k2kw said: [...] Does anyone know if homePod will support Hi-Res Audio?
It's got a tiny little woofer in a tiny little enclosure... It's got -- at best -- a little Class D amp... It uses an array of tweeters doing all kind of phasing lunacy to create an artificial sense of space and directionality... The signal is modulated into a radio wave for transmission to the device...
...and your concern is the sample rate of the source file?
Whether or not it supports hi-res doesn't even make the Top Ten list of things that will affect the listening experience.
Survey finds that people prefer a device that:- 1) Is advertised heavily 24/7 2) Is available 3) Is cheap (for a reason)
over one that 1) Is not available 2) Has not been advertised 3) Is expensive (for a reason)
Surprised? Is the Pope a Catholic.
The company that did this already knew the answers before they started. Not worth a bent penny but the market will take note and mark APPL stock down as a result. Sheesh some people.
Disclaimer, I'm not in the market for or likely to buy any of these things.
Like some posters here have suspected (and a few other tech bloggers), the Siri we get on the speaker is going to be very different from the one on the phone. I think a combination of improvements in the neural network + client-side processing + better analysis of dark data combined with differential privacy will provide a quantum leap in Siri capabilities.
6 months for Apple to get Siri to where it has to be for a smart speaker, followed by iterative improvements as it rolls out to other markets.
The only real downside of the HomePod and what puts me off a bit is its dependance on Siri. I asked Siri on my Mac the other day simply...How old is Lynda Carter (multiple times!) and it didn't even understand that correctly! (and I have a well modulated English accent) With Google Now no problem at all! Siri continues to be crap, I'm sorry. I'd also of liked the HomePod to incorporate a couple of audio in/out ports of some kind like many other wireless speakers do, but I don't think it does.
Like some posters here have suspected (and a few other tech bloggers), the Siri we get on the speaker is going to be very different from the one on the phone. I think a combination of improvements in the neural network + client-side processing + better analysis of dark data combined with differential privacy will provide a quantum leap in Siri capabilities.
6 months for Apple to get Siri to where it has to be for a smart speaker, followed by iterative improvements as it rolls out to other markets.
It has to be different by design since there's no display for displaying data, like on the iPhone. But this doesn't mean that the core Siri brain will be different from what other Apple devices are accessing on the backend.
Also, I've been saying for years that Alexa's brilliance in comparison to Siri probably stems from the far-field microphones making initial comprehension better, which reduces a huge amount of the stress and frustration associated with Siri.
the resident Googler is out running around shitting false information again, ffs.
Rather than vaguely making it sound like you might know something be more direct and point out what that person posted that's false. We should all strive to post accurate info and encourage correction of it when it isn't, right?
(EDIT: Crickets....)
Forgive me if bedtime takes priority over your false claim that Google isn't selling away your privacy, we've been through this before and you never responded to my posts detailing how you are so totally wrong about Google. Most here already know how silly your insistence about Google is (certainly, though, it's really doubtful they come here to hear them, but hey, it's the blogosphere and negative nellies and corporate shills take the place alongside people actually wanting to engage in an honest discussion of Apple products).
The bigger irony here is the post directly below yours addressed your false claims, which you also ignored.
Mark Gurman has a video out where he ponders if Apple did not tell us everything bc they are waiting for the iPhone 8 release...he feels they might have something in the speaker that is capable of doing near field charging of devices
While it could be a good idea, if that sub is as good as they claim then the phone would bounce off the top surely at high volumes.
the resident Googler is out running around shitting false information again, ffs.
Rather than vaguely making it sound like you might know something be more direct and point out what that person posted that's false. We should all strive to post accurate info and encourage correction of it when it isn't, right?
(EDIT: Crickets....)
Forgive me if bedtime take priority over your false claim that Google isn't selling away your privacy, we've been through this before and you never responded to my posts detailing how you are so totally wrong about Google. Most here already know how silly your insistence about Google is (certainly, though, it's really doubtful they come here to hear them, but hey, it's the blogosphere and negative nellies and corporate shills take the place alongside people actually wanting to engage in an honest discussion of Apple products).
