Pundits believe Apple's Jony Ive no longer involved in iPhone, Mac product design [u]

245678

Comments

  • Reply 21 of 146
    sog35 said:
    Good news if true.

    Ive had his day.

    Its pretty obvious by recent designs that Ive is bored, fat, lazy, and not motivated.

    We need new leadership that is exicted, hungry, and willing to take risks.

    Few examples of design that is below the Apple standard:

    1. Same iPhone shell for 3 years. Unacceptable. Even cheap POS China companies come out with yearly shell changes.



    2. Mouse. 



    3. Pencil



    4. Battery case



    5. Smartkey board, non flush design



    6. Camera bump & ugly antenna lines



    These may seem like nitpicking. Small details. But that was what made Apple great. The details.


    You're right. The poor chap has gone completely off his rocker. Get him a bed next to Kanye. 
    rhinotuffSpamSandwichmacxpressmazda 3sentropys
  • Reply 22 of 146
    "A gentle gathering"...Ive is such a pretentious nob.
    dysamoriaentropys
  • Reply 23 of 146
    sockrolidsockrolid Posts: 2,788member
    Ive probably finished the next 4 or 5 generations of iPhone / iPad / Watch / Mac designs years ago.
    Might as well expand his horizons and learn new things about design.  I certainly would.

    Also, we're headed towards "Her"-like future-computing. (1) Just one or two AirPods and a simple
    screen+cam in the pocket for occasional image+video viewing and capture.
    Same with the desktop.  Far simpler hardware and visual design, with far more voice in the user experience.
    All of which means less kvetching about color theory and The Golden Ratio (tm) in design.

    And this shift toward voice UX won't necessarily lead to buses / trains / offices full of people shouting at their devices.
    You can whisper to Siri.  Try it.

    1. "Her", 2013, Spike Jones dir., starring Joaquin Phoenix, Amy Adams, Scarlett Johansson http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1798709/ 
    edited November 2016 robin huberpscooter63
  • Reply 24 of 146
    asdasd said:
    The loss of Jobs and Ive ( who were like Lennon and McCartney better as a team) is potentially a big blow. 


    I agree, IMO -- they were a good team, also with Scott Forestall they all called BS to each other stupid ideas... no Ayn Rand here.  Individually or without each other--- just not the same cream coming to the top.

    And just to beat the crap out of this dead-horse and stomp on the carcass --- no head phone jack on iphone 7--- meh you don't need it or use a dongle/wireless--- but leaving it in the new MacBook Air... um Pro -- oh umm... the Audio Pro's cant use a 'dongle';  reeks of BS to me.

    Not saying Steve would have done differently than above(Id like to think so), but Steve Jobs was famous for sweating details and calling people up on Sunday afternoon or middle of the night to 'fix it'...

    Is there team there like these guys and is anyone at Apple doing that kind of sweating of details and can force changes?

    edited November 2016 asdasddysamoriaentropys
  • Reply 25 of 146
    Apple is a consumer product company first and a tech company second. For the most part their products are well made and still live on longer than expected especially in comparison to their competitor's. How and why do people still "upgrade" perfectly functioning iPhones? To get the lasted fashion statement not so much to press a button that is no longer a button, or take photo's which mimic a depth of field effect. Ive's work for the most part has been outstanding, it would not be so copied if it wasn't. The one big problem with adhering to the ideology of minimalism there comes a time when reduction of form creates a more complex function. Look at the vast amount of items in the iOS preferences, they go on forever. The opening free iPhone today runs an operating system which baroque in its complexity compared to its earlier self. For me we are back at the time or writing commands compared to point and click. 
    gatorguynubusration alpscooter63
  • Reply 26 of 146
    appexappex Posts: 687member
    There is something much more important than plain design: functionality. Sometimes Apple forgets that For instance, back ports on Mac instead of much useful frontal ones, lack of disk and CPU activity lights on Mac, misleading black screen while shutting down Mac not yet turned off (imagine catastrophic effects when unplugging external booting disk in a hurry), lack of matte display as previously available, lack of power button on keyboard as was previously possible, etc.
  • Reply 27 of 146
    boeyc15 said:

     no head phone jack on iphone 7--- meh you don't need it or use a dongle/wireless--- but leaving it in the new MacBook Air... um Pro -- oh umm... the Audio Pro's cant use a 'dongle';  reeks of BS to me.

