This just in: increasingly corrupt national governments continue to engage in corruption. More at 11.
As opposed to corrupt corporations not paying tax, anywhere
And when Apple didn't pay the taxes asked and set by the irish goverment?
The trouble is Apple barely pays taxes anywhere. Forget Ireland, it's a US company, it should be paying tax there but instead it sets up an obscure corporate structure in multiple countries and non countries to dodge contributing to the society it functions in. Ignore for a second that it's Apple - do you believe corporations should be paying tax and therefore contributing to education, healthcare, the police, infrastructure, and the social system?
What i believe is that goverments should put in place clearly stated rules to avoid gaming the system in this way, Apple isn't the only company doing this, your comment implies an outrage tha capitalist companies take advantage of the tax system to maximize profit wich is the nature of every conpany, the anger should be focuse towards the goverment is as if you where getting angry to someone that punched you with your explicit permission, and not only that you are begging to be zunche. This is plain an simple gouging because someone didnt like the deal after they agreed on it.
I have two problems with what you say. If punching suddenly became legal, I wouldn't go around punching anyone and yes I would blame both the government and the people who decided they would take advantage of that new law. Second, clearly stated rules are very difficult to put in place when you have companies like Apple and Google willing to spend a fortune finding ways around the laws. It's whac-a-mole. Yes the US has allowed companies not to pay tax until it's repatriated but that isn't the issue, it's the tax avoidance on international operations by attributing profit to an international, stateless entity where no taxes are paid. The US will struggle to implement taxation laws to prevent it unless every country gets together and agrees, which will never happen. Corporations need to play their part too
You need to better educate yourself on tax laws. Your logic does not hold here, the blame belongs with the government they are the ones striking these deals to bring in jobs and such, why, the government know they make far more taxing individuals than a company. The average tax payer pay far more than anyone, you pay income tax, sales tax, property tax, school tax, local and state tax, and the list goes on and on. Companies generate jobs which bring income into the state or country which governments get to tax over and over as people spend money.
However, if you're upset with companies like Apple not paying their fair share you should also be upset with all the people from these states since they do not pay state income tax Alaska, Florida, Nevada, South Dakota, Texas, Washington, and Wyoming. Those people are not paying their fair share and I believe people in Alaska arre getting money from the state on profit from the oil sales.
You can not blame individual or companies who seek out places which the tax burden is the lowest. I do not see anyone especially liberals/socialist who think the government should do more for everyone trying to find ways to pay more taxes. I find more them hardly pay taxes because they do not make a whole lot of money nor are they interested in making money.
I won't claim to be completely familiar with US state income tax as I live in Europe but my guess is that the vast majority of individuals living in low tax states are there for reasons other than tax. Apple, Microsoft, Google, and Facebook are based in Ireland purely to avoid paying tax in the US. They aren't working within the system, they are working against it for their own benefit to the detriment of everyone else. You don't need to look too hard at their tax set ups to see that what they are doing is to the letter of the law, not the spirit. Google avoids paying VAT in many countries by selling advertising from abroad, at least Apple has a physical product and cannot avoid it but in terms of corporate tax, they are all as bad as each other.
Your view on liberals is probably quite US-centric. It's not uncommon in Europe for wealthy people to be left wing and prefer to see people getting healthcare and education. The right wingers tend to be poorer, anti-immigration types who think foreigners are the reason they don't get paid so much.
This just in: increasingly corrupt national governments continue to engage in corruption. More at 11.
As opposed to corrupt corporations not paying tax, anywhere
And when Apple didn't pay the taxes asked and set by the irish goverment?
The trouble is Apple barely pays taxes anywhere. Forget Ireland, it's a US company, it should be paying tax there but instead it sets up an obscure corporate structure in multiple countries and non countries to dodge contributing to the society it functions in. Ignore for a second that it's Apple - do you believe corporations should be paying tax and therefore contributing to education, healthcare, the police, infrastructure, and the social system?
What i believe is that goverments should put in place clearly stated rules to avoid gaming the system in this way, Apple isn't the only company doing this, your comment implies an outrage tha capitalist companies take advantage of the tax system to maximize profit wich is the nature of every conpany, the anger should be focuse towards the goverment is as if you where getting angry to someone that punched you with your explicit permission, and not only that you are begging to be zunche. This is plain an simple gouging because someone didnt like the deal after they agreed on it.