The bigger irony here is the post directly below addressed your false claims, which you also ignored.
You kind of hit on his 'Raison D'Etre' there very well.
So, people will buy cheaper product even though they'd actually buy the more expensive one if they had the money to do so... Well, aint that surprising (sic).
Isn't that the whole reason why people buy Android phones?
Apple is aspirational, sadly not everyone gets one; but they wish they could...
Price is one reason some people might buy a specific Android phone. For others could be the perceived barriers to switching. People that years ago started using Android because they had bigger screens or Swype keyboards might not want to switch. Other reasons could be screen/body ratio, screen size, OLED screen, camera, Assistant, NFC for banks, design. Some people just don't like Apple as a corporation. Your reasons for buying a product aren't always the same as for everyone else.
For the speaker - I'd almost consider buying it but it seems likely it's limited by not having Spotify support (yet)
the resident Googler is out running around shitting false information again, ffs.
Rather than vaguely making it sound like you might know something be more direct and point out what that person posted that's false. We should all strive to post accurate info and encourage correction of it when it isn't, right?
(EDIT: Crickets....)
Forgive me if bedtime take priority over your false claim that Google isn't selling away your privacy, we've been through this before and you never responded to my posts detailing how you are so totally wrong about Google. Most here already know how silly your insistence about Google is (certainly, though, it's really doubtful they come here to hear them, but hey, it's the blogosphere and negative nellies and corporate shills take the place alongside people actually wanting to engage in an honest discussion of Apple products).
The bigger irony here is the post directly below addressed your false claims, which you also ignored.
MY false claims? Hardly. None of the home assistants are "listening" for anything but the keyword it was programmed to recognize, exactly as I said. But you want to claim that some of these Home Assistants are listening and transcribing your conversations with the kids about their school-day and recording your love-making in the bedroom and that I'm lying about these evil deeds going on? LOL.
That yet another poster would like to tell everyone they're always recording and transcribing everything said in your home is what is false and the very epitome of FUD, but that's what your accusation of me posting falsehoods is based on? If not just what is you DO believe about Home Assistants and when and what they're listening to?
My take won't be popular here, but I'll say it anyhow:
1) To date all voice assistants leave a lot to be lacking. So if they all suck, why spend more? 2) Once it comes out, a true Echo vs AirPod comparison will be more even. Right now one exists the other doesn't. 3) I think the demand for Echo dots is much greater than Echo, and people are probably interchanging those two when asked to consider "echo" vs airpod 4) If I want a top end speaker then I'll buy a higher end speaker than AirPod offers for about the same price. 5) The fact AirPod is late to the game will mean it either needs to provide something revolutionary (they haven't announced anything that fits that bill yet) or will have to be content with maintaining their hold on their current customers (appleTV, iOS, etc).
There is nothing about this product that will make me change from Echo and my dots. SIRI isn't better than Alexa. The only factor that I do miss about Apple vs Amazon is the security. I trust AAPL infinitely more not to eavesdrop and market to me, but I'm already heavily invested in the Echo ecosystem. AAPL needs to innovate or they won't convert enough to grow their market. As an example, AppleTV isn't in my house because they have never provided me anything that Roku or my smart TV's can't. There is no cost justifications when also added to the limits, like no Amazon on it.
This is apples and oranges (no pun intended) -- they aren't equivalent devices.
Amazon will come out with a HomePod competitor at a similar price point within a year or so, probably in partnership with Bose or Harmon Kardon or somebody like that.
"interested" doesn't equal sales. Far from it, and don't forget that except on this site, Apple is a minority of the market. There will always be diehard Apple fans who will purchase nothing but, but Apple needs more than that market.
Even if it's not the same as Amazon Echo, for many people it is, at least in their minds. Amazon has a huge head start in brand awareness, brand integration (how many products have you seen that say 'works with Amazon Echo?') feature development and market penetration. Apple is coming to the game very late and has a big hill to climb.