    Not saying Steve would have done differently that above(Id like to think so), but Steve Jobs was famous for sweating details and calling people up on Sunday afternoon or middle of the night to 'fix it'... is anyone at Apple doing that kind of sweating and that force changes?

    Because in iPhone 7 (and their next portables, like maybe future iPod Shuffle) every nanometer counts! And in the MacBook it simply doesnt. Get it?

    And it amazes me how many people know about Jobs private working habits and how it has suddenly changed.
    randominternetpersonration alwatto_cobra
  • Reply 28 of 146
    sog35 said:
    Good news if true.

    Ive had his day.

    Its pretty obvious by recent designs that Ive is bored, fat, lazy, and not motivated.

    We need new leadership that is exicted, hungry, and willing to take risks.

    Few examples of design that is below the Apple standard:

    1. Same iPhone shell for 3 years. Unacceptable. Even cheap POS China companies come out with yearly shell changes.



    2. Mouse. 



    3. Pencil



    4. Battery case



    5. Smartkey board, non flush design



    6. Camera bump & ugly antenna lines



    These may seem like nitpicking. Small details. But that was what made Apple great. The details.


    You're right, they'd never add a bulky add-on:


    Or something aesthetically unappealing:


    Or the fact that a large number of their products go multiple years without a dramatic design change.  I know, I know, that's not what you're used to with the iPhone.  Does the 7 work? Does it kick ass? Yes and yes.  Does it need to look drastically different because I'm a shallow POS that needs everyone to be jealous of what device I have?  No (at least not for me).

    What you fear or hate would be considered by most to be risks, which is exactly what you want.  Bring on the iToaster and iTV sets of the world, SOG wants to see Apple produce everything in your daily life, if nothing else so that his stock price can go up .20 a share.


    singularitySolinetmagewatto_cobra
  • Reply 29 of 146
    I believe Apple made Ive not the other way.  Same with many of the other executives riding what Steve Jobs started.
    dysamoria
  • Reply 30 of 146
    sockrolid said:
    Ive probably finished the next 4 or 5 generations of iPhone / iPad / Watch / Mac designs years ago.
    Might as well expand his horizons and learn new things about design.  I certainly would.

    Also, we're headed towards "Her"-like future-computing. (1) Just one or two AirPods and a simple
    screen+cam in the pocket for occasional image+video viewing and capture.
    Same with the desktop.  Far simpler hardware and visual design, with far more voice in the user experience.
    All of which means less kvetching about color theory and The Golden Ratio (tm) in design.

    And this shift toward voice UX won't necessarily lead to buses / trains / offices full of people shouting at their devices.
    You can whisper to Siri.  Try it.

    1. "Her", 2013, Spike Jones dir., starring Joaquin Phoenix, Amy Adams, Scarlett Johansson http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1798709/ 
    Spot on. I've been thinking this for a while now. The more natural the UI the better. There is nothing natural about keyboard input. It's a generational thing. I (age 70) learned to expand my Siri inputs from my son (age 39). 
  • Reply 31 of 146
    gatorguygatorguy Posts: 20,032member
    sockrolid said:
    Ive probably finished the next 4 or 5 generations of iPhone / iPad / Watch / Mac designs years ago.
    Might as well expand his horizons and learn new things about design.  I certainly would.

    Also, we're headed towards "Her"-like future-computing. (1) Just one or two AirPods and a simple
    screen+cam in the pocket for occasional image+video viewing and capture.
    Same with the desktop.  Far simpler hardware and visual design, with far more voice in the user experience.
    All of which means less kvetching about color theory and The Golden Ratio (tm) in design.

    And this shift toward voice UX won't necessarily lead to buses / trains / offices full of people shouting at their devices.
    You can whisper to Siri.  Try it.