I have two problems with what you say. If punching suddenly became legal, I wouldn't go around punching anyone and yes I would blame both the government and the people who decided they would take advantage of that new law. Second, clearly stated rules are very difficult to put in place when you have companies like Apple and Google willing to spend a fortune finding ways around the laws. It's whac-a-mole. Yes the US has allowed companies not to pay tax until it's repatriated but that isn't the issue, it's the tax avoidance on international operations by attributing profit to an international, stateless entity where no taxes are paid. The US will struggle to implement taxation laws to prevent it unless every country gets together and agrees, which will never happen. Corporations need to play their part too
You need to better educate yourself on tax laws. Your logic does not hold here, the blame belongs with the government they are the ones striking these deals to bring in jobs and such, why, the government know they make far more taxing individuals than a company. The average tax payer pay far more than anyone, you pay income tax, sales tax, property tax, school tax, local and state tax, and the list goes on and on. Companies generate jobs which bring income into the state or country which governments get to tax over and over as people spend money.
However, if you're upset with companies like Apple not paying their fair share you should also be upset with all the people from these states since they do not pay state income tax Alaska, Florida, Nevada, South Dakota, Texas, Washington, and Wyoming. Those people are not paying their fair share and I believe people in Alaska arre getting money from the state on profit from the oil sales.
You can not blame individual or companies who seek out places which the tax burden is the lowest. I do not see anyone especially liberals/socialist who think the government should do more for everyone trying to find ways to pay more taxes. I find more them hardly pay taxes because they do not make a whole lot of money nor are they interested in making money.
I won't claim to be completely familiar with US state income tax as I live in Europe but my guess is that the vast majority of individuals living in low tax states are there for reasons other than tax. Apple, Microsoft, Google, and Facebook are based in Ireland purely to avoid paying tax in the US. They aren't working within the system, they are working against it for their own benefit to the detriment of everyone else. You don't need to look too hard at their tax set ups to see that what they are doing is to the letter of the law, not the spirit. Google avoids paying VAT in many countries by selling advertising from abroad, at least Apple has a physical product and cannot avoid it but in terms of corporate tax, they are all as bad as each other.
Your view on liberals is probably quite US-centric. It's not uncommon in Europe for wealthy people to be left wing and prefer to see people getting healthcare and education. The right wingers tend to be poorer, anti-immigration types who think foreigners are the reason they don't get paid so much.
Apple move headquarters to britian effective immediately!
20% corporation tax (12.5% in Ireland, even after backdating), and impending problems with access to the European market. Would be an unexpected move for Apple.
Doesn't take long after there's blood in the water for the sharks to start circling.
Which is funny considering that Apple hasn't and is unlikely to pay a sent of any of that $21bln I mean all these tax departments of all these countries are drooling pointlessly that dough behind safety glass, Tim will never let Apple just loose $21 bln with out a long blooded fight to the end, and more to the point Apple wouldn't be involved is such a fiendish scheme just to illegally bypass taxes, I'm aware business is business and shirt's strictly financial but IMO that's a little beneath Apple they are just too successes full to need such underhandedness.
I am not so sure about that.
The current sentiment in Europe is one of unfairness: big companies are evading taxes while smaller companies and private persons have to pay to full amount. The positive image Apple has up to now, has been hit by the tax news, the letter of Tim to the European consumer was perceived by the European press as arrogant and too far away from the truth, so it did not help. The image that Apple has with its customers is a vital element in
justifying the high price for Apple products. The longer this tax saga
continues the longer the image will be impacted and there will be a moment in future where Apple will prefer to settle because the negative image will start to jeopardize the sales figures
It all comes down to whether the EU can legally justify viewing transfer pricing as a form of competitive subsidy. There isn't really a precedent for that in prior EU rulings that fell under state-aid laws.
That would be the case if Apple transferred the European profits to the US, but Apple kept the European profits in Apple Sales International, as Irish company. That is the main reason why the EC made the claim that this is organized state aid
This just in: increasingly corrupt national governments continue to engage in corruption. More at 11.
As opposed to corrupt corporations not paying tax, anywhere
And when Apple didn't pay the taxes asked and set by the irish goverment?
The trouble is Apple barely pays taxes anywhere. Forget Ireland, it's a US company, it should be paying tax there but instead it sets up an obscure corporate structure in multiple countries and non countries to dodge contributing to the society it functions in. Ignore for a second that it's Apple - do you believe corporations should be paying tax and therefore contributing to education, healthcare, the police, infrastructure, and the social system?
What i believe is that goverments should put in place clearly stated rules to avoid gaming the system in this way, Apple isn't the only company doing this, your comment implies an outrage tha capitalist companies take advantage of the tax system to maximize profit wich is the nature of every conpany, the anger should be focuse towards the goverment is as if you where getting angry to someone that punched you with your explicit permission, and not only that you are begging to be zunche. This is plain an simple gouging because someone didnt like the deal after they agreed on it.
