iPhone X took over two years to develop, marks new chapter in iPhone design, says Jony Ive...

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Comments

  • Reply 21 of 90
    Soli said:

    PrimeSense before Apple made it into Face ID










    The Prime Sense image is mind boggling when you think that Apple is adding a 7 megapixel camera, speaker, among other things while shrinking the technology so that it's even smaller than the prime sense logo. 
    SoliGG1radarthekatpatchythepiratesphericphilboogieJWSCStrangeDaysDon.Andersenrepressthis
  • Reply 22 of 90
    radarthekatradarthekat Posts: 2,121moderator
    I can see where the iPhone X is the culmination of years of work and development on many levels.
    But, as Ive's says, rather than being a revolution: 
    ....."the device represents a new chapter in the platform's history".

    If you look at the device as 'just another computer' or a "platform", the truth of that statement becomes clear.   The possibilities of a computer you can carry in your pocket are as unlimited as the possibilities of a computer you can carry in your briefcase were in 1995 -- and maybe more so.

    So often here on ai, I hear people speak of desktops, laptops, tablets and phones as being almost sacred where boundaries cannot be broached:  Their vision is limited to just more of the same -- just faster.   Yet, they are all just computers with the main difference being shape and size.  They all have input & output sources, CPUs, GPUs, storage, memory and some software...  

    They're just computers...  
     
    Not sure this will be the best analogy, but we’re all just cells; humans and chimpanzees and monkeys and tarsiars and such.  There’s more difference than merely shape and size.  The specific methods of input and output on phones and tablets and PCs and watches lend each form unique capabilities.  The phone gets a rockin set of cameras (input) because it’s form factor allows uses for those cameras that would be unwieldy on a laptop computer, as one example of many that could be cited.  There comes an inflection point where capabilities allowed by each specific form and unique I/O developed to take advantage of that form do indeed create boundaries that delineate beyond the fact they are all inherently ‘computers.’
    edited October 2017
  • Reply 22 of 90
    holyoneholyone Posts: 348member
    mr o said:
    At first I was horrified, but I must admit, the notch has grown on me … I really like it, it makes the iPhone distinguishable.

    A silver back would make this iPhone truly irresistible. With chrome edges, it would make iPhone X very reminiscent to the original iPhone. Perhaps with iPhone X series 2?