MpIsP said it more succinct than me. First to market with a product that works very well will win every time, unless there is a new innovation. APPL doesn't have a new innovation, trying to play the "our materials are better" card. That misses when I can pair even a cheap Dot with a great bluetooth speaker.
Now if AAPL also comes out with an AirDot product that can daisychain back to a main AirPod then they may be on to something. My top gripe about Echo and the Dots (great band name, BTW) is that you can't use them as remotes for others. So my dot outside can't control the echo hooked to my surround sound/outdoor speakers that's inside.
My take won't be popular here, but I'll say it anyhow:
1) To date all voice assistants leave a lot to be lacking. So if they all suck, why spend more? 2) Once it comes out, a true Echo vs AirPod comparison will be more even. Right now one exists the other doesn't. 3) I think the demand for Echo dots is much greater than Echo, and people are probably interchanging those two when asked to consider "echo" vs airpod 4) If I want a top end speaker then I'll buy a higher end speaker than AirPod offers for about the same price. 5) The fact AirPod is late to the game will mean it either needs to provide something revolutionary (they haven't announced anything that fits that bill yet) or will have to be content with maintaining their hold on their current customers (appleTV, iOS, etc).
There is nothing about this product that will make me change from Echo and my dots. SIRI isn't better than Alexa. The only factor that I do miss about Apple vs Amazon is the security. I trust AAPL infinitely more not to eavesdrop and market to me, but I'm already heavily invested in the Echo ecosystem. AAPL needs to innovate or they won't convert enough to grow their market. As an example, AppleTV isn't in my house because they have never provided me anything that Roku or my smart TV's can't. There is no cost justifications when also added to the limits, like no Amazon on it.
You make some valid points, but I don't agree with your overall assessment. Your opinion is perhaps rooted in part of your name... You are looking at this from the "techie" point of view of the products and the market.
- Home "Assistant" market is extremely immature, with little value being offered to the broader marketplace. This is in great part because home automation is also (from the majority market perspective) very immature and fragmented. Enthusiasts and techies will do it as a hobby, but it is very far from being something even 10% of households regularly utilize. - From what I have read in many accounts (and a few friends that have) of those using Echo or Google Home, the use cases boil down to asking questions (initially, but fades over time), playing music (more Google Home), setting timers, and home automation. The first is a novelty, with most information more easily obtained and absorbed via a screen (smartphone, tablet, PC). Playing music for home, with all of the benefits of voice interface + subscription services, seems to be a growing use case. Setting timers is nice to have. Home automation, per above point, is fragmented/new/not mainstream (yet). - Further a home assistant that is not tied into your "smart devices" is going to have limited functionality across a person's digital life. - It is for these reasons that the total number of such devices (speculated) sold over the last 2-3 years numbers is just over 10M units. While some/many love them, there are certainly some reports that for others, they are little used (IMO due to reasons above).
So yes, Apple is late. But from a mainstream perspective, the market is in the very early stages. Maybe Apple will not get their usual "10-20%" of the market, but it is too early to tell. The HomePod was only given an introductory "sneak peek", with much of the functionality left unsaid.
And yes they are pricing the product at a premium compared with other home assistant speakers, but in-line with premium music speakers, which is certainly Apple's general methodology - they never target the "cheap enough to try and not use if I don't like it" crowd. It is always much easier to lower a price than to raise it.
the resident Googler is out running around shitting false information again, ffs.
Rather than vaguely making it sound like you might know something be more direct and point out what that person posted that's false. We should all strive to post accurate info and encourage correction of it when it isn't, right?
(EDIT: Crickets....)
Forgive me if bedtime take priority over your false claim that Google isn't selling away your privacy, we've been through this before and you never responded to my posts detailing how you are so totally wrong about Google. Most here already know how silly your insistence about Google is (certainly, though, it's really doubtful they come here to hear them, but hey, it's the blogosphere and negative nellies and corporate shills take the place alongside people actually wanting to engage in an honest discussion of Apple products).
The bigger irony here is the post directly below addressed your false claims, which you also ignored.
