Review: Apple Watch Series 4 is the full realization of what a wearable can and should do

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Comments

  • Reply 41 of 58
    ireland said:
    larrya said:
    “Full realization” might also include an alert when I leave my phone behind. Please?
    Submit that as feedback. Not a watch wearer personally, but that is a great idea.
    Hopefully a developer can create an app for this, if Apple won't.  
  • Reply 42 of 58
    mac_128mac_128 Posts: 3,454member
    apres587 said:
    ireland said:
    larrya said:
    “Full realization” might also include an alert when I leave my phone behind. Please?
    Submit that as feedback. Not a watch wearer personally, but that is a great idea.
    Hopefully a developer can create an app for this, if Apple won't.  
    Apple would have to allow it. I have to believe there is a reason why Apple hasn't incorporated this obvious technology. They eventually did with find my AirPods, after a third party developer created something that did the trick, but Apple wouldn't let him offer it. But this observation was made almost from day one of Series 0, and to date I don't think anyone's done anything about it ...
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 43 of 58
    taddtadd Posts: 136member
    Soli said:
    tadd said:
    perhaps you should consider a car with roadside assistance built in. .
    Nope Nope Nope. Very bad solution. Nope.

    Do you have anything resembling a reason why it's a "very bad solution" for my parents to have AAA?
    AAA is not very bad.  Maybe they are even good.  Though I thought "built-in" meant "hardware is in place to provide this".    AAA has been around much longer than 20 years.  I've had several good cost-saving experiences with AAA.  My wife had one bad experience with AAA when AAA said they wouldn't support the area that she was stuck in.  That was not cool.  It was someplace near Yonkers NY, by the way, and that was 1992 I think.  

    But that's besides the point.  

    I was typing about the cellular/wireless Internet solutions offered in cars since 1998 or so, GM OnStar, Chrysler EVTS, Ford Sync, BMW Assist, etc.  Basically voice calling and automatic telemetry of car status.  I'm a little spooked by data about the vehicle's operations showing up in a database in the cloud, and specified, integrated, and sold by people who are only vaguely aware of security, much less good at it.  There is a time in one's life where sending telemetry about one's life and doings to a 3rd party is a good idea.  Having that done as a not-so-well-exposed-to-the-user by a built in feature of something so basic as transportation does NOT seem like a good idea.  Furthermore, the systems usually allow silent monitoring of the occupants under the control of people who are not responsible to the courts.  This is also not a good idea.  Though it may not come to harm for almost everybody, it seems like a bad precedent to yield to when the desired feature of the system could be done by a separate consumer-controlled apparatus.  

    The built in cellphone features often come with a monthly cost as well and sometimes that cost is even higher than $10/month we're talking about for Verizon and ATT connection to the Apple Watch.  

    Also, the built in cellphone features have, in the past, been expensive to upgrade as cell networks obsolete old protocols and support.  That means the built in services don't necessarily work anymore after 10 years or so.  The OnStar upgrade kit and install process was neither cheap nor easy.    
    edited September 2018 mac_128GeorgeBMac
  • Reply 44 of 58
    Bebe said:
    mac_128 said:
    You don’t need to even activate the LTE service for it to be useful. My mom forgot her phone at home when she ran an errand one day, and of course that’s the day her car broke down, stranding her on the road, and having to seek out a phone to call a tow truck. It’s cheap insurance to have access to emergency services without even paying for a phone plan to otherwise use the calling and data features. A friend had his phone stolen while traveling and would have had a real problem if not for his LTE connected watch.
    It comes really handy on situation you mentioned.  AT&T charges $10 + fees etc, and I find that too much.  If that would have been $5 per month, I probably would get a cellular version.
    You don't need to sign up for a plan. Emergency services will still work in the USA.

    You can also sign up for a plan anytime. It's nice to have if you ever need it.
    mac_128
  • Reply 44 of 58
    taddtadd Posts: 136member
    ireland said:
    Bebe said:
    mac_128 said:
    You don’t need to even activate the LTE service for it to be useful. My mom forgot her phone at home when she ran an errand one day, and of course that’s the day her car broke down, stranding her on the road, and having to seek out a phone to call a tow truck. It’s cheap insurance to have access to emergency services without even paying for a phone plan to otherwise use the calling and data features. A friend had his phone stolen while traveling and would have had a real problem if not for his LTE connected watch.
    It comes really handy on situation you mentioned.  AT&T charges $10 + fees etc, and I find that too much.  If that would have been $5 per month, I probably would get a cellular version.
    It should be free on the same plan.
    Verizon got $30 for startup and $10/month for adding the watch to my plan.  Same as AT&T I think.  I wonder if we should call our phone companies and tell them it should be free on the same plan.  
  • Reply 46 of 58
    I like everything about the new model except that it’s still square. I can’t stand square watches. Predictions from articles I read back in 2015 said Apple would go round in their “next” model. Reason being 80 percent of watches sold are round and people much prefer round. I guess it’s not hurting sales but I won’t buy one for that simple reason- as dumb as that may sound ... and I have lots of Apple products that I love ...
  • Reply 47 of 58
    Unfortunately while we speak (write) of how great the watch is, what must be taken into account that its like we are beta testers.
    First a few bug notes or quirks that my wife and I have experienced.

