Apple researching refinements to sunroofs, seating for 'Project Titan' car

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  • Reply 21 of 44
    boltsfan17boltsfan17 Posts: 2,161member
    lkrupp said:
    So what would the better track for Apple be? Build its own Apple branded car or buy Tesla? How about maybe contracting with Tesla to build the Apple car. Musk might buy into that for a cash infusion. Surely none of the major car manufacturers would do that, would they?

    In either event I’m hoping I live to be able to buy a self-driving electric vehicle. I just turned 68 and would love to just get in such a vehicle and tell it to take me to wherever I want to go. So tired of driving after 52 years of it. I’ve pretty much given up hope of living to see a colony on the Moon or a manned mission to Mars. I can still cross my fingers for SETI to find ET in my lifetime. B)
    We all want it, roads have become so congested that driving is not a fun activity anymore.
    In certain places, public transportation is a mess. Take for example NYC. The subway system there is awful. I think more people are turning to Uber, Lyft, etc because of all the subway delays, crowds, etc. That's putting more cars on the roads in a compact city. 
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 22 of 44
    boltsfan17boltsfan17 Posts: 2,161member
    volcan said:
    paxman said:
    So... 'Hey Siri, I need a car in 10'. I step out and into the 'whatever it is', which then takes me to where I want to go and then goes on its merry way. 

    Most people in the US don't fit that mind set. Personally, I want to own my own car(s). Even something as simple as picking up a friend for tee time and afterwards lunch would be a major inconvenience with a ride share, lugging golf clubs into the restaurant, not cool. I can think of many situations where not owning a car would be a real issue for me. Besides I like to drive and I have really nice cars.
    I'm with you. I love driving and want my own car(s). Not owning a car wouldn't work for me. I go camping a lot and I couldn't think of life without my truck. When I take vacation, I always do long road trips either here or in Europe. 
    claire1
  • Reply 23 of 44
    Rayz2016Rayz2016 Posts: 4,631member
    volcan said:
    paxman said:
    So... 'Hey Siri, I need a car in 10'. I step out and into the 'whatever it is', which then takes me to where I want to go and then goes on its merry way. 

    Most people in the US don't fit that mind set. Personally, I want to own my own car(s). Even something as simple as picking up a friend for tee time and afterwards lunch would be a major inconvenience with a ride share, lugging golf clubs into the restaurant, not cool. I can think of many situations where not owning a car would be a real issue for me. Besides I like to drive and I have really nice cars.

    I would imagine that when you book the car, it’ll want to know how many passengers, and if you need cargo space. It’ll also want to know where you’re going so it can work out whether or not you really need a 4x4. 

    And after a few weeks, it’ll know that this is a regular journey. 

    The other day, Siri advised me on a different route to the gym to avoid music festival traffic. I’ve never made an appointment for the gym, or requested directions. But the phone knows I make the same journey every Saturday morning, so made a helpful assumption. 
    edited August 2018 claire1watto_cobra
  • Reply 24 of 44
    volcanvolcan Posts: 1,789member
    Rayz2016 said:

    I would imagine that when you book the car, it’ll want to know how many passengers, and if you need cargo space. It’ll also want to know where you’re going so it can work out whether or not you really need a 4x4. 

    And after a few weeks, it’ll know that this is a regular journey. 

    No way. I can afford the convenience of having my own vehicles. With a ride share you are just guessing that the driver has a license and insurance and is not on drugs. Who knows if the ride share even has roadside assistance in case of a mechanical problem. I took one in NYC and he had to drive around looking for a gas station. Maybe I'm just spoiled but I'll stick with my own vehicles whenever possible, although I do have a limo service I use to go to and from the airport, but even with an expensive service like that you never know what you are going to get. 

    There are lots of little things like keeping an emergency preparedness kit in my car since we live in an earthquake zone. I seriously doubt many ride share drivers have that.
    philboogie
  • Reply 25 of 44
    volcan said:
    StrangeDays said:
    What value add does Tesla offer Apple that Apple couldn’t provide itself? Why does Apple need Tesla?
    Ask them why they bought Beats and kept the name. They also bought Siri and kept the name.
    They bought both for the same reason: the team and the underlying technology. No reason to change the name in either case.