MY false claims? Hardly. None of the home assistants are "listening" for anything but the keyword it was programmed to recognize, exactly as I said. But you want to claim that some of these Home Assistants are listening and transcribing your conversations with the kids about their school-day and recording your love-making in the bedroom and that I'm lying about these evil deeds going on? LOL.
That yet another poster would like to tell everyone they're always recording and transcribing everything said in your home is what is false and the very epitome of FUD, but that's what your accusation of me posting falsehoods is based on? If not just what is you DO believe about Home Assistants and when and what they're listening to?
Wasn't an Amazon Echo just involved in a murder case earlier this year. Apparently it is always recording or "listening" for it's wake word "Alexa" when not in use. So the DA asked to sequester the recording from Amazon.
Iphone is priced as a premium device. People are willing to pay for it. The simple reason is iPhone offers so many features. For the number of features the price is actually cheap. Tim and his execs are stupid. They don't know this point. Apple Watch and AirPod offer much much less features. And Apple priced them as a premium device because they are made by Apple? Come on! Apple fans are not that stupid. The people that will buy Apple Watch and AirPod are those that are already super rich. The price is not the concern when they buy products.
A $350.00 speaker can only be bought by the super rich? Do you consider Bose and Sonos for the super rich as well? I could see if they were asking for $3500.00 per speaker, but 350.00? I mentioned earlier this is a speaker more comparable to the Sonos Play 3 rather than one of the existing assistants.
the resident Googler is out running around shitting false information again, ffs.
Rather than vaguely making it sound like you might know something be more direct and point out what that person posted that's false. We should all strive to post accurate info and encourage correction of it when it isn't, right?
(EDIT: Crickets....)
Forgive me if bedtime take priority over your false claim that Google isn't selling away your privacy, we've been through this before and you never responded to my posts detailing how you are so totally wrong about Google. Most here already know how silly your insistence about Google is (certainly, though, it's really doubtful they come here to hear them, but hey, it's the blogosphere and negative nellies and corporate shills take the place alongside people actually wanting to engage in an honest discussion of Apple products).
The bigger irony here is the post directly below addressed your false claims, which you also ignored.
MY false claims? Hardly. None of the home assistants are "listening" for anything but the keyword it was programmed to recognize, exactly as I said. But you want to claim that some of these Home Assistants are listening and transcribing your conversations with the kids about their school-day and recording your love-making in the bedroom and that I'm lying about these evil deeds going on? LOL.
That yet another poster would like to tell everyone they're always recording and transcribing everything said in your home is what is false and the very epitome of FUD, but that's what your accusation of me posting falsehoods is based on? If not just what is you DO believe about Home Assistants and when and what they're listening to?
Wasn't an Amazon Echo just involved in a murder case earlier this year. Apparently it is always recording or "listening" for it's wake word "Alexa" when not in use. So the DA asked to sequester the recording from Amazon.
I don't recall there being anything that confirmed they were recording all the time. Did you read something that claimed they actually did? AFAIK it was a fishing expedition to discover if there was anything of value in the searches the owner did, not an expectation of there being hidden recordings. Ever read any stories of some law enforcement agency demanding Apple produce something that Apple says they don't actually possess? I'm sure you have.
If there was any evidence that any of these Home Assistants were always recording it would be a bombshell and reported everywhere! ...and a kiss of death for that product. The fact that it was not reported that there are or were any recordings would be support for there NOT being 24/7 collection of every conversation, hiccup or moan. It ain't happenin'.
But if you're just one of those really distrustful types and believe that one of the companies would dig their own product grave to surreptitiously record you in all your private moments, or that they are incapable of securing the data you've entrusted with them from hackers or governments spies I would suggest keeping all the phone assistants turned off and not placing an Echo, Homepod, or Google Home in your living spaces.
I'm certain there is a slice of the public that has a fear of this and would never consider one of the new Home Assistants period.
Since it was late to market, I have 2 Amazon Echos and 3 Dots. I will be interested in seeing what the HomePod can do. I understand the differences which are not obvious, but my Dots control my house which is all I need for now.
