As far as I can tell, it has not in fact ever been confirmed that Apple was building its own car. Based on the available documentation I've seen (i.e. all the California paperwork that has been made public, unless I missed something), Apple has only ever been working on a system that, like CarPlay, was designed to be sold/licensed to car manufacturers for use in their own models. Of course I could be wrong, but would be interested to know where the source is for confirmation that Apple was building its own complete car for eventual sale to the public (excluding a car built for research/prototype/testing purposes).
Even if I am wrong about that, if there ever had been an Apple car and a Google car to choose from, that decision would take less than a second to make.
I dunno.
I can see why car manufacturers would go with CarPlay: they want a connection to the iPhone. I’m just not sure how Apple would convince them to go with their autonomous drive system. Surely this is something that the manufacturers would want to control themselves, and not leave it to Apple or Google.
I can see the logic in the approach chasm suggests. Most car makers are not computer experts by a long way, let alone into AI, this goes far beyond 'your front left tire is flat' or 'you need a service'. One thing for sure, whatever it is Apple is going to come out with will be followed very quickly with a Google knock off (marketed by Samsung maybe).
I can’t see it. Car manufacturers have been working with computers in their cars for a long time now, far longer than Apple has. They also have the proper real time operating systems needed, which, as far as we know, Apple doesn’t.
its not a matter of thinking that if Apple is doing it, it will automatically work, and be better. It might, and it might not. Apple is they neophyte here, not the auto makers.
Not to mention that we know several car makers such as Merc have working autonomous car prototypes, for a few years now.
...where will Apple fit into this? Selling it to other auto companies? I don’t see how. Anyone who writes that Apple is planning to do that is ignorant of the automobile industry. Apple will see some major problem in trying to convince companies to do that. They tried to get BMW to design and build a car together, do people think they will convince them, or others to buy their own nav system?
I don’t see Apple or Google being able to convince car companies to adopt their software for autonomy. Seems to me they’d be giving up far too much control of their experience and the potential liability could be devastating.
Apple will have to market and sell their own vehicles or buy and modify someone else’s vehicles to offer their system (or service) to the public.
As far as I can tell, it has not in fact ever been confirmed that Apple was building its own car. Based on the available documentation I've seen (i.e. all the California paperwork that has been made public, unless I missed something), Apple has only ever been working on a system that, like CarPlay, was designed to be sold/licensed to car manufacturers for use in their own models. Of course I could be wrong, but would be interested to know where the source is for confirmation that Apple was building its own complete car for eventual sale to the public (excluding a car built for research/prototype/testing purposes).
Even if I am wrong about that, if there ever had been an Apple car and a Google car to choose from, that decision would take less than a second to make.
I dunno.
I can see why car manufacturers would go with CarPlay: they want a connection to the iPhone. I’m just not sure how Apple would convince them to go with their autonomous drive system. Surely this is something that the manufacturers would want to control themselves, and not leave it to Apple or Google.
I can see the logic in the approach chasm suggests. Most car makers are not computer experts by a long way, let alone into AI, this goes far beyond 'your front left tire is flat' or 'you need a service'. One thing for sure, whatever it is Apple is going to come out with will be followed very quickly with a Google knock off (marketed by Samsung maybe).
I can’t see it. Car manufacturers have been working with computers in their cars for a long time now, far longer than Apple has. They also have the proper real time operating systems needed, which, as far as we know, Apple doesn’t.
its not a matter of thinking that if Apple is doing it, it will automatically work, and be better. It might, and it might not. Apple is they neophyte here, not the auto makers.
Not to mention that we know several car makers such as Merc have working autonomous car prototypes, for a few years now.
...where will Apple fit into this? Selling it to other auto companies? I don’t see how. Anyone who writes that Apple is planning to do that is ignorant of the automobile industry. Apple will see some major problem in trying to convince companies to do that. They tried to get BMW to design and build a car together, do people think they will convince them, or others to buy their own nav system?
I don’t see Apple or Google being able to convince car companies to adopt their software for autonomy. Seems to me they’d be giving up far too much control of their experience and the potential liability could be devastating.
Apple will have to market and sell their own vehicles or buy and modify someone else’s vehicles to offer their system (or service) to the public.
Well, that doesn’t really disprove my comment. Will Jaguar be including Waymo in Jaguar vehicles for sale to buyers? No. This is them partnering to provide vehicles to Google/Waymo for a Waymo taxi service. That’s different.
The Waymo Honda news is even less clear what is the intention.
