This whole thing has been a great advertisement for Apple. I briefly visited a few other forums that are usually not in favor of Apple and that are heavily populated by Fandroids, and most of them were in support of Apple's stance, with some of them going so far as to mentioning that they would now be getting iPhones.
I've been noticing that too. I read comments yesterday on news sites from around the world. Lots and lots of people were saying they will now buy an iPhone. On the flip side of that, pretty scary how many uneducated people are out there regarding this issue. I just shake my head reading the many comments of people saying "it's just one phone". They have no clue whatsoever.
Ridiculous short sighted paranoia ..
Unlocking a phone by a court order is not the same as a back door…. Or conpromising an activly encrypted phone when in use.
Plus
Government can search my home with the proper court order. The most privet place to me .
Government can tap my land line with court order. And has for decades with proper court order.
Government can confiscate my computets with proper court order and search the HD… ( iphone is a pocket computer )
This is not an either or case …… Its way more complex and consequential to just leave it in hands of dogmatic idealism .
Creat the proper provisions and everyone wins.
Times changes… so should we… … Thats fundimental to survival.
In the meanwhile apple is loving the Publicity .. ……. It may even all be by design …..(. After all its months we have been screaming for apple PR to wake up)..lol
What part of "Authoritarian governments including Russia and China will demand greater access to mobile data should Apple lose a watershed encryption case brought by the FBI" you don't understand?
Apple's
refusal to help with a terror investigation where 14 people were
butchered has erased my sympathy and appreciation for them. At this
point I am ready to see Tim Cook perp walked into a jail cell and am now
annoyed it has not yet been done.
What has been asked of them is
easy for Apple to do and would cost them nothing. The court has
directed that Apple be paid for its work. The court allowed that Apple
could contain the work to their own facility. The court order makes it
clear that the hack should be keyed to the phone's unique identity and
that it must not work on any other phone. If Apple has further concerns
over containing their modified OS they should propose additional
security safeguards. Be a part of the solution, haggle this thing out.
Not pull a Public Relations stunt, which is all this is truly about.
For example Apple could have proposed:
1. No network connectivity. Do the work on isolated, stand-alone computers.
2.
Isolation from cell tower and wi-fi signals. This can be done with
commercially available jammers or a Faraday cage room. Or both.
3. No viewing of the OS source code by non-Apple employees.
4. The phone leaves Apple facility only with the original OS and content restored, not with the altered OS.
5.
Apple makes it clear they will destroy the work when finished. They
should not do that, but they are behaving like spoiled brats so I expect
them to do this anyway.
The only reason Cook is not making such a
counter offer is because he does not want to be involved in solving
crimes. Not even if he is paid to do so. Because the world's troubles
are not Apple's concern, only PROFIT is Apple's concern.
Ridiculous short sighted paranoia ..
Unlocking a phone by a court order is not the same as a back door…. Or conpromising an activly encrypted phone when in use.
Plus
Government can search my home with the proper court order. The most privet place to me .
Government can tap my land line with court order. And has for decades with proper court order.
Government can confiscate my computets with proper court order and search the HD… ( iphone is a pocket computer )
This is not an either or case …… Its way more complex and consequential to just leave it in hands of dogmatic idealism .
Creat the proper provisions and everyone wins.
Times changes… so should we… … Thats fundimental to survival.
In the meanwhile apple is loving the Publicity .. ……. It may even all be by design …..(. After all its months we have been screaming for apple PR to wake up)..lol
What part of "Authoritarian governments including Russia and China will demand greater access to mobile data should Apple lose a watershed encryption case brought by the FBI" you don't understand?
What part of "Russia and China can that now or any time they want no matter what comes of this ruckus" do you not understand?
Apple's
refusal to help with a terror investigation where 14 people were
butchered has erased my sympathy and appreciation for them. At this
point I am ready to see Tim Cook perp walked into a jail cell and am now
annoyed it has not yet been done.
What has been asked of them is
easy for Apple to do and would cost them nothing. The court has
directed that Apple be paid for its work. The court allowed that Apple
could contain the work to their own facility. The court order makes it
clear that the hack should be keyed to the phone's unique identity and
that it must not work on any other phone. If Apple has further concerns
over containing their modified OS they should propose additional
security safeguards. Be a part of the solution, haggle this thing out.
