Elon Musk walks back Apple Car, Apple Watch aspersions in Twitter confessional

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  • Reply 101 of 156
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by knowitall View Post



    although I think it will take 5 gererations or more for Apple to get it right 

     

    This doesn't mean anything at all.

  • Reply 102 of 156
    knowitall wrote: »
    although I think it will take 5 gererations or more for Apple to get it right 

    This doesn't mean anything at all.

    No! No! No!

    He knows it all, you see...
  • Reply 103 of 156
    rogifanrogifan Posts: 10,669member
    'Awkward' is putting it mildly. He is plainly off-base, IMHO. The first iPad is an utterly gorgeous design. In fact, to this day, I prefer the lines and curves of its back far more than I do those in the current version. Granted it was a tad heavy by today's standards, but to say that it was 'embarrassing' is just completely off-base. Cook couldn't be more wrong.

    Sorry I agree with him. I mean the device shipped with 256MB RAM, had no front facing camera and didn't even support iOS 6 two years later. Plus the web was still chocked full of Flash which iPad didn't support. Of course Apple made the right decision in not supporting Flash on mobile but it was a less than idea user experience when so much video among other things still relied on Flash. iPad 2 had/has a much longer shelf life than iPad 1 did.
  • Reply 104 of 156
    solipsismysolipsismy Posts: 5,099member
    rogifan wrote: »
    Plus the web was still chocked full of Flash which iPad didn't support. Of course Apple made the right decision in not supporting Flash on mobile but it was a less than idea user experience when so much video among other things still relied on Flash.

    You're arguing it was embarrassing that iOS for iPad didn't come with Adobe Flash in 2010, but saying they made the right choice by not including Adobe Flash on iOS for iPhone back in 2007. Now I've heard everything. :no:
  • Reply 105 of 156
    rogifanrogifan Posts: 10,669member
    solipsismy wrote: »
    1) Thanks for providing a source and quoting it.

    2) That was a stupid thing for him to say. Looks like he's human after all.

    He's just being honest. Steve Jobs was honest about the hockey puck mouse and 'fat' Nano too.

    But going back to my larger point Musk didn't say ?Watch as an idea was bad just that it would take a few generations for it to really become compelling. Even though I love my watch and use it every day I don't disagree with him. I don't really use that many third-party apps mostly because they take forever to load. Even some of the native 1st party apps are slow. I find the same thing with Hey Siri. I'll ask Siri to set me a timer. Sometimes it's instant other times I'm waiting 5-10 seconds. And sometimes I say Hey Siri and nothing happens. Little things like that are annoying but I can see the potential of this device and think it will become a really compelling device by the second or third generation.
  • Reply 106 of 156
    rogifanrogifan Posts: 10,669member
    solipsismy wrote: »
    You're arguing it was embarrassing that iOS for iPad didn't come with Adobe Flash in 2010, but saying they made the right choice by not including Adobe Flash on iOS for iPhone back in 2007. Now I've heard everything. :no:

    Yes I think it was the right decision but for the few years that Flash was still predominant on the web it unfortunately made for a poorer user experience on the iPad. I remember many family and friends being frustrated. Most of the time it was when they wanted to watch video of something and couldn't because the video was Flash.
  • Reply 107 of 156
    solipsismysolipsismy Posts: 5,099member
    rogifan wrote: »
    Yes I think it was the right decision but for the few years that Flash was still predominant on the web it unfortunately made for a poorer user experience on the iPad. I remember many family and friends being frustrated. Most of the time it was when they wanted to watch video of something and couldn't because the video was Flash.

    1) It was only a "few years" because apple didn't include a shitty version of Adobe Flash on iOS! if they had, then HTML5 and other standards may not have gotten off the ground as quickly, at all, and even today websites may still be requiring Adobe Flash for a video with 1/10th the longevity do to excessive power usage.

    2) The version of Adobe Flash that was suitable for mobile devices wasn't very capable and the videos on the "web" in 2007 pretty much wouldn't have been able to play most of them on iOS.
  • Reply 108 of 156

    Elon feels the heat a bit as he anticipates apple, google and others to swallow him soon

  • Reply 109 of 156

    Wait til the Feds find out that VW engineers moonlighted on telslas!

