Apple announcement of North Carolina campus 'imminent,' report says

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Comments

  • Reply 21 of 31
    SpamSandwichSpamSandwich Posts: 33,408member
    gatorguy said:
    A more social question: why does Apple need a substantial tax incentive? They're one of the wealthiest companies in the world. RTP has everything they say they need. So why give them a tax break? I get that Apple WANTS the tax break, and that our feckless politicians are happy to give away other people's money. But in a world where public budgets are under substantial stress, the idea of giving a wealthy, established company a significant tax break to get them to do something they know they have to do anyway is galling.
    Why? Because states are competing with each other for large, stable businesses which will need hundreds or thiusands of well paid employees (also known as “taxpayers”).
    The proper answer would have been NO Apple does not need the tax break as that's what he asked.

    They're just accepting what States are offering. IMO the States should not be doing so, particularly when they already offer good locations, an educated workforce, solid energy and transportation resources, a nice climate both business and weather-wise, etc. It seems to me like Apple would want to be in The Triangle anyway even without a tax break. My guess is that was their choice all along and there's no need to give away the house to get them there which is reportedly what the Governor's office is falling all over themselves to do. 
    Apple may not “need” a tax break, but they’d be foolish to not negotiate for a big one.
  • Reply 22 of 31
    StrangeDaysStrangeDays Posts: 11,274member
    netmage said:
    Taxes aren't other people's money 
    What? Taxes are by definition other-peoples-money. Where do you think it comes from? The state doesn’t produce wealth on its own. It collects revenue - money from other people. 
    edited June 2018 SpamSandwich
  • Reply 23 of 31
    tallest skiltallest skil Posts: 43,399member
    nunzy said:
    Apple will get lots of tax breaks. That is the nature of giant corporate entities.
    No, don’t fucking accept that state of being as something unchangeable! That’s utter nonsense. No corporation of any size should receive any benefits over any other. You can make this happen.
    We all pay more taxes
    That’s also not how it works.
    if we don't give tax money to these kinds of giant corporations, they will leave the United States.
    Not if we reinstall our pre-Federal Reserve tariffs they won’t.
    frankie said:
    That would be so awesome to bring all these smart people to NC and turn the state blue.  It's already heading that way.
    No. You’re on the wrong side of history.
    jkichline said:
    I highly doubt that Apple would add a campus in a state so opposed to equal rights and social issues.
    What utter bullshit.
    Taxes are by definition other-peoples-money.
    Depends on the context of the statement. If we’re removing context, and assuming that “the government” is the subject, then “other people” are the taxpayers (including government officials, in most cases), and taxes, therefore are other people’s “money” (note the location of the quotes). If we’re talking about “tax breaks”, then the statement becomes silly.
    Where do you think it comes from?
    Let’s find out!
    When you or I write a check, there must be sufficient funds in our account to cover the check, but when the Federal Reserve writes a check, there is no bank deposit on which the check is drawn. When the Federal Reserve writes a check, it is creating money.*

    Putting It Simply, Boston Federal Reserve, 1984
    So... it comes from literally nowhere! Hooray! Hyperinflation!
    The state doesn’t produce wealth on its own. It collects revenue - money from other people. 
    It literally “does”... sort of. The Federal Reserve–which is a private corporation with no ties to or control by the government–creates all currency out of thin air with absolutely no intrinsic value connected to it whatsoever. This currency is used as a medium of exchange for goods and services. The governments of the West (et. al.) have no power here, and only a handful of governments on Earth today have any power over the creation of their own currency. The government does not produce money on its own, or indeed at all. Money–a medium of exchange that is an inherent store of value–is mined from the Earth. And sure, a government is usually the one responsible for running the mining operation itself, thus increasing the sum total of money held by the nation, the government is not still producing the money itself. Finally, you’re right: the state does not produce wealth on its own. Currency is not wealth. Money is not wealth. Your wealth is your time and freedom. Money is a storage container for the time (meaning effort) you have spent, and operates as evidence that you spent it. It is a container that does not devalue, and thus maintains the worth of your time. Currency is a claim check to money.