    1- Walkie Talkie feature is not instant watch to watch (person to person) we can select each other to use it, but it takes repeated taps on the TALK button to even connect.
    this is not as instantaneous as Apple led people to believe. After many attempts my wife and I can converse with one another. Same with friends with this watch.

    2- When you engage walkie talkie mode and end speaking you are met with another quirk or bug in the watch. Open messages and try to speak (Dictation) and you are met with a message saying Dictation failed/unavailable. This is not something the watch should do. In fact you must either slide the walkie talkie icon to left of screen to turn it off. or a watch reset will allow speaking your messages yet again. But this is not how the watch should work.

    3- The highly touted heart graphs has not been initialized yet. Apple did say it would be available later but I have my doubts. It will be by the end of the year.

    The cellular function for calls seems to work fine, and the email app doesn't always alert you to incoming emails. also if you were to want to reply to your email it is done via speech but if the walkie talkie has been used the problem of not being able to use dictation as in messaging is the same with email replies. Not able to transcribe your message via voice. 

    It would seem Apple just wanted to get these out of the gate and figured they would fix issues later on. Just like using us as beta testers.



  • Reply 48 of 58
    elector said:
    Unfortunately while we speak (write) of how great the watch is, what must be taken into account that its like we are beta testers.
    First a few bug notes or quirks that my wife and I have experienced.

    1- Walkie Talkie feature is not instant watch to watch (person to person) we can select each other to use it, but it takes repeated taps on the TALK button to even connect.
    this is not as instantaneous as Apple led people to believe. After many attempts my wife and I can converse with one another. Same with friends with this watch.

    2- When you engage walkie talkie mode and end speaking you are met with another quirk or bug in the watch. Open messages and try to speak (Dictation) and you are met with a message saying Dictation failed/unavailable. This is not something the watch should do. In fact you must either slide the walkie talkie icon to left of screen to turn it off. or a watch reset will allow speaking your messages yet again. But this is not how the watch should work.

    3- The highly touted heart graphs has not been initialized yet. Apple did say it would be available later but I have my doubts. It will be by the end of the year.

    The cellular function for calls seems to work fine, and the email app doesn't always alert you to incoming emails. also if you were to want to reply to your email it is done via speech but if the walkie talkie has been used the problem of not being able to use dictation as in messaging is the same with email replies. Not able to transcribe your message via voice. 

    It would seem Apple just wanted to get these out of the gate and figured they would fix issues later on. Just like using us as beta testers.



    Sadly, launching products at this scale means that some bugs, at least for some people, are to be expected.

    This is true no matter what company/brand we’re talking about (but in my opinion Apple has a better track record than most when it comes to actually fixing these problems).
  • Reply 49 of 58
    svanstrom said:
    elector said:
    Unfortunately while we speak (write) of how great the watch is, what must be taken into account that its like we are beta testers.
    First a few bug notes or quirks that my wife and I have experienced.

    1- Walkie Talkie feature is not instant watch to watch (person to person) we can select each other to use it, but it takes repeated taps on the TALK button to even connect.
    this is not as instantaneous as Apple led people to believe. After many attempts my wife and I can converse with one another. Same with friends with this watch.

    2- When you engage walkie talkie mode and end speaking you are met with another quirk or bug in the watch. Open messages and try to speak (Dictation) and you are met with a message saying Dictation failed/unavailable. This is not something the watch should do. In fact you must either slide the walkie talkie icon to left of screen to turn it off. or a watch reset will allow speaking your messages yet again. But this is not how the watch should work.

    3- The highly touted heart graphs has not been initialized yet. Apple did say it would be available later but I have my doubts. It will be by the end of the year.

    The cellular function for calls seems to work fine, and the email app doesn't always alert you to incoming emails. also if you were to want to reply to your email it is done via speech but if the walkie talkie has been used the problem of not being able to use dictation as in messaging is the same with email replies. Not able to transcribe your message via voice. 

    It would seem Apple just wanted to get these out of the gate and figured they would fix issues later on. Just like using us as beta testers.



    Sadly, launching products at this scale means that some bugs, at least for some people, are to be expected.

    This is true no matter what company/brand we’re talking about (but in my opinion Apple has a better track record than most when it comes to actually fixing these problems).
    This may be the norm for today's businesses but to put out a worldwide demonstration and show the wonders of what you will get, and sadly see that it was actually staged.
    This is not the way it should be. I bought the new watch because my wife liked the walkie talkie feature, the fall detection feature, the ECG graph feature, the sleeker design for a nice fit, and since we had the watch 3 with cellular which worked perfectly, putting out a newer model with bugs in it is a real turn off to TRUST apple in the future with their hype.