    >:x
    That's the Apple reality distortion effect ;), just teasing. The all metal back would be cool, but ( "Air power" stupid name ) won't work I think, so nuts to that unfortunately, unless you mean a mirro back off cause, which I don't know why they never did with this first gen honestly, oh well. I just never got the bitching about the notch, it's kinda like the camera bump, it's not esthetical it's technical any one with half a brain should be able realize this, a notch less iPhone is a very long way away.
  • Reply 24 of 90
    They should simply have blocked any developer access to the two Notch-Ears. Leave them ALWAYS running with a solid-black background and light-text providing phone-status data (or turned-off completely by user's choice) and nothing more.  Then we would not all be sitting here complaining about how silly the iPhone X 'Notch-Bar' equipment looks. Just as there are cameras and sensors on every other smartphone out there hidden behind the screen-glass. Nobody ever dumps on them.
    edited October 2017 netmagemrboba1
  • Reply 25 of 90
    radarthekatradarthekat Posts: 2,121moderator
    holyone said:
    "Discussing the inner workings of iPhone X, Ive said the inclusion of Face ID is the culmination of years of work toward a non-contact user interface. From a user's perspective, features that do not require physical interaction make a device feel simpler, yet at the same time more robust. Ive goes on to say the replacement of Touch ID, a capacitive fingerprint reading solution included in all iPhone models since iPhone 5s, equates to a heightened user experience." Wow Jony what dubious reasoning, sure raising the iPhone and have it ready and unlocked with out interaction is less friction, but the home button paradigm was just as simple considering that you don't just look at iPhone X and have it read youre mind thus forfulling this zero interaction premiss, you still have to touch the phone to interacting with it and since you're going to touch the phone any ways using one of those " touchese" for biometric features is just as clean I think. The fact is the iPhone user experience is still firmly interaction heavy and very much "heightened", IMO killing touch ID is a horrendous mistake and is testament to Apple being technology drunk, technological fetuses are just being thrown in there for technology sake with weak and half assed though, the touch bar in MBP's which though not completely useless is just there because Apple can put it there and serves little els, the cylindrical Mac which looked great but was as a result of technology allowing it and no other consideration, if you looking at where those things are now its disappointing. Personally I'm thrilled with Face ID I've been hoping for it on the MBs and iMacs forever but it should have been in addition to Touch ID not replacement for it, not that the X in not great, but Face ID seems like a fan boy geeking out with little thought beyond the obvious, this becomes clear if you unbiasedly consider "simplicity" in touch ID Apple pay and face ID Apple pay. But hey who cares when all that matters is profits on top of profits, shout out to sog 35 ;) and to Strange Days and gang unless to challenge points above please spare me, thanks
    Regarding the ‘technology drunk’ view, this doesn’t exactly hold water.  FaceID as a replacement for TouchID frees up space in the handset while providing far greater security.  The touch bar on tne Mac is a fine replacement for fixed function keys that needed to be Shifted, Ctrl’d, or Alt’d to expand beyond single use.  The litmus test is not a comparison to what many are accustomed to.  The litmus test is which solution you would choose had both been available from the start.  To my mind a dynamic touch bar wins out easily over a row of fixed keys.  To my mind a more secure face recognition solution wins out over an extra component that’s less secure, is subject to smudges and dirt and other means of failure.  As to Apple Pay, those who have been paying attention are aware that the process is equally simple via FaceID versus  TouchID.
    edited October 2017 pscooter63StrangeDayswatto_cobra
  • Reply 26 of 90
    As for the notch, if you have a background image that’s black at the top, it seems like you could make it basically disappear if it’s really bothering you that much.
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 27 of 90
    mjtomlinmjtomlin Posts: 1,669member
    holyone said:
    "Discussing the inner workings of iPhone X, Ive said the inclusion of Face ID is the culmination of years of work toward a non-contact user interface. From a user's perspective, features that do not require physical interaction make a device feel simpler, yet at the same time more robust. Ive goes on to say the replacement of Touch ID, a capacitive fingerprint reading solution included in all iPhone models since iPhone 5s, equates to a heightened user experience." Wow Jony what dubious reasoning, sure raising the iPhone and have it ready and unlocked with out interaction is less friction, but the home button paradigm was just as simple considering that you don't just look at iPhone X and have it read youre mind thus forfulling this zero interaction premiss, you still have to touch the phone to interacting with it and since you're going to touch the phone any ways using one of those " touchese" for biometric features is just as clean I think. The fact is the iPhone user experience is still firmly interaction heavy and very much "heightened", IMO killing touch ID is a horrendous mistake and is testament to Apple being technology drunk, technological fetuses are just being thrown in there for technology sake with weak and half assed though, the touch bar in MBP's which though not completely useless is just there because Apple can put it there and serves little els, the cylindrical Mac which looked great but was as a result of technology allowing it and no other consideration, if you looking at where those things are now its disappointing. Personally I'm thrilled with Face ID I've been hoping for it on the MBs and iMacs forever but it should have been in addition to Touch ID not replacement for it, not that the X in not great, but Face ID seems like a fan boy geeking out with little thought beyond the obvious, this becomes clear if you unbiasedly consider "simplicity" in touch ID Apple pay and face ID Apple pay. But hey who cares when all that matters is profits on top of profits, shout out to sog 35 ;) and to Strange Days and gang unless to challenge points above please spare me, thanks
    Regarding the ‘technology drunk’ view, this doesn’t exactly hold water.  FaceID as a replacement for TouchID frees up space in the handset while providing far greater security.  The touch bar on tne Mac is a fine replacement for fixed function keys that needed to be Shifted, Ctrl’d, or Alt’d to expand beyond single use.  The litmus test is not a comparison to what many are accustomed to.  The litmus test is which solution you would choose had both been available from the start.  To my mind a dynamic touch bar wins out easily over a row of fixed keys.  To my mind a more secure face recognition solution wins out over an extra component that’s less secure, is subject to smudges and dirt and other means of failure.  As to Apple Pay, those who have been paying attention are aware that the process is equally simple via FaceID versus  TouchID.

