What's different from Tmo iPhone? I order Tmo and used it with ATT SIM since day 1.
They are nearly identical. The difference, according to the Technical Specifications page is the cellular bands. In previous models, there were more differences, but this year, the difference is SIM-Free has LTE Band 30, T-Mobile unlocked doesnt. It's the new modern faster band being rolled out by some carriers. Only a few phones support it and it's not very widespread yet. I believe that one band is the only difference, otherwise identical.
This is all very confusing to me. I, too, thought there were at least two different iPhone versions for GSM (AT&T in the US and many/most non-US carriers) and CDMA (most other than AT&T in the US and very few non-US carriers). However, looking at Apple's iPhone-to-network compatibility list, it looks like different versions of iPhones work with different carriers - sometimes exclusive and sometimes overlapping with little rhyme or reason. So, not only are their 2 different sizes, 4 different colors, 3 different storage capacities, there are at least 5 different "retail" versions (AT&T, TMO, Sprint, Verizon, and "unlocked") and then 4 more versions on Apple's upgrade program since that requires a carrier selection. And, now there's "SIM-free" on top of that. That's at least 960 different variations of iPhones whether the difference is in hardware and/or software. That's mind-boggling to me. I thought carrier-specific iPhones disappeared somewhere after the iPhone 4 and that the 4S and above had radios that were compatible with both GSM and CDMA carriers.
So, my question is, does the "SIM-free" version literally work with any carrier? If so, wouldn't this be the most valuable model in terms of residual value?
So what would the difference in the monthly bill be? With a subsidized phone, that bill includes additional charges that eventually pay off the cost of the phone. The monthly bill for an unsubsidized phone should be less, correct? How much less per month?
Yes, so just what is the difference between the unlocked, sim free iPhone and the unlocked Apple Upgrade phone offer (which I took advantage of keeping my AT&at nlimited plan)???
I was told my phone was unlocked and although it came with an AT&T sim, it could be switched to any other carrier at any time, AND it could be used worldwide outside of the US.
You can't buy an iPhone with the Upgrade Program online ...
You have to:
find an Apple Retail Store with the color/model/size you want in stock
reserve one with an appointment (1/2 hour window) in an Apple Retail Store and go to the Apple Retail Store to pick it up
you can buy 1 or 2 of the exact color/model/size per reservation
you can have 2 reservations per AppleID -- up to 2 x (2 different color/model/size )
The iPhone Upgrade Program is a fantastic concept -- that is very poorly implemented.
This is all very confusing to me. I, too, thought there were at least two different iPhone versions for GSM (AT&T in the US and many/most non-US carriers) and CDMA (most other than AT&T in the US and very few non-US carriers). However, looking at Apple's iPhone-to-network compatibility list, it looks like different versions of iPhones work with different carriers - sometimes exclusive and sometimes overlapping with little rhyme or reason. So, not only are their 2 different sizes, 4 different colors, 3 different storage capacities, there are at least 5 different "retail" versions (AT&T, TMO, Sprint, Verizon, and "unlocked") and then 4 more versions on Apple's upgrade program since that requires a carrier selection. And, now there's "SIM-free" on top of that. That's at least 960 different variations of iPhones whether the difference is in hardware and/or software. That's mind-boggling to me. I thought carrier-specific iPhones disappeared somewhere after the iPhone 4 and that the 4S and above had radios that were compatible with both GSM and CDMA carriers.
So, my question is, does the "SIM-free" version literally work with any carrier? If so, wouldn't this be the most valuable model in terms of residual value?