    1. "Her", 2013, Spike Jones dir., starring Joaquin Phoenix, Amy Adams, Scarlett Johansson http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1798709/ 
    Spot on. I've been thinking this for a while now. The more natural the UI the better. There is nothing natural about keyboard input. It's a generational thing. I (age 70) learned to expand my Siri inputs from my son (age 39). 
    I rarely, in fact almost never, use my smartphone keyboard. I open apps, do searches, set alarms, initiate phone calls, send texts and use navigation all by voice. I really dislike keyboards whether virtual or physical, just too slow for me, and have become pretty proficient with voice controls and input.
    edited November 2016
  • Reply 32 of 146
    I heard that Samsung lead designer started doing the same 2 minutes after this article showed up...
    Rayz2016watto_cobra
  • Reply 33 of 146
    avon b7avon b7 Posts: 3,318member
    sog35 said:
    Good news if true.

    Ive had his day.

    Its pretty obvious by recent designs that Ive is bored, fat, lazy, and not motivated.

    We need new leadership that is exicted, hungry, and willing to take risks.

    Few examples of design that is below the Apple standard:

    1. Same iPhone shell for 3 years. Unacceptable. Even cheap POS China companies come out with yearly shell changes.



    2. Mouse. 



    3. Pencil



    4. Battery case



    5. Smartkey board, non flush design



    6. Camera bump & ugly antenna lines



    These may seem like nitpicking. Small details. But that was what made Apple great. The details.


    That is a nice summary of recent disasters. I agree that design at Apple is past it's best. The trash can Mac Pro wasn't innovation at all, it was an exercise is doing something different - for the sake of doing something different.

    They had honed the Mac Pro very well then released an abomination.

    They spent nearly two years getting the plastics right for the Flower Power and Dalmatian iMacs. Then they died a death

    Sunflower iMac? It went away never to be seen again.

    The Cube was another example of doing something different for the sake of it. It never came back either (not even when aluminium became all the rage)

    Hockey Puck mouse?

    Always white cables for iDevices?

    Is the front of the phone the best place for the fingerprint sensor? 

    Etc.

    Then you have the things they took away. The little practical details. Taking the power button off the keyboard. Or the little but not practical things like the illuminated Apple logo.

    In the quest for thinness we lost accessibility. We lost the option for user upgrading of RAM and storage. We got glued on batteries instead. We lost a decent keyboard and got a hard, loud one instead. With keys so thin that they feel cheap. On the machine I tried for a long while, the space bar wobbled BUT it was optically 'cleaner'. Much less light bleeding through the keys. I hated it but I mean absolutely hated it. Then people will say 'you'll get used to it'. That's not the issue. The question is: what was wrong about the old one? The answer is nothing, but to reach the size they wanted it was the only way to go.

    Can someone tell me why I need to take off the screen to change a hard drive on an iMac if the result is 20 minutes to replace the drive and an extra 30 making sure the screen and glass cover are dust free. And why the special dust removing kit is even exists? Was it really two much to design access from the rear?

    Why did iMacs get thinner (and thermally compromised) if they are rarely moved and almost always looked at front on. Just so you Can admire their thinness at the store?

    Why can't iDevices have microSD support?

    Why can't my wife Bluetooth a file directly to another device. Why is AirDrop so flaky?

    On the MacOS/iOS front, why is the design so unintuitive? Shake to undo? Hold down the refresh but to to load the desktop version of a page? I challenge any user to figure out how to bring up an email draft with out help.

    Why are there no arrow keys on the keyboard? Why are certain interface elements almost microscopic? Close tab in Safari, for example.

    Why did OSX on an Air have zero colour contrasting on key interface elements (sidebar contents).

    How did they manage to bloat iTunes so much and royally screw up the interface so often?

    Why is it that whenever Apple touches cloud computing it screws up so much. iCloud is STILL the worst cloud service to trust your documents to?

    Lots of great design but lots of trash design too.

    Lots of hideous design in the interfaces of both iOS and Mac OSX. Bad design that also goes against Apple's own thinking.

    So what's happening? Millions are being spent on store re-fits to make what was already a decent (if utterly boring) design more hip!




    edited November 2016 gatorguysingularitydysamoria
  • Reply 34 of 146
    Gorecki said:


    1. Same iPhone shell for 3 years. Unacceptable.

    ...