  • Reply 110 of 156
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

     
    Originally Posted by TechLover View Post

    I hope that if Apple is indeed making and electric vehicle that they use the industry standard charging port that is compatible with all of the existing charging stations.



    You know nothing whatsoever about Apple, do you. They’ll make their own port to which everyone else will switch, because it will be better, operationally, than anything on the market today. 


    I am not sure if you are joking or not.

     

    You left out the /s or the  <img class=" src="http://forums-files.appleinsider.com/images/smilies//lol.gif" />  or the  :rolleyes:  or the  :p  or the....

  • Reply 111 of 156
    solipsismy wrote: »

    1) It was only a "few years" because apple didn't include a shitty version of Adobe Flash on iOS! if they had, then HTML5 and other standards may not have gotten off the ground as quickly, at all, and even today websites may still be requiring Adobe Flash for a video with 1/10th the longevity do to excessive power usage.

    2) The version of Adobe Flash that was suitable for mobile devices wasn't very capable and the videos on the "web" in 2007 pretty much wouldn't have been able to play most of them on iOS.

    I think that unambiguously drawing the line on Flash was one of the boldest decisions SJ ever made. It displayed tremendous courage, because he ended up taking massive abuse for it.

    Yet, he remained steadfast, and was completely vindicated at the end.

    True leadership.
  • Reply 112 of 156
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post



    Here is the source. And considering Tim Cook is CEO I do believe what he thinks is relevant.



    http://www.mercurynews.com/business/ci_25250440/no-fireworks-at-apple-shareholders-meeting
    Quote:
    Some of Cook's comments came off a bit awkward. While he praised the new iPad Air as "really profound," he added that "when we looked at our first iPad, it looked great. But now when we look back at it, we're kind of embarrassed."



     

    Thanks for that article, from which I also read the following:

     

    [quote]

    "We want to grow more," he said, with a sly grin. "And this morning, we want to unveil some new products ..."

    It was reminiscent of the late Steve Jobs, who repeatedly would use lines like that just before hitting his product-launch audiences with some amazing new gadget. But after a pregnant pause, filled with an excited "Oooooohh" from the audience, Cook said: "I was kidding about that last part."

    The audience collectively groaned, to which Cook replied: "Hey, I gotta have some fun."[/quote]

     

    That's relevant, right?

     

  • Reply 113 of 156
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by tmay View Post

     

    Mirrors aren't an aerodynamic issue on cars, albeit at high speeds, they would absorb some HP output of the vehicle. This is an issue for cars on a track, not for anybody on public roads of any kind.

     


    I have no idea of the total "hit" mirrors have on drag, but have seen some wind tunnel tests where minor contouring can have significant change in the drag.  Plus, have seen where adding a small profusion can have a significant change to the profile.

     

    Not sure where you're getting your info on car performances and high speed, but I have observed over a 10% change in range when I drive the same route going 50 vs 60 mph - neither speed would be thought of as high speed.

     

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automobile_drag_coefficient#Side_mirrors

  • Reply 114 of 156
    tmaytmay Posts: 3,984member


    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Michael_C View Post

     

    I have no idea of the total "hit" mirrors have on drag, but have seen some wind tunnel tests where minor contouring can have significant change in the drag.  Plus, have seen where adding a small profusion can have a significant change to the profile.

     

    Not sure where you're getting your info on car performances and high speed, but I have observed over a 10% change in range when I drive the same route going 50 vs 60 mph - neither speed would be thought of as high speed.

     

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automobile_drag_coefficient#Side_mirrors


    1) The context was whether a well designed mirror would have much more drag than no mirror at all. I argue that it doesn't have matter in the context of the cross sectional area of the car against the small area of the mirrors.

     

    2) Aerodynamic drag is one of many factors in efficiency. Rolling resistance at those speeds is likely a bigger factor, but there are also mechanical systems that have inefficiencies that add up.