My take won't be popular here, but I'll say it anyhow:
1) To date all voice assistants leave a lot to be lacking. So if they all suck, why spend more? 2) Once it comes out, a true Echo vs AirPod comparison will be more even. Right now one exists the other doesn't. 3) I think the demand for Echo dots is much greater than Echo, and people are probably interchanging those two when asked to consider "echo" vs airpod 4) If I want a top end speaker then I'll buy a higher end speaker than AirPod offers for about the same price. 5) The fact AirPod is late to the game will mean it either needs to provide something revolutionary (they haven't announced anything that fits that bill yet) or will have to be content with maintaining their hold on their current customers (appleTV, iOS, etc).
There is nothing about this product that will make me change from Echo and my dots. SIRI isn't better than Alexa. The only factor that I do miss about Apple vs Amazon is the security. I trust AAPL infinitely more not to eavesdrop and market to me, but I'm already heavily invested in the Echo ecosystem. AAPL needs to innovate or they won't convert enough to grow their market. As an example, AppleTV isn't in my house because they have never provided me anything that Roku or my smart TV's can't. There is no cost justifications when also added to the limits, like no Amazon on it.
Since all of those assistants are sort of disapointment, you focus on the one thing were you can provide a superior value with certainty and people are 100% proven to be ready to pay for it : a decent compact sound source that will fill a room without fidling with anything.
Apple has a hell of expertise in the last 15 years with music, it's a core aspect of their brand and not an adjunct like with Amazon.
Also, your making the exact same arguments as for phones, and Ipod, tablets, Watches.... People online and analysts are invariably WRONG.
Apple decided to differentiate on something Amazon seemingly has no interest in, their speaker is utter shit even by low standards, instead of providing another me too product.
Your argument would be slightly better if you ACTUALLY USED THE RIGHT PRODUCT NAME: It is HOMEPOD.
Comments
It's got a tiny little woofer in a tiny little enclosure...
It's got -- at best -- a little Class D amp...
It uses an array of tweeters doing all kind of phasing lunacy to create an artificial sense of space and directionality...
The signal is modulated into a radio wave for transmission to the device...
...and your concern is the sample rate of the source file?
Whether or not it supports hi-res doesn't even make the Top Ten list of things that will affect the listening experience.
1) Is advertised heavily 24/7
2) Is available
3) Is cheap (for a reason)
over one that
1) Is not available
2) Has not been advertised
3) Is expensive (for a reason)
Surprised? Is the Pope a Catholic.
The company that did this already knew the answers before they started. Not worth a bent penny but the market will take note and mark APPL stock down as a result.
Sheesh some people.
Disclaimer, I'm not in the market for or likely to buy any of these things.
Like some posters here have suspected (and a few other tech bloggers), the Siri we get on the speaker is going to be very different from the one on the phone. I think a combination of improvements in the neural network + client-side processing + better analysis of dark data combined with differential privacy will provide a quantum leap in Siri capabilities.
6 months for Apple to get Siri to where it has to be for a smart speaker, followed by iterative improvements as it rolls out to other markets.
Also, I've been saying for years that Alexa's brilliance in comparison to Siri probably stems from the far-field microphones making initial comprehension better, which reduces a huge amount of the stress and frustration associated with Siri.
The bigger irony here is the post directly below yours addressed your false claims, which you also ignored.
For the speaker - I'd almost consider buying it but it seems likely it's limited by not having Spotify support (yet)
That yet another poster would like to tell everyone they're always recording and transcribing everything said in your home is what is false and the very epitome of FUD, but that's what your accusation of me posting falsehoods is based on? If not just what is you DO believe about Home Assistants and when and what they're listening to?
1. Apple announces a new product.
2. Trolls: Ha Ha Ha. Too expensive
3. Consumer Reports: Alexa is better
4. Analysts: Apple is doomed
5. AppleInsider fake techies: If I can’t upgrade it and fiddle with it I won’t buy it.
6. Product is released: Sells like hotcakes
Any questions?
