Apple updates AirPort firmware with KRACK vulnerability fix

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Comments

  • Reply 41 of 50
    gatorguygatorguy Posts: 24,294member
    Marvin said:
    harrissjt said:

    I've had an Apple-only home for years, but I got tired of waiting for them to update their aging Airport devices.  So I sold my soul, and as soon as they became available here in Australia I got a 3-pack of Google wifi pucks, and I haven't looked back...not once.

    Much better wifi throughout my home.  No dead-spots, no spurious drop-outs requiring reboots, and no grumpy wife and kids - just a fast, reliable signal throughout.

    Oh, and Google supplied the KRACK patch within days...

    You have to be careful with ad company hardware though. Just make sure they aren't doing things like defaulting the DNS lookups through their own servers:

    https://support.google.com/wifi/answer/6274141?hl=en

    The 4th step there has a screenshot showing an automatic config being set to use Google's DNS servers:



    If that was the default (it might not be), it would mean every website you visit is being logged by them.

    https://www.pcworld.com/article/183671/Google_Public_DNS_and_Your_Privacy.html

    It's good to have companies like Apple making this kind of hardware because you have a greater assurance that they have no interest in compromising user's privacy for their own gain.

    They can also add useful features to iOS users like personal VPN server allowing you to connect mobile devices to a home network, QoS controls to throttle iCloud backups to not impact streaming video etc.
    I'm fairly sure that every router collects some data connected to your use of it. ;)
    Take a look at privacy policies. Some router/mesh companies even do better than that, going into some detail about what they collect and why.

    Here, I'll help you with Google's since they seem to be a particular concern for you, and if you have any interest in any of the others  it's easy enough to find them. I've already looked at Eero for example, pretty similar to Google's. 
    https://support.google.com/wifi/answer/6246642?hl=en
    To put you at ease about an "ad company" and their wifi hardware logging every website you visit:
    "the Google Wifi app and your Wifi points do not track the websites you visit or collect the content of any traffic on your network"

    Wouldn't it have been better to have a look before introducing fear, uncertainty and doubt?
    edited December 2017
  • Reply 42 of 50
    MarvinMarvin Posts: 15,362moderator
    gatorguy said:
    To put you at ease about an "ad company" and their wifi hardware logging every website you visit:
    "the Google Wifi app and your Wifi points do not track the websites you visit or collect the content of any traffic on your network"

    Wouldn't it have been better to have a look before introducing fear, uncertainty and doubt?
    It's not the hardware/software that's the main issue here but the DNS server.

    https://developers.google.com/speed/public-dns/privacy

    People might be happy with their data collection and that's fine but Google is an ad company that is constantly trying to mine deep data and their violation of Safari tracking settings is evidence of their motives:

    https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2012/feb/17/google-admits-tracking-safari-users

    This data gives ad companies an advantage in their business of selling ads, they wouldn't collect it otherwise. It's important for people to be aware of the fact that ad companies sell lower priced hardware and services in order to boost user adoption with the intention of watching how they use the products and services to boost their ad performance. They even say so explicitly:

    https://www.google.com/intl/en/policies/privacy/

    It's just safer to use hardware/software/services from non-ad companies like Apple who don't have the motivation to track everything people do.
    edited December 2017
  • Reply 43 of 50
    gatorguygatorguy Posts: 24,294member
    Marvin said:
    gatorguy said:
    To put you at ease about an "ad company" and their wifi hardware logging every website you visit:
    "the Google Wifi app and your Wifi points do not track the websites you visit or collect the content of any traffic on your network"

    Wouldn't it have been better to have a look before introducing fear, uncertainty and doubt?
    It's not the hardware/software that's the main issue here but the DNS server.

    https://developers.google.com/speed/public-dns/privacy

    This data gives ad companies an advantage in their business of selling ads, they wouldn't collect it otherwise. It's important for people to be aware of the fact that ad companies sell lower priced hardware and services in order to boost user adoption with the intention of watching how they use the products and services to boost their ad performance. They even say so explicitly:

    https://www.google.com/intl/en/policies/privacy/

    It's just safer to use hardware/software/services from non-ad companies like Apple who don't have the motivation to track everything people do.
    Marvin, you were referring to Google Wifi and expressing the view that they might be collecting and connecting personal data about every site you visit when you use it.
    1. I offered you evidence they do not which you seem to prefer ignoring. Why?