    Let's also take into account that Touch ID had a single purpose - authentication. The TrueDepth camera used by Face ID has multiple uses including facial tracking (animoji) and depth data (Portrait Mode and Portrait Lighting). Why wouldn't they use a technology that is much more versatile? (This is the same question to ask as to why TouchBar? Context aware controls, TouchID, a more secure camera and microphone)
    lkrupppscooter63sphericradarthekatrepressthisjony0watto_cobra
  • Reply 28 of 90
    It is likely that if I were to purchase the iPhone X my life would change in any meaningful way. Jony is quite the salesman. 
  • Reply 29 of 90
    asdasdasdasd Posts: 4,880member
    holyone said:
    "Discussing the inner workings of iPhone X, Ive said the inclusion of Face ID is the culmination of years of work toward a non-contact user interface. From a user's perspective, features that do not require physical interaction make a device feel simpler, yet at the same time more robust. Ive goes on to say the replacement of Touch ID, a capacitive fingerprint reading solution included in all iPhone models since iPhone 5s, equates to a heightened user experience." Wow Jony what dubious reasoning, sure raising the iPhone and have it ready and unlocked with out interaction is less friction, but the home button paradigm was just as simple considering that you don't just look at iPhone X and have it read youre mind thus forfulling this zero interaction premiss, you still have to touch the phone to interacting with it and since you're going to touch the phone any ways using one of those " touchese" for biometric features is just as clean I think. The fact is the iPhone user experience is still firmly interaction heavy and very much "heightened", IMO killing touch ID is a horrendous mistake and is testament to Apple being technology drunk, technological fetuses are just being thrown in there for technology sake with weak and half assed though, the touch bar in MBP's which though not completely useless is just there because Apple can put it there and serves little els, the cylindrical Mac which looked great but was as a result of technology allowing it and no other consideration, if you looking at where those things are now its disappointing. Personally I'm thrilled with Face ID I've been hoping for it on the MBs and iMacs forever but it should have been in addition to Touch ID not replacement for it, not that the X in not great, but Face ID seems like a fan boy geeking out with little thought beyond the obvious, this becomes clear if you unbiasedly consider "simplicity" in touch ID Apple pay and face ID Apple pay. But hey who cares when all that matters is profits on top of profits, shout out to sog 35 ;) and to Strange Days and gang unless to challenge points above please spare me, thanks
    Paragraphs. 
    StrangeDaysJWSCrepressthisjony0
  • Reply 30 of 90
    netmagenetmage Posts: 149member
    holyone said:
    you still have to touch the phone to interacting with it and since you're going to touch the phone any ways using one of those " touchese" for biometric features is just as clean I think.
    Perhaps you haven't heard of a little feature Apple added a few generations ago called Siri?
    repressthiswatto_cobra
  • Reply 31 of 90
    So, Ive says the iPhone X is a new “chapter”, not the “ultimate expression” of the iPhone. The previous “expressions” of iPhone will persist. Touch ID will persist, iPhone X doesn’t signal its replacement. Face ID may be better, more natural, not invasive but it can’t replace Touch ID in all cases. It is ineffective against twins and kids below 13 years old.
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 32 of 90
    AI_liasAI_lias Posts: 186member
     I see some comments about the notch. The test question is this: would you like the notch if you saw it on an Android phone? And the answer is, you would ridicule it, whether you want to admit it or not. So, no, the notch is not good. The thing is this: do you think the Face ID is worth the notch? The alternative is to use Touch ID on the back side, and whatever there is left to put on the front, would probably fit in the edge that would be left at the top, since iPhone X bezels are quite thick for a "bezel-less" phone. In my opinion, Touch ID is just fine, and did not need to be replaced with a fancy Face ID. And putting it on the back would not have been that bad. It would not have been the first thing we copied from the Android side.
  • Reply 33 of 90
    macxpressmacxpress Posts: 3,858member
    spheric said:
    Soli said:
    MacRumors are going nuts about this interview with Jony Ive. They keep saying that if it's not about the 10 year anniversary they why call it iPhone X. Clearly that's the marketing department capitalizing on the timing, not the technology involved to create this amazing jump into the future of the iPhone.
    I don't see what's so difficult to understand. 