As far as I can tell, it has not in fact ever been confirmed that Apple was building its own car. Based on the available documentation I've seen (i.e. all the California paperwork that has been made public, unless I missed something), Apple has only ever been working on a system that, like CarPlay, was designed to be sold/licensed to car manufacturers for use in their own models. Of course I could be wrong, but would be interested to know where the source is for confirmation that Apple was building its own complete car for eventual sale to the public (excluding a car built for research/prototype/testing purposes).
Even if I am wrong about that, if there ever had been an Apple car and a Google car to choose from, that decision would take less than a second to make.
I dunno.
I can see why car manufacturers would go with CarPlay: they want a connection to the iPhone. I’m just not sure how Apple would convince them to go with their autonomous drive system. Surely this is something that the manufacturers would want to control themselves, and not leave it to Apple or Google.
I can see the logic in the approach chasm suggests. Most car makers are not computer experts by a long way, let alone into AI, this goes far beyond 'your front left tire is flat' or 'you need a service'. One thing for sure, whatever it is Apple is going to come out with will be followed very quickly with a Google knock off (marketed by Samsung maybe).
I can’t see it. Car manufacturers have been working with computers in their cars for a long time now, far longer than Apple has. They also have the proper real time operating systems needed, which, as far as we know, Apple doesn’t.
its not a matter of thinking that if Apple is doing it, it will automatically work, and be better. It might, and it might not. Apple is they neophyte here, not the auto makers.
Not to mention that we know several car makers such as Merc have working autonomous car prototypes, for a few years now.
...where will Apple fit into this? Selling it to other auto companies? I don’t see how. Anyone who writes that Apple is planning to do that is ignorant of the automobile industry. Apple will see some major problem in trying to convince companies to do that. They tried to get BMW to design and build a car together, do people think they will convince them, or others to buy their own nav system?
I don’t see Apple or Google being able to convince car companies to adopt their software for autonomy. Seems to me they’d be giving up far too much control of their experience and the potential liability could be devastating.
Apple will have to market and sell their own vehicles or buy and modify someone else’s vehicles to offer their system (or service) to the public.
Well, that doesn’t really disprove my comment. Will Jaguar be including Waymo in Jaguar vehicles for sale to buyers? No. This is them partnering to provide vehicles to Google/Waymo for a Waymo taxi service. That’s different.
The Waymo Honda news is even less clear what is the intention.
Not to mention, could you imagine Apple trying to market and provide customer service on a car where they are the OS and the self-drive bit, but not the rest of the car. It would be a nightmare for Apple and the customer.
As far as I can tell, it has not in fact ever been confirmed that Apple was building its own car. Based on the available documentation I've seen (i.e. all the California paperwork that has been made public, unless I missed something), Apple has only ever been working on a system that, like CarPlay, was designed to be sold/licensed to car manufacturers for use in their own models. Of course I could be wrong, but would be interested to know where the source is for confirmation that Apple was building its own complete car for eventual sale to the public (excluding a car built for research/prototype/testing purposes).
Even if I am wrong about that, if there ever had been an Apple car and a Google car to choose from, that decision would take less than a second to make.
I dunno.
I can see why car manufacturers would go with CarPlay: they want a connection to the iPhone. I’m just not sure how Apple would convince them to go with their autonomous drive system. Surely this is something that the manufacturers would want to control themselves, and not leave it to Apple or Google.
I can see the logic in the approach chasm suggests. Most car makers are not computer experts by a long way, let alone into AI, this goes far beyond 'your front left tire is flat' or 'you need a service'. One thing for sure, whatever it is Apple is going to come out with will be followed very quickly with a Google knock off (marketed by Samsung maybe).
I can’t see it. Car manufacturers have been working with computers in their cars for a long time now, far longer than Apple has. They also have the proper real time operating systems needed, which, as far as we know, Apple doesn’t.
its not a matter of thinking that if Apple is doing it, it will automatically work, and be better. It might, and it might not. Apple is they neophyte here, not the auto makers.
Not to mention that we know several car makers such as Merc have working autonomous car prototypes, for a few years now.
Of course. It’s even possible that Apple decided that the investment was much more than they had expected, and so they decided to not go that route. If that’s true, I can’t really understand what they are trying to accomplish.
we’ve just been reading that Toyota, the worlds second largest auto maker, put Apple’s Auto play on just one model car, though it’s now agreed to put it in several in a higher end line. Google has been trying to convince then to use their infotainment system too, but Toyota hasn’t been interested. The articles on this have said that Toyota, which is a somewhat conservative company, doesn’t want to put CarPlay in their vehicles, and all it wants to know is whether the car is moving, why would it want to put Google’s system in, which wants to know a whole raft of things about what the car (and thereby, its driver) is doing?
a system that actually controls the car is vastly more invasive. It needs to know almost every parameter of what the car is doing, and something of what the “driver” is, and isn’t doing, and when. Where does all of that info go? Does it all go to the car maker, does it go to the system maker or does it go to both? Both can make the argument that they need that data to improve their product.
but auto makers don’t want to share that information. They’ve been stating that for some time. That’s a major disconnect. So Google has Waymo, which is going to either buy cars that they will modify, along with the manufacturer, and not sell their system outright to auto makers. Other car makers are going it alone.
where will Apple fit into this? Selling it to other auto companies? I don’t see how. Anyone who writes that Apple is planning to do that is ignorant of the automobile industry. Apple will see some major problem in trying to convince companies to do that. They tried to get BMW to design and build a car together, do people think they will convince them, or others to buy their own nav system?