As I understand it, any iPhone 6s/6s+ will work on any network. So for all intents and purposes it won't matter for the vast majority of users. There are a few minor differences. The ATT phone, which is the same model number as the sim-free version, has one extra LTE band. But if you have a different model, your phone will still work fine on ATT's network. You won't be able to utilize that missing LTE band, but for 99% of users probably won't make a difference. Someone posted above that if you have a non-Tmobile phone on the Tmobile network you won't get wi-fi calling which seems strange if true. The only other item I've not seen info on is whether or not you'd need to do anything special to get a non-Verizon, non-Sprint phone to be able to access those respective network's CDMA bands. Regardless of the 6s model you have, it will have the CDMA compatible hardware. It's a question of whether those phones will need to be white listed by the carrier. Since CDMA doesn't utilize SIM cards to identify their networks they essentially need to be "pre-registered" on those networks.
So really, the only reason Apple sells "different" phones for different carriers is to determine which carriers SIM card to include with the phone. The phone hardware is identical (other than the one ATT LTE band). Otherwise you'd have to buy your phone then go to the carrier to get a SIM card (or transfer it from your existing phone if you are staying with your existing carrier). Americans can't be bothered to deal with that so instead Apple pre-installs the carriers' SIM cards for us and then labels the box as a "Verizon phone", "Tmobile phone", etc, even those the phone's themselves are identical.
Side note: It's quite odd that Apple made a separate ATT phone model which is just causing confusion. Perhaps the chips that support that extra LTE band are in short supply or cost a little more because it's relatively new so they didn't want to use that chip in phones for the other carriers. If that is the case, perhaps down the road when the chip supply/cost improves they will quietly make the change to standardize all iPhones to include that extra band.
So what would the difference in the monthly bill be? With a subsidized phone, that bill includes additional charges that eventually pay off the cost of the phone. The monthly bill for an unsubsidized phone should be less, correct? How much less per month?
Depends on your carrier. ATT's 2 year contract subsidized phone on a family plan is $40/mth.... No contract either buying the phone or on their Next Plan drops to $15. So $25 dollars a month. So if you go subsidized you save $450 at the time of purchase but pay $600 over two years.
As I understand it, any iPhone 6s/6s+ will work on any network. So for all intents and purposes it won't matter for the vast majority of users. There are a few minor differences. The ATT phone, which is the same model number as the sim-free version, has one extra LTE band. But if you have a different model, your phone will still work fine on ATT's network. You won't be able to utilize that missing LTE band, but for 99% of users probably won't make a difference. Someone posted above that if you have a non-Tmobile phone on the Tmobile network you won't get wi-fi calling which seems strange if true. The only other item I've not seen info on is whether or not you'd need to do anything special to get a non-Verizon, non-Sprint phone to be able to access those respective network's CDMA bands. Regardless of the 6s model you have, it will have the CDMA compatible hardware. It's a question of whether those phones will need to be white listed by the carrier. Since CDMA doesn't utilize SIM cards to identify their networks they essentially need to be "pre-registered" on those networks.
So really, the only reason Apple sells "different" phones for different carriers is to determine which carriers SIM card to include with the phone. The phone hardware is identical (other than the one ATT LTE band). Otherwise you'd have to buy your phone then go to the carrier to get a SIM card (or transfer it from your existing phone if you are staying with your existing carrier). Americans can't be bothered to deal with that so instead Apple pre-installs the carriers' SIM cards for us and then labels the box as a "Verizon phone", "Tmobile phone", etc, even those the phone's themselves are identical.
Side note: It's quite odd that Apple made a separate ATT phone model which is just causing confusion. Perhaps the chips that support that extra LTE band are in short supply or cost a little more because it's relatively new so they didn't want to use that chip in phones for the other carriers. If that is the case, perhaps down the road when the chip supply/cost improves they will quietly make the change to standardize all iPhones to include that extra band.
lolliver 10/08/2015 10:47 PM So does it stil need a SIM card from your carrier of choice? If so its no different than the way we've been able to buy iPhones in the rest of the world.
It is not achievement of Apple. Regulators said so and you cannot even change between US networks to do roaming. No coverage by your provider means no coverage at all (even if there is coverage by other providers).
So when you refer that the limitation should not exist like in other parts of the world then talk to FCC and US regulators to stop that madness.