    They've been developing this generation of iPhone for several years. That it would be ready to announce on the tenth anniversary is a happy coincidence, which I'm sure became an internal target at some point, so they took the opportunity and named it "X" to commemorate that.

    Why the hell would anybody get in a tizzy over that? What is there even to discuss about the obvious?
    Why would they get in a tizzy....well because its MacRumors. It's what they do best, make a big deal out of things that don't need a big deal made out of instead of focusing on the the actual article's contents. I've said before, and I'll say it again...its amazing how a 2 groups of people (MacRumors and AI) that are kind of under the same umbrella with using and discussing Apple products have such different views on almost everything. 
    randominternetpersonshark5150jony0watto_cobra
  • Reply 34 of 90
    AI_lias said:
     I see some comments about the notch. The test question is this: would you like the notch if you saw it on an Android phone? And the answer is, you would ridicule it, whether you want to admit it or not. So, no, the notch is not good. The thing is this: do you think the Face ID is worth the notch? The alternative is to use Touch ID on the back side, and whatever there is left to put on the front, would probably fit in the edge that would be left at the top, since iPhone X bezels are quite thick for a "bezel-less" phone. In my opinion, Touch ID is just fine, and did not need to be replaced with a fancy Face ID. And putting it on the back would not have been that bad. It would not have been the first thing we copied from the Android side.
    They came with a better solution: iPhone 8. Full screen is not so important to justify Touch ID on the back. Aspect ratio is more important than the size of the screen. Hundreds of millions of Touch ID iPhones and iPads prove there is nothing wrong with that design. There is nothing wrong with their efforts to provide a full screen iPhone either, because the smartphone form factor has already been pushed to its limits and a breakthrough is needed. Face ID is the most significant progress since the smartphone form factor has stuck to its limits. Time will tell how the new aspect ratio will affect that breakthrough. Not a big deal, a Plus category iPhone X may resolve that too.
    edited October 2017 repressthiswatto_cobra
  • Reply 35 of 90
    Rayz2016Rayz2016 Posts: 3,150member
    So, Ive says the iPhone X is a new “chapter”, not the “ultimate expression” of the iPhone. The previous “expressions” of iPhone will persist. Touch ID will persist, iPhone X doesn’t signal its replacement. Face ID may be better, more natural, not invasive but it can’t replace Touch ID in all cases. It is ineffective against twins and kids below 13 years old.
    That’s quite a leap. 

    When he said it’s not the ultimate expression, I think he meant he’s not done designing iPhones yet. This is a new chapter, not the last chapter. Pretty much everything else he said indicates that he’s fully onboard with FaceID as the “no touch” expression of the future. 

    We shall have to see how it works with twins and the under thirteens. I reckon Apple is playing it cautious while they improve the technology. 
    StrangeDayswatto_cobra
  • Reply 36 of 90
    Rayz2016Rayz2016 Posts: 3,150member
    holyone said:
    mr o said:
    At first I was horrified, but I must admit, the notch has grown on me … I really like it, it makes the iPhone distinguishable.