I have two problems with what you say. If punching suddenly became legal, I wouldn't go around punching anyone and yes I would blame both the government and the people who decided they would take advantage of that new law. Second, clearly stated rules are very difficult to put in place when you have companies like Apple and Google willing to spend a fortune finding ways around the laws. It's whac-a-mole. Yes the US has allowed companies not to pay tax until it's repatriated but that isn't the issue, it's the tax avoidance on international operations by attributing profit to an international, stateless entity where no taxes are paid. The US will struggle to implement taxation laws to prevent it unless every country gets together and agrees, which will never happen. Corporations need to play their part too
You need to better educate yourself on tax laws. Your logic does not hold here, the blame belongs with the government they are the ones striking these deals to bring in jobs and such, why, the government know they make far more taxing individuals than a company. The average tax payer pay far more than anyone, you pay income tax, sales tax, property tax, school tax, local and state tax, and the list goes on and on. Companies generate jobs which bring income into the state or country which governments get to tax over and over as people spend money.
However, if you're upset with companies like Apple not paying their fair share you should also be upset with all the people from these states since they do not pay state income tax Alaska, Florida, Nevada, South Dakota, Texas, Washington, and Wyoming. Those people are not paying their fair share and I believe people in Alaska arre getting money from the state on profit from the oil sales.
You can not blame individual or companies who seek out places which the tax burden is the lowest. I do not see anyone especially liberals/socialist who think the government should do more for everyone trying to find ways to pay more taxes. I find more them hardly pay taxes because they do not make a whole lot of money nor are they interested in making money.
I won't claim to be completely familiar with US state income tax as I live in Europe but my guess is that the vast majority of individuals living in low tax states are there for reasons other than tax. Apple, Microsoft, Google, and Facebook are based in Ireland purely to avoid paying tax in the US. They aren't working within the system, they are working against it for their own benefit to the detriment of everyone else. You don't need to look too hard at their tax set ups to see that what they are doing is to the letter of the law, not the spirit. Google avoids paying VAT in many countries by selling advertising from abroad, at least Apple has a physical product and cannot avoid it but in terms of corporate tax, they are all as bad as each other.
Your view on liberals is probably quite US-centric. It's not uncommon in Europe for wealthy people to be left wing and prefer to see people getting healthcare and education. The right wingers tend to be poorer, anti-immigration types who think foreigners are the reason they don't get paid so much.
Companies don't pay VAT, consumers pay VAT. Companies collect it on behalf of the government. Apart from some administrative burden, VAT is pretty neutral to companies
I won't claim to be completely familiar with US state income tax as I live in Europe but my guess is that the vast majority of individuals living in low tax states are there for reasons other than tax. Apple, Microsoft, Google, and Facebook are based in Ireland purely to avoid paying tax in the US. They aren't working within the system, they are working against it for their own benefit to the detriment of everyone else. You don't need to look too hard at their tax set ups to see that what they are doing is to the letter of the law, not the spirit. Google avoids paying VAT in many countries by selling advertising from abroad, at least Apple has a physical product and cannot avoid it but in terms of corporate tax, they are all as bad as each other.
Your view on liberals is probably quite US-centric. It's not uncommon in Europe for wealthy people to be left wing and prefer to see people getting healthcare and education. The right wingers tend to be poorer, anti-immigration types who think foreigners are the reason they don't get paid so much.
Companies don't pay VAT, consumers pay VAT. Companies collect it on behalf of the government. Apart from some administrative burden, VAT is pretty neutral to companies
If you don't charge your customers VAT but your competitors do, you can unfairly offer lower prices and the local market misses out on tax revenue. OnePlus I'm sure does it in Europe somehow. Google doesn't totally avoid it but pays VAT to Ireland instead of other European countries where it serves ads. No skin off the nose of the customer or Google but it is to the French tax payer
The usual round of handout-seekers have faithfully shown up, I see.
Hey, what's not to like about 'free' money? Screw scruples, principles, morals, decency,....
That describes the corporations well. Free access to developed markets on roads funded by others in cities kept ticking over by someone else. Sounds like a hand out for Apple
I won't claim to be completely familiar with US state income tax as I live in Europe but my guess is that the vast majority of individuals living in low tax states are there for reasons other than tax. Apple, Microsoft, Google, and Facebook are based in Ireland purely to avoid paying tax in the US. They aren't working within the system, they are working against it for their own benefit to the detriment of everyone else. You don't need to look too hard at their tax set ups to see that what they are doing is to the letter of the law, not the spirit. Google avoids paying VAT in many countries by selling advertising from abroad, at least Apple has a physical product and cannot avoid it but in terms of corporate tax, they are all as bad as each other.