    Beats mostly for the team rather than the streaming technology. Beats also had the added benefit of brand equity with a young demographic, and with it a nice cash flow that has no doubt already paid for itself. 
    edited August 2018
  • Reply 26 of 44
    Apple is one of a few companies with artificial intelligence operating at the mobile chip level.  With millions of AI powered devices shipped, one could argue Apple is the only company that has successfully designed, manufactured, and sold mass produced AI mobile chipsets.  Apple’s unique ability to leverage AI at both  sensor and vehicle levels will place them at the forefront of self-driving technology.  I suspect that the current fleet of self-driving Apple vehicles is to train, test and improve the AI systems.  By allowing the AI to learn how human drivers prioritize and handle situations or road conditions, a more natural style of driving can be achieved.  Apple’s PAIL transit could be to disguise real-world testing of these technologies and a chance to perfect them until 
    project Titan delivers a product.
  • Reply 27 of 44
    SpamSandwichSpamSandwich Posts: 31,197member
    ireland said:
    Obligatory Apple Car concept:

    That’s nice but I was really looking a car in wheat.
  • Reply 28 of 44
    SpamSandwichSpamSandwich Posts: 31,197member
    I truly wish the first meetings of the Titan team, back a few years ago, resolved that the eventual entry of an Apole vehicle would come only as a fully automated vehicle, after the day comes when such vehicles would no longer be required to have human driver controls at all.  Perhaps I’m dreaming, maybe that day is too far afield and Apple needs to participate even during the transitional era.  But it seems Apple’s DNA fits with a truly driverless vehicle; one that can be minimized by stripping out all the human driver interface.  All those mechanics and even drive-by-wire redundancies removed, to focus their design and engineering teams on the essence of a moving vehicle, devoid of even headlights.
    Elon Musk has stated by 2019 Tesla would have enough on-the-road data collection that they would be able to have one of their vehicles drive across the country completely autonomously and that to me indicates that the AI needed for piloting a car is advancing quite rapidly and there will be a window for Apple to get in early in this space between 2019-2022. If they wait much longer they lose early adopters and then the traditional car companies, such as Toyota, VW, Ford, etc. all come in with their vehicles and then everyone will be competing on price and amenities. All cars will eventually be roughly equally “intelligent” when it comes to navigating the environment safely.
    edited August 2018
  • Reply 29 of 44
    tmaytmay Posts: 3,819member
    lkrupp said:
    So what would the better track for Apple be? Build its own Apple branded car or buy Tesla? How about maybe contracting with Tesla to build the Apple car. Musk might buy into that for a cash infusion. Surely none of the major car manufacturers would do that, would they?

    In either event I’m hoping I live to be able to buy a self-driving electric vehicle. I just turned 68 and would love to just get in such a vehicle and tell it to take me to wherever I want to go. So tired of driving after 52 years of it. I’ve pretty much given up hope of living to see a colony on the Moon or a manned mission to Mars. I can still cross my fingers for SETI to find ET in my lifetime. B)
    You obviously are oblivious to the current problems Tesla has with the Model 3, in manufacturing, selling, and supporting the model 3, not to mention retention of lead employees.

    Elon needs to go, but it might be too late for Tesla to ever be a player in Autos, or even solar power anymore.
    larryaphilboogie
  • Reply 30 of 44
    Rayz2016Rayz2016 Posts: 4,631member
    volcan said:
    Rayz2016 said:

    I would imagine that when you book the car, it’ll want to know how many passengers, and if you need cargo space. It’ll also want to know where you’re going so it can work out whether or not you really need a 4x4. 

    And after a few weeks, it’ll know that this is a regular journey. 

    No way. I can afford the convenience of having my own vehicles. With a ride share you are just guessing that the driver has a license and insurance and is not on drugs. Who knows if the ride share even has roadside assistance in case of a mechanical problem. I took one in NYC and he had to drive around looking for a gas station. Maybe I'm just spoiled but I'll stick with my own vehicles whenever possible, although I do have a limo service I use to go to and from the airport, but even with an expensive service like that you never know what you are going to get. 

    There are lots of little things like keeping an emergency preparedness kit in my car since we live in an earthquake zone. I seriously doubt many ride share drivers have that.
    Ah, no. I was actually thinking of a self-driving car.  Nope, a ride share still includes the human error element.  Has to be AI driven for this to work. 
  • Reply 31 of 44
    volcanvolcan Posts: 1,789member
    SpamSandwich said:
    Elon Musk has stated by 2019 Tesla would have enough on-the-road data collection that they would be able to have one of their vehicles drive across the country completely autonomously

    This has already been done back in 2015 by Delphi in an Audi Q5 traveling from SF to NYC with the car being driven autonomously for 99% of the trip.
    philboogie
  • Reply 32 of 44
    volcanvolcan Posts: 1,789member
    Rayz2016 said:
    Ah, no. I was actually thinking of a self-driving car.  Nope, a ride share still includes the human error element.  Has to be AI driven for this to work. 
    Regardless, neither would work for me or quite frankly for anyone with a family and a busy schedule. For example I go on an errand run which might involve several stops ultimately picking up kids from school. Is an autonomous car service going wait 15 minutes at a time while I go to the dry cleaner then Home Depot, the grocery store, etc. or would I need to hail a new ride at each stop?
  • Reply 33 of 44
    claire1claire1 Posts: 510unconfirmed, member
    But but Apple are pumping BILLIONS $$$ into a software that 3rd parties will(or will not) use!!