I prefer my Verizon multi-system iPhone with international SIM card that I can buy here in the US... bu then calling me in the USA is not an international number (only in the USA - go figure).
I wouldn't at all read that as meaning there are 5 different radio configurations. Take a look at the Tech Specs page for the iPhone and you'll see in the Cellular and Wireless section that there is no distinction for GSM and CDMA models. They both have the same GSM And CDMA radios.
Also, Apple's support document (https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201296) only lists three model numbers for the 6s: A1633, A1688, A1700. There is no model distinction between GSM and CDMA.
As for the A1700 model, fair point. But those are the Chinese market models, and I hadn't really consider those. It appears that those also have the same LTE configuration as the non-ATT phones for the rest of the world. The difference is probably due to the Chinese, I believe, using a home-grown variation of CDMA. Even then, the CDMA radio may be the same but just a difference software protocol (just guessing there).
I wouldn't at all read that as meaning there are 5 different radio configurations. Take a look at the Tech Specs page for the iPhone and you'll see in the Cellular and Wireless section that there is no distinction for GSM and CDMA models. They both have the same GSM And CDMA radios.
Also, Apple's support document (https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201296) only lists three model numbers for the 6s: A1633, A1688, A1700. There is no model distinction between GSM and CDMA.
As for the A1700 model, fair point. But those are the Chinese market models, and I hadn't really consider those. It appears that those also have the same LTE configuration as the non-ATT phones for the rest of the world. The difference is probably due to the Chinese, I believe, using a home-grown variation of CDMA. Even then, the CDMA radio may be the same but just a difference software protocol (just guessing there).
I wonder why they would list GSM and CDMA in parentheses on separate lines if there was no difference. On the A1633, there is no reference to GSM or CDMA. On the the A1688 and A1700, there is. If each model had both radios, I wonder why they wouldn't just list it without references either like they do on the A1633 model is simply put "A1688 GSM and CDMA" on one line. And, it appears the A1633 and A1700 have the same band coverage and both list GSM and CDMA with their respective model numbers, so I wonder what the actual difference(s) between an A1633 and A1700 are?
I wonder why they would list GSM and CDMA in parentheses on separate lines if there was no difference. On the A1633, there is no reference to GSM or CDMA. On the the A1688 and A1700, there is. If each model had both radios, I wonder why they wouldn't just list it without references either like they do on the A1633 model is simply put "A1688 GSM and CDMA" on one line. And, it appears the A1633 and A1700 have the same band coverage and both list GSM and CDMA with their respective model numbers, so I wonder what the actual difference(s) between an A1633 and A1700 are?
That is curious. The only thing I can think of is that that web page is specifically about LTE support, not CDMA or even non-LTE GSM support for that matter. Since historically we've referred to Verizon and Sprint as CDMA networks and ATT and Tmobile as GSM networks, perhaps they simply put those identifiers on there to say that this phone, purchased from either a CDMA or GSM provider, supports these LTE bands.
When you said, "And, it appears the A1633 and A1700 have the same band coverage and both list GSM and CDMA with their respective model numbers, so I wonder what the actual difference(s) between an A1633 and A1700 are?" I assume you meant to say A1688, not A1633. As I stated earlier, Chinese networks use a different flavor of CDMA than the rest of the world (which is mostly the US when it comes to CDMA). I don't know if this means a difference in hardware or if it's a software/firmware difference only. But I believe it's always been the case even when there were specific CDMA phones, if you wanted to play in China you needed to have a different model to support their systems. (I vaguely recall reading several years ago that it was because China didn't want to pay the licensing fees to use CDMA so they created their own knock-off, home-grown version, but I'm not sure.)
Whoopee. iPhones have been unlocked in New Zealand since day 1. It is illegal (and anti-competitive) to lock a phone to a carrier here. So much for the land-of-the-free. More like the land of big business.