    A silver back would make this iPhone truly irresistible. With chrome edges, it would make iPhone X very reminiscent to the original iPhone. Perhaps with iPhone X series 2?

    >:x
    That's the Apple reality distortion effect ;), just teasing. The all metal back would be cool, but ( "Air power" stupid name ) won't work I think, so nuts to that unfortunately, unless you mean a mirro back off cause, which I don't know why they never did with this first gen honestly, oh well. I just never got the bitching about the notch, it's kinda like the camera bump, it's not esthetical it's technical any one with half a brain should be able realize this, a notch less iPhone is a very long way away.
    I didn’t catch a single word of that. 
    StrangeDaysfastasleep
  • Reply 37 of 90
    holyone said:
    "Discussing the inner workings of iPhone X, Ive said the inclusion of Face ID is the culmination of years of work toward a non-contact user interface. From a user's perspective, features that do not require physical interaction make a device feel simpler, yet at the same time more robust. Ive goes on to say the replacement of Touch ID, a capacitive fingerprint reading solution included in all iPhone models since iPhone 5s, equates to a heightened user experience." Wow Jony what dubious reasoning, sure raising the iPhone and have it ready and unlocked with out interaction is less friction, but the home button paradigm was just as simple considering that you don't just look at iPhone X and have it read youre mind thus forfulling this zero interaction premiss, you still have to touch the phone to interacting with it and since you're going to touch the phone any ways using one of those " touchese" for biometric features is just as clean I think. The fact is the iPhone user experience is still firmly interaction heavy and very much "heightened", IMO killing touch ID is a horrendous mistake and is testament to Apple being technology drunk
    You don't live in a cold climate, do you? My family members can't wait for the iPhone X, which don't require them to take off their gloves in sub-zero weather to unlock the damn thing. When I'm at my desk, I have my iPhone in a stand right next to my Mac. I hate having to pick up the phone to unlock it to answer a call. I'm looking forward to just looking at the phone and touching "Accept". Better yet, I hope I'll eventually be able to ask Siri to pick up the phone for me.
    Eric_WVGGpatchythepiraterandominternetpersonrepressthiswatto_cobra
  • Reply 38 of 90
    Of course it was. I can’t believe people are stupid enough to think that something like FaceID was added at the last minute because TouchID under the screen wasn’t ready. Or that Apple sits around to see what others do and then copies them.
    You mean Ming Chi Kuo’s anonymous sources were wrong (aka full of shit).  I just can’t believe it.

    Nor can I believe that Apple would introduce a technology it couldn’t produce in volume (mom Kuo bullshit). 
    The thing with Apple and all of the rumors on new products is that they have to be working on multiple iterations for each potential future product, knowing every possible new product or feature will have failure points or hurdles that may or may not be able to be overcome.  Under-screen TouchID may indeed have been on the docket as a potential iPhone X release, but with too many failure points or hurdles to overcome, they decided to go to facial recognition, even if it too had hurdles to overcome.

    The delays Apple seems to face with each big new product offering are simply a matter of pushing new tech out in such huge volumes that wouldn't necessarily effect other manufacturers.
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 39 of 90
    schlackschlack Posts: 667member
    would be awesome if they would release a miniaturized version of iPhone X in a year or two, something the size of the SE but with the full frontal screen.
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 40 of 90
    bsimpsen said:

    You don't live in a cold climate, do you? My family members can't wait for the iPhone X, which don't require them to take off their gloves in sub-zero weather to unlock the damn thing. 
    That's a really interesting point. And now that you mention it, TouchID fails all the time in humid environments, FaceID should work much better in the tropics (or fresh out of the shower, or after a sweaty workout…)
    edited October 2017 patchythepirateDon.Andersenwatto_cobra
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