With Toyota specifically many here are probably unaware they've announced that 2018 Toyota models equipped with the Toyota Entune system as well as their Lexus models with Lexus Enform will feature Amazon Alexa integration. Drivers and passengers in those vehicles will be able to communicate with Alexa via voice commands to do everything from controlling entertainment in the vehicle to adding items to a shopping list to controlling their own "smart" home, and more compatible models are on the way.
Since you also mentioned Waymo(Google) they've announced a partnership with Tata Motors-owned Jaguar on supplying their autonomous system for use in a new Jaguar vehicle and reportedly has Honda on-board as a production partner for a delivery vehicle. On top of that "thousands" of Chrysler's are going into service, many of them within the next couple of months, as completely driverless ride-sharing taxis. There's a lot of stuff going on in the space, and much of it happening quite quickly.
Waymo isn’t what I was talking about when referring to Google’s infotainment system, which Toyota is refusing to add. Tata is well behind everyone major in this field, so I’m not surprised they’re working with Waymo, but not Google’s system.
As far as I can tell, it has not in fact ever been confirmed that Apple was building its own car. Based on the available documentation I've seen (i.e. all the California paperwork that has been made public, unless I missed something), Apple has only ever been working on a system that, like CarPlay, was designed to be sold/licensed to car manufacturers for use in their own models. Of course I could be wrong, but would be interested to know where the source is for confirmation that Apple was building its own complete car for eventual sale to the public (excluding a car built for research/prototype/testing purposes).
Even if I am wrong about that, if there ever had been an Apple car and a Google car to choose from, that decision would take less than a second to make.
I dunno.
I can see why car manufacturers would go with CarPlay: they want a connection to the iPhone. I’m just not sure how Apple would convince them to go with their autonomous drive system. Surely this is something that the manufacturers would want to control themselves, and not leave it to Apple or Google.
I can see the logic in the approach chasm suggests. Most car makers are not computer experts by a long way, let alone into AI, this goes far beyond 'your front left tire is flat' or 'you need a service'. One thing for sure, whatever it is Apple is going to come out with will be followed very quickly with a Google knock off (marketed by Samsung maybe).
I can’t see it. Car manufacturers have been working with computers in their cars for a long time now, far longer than Apple has. They also have the proper real time operating systems needed, which, as far as we know, Apple doesn’t.
its not a matter of thinking that if Apple is doing it, it will automatically work, and be better. It might, and it might not. Apple is they neophyte here, not the auto makers.
Not to mention that we know several car makers such as Merc have working autonomous car prototypes, for a few years now.
Of course. It’s even possible that Apple decided that the investment was much more than they had expected, and so they decided to not go that route. If that’s true, I can’t really understand what they are trying to accomplish.
we’ve just been reading that Toyota, the worlds second largest auto maker, put Apple’s Auto play on just one model car, though it’s now agreed to put it in several in a higher end line. Google has been trying to convince then to use their infotainment system too, but Toyota hasn’t been interested. The articles on this have said that Toyota, which is a somewhat conservative company, doesn’t want to put CarPlay in their vehicles, and all it wants to know is whether the car is moving, why would it want to put Google’s system in, which wants to know a whole raft of things about what the car (and thereby, its driver) is doing?
a system that actually controls the car is vastly more invasive. It needs to know almost every parameter of what the car is doing, and something of what the “driver” is, and isn’t doing, and when. Where does all of that info go? Does it all go to the car maker, does it go to the system maker or does it go to both? Both can make the argument that they need that data to improve their product.
but auto makers don’t want to share that information. They’ve been stating that for some time. That’s a major disconnect. So Google has Waymo, which is going to either buy cars that they will modify, along with the manufacturer, and not sell their system outright to auto makers. Other car makers are going it alone.
where will Apple fit into this? Selling it to other auto companies? I don’t see how. Anyone who writes that Apple is planning to do that is ignorant of the automobile industry. Apple will see some major problem in trying to convince companies to do that. They tried to get BMW to design and build a car together, do people think they will convince them, or others to buy their own nav system?