Thanks Wiggin. Here is a link with a bit more info, but Macworld has the same question you do, which is why did Apple decide to have two very slightly different models..
Comments
What's different from Tmo iPhone? I order Tmo and used it with ATT SIM since day 1.
They are nearly identical. The difference, according to the Technical Specifications page is the cellular bands. In previous models, there were more differences, but this year, the difference is SIM-Free has LTE Band 30, T-Mobile unlocked doesnt. It's the new modern faster band being rolled out by some carriers. Only a few phones support it and it's not very widespread yet. I believe that one band is the only difference, otherwise identical.
This is all very confusing to me. I, too, thought there were at least two different iPhone versions for GSM (AT&T in the US and many/most non-US carriers) and CDMA (most other than AT&T in the US and very few non-US carriers). However, looking at Apple's iPhone-to-network compatibility list, it looks like different versions of iPhones work with different carriers - sometimes exclusive and sometimes overlapping with little rhyme or reason. So, not only are their 2 different sizes, 4 different colors, 3 different storage capacities, there are at least 5 different "retail" versions (AT&T, TMO, Sprint, Verizon, and "unlocked") and then 4 more versions on Apple's upgrade program since that requires a carrier selection. And, now there's "SIM-free" on top of that. That's at least 960 different variations of iPhones whether the difference is in hardware and/or software. That's mind-boggling to me. I thought carrier-specific iPhones disappeared somewhere after the iPhone 4 and that the 4S and above had radios that were compatible with both GSM and CDMA carriers.
So, my question is, does the "SIM-free" version literally work with any carrier? If so, wouldn't this be the most valuable model in terms of residual value?
You can't buy an iPhone with the Upgrade Program online ...
You have to:
The iPhone Upgrade Program is a fantastic concept -- that is very poorly implemented.
This is all very confusing to me. I, too, thought there were at least two different iPhone versions for GSM (AT&T in the US and many/most non-US carriers) and CDMA (most other than AT&T in the US and very few non-US carriers). However, looking at Apple's iPhone-to-network compatibility list, it looks like different versions of iPhones work with different carriers - sometimes exclusive and sometimes overlapping with little rhyme or reason. So, not only are their 2 different sizes, 4 different colors, 3 different storage capacities, there are at least 5 different "retail" versions (AT&T, TMO, Sprint, Verizon, and "unlocked") and then 4 more versions on Apple's upgrade program since that requires a carrier selection. And, now there's "SIM-free" on top of that. That's at least 960 different variations of iPhones whether the difference is in hardware and/or software. That's mind-boggling to me. I thought carrier-specific iPhones disappeared somewhere after the iPhone 4 and that the 4S and above had radios that were compatible with both GSM and CDMA carriers.
So, my question is, does the "SIM-free" version literally work with any carrier? If so, wouldn't this be the most valuable model in terms of residual value?
As I understand it, any iPhone 6s/6s+ will work on any network. So for all intents and purposes it won't matter for the vast majority of users. There are a few minor differences. The ATT phone, which is the same model number as the sim-free version, has one extra LTE band. But if you have a different model, your phone will still work fine on ATT's network. You won't be able to utilize that missing LTE band, but for 99% of users probably won't make a difference. Someone posted above that if you have a non-Tmobile phone on the Tmobile network you won't get wi-fi calling which seems strange if true. The only other item I've not seen info on is whether or not you'd need to do anything special to get a non-Verizon, non-Sprint phone to be able to access those respective network's CDMA bands. Regardless of the 6s model you have, it will have the CDMA compatible hardware. It's a question of whether those phones will need to be white listed by the carrier. Since CDMA doesn't utilize SIM cards to identify their networks they essentially need to be "pre-registered" on those networks.
So really, the only reason Apple sells "different" phones for different carriers is to determine which carriers SIM card to include with the phone. The phone hardware is identical (other than the one ATT LTE band). Otherwise you'd have to buy your phone then go to the carrier to get a SIM card (or transfer it from your existing phone if you are staying with your existing carrier). Americans can't be bothered to deal with that so instead Apple pre-installs the carriers' SIM cards for us and then labels the box as a "Verizon phone", "Tmobile phone", etc, even those the phone's themselves are identical.
