of a USB-C connector sticking out gets in the way of the main suitable spot to hold the machine on the top left edge.  I also find the 12 inch screen too small -- it's only a tiny bit larger than the 11.6 inch screen on the smallest Air!  I'm also not fond of the new lower profile keyboard -- it takes too much force to press the keys, in my opinion.  And the lack of a fan means the machine gets hot if you push the performance.

     

    So what I'm hoping for is a 14 inch Macbook Air that is smaller and lighter than the current 13.3 inch Air, with a nearly edge-to-edge retina display.  That would hit the sweet spot for me!




    You mean a 14 inch MacBook, not Macbook Air, right?

     

    Personally, I agree with other posters here in that the Air's days are numbered.  My guess: Skylake is its last CPU upgrade and it'll be discontinued sometime by 2017 at the latest.  The MacBook will be well on its way to taking over the consumer sales title crown by then, especially if/when Apple releases the model you suggest, most likely with another port or two.  I'm looking forward to it because I think it will make the ideal laptop/desktop machine, one that is plenty light and mobile, and only requires one cable for docking.  Which brings us to the Thunderbolt display: can't wait to see the new ones.  It'd be nice to see Apple continue with a 27" 5K model, but also release a smaller 4K screen around 23 or 24 inches; something a little more consumer grade that pairs nicely with the rMB.  We'll see.

  • Reply 23 of 38
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 13,377member
    frank777 wrote: »
    The 14"/16" idea is being thrown around the forum a lot, but does anybody know if there's really enough room in the MBP to remove the bezel and gain an inch of screen width?

    If Apple managed to go edge to edge (and somehow dealt with the camera placement) how big of a screen would fit in the 15" Pro?

    Most likely they would need to bump up the size of the machine slightly but edge to edge technology would minimize the expansion considerably. The laptop would be much smaller than the old 17" though. One could just take a tape measure to a current machine, laid across the current diagonal, to see what is possible.

    I don't think most common MBP users would be worried about slight changes in size as these machines aren't adopted by people interested in ultra portability. For that Apple has the Air and MacBook.
  • Reply 24 of 38
    frank777frank777 Posts: 5,837member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post





    Most likely they would need to bump up the size of the machine slightly but edge to edge technology would minimize the expansion considerably.

     

    Given that they will be baking a new shell to accommodate the new port scheme anyway, a slight increase in size isn't a problem.

     

    I do think that the MacBook Pro, at 4.5 pounds, is as heavy as Apple's going to want it to be. So I'm not sure Apple will increase the size if it adds noticeably more weight to the machine.

  • Reply 25 of 38
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 13,377member
    rogifan wrote: »
    Where are the more ports going to come from?
    Wherever they can find the room.
    Removing the headphone jack?
    Actually that might not be a bad idea.
    Why does this need to be like 2008 all over again?
    Apple keeps screwing up that is why.
    Lots of people use iPads just find with one port.

    So? I mean really I sit here with an iPad and a MBP which are used in dramatically different ways. A single port machine would never work as a replacement for my laptop usage. Furthermore the port on the iPad is actively locked down, even if I wanted too the iPad could never work for me like the Mac does. Well never in the sense that Apple doesn't change their mind about port access.
  • Reply 26 of 38
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 13,377member
    
    
    
    frank777 wrote: »
    Given that they will be baking a new shell to accommodate the new port scheme anyway, a slight increase in size isn't a problem.

    I do think that the MacBook Pro, at 4.5 pounds, is as heavy as Apple's going to want it to be. So I'm not sure Apple will increase the size if it adds noticeably more weight to the machine.

    They may be able to trim weight elsewhere. But again I believe they have some freedom here with their customer base to keep the 15(16)" MBP as their power users laptop. A bit heavier (fractions of a pound) might irritate the prestige buyers but that is a small portion of Apples market, the MBP is still a portable performance workstation.
  • Reply 27 of 38
    toddzrxtoddzrx Posts: 235member

    When you think about it, Apple historically doesn't overlap product lines quite like it does with its laptops that are offered right now.  I think the future holds a simpler lineup: 12 and 14 inch Macbooks, and 14 and 16 inch Macbook Pros.  All with retina screens of course.  Macbooks for ultra-portability and consumer grade, the Pro for heavier lifting for those who need it. 