Not pull a Public Relations stunt, which is all this is truly about.
For example Apple could have proposed:
1. No network connectivity. Do the work on isolated, stand-alone computers.
2.
Isolation from cell tower and wi-fi signals. This can be done with
commercially available jammers or a Faraday cage room. Or both.
3. No viewing of the OS source code by non-Apple employees.
4. The phone leaves Apple facility only with the original OS and content restored, not with the altered OS.
5.
Apple makes it clear they will destroy the work when finished. They
should not do that, but they are behaving like spoiled brats so I expect
them to do this anyway.
The only reason Cook is not making such a
counter offer is because he does not want to be involved in solving
crimes. Not even if he is paid to do so. Because the world's troubles
are not Apple's concern, only PROFIT is Apple's concern.
Your ignorance of the real issue in this case is pathetic. The issue is not whether or not it can be done (and Apple has not said that it can"t,) but whether or not it should be done. You cannot speak to Tim Cook's motivation for his response since your post makes it obvious you either have not read it, or you have wilfully misinterpreted it .
The emotions driving this question are no reason to throw out the principles upon which the constitution and its amendments were based. This is precisely the type of government behaviour that drove the founding fathers to escape British tyranny in the first place.
What part of "Authoritarian governments including Russia and China will demand greater access to mobile data should Apple lose a watershed encryption case brought by the FBI" you don't understand?
What part of "Russia and China can that now or any time they want no matter what comes of this ruckus" do you not understand?
And just how much more legitimacy will this give to China and Russia's request when it's already been achieved in a supposedly democratic country with constitutional protections for its citizenry?
Apple's
refusal to help with a terror investigation where 14 people were
butchered has erased my sympathy and appreciation for them. At this
point I am ready to see Tim Cook perp walked into a jail cell and am now
annoyed it has not yet been done.
What has been asked of them is
easy for Apple to do and would cost them nothing. The court has
directed that Apple be paid for its work. The court allowed that Apple
could contain the work to their own facility. The court order makes it
clear that the hack should be keyed to the phone's unique identity and
that it must not work on any other phone. If Apple has further concerns
over containing their modified OS they should propose additional
security safeguards. Be a part of the solution, haggle this thing out.
Not pull a Public Relations stunt, which is all this is truly about.
For example Apple could have proposed:
1. No network connectivity. Do the work on isolated, stand-alone computers.
2.
Isolation from cell tower and wi-fi signals. This can be done with
commercially available jammers or a Faraday cage room. Or both.
3. No viewing of the OS source code by non-Apple employees.
4. The phone leaves Apple facility only with the original OS and content restored, not with the altered OS.
5.
Apple makes it clear they will destroy the work when finished. They
should not do that, but they are behaving like spoiled brats so I expect
them to do this anyway.
The only reason Cook is not making such a
counter offer is because he does not want to be involved in solving
crimes. Not even if he is paid to do so. Because the world's troubles
are not Apple's concern, only PROFIT is Apple's concern.
You're either very naive or a troll. One the FBI gets that tool, there's no stopping them. First it's terrorism. Next, it'll be traffic violation.
A back door for one is a back door for all. What if the president authorizes a master key to all buildings but promised to use it on a specific house. It won't happen. Absolute power corrupts absolutely.
Because the world's troubles
are not Apple's concern, only PROFIT is Apple's concern.
You're saying that like it's a bad thing...
And there probably is some law that says that only certain people at certain ranks can have access to the evidence in the investigation. That would rule out anybody in Apple.
Sitting 1000s of miles away from USA, I can see the importance of Cook's refusal. I can't imagine how people sitting right between the cross-hairs cannot see it.
Ridiculous short sighted paranoia ..
Unlocking a phone by a court order is not the same as a back door…. Or conpromising an activly encrypted phone when in use.
Plus
Government can search my home with the proper court order. The most privet place to me .
Government can tap my land line with court order. And has for decades with proper court order.