Side note: It's quite odd that Apple made a separate ATT phone model which is just causing confusion. Perhaps the chips that support that extra LTE band are in short supply or cost a little more because it's relatively new so they didn't want to use that chip in phones for the other carriers. If that is the case, perhaps down the road when the chip supply/cost improves they will quietly make the change to standardize all iPhones to include that extra band.
So what would the difference in the monthly bill be? With a subsidized phone, that bill includes additional charges that eventually pay off the cost of the phone. The monthly bill for an unsubsidized phone should be less, correct? How much less per month?
Depends on your carrier. ATT's 2 year contract subsidized phone on a family plan is $40/mth.... No contract either buying the phone or on their Next Plan drops to $15. So $25 dollars a month. So if you go subsidized you save $450 at the time of purchase but pay $600 over two years.
As I understand it, any iPhone 6s/6s+ will work on any network. So for all intents and purposes it won't matter for the vast majority of users. There are a few minor differences. The ATT phone, which is the same model number as the sim-free version, has one extra LTE band. But if you have a different model, your phone will still work fine on ATT's network. You won't be able to utilize that missing LTE band, but for 99% of users probably won't make a difference. Someone posted above that if you have a non-Tmobile phone on the Tmobile network you won't get wi-fi calling which seems strange if true. The only other item I've not seen info on is whether or not you'd need to do anything special to get a non-Verizon, non-Sprint phone to be able to access those respective network's CDMA bands. Regardless of the 6s model you have, it will have the CDMA compatible hardware. It's a question of whether those phones will need to be white listed by the carrier. Since CDMA doesn't utilize SIM cards to identify their networks they essentially need to be "pre-registered" on those networks.
So really, the only reason Apple sells "different" phones for different carriers is to determine which carriers SIM card to include with the phone. The phone hardware is identical (other than the one ATT LTE band). Otherwise you'd have to buy your phone then go to the carrier to get a SIM card (or transfer it from your existing phone if you are staying with your existing carrier). Americans can't be bothered to deal with that so instead Apple pre-installs the carriers' SIM cards for us and then labels the box as a "Verizon phone", "Tmobile phone", etc, even those the phone's themselves are identical.
Side note: It's quite odd that Apple made a separate ATT phone model which is just causing confusion. Perhaps the chips that support that extra LTE band are in short supply or cost a little more because it's relatively new so they didn't want to use that chip in phones for the other carriers. If that is the case, perhaps down the road when the chip supply/cost improves they will quietly make the change to standardize all iPhones to include that extra band.
According to http://www.apple.com/iphone/LTE/ there may be at least 5 different radio configurations:
Model A1633
Model A1688 (GSM)
Model A1688 (CDMA)
Model A1700 (GSM)
Model A1700 (CDMA)
So does it stil need a SIM card from your carrier of choice? If so its no different than the way we've been able to buy iPhones in the rest of the world.
It is not achievement of Apple. Regulators said so and you cannot even change between US networks to do roaming. No coverage by your provider means no coverage at all (even if there is coverage by other providers).
So when you refer that the limitation should not exist like in other parts of the world then talk to FCC and US regulators to stop that madness.
I prefer my Verizon multi-system iPhone with international SIM card that I can buy here in the US... bu then calling me in the USA is not an international number (only in the USA - go figure).
According to http://www.apple.com/iphone/LTE/ there may be at least 5 different radio configurations:
Model A1633
Model A1688 (GSM)
Model A1688 (CDMA)
Model A1700 (GSM)
Model A1700 (CDMA)
I wouldn't at all read that as meaning there are 5 different radio configurations. Take a look at the Tech Specs page for the iPhone and you'll see in the Cellular and Wireless section that there is no distinction for GSM and CDMA models. They both have the same GSM And CDMA radios.
http://www.apple.com/iphone-6s/specs/
Also, Apple's support document (https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201296) only lists three model numbers for the 6s: A1633, A1688, A1700. There is no model distinction between GSM and CDMA.