    Forums have confirmed this!!!
  • Reply 34 of 44
    ... devoid of even headlights.

    Buh ... why? Even were they unnecessary, I'd prefer to see where my car is taking me.
  • Reply 35 of 44
    lkrupplkrupp Posts: 7,162member
    Ming-Chi Kuo says 2025. In tech years that’s over a million. What will battery technology be like then? What will AI software be capable of then? Eight years is a long time to make a prediction like that.
    philboogie
  • Reply 36 of 44
    SpamSandwichSpamSandwich Posts: 31,197member
    ... devoid of even headlights.

    Buh ... why? Even were they unnecessary, I'd prefer to see where my car is taking me.
    Presumably one would have a view of the outside which would be enhanced by sensors. For the sake of pedestrians, animals, bicyclists, etc. I think exterior illumination will remain.
    king editor the graterandominternetperson
  • Reply 37 of 44
    paxmanpaxman Posts: 4,603member
    volcan said:
    Rayz2016 said:

    I would imagine that when you book the car, it’ll want to know how many passengers, and if you need cargo space. It’ll also want to know where you’re going so it can work out whether or not you really need a 4x4. 

    And after a few weeks, it’ll know that this is a regular journey. 

    No way. I can afford the convenience of having my own vehicles. With a ride share you are just guessing that the driver has a license and insurance and is not on drugs. Who knows if the ride share even has roadside assistance in case of a mechanical problem. I took one in NYC and he had to drive around looking for a gas station. Maybe I'm just spoiled but I'll stick with my own vehicles whenever possible, although I do have a limo service I use to go to and from the airport, but even with an expensive service like that you never know what you are going to get. 

    There are lots of little things like keeping an emergency preparedness kit in my car since we live in an earthquake zone. I seriously doubt many ride share drivers have that.
    I wasn't talking about ride share - I mean autonomous vehicles that buzz about by themselves. If you live in an urban setting it would be such a benefit. If you need to go out of town you get a self drive delivered. If you like driving for real you need to go to a track. I have test driven Porches at a local test track and there is no better fun. But driving in traffic... I'd rather sleep. Wait, with an autonomous car service I can do both. :) 
    edited August 2018 randominternetperson
  • Reply 38 of 44
    paxmanpaxman Posts: 4,603member

    volcan said:
    Rayz2016 said:
    Ah, no. I was actually thinking of a self-driving car.  Nope, a ride share still includes the human error element.  Has to be AI driven for this to work. 
    Regardless, neither would work for me or quite frankly for anyone with a family and a busy schedule. For example I go on an errand run which might involve several stops ultimately picking up kids from school. Is an autonomous car service going wait 15 minutes at a time while I go to the dry cleaner then Home Depot, the grocery store, etc. or would I need to hail a new ride at each stop?
    I don't see why not. You have a car subscription that suits you. You arrive at store - 'Hey Siri, park and wait'. Etc. There would be a ton of permutations and when most lanes are reserved for autonomous vehicles owning you own may become a silly proposition.
  • Reply 39 of 44
    volcanvolcan Posts: 1,789member
    paxman said:
    I don't see why not. You have a car subscription that suits you. You arrive at store - 'Hey Siri, park and wait'. Etc. There would be a ton of permutations and when most lanes are reserved for autonomous vehicles owning you own may become a silly proposition.
    Just seems very inconvenient to my thinking. For example again with the golf clubs. I hail a ride to work in the morning and now I have to carry my golf clubs into the office. And lets say I want to pickup my dry cleaning and a prescription at the drug store during my lunch break, I again have to bring them into the office. Then when I go to the golf course later I have to find someplace to store that stuff while hitting a bucket of balls at the driving range. How exactly does hailing an autonomous car make my life easier?

    If all the freeway lanes and parking spots in Southern California are eventually reserved for autonomous vehicles, I'll move to another location where that is not the case. But I probably won't have to deal with that situation anyway since it will likely be several decades before anything like that happens, if ever, at least in my lifetime.
    edited August 2018
  • Reply 40 of 44

    larryjw said:
    Patents can be valuable on their own. Apple doesn't have to build a car for the patents to earn money for Apple. Now that the patents are filed, other manufacturers can license and build. 
    Selling patents isn’t a business line for Apple. They wouldn’t get into auto patents for that reason alone.
    Agreed as far as your statement goes, but it is entirely possible (maybe even likely) that Apple spent millions pursuing the design of its own car, developed valuable technology and designs in doing so, ultimately scuttled the project or at least dramatically scaled it back, and is now giving itself the option to either pick the project back up later and/or recoup some of its shareholders' money by patenting and later licensing the designs that it paid to develop.
    randominternetperson
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