Government can confiscate my computets with proper court order and search the HD… ( iphone is a pocket computer )
This is not an either or case …… Its way more complex and consequential to just leave it in hands of dogmatic idealism .
Creat the proper provisions and everyone wins.
Times changes… so should we… … Thats fundimental to survival.
In the meanwhile apple is loving the Publicity .. ……. It may even all be by design …..(. After all its months we have been screaming for apple PR to wake up)..lol
Of course it's a back door. It's not the software that breaks into the iPhone that is the back door, it's that court order that forces the phone maker to break into the phone that is the back door. Any time the FBI wants to access the data on an encrypted phone, they just get a court order for the phone maker to break into it or modify the security measure in order to access the data. That's a back door. And the court order becomes the master key that will give them access to the data on all phones.
This has nothing to do with the FBI rights to access the data in this iPhone, with a court order. It has to do with the FBI being able to force Apple to create the special software needed to access the data in this iPhone, with a court order. Apple is not the owner of the phone or the data in it. Apple don't even know if they can create the special software. Let alone successfully load it into a locked iPhone without first wiping it. So Apple don't really care if the FBI has a court order to access the data on this phone so long as they do it on their own, using their own resources. Apple shouldn't be forced to do the FBI job if it means compromising the security on all their iPhones. And if Apple can create software to break into an iPhone, then it won't be long before hackers can because they will know that's it's possible.
And just in case you don't know. If you are ever served with a search warrant, you don't have to voluntary give the police the key to a safe you have buried under the barbecue in your backyard. A safe that contains incriminating evidence. Or the password to your computer or phone. You are under no obligation to help the police search your home, looking for evidence that can be used against you. No court order can make you do that. And if you are not suspected or charged with a crime, the police should not be able to get a search warrant to search your home.
Alright, stay with me here. Why can't the FBI give Apple the phone, tell them...."Hey Apple, this is what we want." Apple does their thing behind closed doors without the FBI being involved at all, providing the required data, returning the phone back to the FBI in its exact state before they had it? In no way will the FBI be using a hacked back door. Can't they (Apple) just provide the data? I guess the thing everyone is hung up on is the precedent this would set for the gov to pull this many times. All they would have to do is site this case.
Plus if Apple were able to successfully access the data, then hackers would know that it's possible and soon N.Korea, China and Russia will be able to do the same. It is in the best interest for Apple to let the hackers of the World think that the encryption included in iOS 9 is so secure, that even programers at Apple can't break it.
Thanks I did it...it took two minutes thanks to your link. Also thanks DED for outing Henry Blodget's lack of journalistic credibility. And Nellie Bowles sounds like a tool.
Because the world's troubles
are not Apple's concern, only PROFIT is Apple's concern.
You're saying that like it's a bad thing...
And there probably is some law that says that only certain people at certain ranks can have access to the evidence in the investigation. That would rule out anybody in Apple.
Sitting 1000s of miles away from USA, I can see the imsportance of Cook's refusal. I can't imagine how people sitting right between the cross-hairs cannot see it.
For reasons of commerce, China has so far followed the U.S. lead wrt smartphone encryption. This is true for many other trading partners.
All that goes away if the FBI is successful in obtaining a backdoor.
Myself, terrorism on U.S. soil is the least of my concerns, and most of it is blowback from centuries of Western meddling in the Middle East and Southeast Asia. It's easy to imagine those wars in Syria, Iraq and Yemen spilling over into Turkey and Saudi Arabia. Perhaps all of those countries supporting terrorist elements in some form or another, including The United States, Russia, Israel, Lebanon, Turkey, Saudi Arabia, Iran, The UAE, Bahrain, and various other Arab and Western Nations would do better to stop throwing fuel on the fire, and concentrate on rolling back ISIS gains, which is fueling recruitment of more terrorists, including in North Africa.
While all of this is happening, the next superpower, China, is building out the infrastructure to connect South Asia with Northwestern China and Europe, ultimately constraining U.S. influence in the region.
Encryption or lack thereof of smartphones is having/will have minimal effect on terrorism. This is an FBI land grab.