     

    The important thing to remember is that drag increases with the cube of the velocity:

     

    The equation for air drag (via http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dra... is 

    P = .5 * p * v^3 * A * Cd

  • Reply 115 of 156
    Originally Posted by TechLover View Post

    I am not sure if you are joking or not. You left out the /s or the  <img class=" src="http://forums-files.appleinsider.com/images/smilies//lol.gif" />  or the  :rolleyes:  or the  :p  or the....



    Yes! Sorry. Scatterbrained as of late; things aren’t going well. It was half joking/half serious. They might well use a ‘standard’ charger if they made a car, but knowing Apple I wouldn’t put it past them to come up with something proprietary that could charge their batteries 10x faster or something.

  • Reply 116 of 156
    I recall a former official for Verizon once saying something about what did Apple know about cell phones . Elon should have a talk with this guy.
  • Reply 117 of 156
    rogifanrogifan Posts: 10,669member
    philboogie wrote: »
    Thanks for that article, from which I also read the following:
    "We want to grow more," he said, with a sly grin. "And this morning, we want to unveil some new products ..."
    It was reminiscent of the late Steve Jobs, who repeatedly would use lines like that just before hitting his product-launch audiences with some amazing new gadget. But after a pregnant pause, filled with an excited "Oooooohh" from the audience, Cook said: "I was kidding about that last part."
    The audience collectively groaned, to which Cook replied: "Hey, I gotta have some fun."


    That's relevant, right?

    Cook said he was kidding about having new products to unveil. Not sure what that has to do with his iPad comment.
  • Reply 118 of 156
    rogifanrogifan Posts: 10,669member
    solipsismy wrote: »
    1) It was only a "few years" because apple didn't include a shitty version of Adobe Flash on iOS! if they had, then HTML5 and other standards may not have gotten off the ground as quickly, at all, and even today websites may still be requiring Adobe Flash for a video with 1/10th the longevity do to excessive power usage.

    2) The version of Adobe Flash that was suitable for mobile devices wasn't very capable and the videos on the "web" in 2007 pretty much wouldn't have been able to play most of them on iOS.

    I don't disagree with any of that. My point is I think it took several generations for iPad to really hit its stride (even though it took off sales wise faster than any other Apple product). I don't think any of this is unique to the Watch. Look at the 1st gen MacBook Air compared to what we have now. And like I said earlier I think the iPhone 3GS was the first really great iPhone. It could very well be the 3rd gen before Apple gets the Watch that the ultimately envisioned.
  • Reply 119 of 156
    tmaytmay Posts: 3,984member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post





    I don't disagree with any of that. My point is I think it took several generations for iPad to really hit its stride (even though it took off sales wise faster than any other Apple product). I don't think any of this is unique to the Watch. Look at the 1st gen MacBook Air compared to what we have now. And like I said earlier I think the iPhone 3GS was the first really great iPhone. It could very well be the 3rd gen before Apple gets the Watch that the ultimately envisioned.

    Likely true for any new product. No matter how you game it, the user and developers for the most part will decide how it will be used, and feedback from that will go into followup generations that Apple designs.

     

    I'm really looking forward to the iPad Pro. This is a product that will help define productivity and content creation on tablets, and unlike Surface, will create it from a mobile perspective, not from the desktop.

  • Reply 120 of 156
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by tmay View Post

     

    1) The context was whether a well designed mirror would have much more drag than no mirror at all. I argue that it doesn't have matter in the context of the cross sectional area of the car against the small area of the mirrors.

     

    2) Aerodynamic drag is one of many factors in efficiency. Rolling resistance at those speeds is likely a bigger factor, but there are also mechanical systems that have inefficiencies that add up.

     

    The important thing to remember is that drag increases with the cube of the velocity:

     

    The equation for air drag (via http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dra... is 

    P = .5 * p * v^3 * A * Cd


    As you said, the delta in cross sectional area with/without mirrors is not the entire picture.  This is not my area of expertise, however, looking at this as a cross sectional problem is too simplistic.  Tesla's air suspension and aero wheels have both been shown to improve range, and neither alter the cross section of the vehicle.

     

    I believe the issue on mirrors has more to do with turbulence and laminar flow, and this changes with varying speeds.

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