    These may seem like nitpicking. Small details. But that was what made Apple great. The details.


    You are completely clueless when it comes to industrial design.

    1. Try new glasses when you see no difference. And no, the competition doesnt come out with new designs every year.

    2. Its the best place for occasional charging without spoiling the clean design. What is your (better) idea? Please, let us know.

    3. Again, the same argument. What is your (better) idea? Please, let us know.

    4. The battery is most effective when bulky. This design doesnt make the phone bulky. It fits ergonomically into your palm. Have you ever used one of those thick but "flushed" battery cases from competition?
    This looks slim just like with regular rubber case when placed on the table or from most angles. And is very easy to put on and off.

    5. Again, this is the compromise with the best usability and quality of the keyboard. You would like to have the nonkeyboard part the same thickness only to look flush?? What is your (better) idea? Please, let us know.

    6. Camera bumps - you can find them on many phones and there is a reason for it. When you manage to brake the rules of physics, please, let us know.

    Yes, these are small details, nitpicking. But it only proves, that Apple did think about those designs more than you ever did and they did it not only from the primitive perspective of how it looks, like you did, but how it works and how it is used!

    Exactly. Those are all excellent designs (with the possible exception of the battery case being open to subjective judgment). sog is just, as usual, impulsively regurgitating dumb shit he saw on the internet posted by idiots/trolls because he's upset about the stock price. sog would be one of those people that, if Apple made a mouse that was able to be plugged in while using it, would just leave the cord in indefinitely.

    It makes sense (as sockrolid said) that as these industrial designs reach their simpler, logical conclusions, that there is much less designing that needs to be done. I just started going through the design book last night, and those early designs, with the constraints of the limited technology of the time, yielded some very interesting and intriguing results. The designs of Apple's current products are inevitably, as they should, going to get more boring. So, I'm glad to hear Ive is exploring other areas, including architecture (some of the recent stores look really amazing). I hope Apple continues to expand their product portfolio though, and look for other ways to influence the world with their design ethos and integrity. And I hope they take on challenging products that result in some exciting designs along the way.

    randominternetpersonwatto_cobra
  • Reply 35 of 146
    asdasdasdasd Posts: 5,233member
    sockrolid said:
    Ive probably finished the next 4 or 5 generations of iPhone / iPad / Watch / Mac designs years ago.
    Might as well expand his horizons and learn new things about design.  I certainly would.

    Also, we're headed towards "Her"-like future-computing. (1) Just one or two AirPods and a simple
    screen+cam in the pocket for occasional image+video viewing and capture.
    Same with the desktop.  Far simpler hardware and visual design, with far more voice in the user experience.
    All of which means less kvetching about color theory and The Golden Ratio (tm) in design.

    And this shift toward voice UX won't necessarily lead to buses / trains / offices full of people shouting at their devices.
    You can whisper to Siri.  Try it.

    1. "Her", 2013, Spike Jones dir., starring Joaquin Phoenix, Amy Adams, Scarlett Johansson http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1798709/ 
    Spot on. I've been thinking this for a while now. The more natural the UI the better. There is nothing natural about keyboard input. It's a generational thing. I (age 70) learned to expand my Siri inputs from my son (age 39). 
    Voice control needs to be a whole lot better to replace touch. Nor is it true that it's a natural progression from voice to touch. By and large humans use their hands to work tools. 
    randominternetpersondysamoria
  • Reply 36 of 146
    aplnubaplnub Posts: 2,584member
    Is Gruber reporting on tech again or still railing about the election?
    SpamSandwichpatchythepirateentropysnetmage
  • Reply 37 of 146
    wdowell said:
    Makes sense.

    The next iphone - in terms of design - is basically a year late, for technical reasons, but the design will have been locked down since at least september. iOS ovehall is done, Mac - well, they didnt really do that. So yea, what do you think he's doing?  The rumoured on-off car - there must have been a design for that.  The rest, basically is iterative and he has a solid team.

    For what it's worth i dont thnk Ive will ever actaully 'leave' apple. He'll just sort of stay on nominally.
    I agree w/ all that. I'm thinking he's pleased w/ the form factors across the product line.