Comments
https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/2714001/SB-Shooter-Order-Compelling-Apple-Asst-iPhone.pdf
Apple's refusal to help with a terror investigation where 14 people were butchered has erased my sympathy and appreciation for them. At this point I am ready to see Tim Cook perp walked into a jail cell and am now annoyed it has not yet been done.
What has been asked of them is easy for Apple to do and would cost them nothing. The court has directed that Apple be paid for its work. The court allowed that Apple could contain the work to their own facility. The court order makes it clear that the hack should be keyed to the phone's unique identity and that it must not work on any other phone. If Apple has further concerns over containing their modified OS they should propose additional security safeguards. Be a part of the solution, haggle this thing out. Not pull a Public Relations stunt, which is all this is truly about.
For example Apple could have proposed:
1. No network connectivity. Do the work on isolated, stand-alone computers.
2. Isolation from cell tower and wi-fi signals. This can be done with commercially available jammers or a Faraday cage room. Or both.
3. No viewing of the OS source code by non-Apple employees.
4. The phone leaves Apple facility only with the original OS and content restored, not with the altered OS.
5. Apple makes it clear they will destroy the work when finished. They should not do that, but they are behaving like spoiled brats so I expect them to do this anyway.
The only reason Cook is not making such a counter offer is because he does not want to be involved in solving crimes. Not even if he is paid to do so. Because the world's troubles are not Apple's concern, only PROFIT is Apple's concern.
The emotions driving this question are no reason to throw out the principles upon which the constitution and its amendments were based. This is precisely the type of government behaviour that drove the founding fathers to escape British tyranny in the first place.
A back door for one is a back door for all. What if the president authorizes a master key to all buildings but promised to use it on a specific house. It won't happen. Absolute power corrupts absolutely.
And there probably is some law that says that only certain people at certain ranks can have access to the evidence in the investigation. That would rule out anybody in Apple.
Sitting 1000s of miles away from USA, I can see the importance of Cook's refusal. I can't imagine how people sitting right between the cross-hairs cannot see it.
This has nothing to do with the FBI rights to access the data in this iPhone, with a court order. It has to do with the FBI being able to force Apple to create the special software needed to access the data in this iPhone, with a court order. Apple is not the owner of the phone or the data in it. Apple don't even know if they can create the special software. Let alone successfully load it into a locked iPhone without first wiping it. So Apple don't really care if the FBI has a court order to access the data on this phone so long as they do it on their own, using their own resources. Apple shouldn't be forced to do the FBI job if it means compromising the security on all their iPhones. And if Apple can create software to break into an iPhone, then it won't be long before hackers can because they will know that's it's possible.
And just in case you don't know. If you are ever served with a search warrant, you don't have to voluntary give the police the key to a safe you have buried under the barbecue in your backyard. A safe that contains incriminating evidence. Or the password to your computer or phone. You are under no obligation to help the police search your home, looking for evidence that can be used against you. No court order can make you do that. And if you are not suspected or charged with a crime, the police should not be able to get a search warrant to search your home.
Plus if Apple were able to successfully access the data, then hackers would know that it's possible and soon N.Korea, China and Russia will be able to do the same. It is in the best interest for Apple to let the hackers of the World think that the encryption included in iOS 9 is so secure, that even programers at Apple can't break it.
All that goes away if the FBI is successful in obtaining a backdoor.
Myself, terrorism on U.S. soil is the least of my concerns, and most of it is blowback from centuries of Western meddling in the Middle East and Southeast Asia. It's easy to imagine those wars in Syria, Iraq and Yemen spilling over into Turkey and Saudi Arabia. Perhaps all of those countries supporting terrorist elements in some form or another, including The United States, Russia, Israel, Lebanon, Turkey, Saudi Arabia, Iran, The UAE, Bahrain, and various other Arab and Western Nations would do better to stop throwing fuel on the fire, and concentrate on rolling back ISIS gains, which is fueling recruitment of more terrorists, including in North Africa.
While all of this is happening, the next superpower, China, is building out the infrastructure to connect South Asia with Northwestern China and Europe, ultimately constraining U.S. influence in the region.
Encryption or lack thereof of smartphones is having/will have minimal effect on terrorism. This is an FBI land grab.