    SUMMARY:

    Private corporations create currency out of thin air.
    Governments can mine money out of the ground.
    Time and personal freedom are wealth.
    Money is a means of the storage of wealth.
    Currency is a claim check to money.
    Currency is not a store of value.
    Money is a store of value.

    * Asterisk from the quote from Putting It Simply: IT IS NOT CREATING MONEY. DO NOT LET LANGUAGE BE PERVERTED.
    edited June 2018 nunzy
  • Reply 24 of 31
    buzdotsbuzdots Posts: 451member
    netmage said:
    Taxes aren't other people's money and a tax break isn't giving away other's people's money.

    I can't even believe anyone would make a statement like that.

    Are you 8 years old or just completely unschooled in economics, the U.S. Government and who paid for what ever public education you obtained - or the road to your private institution.

    Never mind, I get it - your not from here...


  • Reply 25 of 31
    buzdotsbuzdots Posts: 451member
    frankie said:
    Time to leave California. Keep the Apple Park facility, but legally locate the headquarters out of state.
    That would be so awesome to bring all these smart people to NC and turn the state blue.  It's already heading that way.
    North Carolina won't be blue in your life time.
    SpamSandwichtallest skil
  • Reply 26 of 31
    tallest skiltallest skil Posts: 43,399member
    buzdots said:
    ...or just completely unschooled in economics
    To be fair, that’s every US high school graduate, since I don’t know of a school that actually teaches our economic system.
    SpamSandwich
  • Reply 27 of 31
    1st1st Posts: 443member
    Research triangle does have advantages, especially, for next gen network. Years ago, group of Att bell lab top notch researchers moved to NCU,that established outstanding engineering program. Besides, there are many dotted in the woods of top current and ex research labs. A good place to hide the talents. The only place I thought more suitable is upper state NY, with IBM for brain chip, Albany chip plant, lucent lab (what ever remain of the bell lab).and tax break make it more attractive IMHO.   Especially, less natural element effect (big consideration for business continuity risk mitigation). Although it is bit too cold for majority of the software chaps (hardware not really care much, it is in an office environment anyhow), both a bit hilly to land a UFO. :-). 
  • Reply 28 of 31
    buzdotsbuzdots Posts: 451member
    buzdots said:
    ...or just completely unschooled in economics
    To be fair, that’s every US high school graduate, since I don’t know of a school that actually teaches our economic system.
    Maybe so any more.  Guess I'm getting to old.  When I went to high school we knew the "system" from the ground up.
    Now I guess the big hurdle is cursive writing...
    tallest skil
  • Reply 29 of 31
    You have the financial ability to go anywhere.  So why go to a state with a track record of racial, LGBT, ethnical discrimination.  Why go to a state with a confederate / slavery legacy.  Why go to a state where evangelical right wing groups are actively projecting a message of hate and exclusion; particularly towards immagrants.  

    You choice is to buy into this?  Too bad.
  • Reply 30 of 31
    tallest skiltallest skil Posts: 43,399member
    StuSpenz said:
    You have the financial ability to go anywhere.  So why go to a state with a track record of racial, LGBT, ethnical discrimination.  Why go to a state with a confederate / slavery legacy.  Why go to a state where evangelical right wing groups are actively projecting a message of hate and exclusion; particularly towards immagrants.  

    You choice is to buy into this?  Too bad.
    You already seem to have bought into something… Get a clue. 
  • Reply 31 of 31
    nunzynunzy Posts: 662member
    StuSpenz said:
    You have the financial ability to go anywhere.  So why go to a state with a track record of racial, LGBT, ethnical discrimination.  Why go to a state with a confederate / slavery legacy.  Why go to a state where evangelical right wing groups are actively projecting a message of hate and exclusion; particularly towards immagrants.  

    You choice is to buy into this?  Too bad.
    Apple is owned by Wall Street. Apple will go to where they can produce maximum profits for Wall Street.

    Nothing you cite is relevant except to the extent that it might affect Apple's bottom line.
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