    Cook's ending at the last Keynote was impressive. Saying, Apple, going into the Holiday's, with it's strongest product offerings ever. The Apple Watch series, iPad Pro's, MacBooks, MacBook Pro's and iPhone 7's all with iOS 10 and Sierra. Just a fantastic amount of hard work and skill. Well done!

    watto_cobra
  • Reply 38 of 146
    gatorguygatorguy Posts: 20,032member
    asdasd said:
    sockrolid said:
    Ive probably finished the next 4 or 5 generations of iPhone / iPad / Watch / Mac designs years ago.
    Might as well expand his horizons and learn new things about design.  I certainly would.

    Also, we're headed towards "Her"-like future-computing. (1) Just one or two AirPods and a simple
    screen+cam in the pocket for occasional image+video viewing and capture.
    Same with the desktop.  Far simpler hardware and visual design, with far more voice in the user experience.
    All of which means less kvetching about color theory and The Golden Ratio (tm) in design.

    And this shift toward voice UX won't necessarily lead to buses / trains / offices full of people shouting at their devices.
    You can whisper to Siri.  Try it.

    1. "Her", 2013, Spike Jones dir., starring Joaquin Phoenix, Amy Adams, Scarlett Johansson http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1798709/ 
    Spot on. I've been thinking this for a while now. The more natural the UI the better. There is nothing natural about keyboard input. It's a generational thing. I (age 70) learned to expand my Siri inputs from my son (age 39). 
    Voice control needs to be a whole lot better to replace touch. Nor is it true that it's a natural progression from voice to touch. By and large humans use their hands to work tools. 
    Personally I don't have much issue with voice control. For me it's much easier than using the keyboard for tasks like search or texting. No need for me to even touch the screen to initiate it unless the screen is locked
  • Reply 39 of 146
    Gorecki said:


    1. Same iPhone shell for 3 years. Unacceptable. Even cheap POS China companies come out with yearly shell changes.



    2. Mouse. 



    3. Pencil



    4. Battery case



    5. Smartkey board, non flush design



    6. Camera bump & ugly antenna lines



    These may seem like nitpicking. Small details. But that was what made Apple great. The details.


    You are completely clueless when it comes to industrial design.

    1. Try new glasses when you see no difference. And no, the competition doesnt come out with new designs every year.

    2. Its the best place for occasional charging without spoiling the clean design. What is your (better) idea? Please, let us know.

    3. Again, the same argument. What is your (better) idea? Please, let us know.

    4. The battery is most effective when bulky. This design doesnt make the phone bulky. It fits ergonomically into your palm. Have you ever used one of those thick but "flushed" battery cases from competition?
    This looks slim just like with regular rubber case when placed on the table or from most angles. And is very easy to put on and off.

    5. Again, this is the compromise with the best usability and quality of the keyboard. You would like to have the nonkeyboard part the same thickness only to look flush?? What is your (better) idea? Please, let us know.

    6. Camera bumps - you can find them on many phones and there is a reason for it. When you manage to brake the rules of physics, please, let us know.

    Yes, these are small details, nitpicking. But it only proves, that Apple did think about those designs more than you ever did and they did it not only from the primitive perspective of how it looks, like you did, but how it works and how it is used!
    Ive has been overrated for years. From stupid OS interface changes to the mouse charging design Ive has been hit-or-miss. You keep asking, "What is your better idea," admitting the dicey design choices. You know what Jobs would have said? "FIGURE IT OUT!"
    dysamoria
  • Reply 40 of 146
    How is this news? Hasn't it been well documented that Richard Howarth runs ID and Alan Dye took over UI, so Ive could work on bigger picture stuff like stores (and car and door handles at the UFO etc). This all happened Spring 2015 and was very widely reported on, including interviews and profiles of the new heads of design, etc. 

    http://appleinsider.com/articles/15/05/25/apples-jony-ive-promoted-to-chief-design-officer-to-work-on-apple-stores

    Time is a flat circle. 
    edited November 2016 randominternetpersongoodbyeranchration aldysamorianetmage
Sign In or Register to comment.