As for the A1700 model, fair point. But those are the Chinese market models, and I hadn't really consider those. It appears that those also have the same LTE configuration as the non-ATT phones for the rest of the world. The difference is probably due to the Chinese, I believe, using a home-grown variation of CDMA. Even then, the CDMA radio may be the same but just a difference software protocol (just guessing there).
I wouldn't at all read that as meaning there are 5 different radio configurations. Take a look at the Tech Specs page for the iPhone and you'll see in the Cellular and Wireless section that there is no distinction for GSM and CDMA models. They both have the same GSM And CDMA radios.
http://www.apple.com/iphone-6s/specs/
Also, Apple's support document (https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201296) only lists three model numbers for the 6s: A1633, A1688, A1700. There is no model distinction between GSM and CDMA.
As for the A1700 model, fair point. But those are the Chinese market models, and I hadn't really consider those. It appears that those also have the same LTE configuration as the non-ATT phones for the rest of the world. The difference is probably due to the Chinese, I believe, using a home-grown variation of CDMA. Even then, the CDMA radio may be the same but just a difference software protocol (just guessing there).
I wonder why they would list GSM and CDMA in parentheses on separate lines if there was no difference. On the A1633, there is no reference to GSM or CDMA. On the the A1688 and A1700, there is. If each model had both radios, I wonder why they wouldn't just list it without references either like they do on the A1633 model is simply put "A1688 GSM and CDMA" on one line. And, it appears the A1633 and A1700 have the same band coverage and both list GSM and CDMA with their respective model numbers, so I wonder what the actual difference(s) between an A1633 and A1700 are?
I wonder why they would list GSM and CDMA in parentheses on separate lines if there was no difference. On the A1633, there is no reference to GSM or CDMA. On the the A1688 and A1700, there is. If each model had both radios, I wonder why they wouldn't just list it without references either like they do on the A1633 model is simply put "A1688 GSM and CDMA" on one line. And, it appears the A1633 and A1700 have the same band coverage and both list GSM and CDMA with their respective model numbers, so I wonder what the actual difference(s) between an A1633 and A1700 are?
That is curious. The only thing I can think of is that that web page is specifically about LTE support, not CDMA or even non-LTE GSM support for that matter. Since historically we've referred to Verizon and Sprint as CDMA networks and ATT and Tmobile as GSM networks, perhaps they simply put those identifiers on there to say that this phone, purchased from either a CDMA or GSM provider, supports these LTE bands.
When you said, "And, it appears the A1633 and A1700 have the same band coverage and both list GSM and CDMA with their respective model numbers, so I wonder what the actual difference(s) between an A1633 and A1700 are?" I assume you meant to say A1688, not A1633. As I stated earlier, Chinese networks use a different flavor of CDMA than the rest of the world (which is mostly the US when it comes to CDMA). I don't know if this means a difference in hardware or if it's a software/firmware difference only. But I believe it's always been the case even when there were specific CDMA phones, if you wanted to play in China you needed to have a different model to support their systems. (I vaguely recall reading several years ago that it was because China didn't want to pay the licensing fees to use CDMA so they created their own knock-off, home-grown version, but I'm not sure.)
iPhones have been unlocked in New Zealand since day 1.
It is illegal (and anti-competitive) to lock a phone to a carrier here.
So much for the land-of-the-free. More like the land of big business.
Thanks Wiggin. Here is a link with a bit more info, but Macworld has the same question you do, which is why did Apple decide to have two very slightly different models..
http://www.macworld.com/article/2991494/carriers/new-iphones-use-lte-on-any-american-carrier-despite-the-way-theyre-listed.html