  • Reply 28 of 38
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post

     
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Frank777 View Post



    The 14"/16" idea is being thrown around the forum a lot, but does anybody know if there's really enough room in the MBP to remove the bezel and gain an inch of screen width?



    If Apple managed to go edge to edge (and somehow dealt with the camera placement) how big of a screen would fit in the 15" Pro?




    Most likely they would need to bump up the size of the machine slightly but edge to edge technology would minimize the expansion considerably. The laptop would be much smaller than the old 17" though. One could just take a tape measure to a current machine, laid across the current diagonal, to see what is possible.



    I don't think most common MBP users would be worried about slight changes in size as these machines aren't adopted by people interested in ultra portability. For that Apple has the Air and MacBook.



    How much longer before the separate "Air" and "Pro" model types go away?

     

    Maybe not in the next year, but we're heading toward all models sporting high dpi screens and improved performance in a thin package. A not-too-distant-future simplified MacBook lineup might then consist of a 12" (with an extra port for the whiners), plus a 14" and 16" evolution of the current 13" and 15" MBPR (faster and a bit thinner, but still with ports). Three models, each with a few CPU/RAM/SSD options would cover the bases nicely.

  • Reply 29 of 38
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by RobertC View Post

     

    I'm surprised AppleInsider covered this and not Intel's new Xeon chips for mobile workstations.  

     

    Lenovo already announced 15" and 17" laptops with the new Skylake 47 W Xeon chips (DDR4 ECC, Thunderbolt 3, PCIe SSD, nVidia Quadro, 4k display with built-in calibration sensor, fingerprint sensor, etc.). 

     

    I'm curious to see what Apple might have planned for the next MacBook Pro.




    If Apple does something like that Lenovo, then it would be worthy of the "Pro" designation. Everything else could simply be "MacBook."

  • Reply 30 of 38
    hmmhmm Posts: 3,405member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by RoundaboutNow View Post

     



     (with an extra port for the whiners)

     


     

    Why refer to people as whiners? I can tell you that carrying extra dongles really does suck. They're often poorly manufactured and unreliable. Sometimes they're a poor fit.

     

    I disagree with your assertion of a 16" model here, but I've been wrong before. 15" has been the most popular size for years. The gain from 15" to 17" is decent, not amazing. I still have one of the last 17" models, so I speak from experience. While Apple has drifted away from some of their old patterns, there's nothing that would necessarily motivate them to bump the 15" up by 1 inch. It wouldn't necessarily align well with 4K displays or provide a lot of benefit. I would be somewhat less surprised to see 12" and 14". It wouldn't please me, but it seems more likely.

  • Reply 31 of 38
    frank777frank777 Posts: 5,837member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by hmm View Post

     

     

    Why refer to people as whiners? I can tell you that carrying extra dongles really does suck. They're often poorly manufactured and unreliable. Sometimes they're a poor fit.


     

    Another port isn't going to do anything for your "extra dongles" problem.

     

    If Apple puts a second port on the MacBook, it's almost certainly going to be another USB 3.1 port.

     

    If you need VGA or HDMI, you'll still need to carry around the adapter.

  • Reply 32 of 38
    hmmhmm Posts: 3,405member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Frank777 View Post

     

     

    Another port isn't going to do anything for your "extra dongles" problem.

     

    If Apple puts a second port on the MacBook, it's almost certainly going to be another USB 3.1 port.

     

    If you need VGA or HDMI, you'll still need to carry around the adapter.




    I don't believe he was referring to the macbook perse. He was referring to whatever occupies the 15" rmbp spot in Apple's lineup. I wasn't referring to just those. There are various reasons you might need to plug something in, but anyway HDMI is more typical now. I haven't seen a projector that uses VGA in some time.