Exactly. And I’d bet with Apple and BMW, Apple purely wanted them as a potential contract manufacturer, with BMW playing a pure Foxconn role. If you are serious about making a car, and if you are Apple, you make a car. You don’t partner with Honda or something, giving away even 10% of control. I’d say Apple knew building a car was a momental investment for the brand going in. Even purely from a design standpoint several of Ive’s team are former supercar designers. Then there’s autonomy, electrification, the battery problem, the ownership cost problem, a entirely new carOS, a charge network and home charging. A huge deal, and technologically and infrastructure wise Elon has set the bar very high. Design wise Apple would wipe the floor with Tesla, but they’ve such a huge lead in other areas. They even sell solar roof tiles and a complete home battery solution.
Tesla’s Solor City guy isn’t working out well, as the very moderate installations have been dropping. Their home battery sales haven’t been going too well either. It was a mistake for Tesla to buy Musk’s other company.
As far as I can tell, it has not in fact ever been confirmed that Apple was building its own car. Based on the available documentation I've seen (i.e. all the California paperwork that has been made public, unless I missed something), Apple has only ever been working on a system that, like CarPlay, was designed to be sold/licensed to car manufacturers for use in their own models. Of course I could be wrong, but would be interested to know where the source is for confirmation that Apple was building its own complete car for eventual sale to the public (excluding a car built for research/prototype/testing purposes).
Even if I am wrong about that, if there ever had been an Apple car and a Google car to choose from, that decision would take less than a second to make.
I dunno.
I can see why car manufacturers would go with CarPlay: they want a connection to the iPhone. I’m just not sure how Apple would convince them to go with their autonomous drive system. Surely this is something that the manufacturers would want to control themselves, and not leave it to Apple or Google.
I can see the logic in the approach chasm suggests. Most car makers are not computer experts by a long way, let alone into AI, this goes far beyond 'your front left tire is flat' or 'you need a service'. One thing for sure, whatever it is Apple is going to come out with will be followed very quickly with a Google knock off (marketed by Samsung maybe).
I can’t see it. Car manufacturers have been working with computers in their cars for a long time now, far longer than Apple has. They also have the proper real time operating systems needed, which, as far as we know, Apple doesn’t.
its not a matter of thinking that if Apple is doing it, it will automatically work, and be better. It might, and it might not. Apple is they neophyte here, not the auto makers.
Not to mention that we know several car makers such as Merc have working autonomous car prototypes, for a few years now.
Of course. It’s even possible that Apple decided that the investment was much more than they had expected, and so they decided to not go that route. If that’s true, I can’t really understand what they are trying to accomplish.
we’ve just been reading that Toyota, the worlds second largest auto maker, put Apple’s Auto play on just one model car, though it’s now agreed to put it in several in a higher end line. Google has been trying to convince then to use their infotainment system too, but Toyota hasn’t been interested. The articles on this have said that Toyota, which is a somewhat conservative company, doesn’t want to put CarPlay in their vehicles, and all it wants to know is whether the car is moving, why would it want to put Google’s system in, which wants to know a whole raft of things about what the car (and thereby, its driver) is doing?
a system that actually controls the car is vastly more invasive. It needs to know almost every parameter of what the car is doing, and something of what the “driver” is, and isn’t doing, and when. Where does all of that info go? Does it all go to the car maker, does it go to the system maker or does it go to both? Both can make the argument that they need that data to improve their product.
but auto makers don’t want to share that information. They’ve been stating that for some time. That’s a major disconnect. So Google has Waymo, which is going to either buy cars that they will modify, along with the manufacturer, and not sell their system outright to auto makers. Other car makers are going it alone.
where will Apple fit into this? Selling it to other auto companies? I don’t see how. Anyone who writes that Apple is planning to do that is ignorant of the automobile industry. Apple will see some major problem in trying to convince companies to do that. They tried to get BMW to design and build a car together, do people think they will convince them, or others to buy their own nav system?
I don’t see Apple or Google being able to convince car companies to adopt their software for autonomy. Seems to me they’d be giving up far too much control of their experience and the potential liability could be devastating.
Apple will have to market and sell their own vehicles or buy and modify someone else’s vehicles to offer their system (or service) to the public.
Yes. I really can’t see it working out any other way. Unless, just possibly, they could convince fleet owners to adapt their tech to the fleets they buy, but it seems far fetched to me right now.
Comments
https://www.engadget.com/2018/04/02/waymo-honda-autonomous-delivery-vehicle/
The Waymo Honda news is even less clear what is the intention.
Yes. I really can’t see it working out any other way. Unless, just possibly, they could convince fleet owners to adapt their tech to the fleets they buy, but it seems far fetched to me right now.