    2. What does Apple say they collect from your use of their AirPort router and why?   

    3. How does it compare to what Google collects from Google wifi routers and why?

    4.. Where does Google say they're using any data collected from their public DNS server, assuming you're conected to it, for personalized,targeted ads? As I read it they don't.  On the contrary they specifically say:
    "...we don't keep personally identifiable information or IP information. We do keep some location information (at the city/metro level) so that we can conduct debugging, analyze abuse phenomena. After keeping this data for two weeks, we randomly sample a small subset for permanent storage.

    We don't correlate or combine information from our temporary or permanent logs with any personal information that you have provided Google for other services."

    They even explicitely state WHY they collect it and what it is used for, and it's not ads despite your insistance that could be the only possible reason to do it.  

    So I've no idea what you thought you read.  You seem to be encouraging the spread of FUD which is unlike you. 


    As for general overall privacy policies what does Apple say they collect and what it can be used for as compared to Google?  Last time I looked they were almost identical legally, just using different words to decribe the same data collection permissions.
    https://www.apple.com/legal/privacy/en-ww/

    Sidenote: Apple is dipping toes back into the ad game they supposedly exited a couple years back which I don't expect you to acknowledge, even collecting personal information from your use of apps and the news you choose to read to deliver targeted ads based on "your" interests, and using the same general "bucket of anonymised users" that Google does for targeted ads. Am I right?
    https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT205223
    edited December 2017
  • Reply 44 of 50
    I got tired of waiting for a new AirPort Extreme and fully intended buying the next version.  Since I needed a router and WAP, I ended up going with Ubiquiti USG and a Unifi AC pro access point.  I liked the extra features and that it is a bit more enterprisy than some consumer level hardware.  I can’t speak for all consumer hardware, but wasn’t impressed with the security of many of them, especially the d-link.  I considered an ASUS router because of the performance, but I liked the features, UI, and being able to do some more advanced network stuff.  Being technically minded (could’ve had my ccna) this is a non issue for me, but for others the UniFi stuff may be to nerdy/not as easy to setup.
  • Reply 45 of 50
    SoliSoli Posts: 10,038member
    Since I needed a router and WAP
    Why do you need WAP?
  • Reply 46 of 50
    Soli said:
    Since I needed a router and WAP
    Why do you need WAP?
    The USG is just a router, firewall, and controller for Unifi devices; there is no built in WiFi or switch... which is why I need the WAP.  Only bought 1 to see if it will cover the whole house (2600 sq ft) not including the basement.  I am also planning to put cat6 drops in the bedrooms and living room.  I also have a 16 port switch and may add in a PoE switch for additional WAPs or additional IP cameras.
  • Reply 47 of 50
    SoliSoli Posts: 10,038member
    Soli said:
    Since I needed a router and WAP
    Why do you need WAP?
    The USG is just a router, firewall, and controller for Unifi devices; there is no built in WiFi or switch... which is why I need the WAP.  Only bought 1 to see if it will cover the whole house (2600 sq ft) not including the basement.  I am also planning to put cat6 drops in the bedrooms and living room.  I also have a 16 port switch and may add in a PoE switch for additional WAPs or additional IP cameras.
    Are you using WAP to mean Wireless Access Point, not insecure and long replaced Wireless Application Protocol known as WAP?
  • Reply 48 of 50
    Soli said:
    Soli said:
    Since I needed a router and WAP
    Why do you need WAP?
    The USG is just a router, firewall, and controller for Unifi devices; there is no built in WiFi or switch... which is why I need the WAP.  Only bought 1 to see if it will cover the whole house (2600 sq ft) not including the basement.  I am also planning to put cat6 drops in the bedrooms and living room.  I also have a 16 port switch and may add in a PoE switch for additional WAPs or additional IP cameras.
    Are you using WAP to mean Wireless Access Point, not insecure and long replaced Wireless Application Protocol known as WAP?
    Yes
  • Reply 49 of 50
    Soli said:
    Soli said:
    Since I needed a router and WAP
    Why do you need WAP?
    The USG is just a router, firewall, and controller for Unifi devices; there is no built in WiFi or switch... which is why I need the WAP.  Only bought 1 to see if it will cover the whole house (2600 sq ft) not including the basement.  I am also planning to put cat6 drops in the bedrooms and living room.  I also have a 16 port switch and may add in a PoE switch for additional WAPs or additional IP cameras.
    Are you using WAP to mean Wireless Access Point, not insecure and long replaced Wireless Application Protocol known as WAP?
    I’ve always referred to them as WAPs but I guess AP is more ubiquitous.  I’m also the guy who still calls GFIs as GFCIs and I’ve gotten some quizzical looks from electricians almost like “you still call it that?”  It has also been almost 15 years since I’ve had any formal network training, and a lot has changed since then.  Still make my own straight through cables though.
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