Your view on liberals is probably quite US-centric. It's not uncommon in Europe for wealthy people to be left wing and prefer to see people getting healthcare and education. The right wingers tend to be poorer, anti-immigration types who think foreigners are the reason they don't get paid so much.
Companies don't pay VAT, consumers pay VAT. Companies collect it on behalf of the government. Apart from some administrative burden, VAT is pretty neutral to companies
If you don't charge your customers VAT but your competitors do, you can unfairly offer lower prices and the local market misses out on tax revenue. OnePlus I'm sure does it in Europe somehow. Google doesn't totally avoid it but pays VAT to Ireland instead of other European countries where it serves ads. No skin off the nose of the customer or Google but it is to the French tax payer
And, of course, all European iTunes purchases are delivered by a Luxembourg SARL, so Apple pay very low VAT on digital goods.
This just in: increasingly corrupt national governments continue to engage in corruption. More at 11.
As opposed to corrupt corporations not paying tax, anywhere
And when Apple didn't pay the taxes asked and set by the irish goverment?
The trouble is Apple barely pays taxes anywhere. Forget Ireland, it's a US company, it should be paying tax there but instead it sets up an obscure corporate structure in multiple countries and non countries to dodge contributing to the society it functions in. Ignore for a second that it's Apple - do you believe corporations should be paying tax and therefore contributing to education, healthcare, the police, infrastructure, and the social system?
Apple pays a lot of taxes already. Their average rate in the world is 25%. Last year they paid close to 10 billion USD. So your statement "Apple barely pays taxes anywhere" is at least a misrepresentation of information. So, stop lying. Or get your facts straight.
Apple Le has contributed to,the society more than you will be even able to comprehend. If you want to,contribute to the society more, tell us how much tax (in percentage) have you been paying? And now let's increase it by 50%. With this we will give you a great opportunity to contribute to educati N, healthcare, the police, infrastructure, and the social system (whatever you mean by that). Why are you not paying more taxes than you should do? You should. This is the spirit of tax system.
This just in: increasingly corrupt national governments continue to engage in corruption. More at 11.
As opposed to corrupt corporations not paying tax, anywhere
Morals don't come into it, Apple is not outside the law they are paying taxes agreed on by all parties. If this is not good enough then the law needs to be changed. People or companies that pay more tax than they are legally required to do you can count on the fingers of one hand.
Because sticking to the letter of the law is always the best thing for corporations to do? By that logic, Apple should be pillaging the environment because it makes financial sense. Or do you think their green policies are just good marketing?
Do you stick to the letter of the law when you pay taxes and only pay the exact amount your are required to do so? Do you do that and then decide to do give to a local charity even though it isn't required?
Welcome to thinking like Apple and other corporations then. Surprise!
This just in: increasingly corrupt national governments continue to engage in corruption. More at 11.
As opposed to corrupt corporations not paying tax, anywhere
franklinjackcon do you pay more taxes than the government requires?? I am sure you don't so why don't you SHUT UP!!!
I can assure you that i have not set up subsidiaries around the world to reduce my tax bill in the country I work/live/enjoy social services and if I had, and the tax man came knocking, I wouldn't be trying to claim it's an acceptable business practice.
Is there any law about doing that I think not what you say holds no water so now it is time to SHUT UP AND GO AWAY!!!
Comments
Your view on liberals is probably quite US-centric. It's not uncommon in Europe for wealthy people to be left wing and prefer to see people getting healthcare and education. The right wingers tend to be poorer, anti-immigration types who think foreigners are the reason they don't get paid so much.
Hey, what's not to like about 'free' money? Screw scruples, principles, morals, decency,....
The current sentiment in Europe is one of unfairness: big companies are evading taxes while smaller companies and private persons have to pay to full amount. The positive image Apple has up to now, has been hit by the tax news, the letter of Tim to the European consumer was perceived by the European press as arrogant and too far away from the truth, so it did not help.
The image that Apple has with its customers is a vital element in justifying the high price for Apple products. The longer this tax saga continues the longer the image will be impacted and there will be a moment in future where Apple will prefer to settle because the negative image will start to jeopardize the sales figures
So your statement "Apple barely pays taxes anywhere" is at least a misrepresentation of information. So, stop lying.
Or get your facts straight.
Apple Le has contributed to,the society more than you will be even able to comprehend. If you want to,contribute to the society more, tell us how much tax (in percentage) have you been paying? And now let's increase it by 50%. With this we will give you a great opportunity to contribute to educati N, healthcare, the police, infrastructure, and the social system (whatever you mean by that).
Why are you not paying more taxes than you should do? You should. This is the spirit of tax system.
Welcome to thinking like Apple and other corporations then. Surprise!