1) To date all voice assistants leave a lot to be lacking. So if they all suck, why spend more?
2) Once it comes out, a true Echo vs AirPod comparison will be more even. Right now one exists the other doesn't.
3) I think the demand for Echo dots is much greater than Echo, and people are probably interchanging those two when asked to consider "echo" vs airpod
4) If I want a top end speaker then I'll buy a higher end speaker than AirPod offers for about the same price.
5) The fact AirPod is late to the game will mean it either needs to provide something revolutionary (they haven't announced anything that fits that bill yet) or will have to be content with maintaining their hold on their current customers (appleTV, iOS, etc).
There is nothing about this product that will make me change from Echo and my dots. SIRI isn't better than Alexa. The only factor that I do miss about Apple vs Amazon is the security. I trust AAPL infinitely more not to eavesdrop and market to me, but I'm already heavily invested in the Echo ecosystem. AAPL needs to innovate or they won't convert enough to grow their market. As an example, AppleTV isn't in my house because they have never provided me anything that Roku or my smart TV's can't. There is no cost justifications when also added to the limits, like no Amazon on it.
Now if AAPL also comes out with an AirDot product that can daisychain back to a main AirPod then they may be on to something. My top gripe about Echo and the Dots (great band name, BTW) is that you can't use them as remotes for others. So my dot outside can't control the echo hooked to my surround sound/outdoor speakers that's inside.
- Home "Assistant" market is extremely immature, with little value being offered to the broader marketplace. This is in great part because home automation is also (from the majority market perspective) very immature and fragmented. Enthusiasts and techies will do it as a hobby, but it is very far from being something even 10% of households regularly utilize.
- From what I have read in many accounts (and a few friends that have) of those using Echo or Google Home, the use cases boil down to asking questions (initially, but fades over time), playing music (more Google Home), setting timers, and home automation. The first is a novelty, with most information more easily obtained and absorbed via a screen (smartphone, tablet, PC). Playing music for home, with all of the benefits of voice interface + subscription services, seems to be a growing use case. Setting timers is nice to have. Home automation, per above point, is fragmented/new/not mainstream (yet).
- Further a home assistant that is not tied into your "smart devices" is going to have limited functionality across a person's digital life.
- It is for these reasons that the total number of such devices (speculated) sold over the last 2-3 years numbers is just over 10M units. While some/many love them, there are certainly some reports that for others, they are little used (IMO due to reasons above).
So yes, Apple is late. But from a mainstream perspective, the market is in the very early stages. Maybe Apple will not get their usual "10-20%" of the market, but it is too early to tell. The HomePod was only given an introductory "sneak peek", with much of the functionality left unsaid.
And yes they are pricing the product at a premium compared with other home assistant speakers, but in-line with premium music speakers, which is certainly Apple's general methodology - they never target the "cheap enough to try and not use if I don't like it" crowd. It is always much easier to lower a price than to raise it.
http://www.cnn.com/2017/03/07/tech/amazon-echo-alexa-bentonville-arkansas-murder-case/index.html
A $350.00 speaker can only be bought by the super rich? Do you consider Bose and Sonos for the super rich as well? I could see if they were asking for $3500.00 per speaker, but 350.00? I mentioned earlier this is a speaker more comparable to the Sonos Play 3 rather than one of the existing assistants.
If there was any evidence that any of these Home Assistants were always recording it would be a bombshell and reported everywhere!
...and a kiss of death for that product. The fact that it was not reported that there are or were any recordings would be support for there NOT being 24/7 collection of every conversation, hiccup or moan. It ain't happenin'.
But if you're just one of those really distrustful types and believe that one of the companies would dig their own product grave to surreptitiously record you in all your private moments, or that they are incapable of securing the data you've entrusted with them from hackers or governments spies I would suggest keeping all the phone assistants turned off and not placing an Echo, Homepod, or Google Home in your living spaces.
I'm certain there is a slice of the public that has a fear of this and would never consider one of the new Home Assistants period.