  • Reply 33 of 38
    winterwinter Posts: 1,238member
    Is the Intel HD 520 = to the Broadwell Iris 6100 on a 15W chip? That would be perfect for a Mac mini if they made it.
  • Reply 34 of 38
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by hmm View Post

     
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Frank777 View Post

     

     

    Another port isn't going to do anything for your "extra dongles" problem.

     

    If Apple puts a second port on the MacBook, it's almost certainly going to be another USB 3.1 port.

     

    If you need VGA or HDMI, you'll still need to carry around the adapter.




    I don't believe he was referring to the macbook perse. He was referring to whatever occupies the 15" rmbp spot in Apple's lineup. I wasn't referring to just those. There are various reasons you might need to plug something in, but anyway HDMI is more typical now. I haven't seen a projector that uses VGA in some time.




    I was in fact referring to the MacBook (the 12") with the idea that adding another port would be good. The rest of the line up should have a decent complement of built-in ports IMO. OK, so I was being a little rude when I implied that anyone wanting more ports on a 12" was a "whiner." However, from what I read, the majority use case for the 12" seems to be OK with a single port, and it seems to me that for many people wanting more ports, there are other MacBooks to choose from. Personally, I'm not interested in a 12", but I can see another USB-C port as a benefit (with or without whining). (Although if there was a way to pack a quad-core i7 and GPU to support external 4K/5K @ 60Hz displays in a 12" form factor, I would re-consider--but of course, that does not seem at all likely).

     

    So far as going from 13" to 14" and 15" to 16", I was just suggesting that as a way to create more space from the 12" on up to larger sizes to simplify the line up (and that the 13" and 15" would go away).

     

    PS: I'm a bit tired of all the dongles too, but as Frank777 points out, we will probably still need at least a few for the foreseeable future.

  • Reply 35 of 38
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 13,377member

    I was in fact referring to the MacBook (the 12") with the idea that adding another port would be good. The rest of the line up should have a decent complement of built-in ports IMO. OK, so I was being a little rude when I implied that anyone wanting more ports on a 12" was a "whiner."
    It isn't a question of being rude it is a question of not seeing the needs of others. The fact is I find multiple ports more useful away from the desk but that is due to the way I use the machines.
    However, from what I read, the majority use case for the 12" seems to be OK with a single port, and it seems to me that for many people wanting more ports, there are other MacBooks to choose from. Personally, I'm not interested in a 12", but I can see another USB-C port as a benefit (with or without whining).
    When announced I found the Mac Book to be a very interesting machine, like the first iPad or even iPhone it is more proof of concept than anything. Two negatives stood out with this machine, one being the lack of ports, the other being rather lackluster performance. The March of technology will take care of the performance issue but the ports issue won't be corrected unless Apple feels pressure to do so.
    (Although if there was a way to pack a quad-core i7 and GPU to support external 4K/5K @ 60Hz displays in a 12" form factor, I would re-consider--but of course, that does not seem at all likely).
    It is very likely to happen sometime in the future. Another process shrink would free up an amazing amount of area for new circuitry. With the current GPU's being "there" that means Intel can refocus on the CPU and the easiest way to accelerate the CPU would be to add more cores. I would suspect that the next process shrink would lead us all away from dual core machines.
    So far as going from 13" to 14" and 15" to 16", I was just suggesting that as a way to create more space from the 12" on up to larger sizes to simplify the line up (and that the 13" and 15" would go away).
    I've been an advocate of 14" and 16" MBP simply because I think Apple can do so without blowing out the machines size excessively. This would separate the machines a bit from the Air lineup. Unlike others here I don't see the Airs going away anytime soon.

    Why? The Airs can handle considerably for powerful CPUs than the Mac Book for one. Second the support a variety of ports whereas the Mac Book supports exactly one. Even it the Mac Book got two ports it wouldn't be as flexible as the Air.
    PS: I'm a bit tired of all the dongles too, but as Frank777 points out, we will probably still need at least a few for the foreseeable future.
    Dongles and adapter cables won't go away anytime soon! My problem is that you often need two connected at once and some of those adapter cables really don't like to be routed through hubs. I know a lot of people around here apparently never hook there laptops up to a variety of equipment (thinking manufacturing plant here) but sometimes you simply need more than one port. It gets even uglier if you need to run the machine on a charger!

    Which brings up another issue that burns my ass, why would Apple build a machine like the Mac Book and not put a couple of ports in the charger itself? Effectively the charger becomes an expansion hub. Done right, this would make for a significantly more useful and versatile Mac Book.
  • Reply 36 of 38
    hmmhmm Posts: 3,405member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post



    Which brings up another issue that burns my ass, why would Apple build a machine like the Mac Book and not put a couple of ports in the charger itself? Effectively the charger becomes an expansion hub. Done right, this would make for a significantly more useful and versatile Mac Book.

    Cost is probably a big reason, assuming it can deliver power and data simultaneously. Notebook chargers tend to be an expensive replacement relative to machine cost, and Apple is already a bit higher than average there. The expected place for the actual ports would also be the transformer itself. I don't know how most people would deal with that. I would just zip tie any set of cords that needs to connected while at my desk and have a second set that goes with me if necessary.

     

    If they update the thunderbolt display, it really should connect to the macbook. It makes some sense there, because you're still only plugging and unplugging from one location.

  • Reply 37 of 38
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 13,377member
    hmm wrote: »
    Cost is probably a big reason, assuming it can deliver power and data simultaneously.
    I never even thought about simultaneous use. Now I have to wonder if it is possible. If it isn't my hate of the Mac Book will only grow.
    Notebook chargers tend to be an expensive replacement relative to machine cost, and Apple is already a bit higher than average there. The expected place for the actual ports would also be the transformer itself. I don't know how most people would deal with that. I would just zip tie any set of cords that needs to connected while at my desk and have a second set that goes with me if necessary.
    My thought here is to have the charger sitting at the work desk more or less permanently. Ideally the charger would have a video port of some type, a network connection and probably an additional USB port.
    If they update the thunderbolt display, it really should connect to the macbook. It makes some sense there, because you're still only plugging and unplugging from one location.

    I guess that would be a solid alternative and effectively serves a similar purpose. Of course that means being stuck with an Apple monitor.

    All this makes me wonder if anybody has seen signs of a third party charger that addresses these sorts of issues. With USB-C supposedly being an open standard that should be possible. I say supposedly because I've seen signs of validation capabilities for connected devices. Last thing this world needs is MiFi coming to USB-C devices.
  • Reply 38 of 38
    hmmhmm Posts: 3,405member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post





    I never even thought about simultaneous use. Now I have to wonder if it is possible. If it isn't my hate of the Mac Book will only grow.

    I don't personally hate the macbook, but it's not suitable for me.

    Quote:

    My thought here is to have the charger sitting at the work desk more or less permanently. Ideally the charger would have a video port of some type, a network connection and probably an additional USB port.

    I guess that would be a solid alternative and effectively serves a similar purpose. Of course that means being stuck with an Apple monitor.


    I guess it would be a little different with a somewhat stationary charger. I would expect ports to be on the same side as the cord that terminates in a grounded AC plug. It's a little awkward in the other direction, and on the sides you would create a 2D scheme, which is asking for accidental damage. The brick itself contains a small transformer, but I have no idea how easy it is to accommodate the other parts around that. I know very little about the low level details of hardware components. I mean I can read a circuit diagram but not much more than that.

     

    Quote:

    All this makes me wonder if anybody has seen signs of a third party charger that addresses these sorts of issues. With USB-C supposedly being an open standard that should be possible. I say supposedly because I've seen signs of validation capabilities for connected devices. Last thing this world needs is MiFi coming to USB-C devices.


    I've never seen a really good third party charger for any notebook, although some of the dedicated Apple resellers used to carry aftermarket G4 chargers. I was mostly pointing out that Apple has some established level of markup on these replacements, and they probably do not want to budge too much on either price or margins. I'm referring to replacement chargers with a sale of $129 or so rather than $1200-2000 for a notebook including that charger.

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