    Reminds me of a James Bond movie where Eliot Carver says " Release the app now since we will have to update it for years to come" This is how business is suited for today.

  • Reply 50 of 58
    elector said:
    svanstrom said:
    elector said:
    Unfortunately while we speak (write) of how great the watch is, what must be taken into account that its like we are beta testers.
    First a few bug notes or quirks that my wife and I have experienced.

    1- Walkie Talkie feature is not instant watch to watch (person to person) we can select each other to use it, but it takes repeated taps on the TALK button to even connect.
    this is not as instantaneous as Apple led people to believe. After many attempts my wife and I can converse with one another. Same with friends with this watch.

    2- When you engage walkie talkie mode and end speaking you are met with another quirk or bug in the watch. Open messages and try to speak (Dictation) and you are met with a message saying Dictation failed/unavailable. This is not something the watch should do. In fact you must either slide the walkie talkie icon to left of screen to turn it off. or a watch reset will allow speaking your messages yet again. But this is not how the watch should work.

    3- The highly touted heart graphs has not been initialized yet. Apple did say it would be available later but I have my doubts. It will be by the end of the year.

    The cellular function for calls seems to work fine, and the email app doesn't always alert you to incoming emails. also if you were to want to reply to your email it is done via speech but if the walkie talkie has been used the problem of not being able to use dictation as in messaging is the same with email replies. Not able to transcribe your message via voice. 

    It would seem Apple just wanted to get these out of the gate and figured they would fix issues later on. Just like using us as beta testers.



    Sadly, launching products at this scale means that some bugs, at least for some people, are to be expected.

    This is true no matter what company/brand we’re talking about (but in my opinion Apple has a better track record than most when it comes to actually fixing these problems).
    This may be the norm for today's businesses but to put out a worldwide demonstration and show the wonders of what you will get, and sadly see that it was actually staged.
    This is not the way it should be. I bought the new watch because my wife liked the walkie talkie feature, the fall detection feature, the ECG graph feature, the sleeker design for a nice fit, and since we had the watch 3 with cellular which worked perfectly, putting out a newer model with bugs in it is a real turn off to TRUST apple in the future with their hype.

    Reminds me of a James Bond movie where Eliot Carver says " Release the app now since we will have to update it for years to come" This is how business is suited for today.

    That's bs though. Apple don't straight up fake demonstrations knowingly releasing non-functioning products. The cost of doing that is waaaay higher than any short-term money they'd be making.

    With enough complexity there's just no amount of testing that can be done to guarantee that there will be no bugs at launch. That's it. No ifs or buts about it. If you at day one get a product launched at this scale you have to expect that there might be bugs. There's even a slight chance that the whole damn first batch must be recalled due to a hardware failure. You just never know. And they don't know for sure until the product is actually released.

    The alternative would be to instead release the product in much smaller batches, but then everyone would be b*tching about how they can't buy it. 

    So… hey… either drop Apple, or drop this whole "I'm feeling so hurt that I'll never trust them again"-thing; because it won't change anything, and you should try to avoid things in life that makes you want to complain. :smile: 
  • Reply 51 of 58
    asciiascii Posts: 5,936member
    svanstrom said:
    With enough complexity there's just no amount of testing that can be done to guarantee that there will be no bugs at launch. 
    That's right. And yet when Apple tries to reduce the overall complexity of the system by removing old frameworks like OpenGL, or replacing an older filesystem with a new one, people give them grief for that too. It's important to see the big picture when dealing with complex systems.
    Soli
  • Reply 52 of 58
    svanstrom said:
    That's bs though. Apple don't straight up fake demonstrations knowingly releasing non-functioning products. The cost of doing that is waaaay higher than any short-term money they'd be making.

    With enough complexity there's just no amount of testing that can be done to guarantee that there will be no bugs at launch. That's it. No ifs or buts about it. If you at day one get a product launched at this scale you have to expect that there might be bugs. There's even a slight chance that the whole damn first batch must be recalled due to a hardware failure. You just never know. And they don't know for sure until the product is actually released.

    The alternative would be to instead release the product in much smaller batches, but then everyone would be b*tching about how they can't buy it. 

    So… hey… either drop Apple, or drop this whole "I'm feeling so hurt that I'll never trust them again"-thing; because it won't change anything, and you should try to avoid things in life that makes you want to complain. :smile: 
    The facts are the product was released without through testing. Just looking at all these "Best watch ever" "Best design over previous models" "The watch that everyone wants" Please quit with the rah rah. I am giving alternate facts based on ownership. Not through paid sources of hype. Its a nice device but it has issues. I don't expect to purchase a product with half the functions touted at the apple event. I expect the device to do what was claimed to do. I as a consumer have that expectation as would any sane informed consumer.

    Released in smaller batches? Not viable. Release the product after through testing and make sure it actually does as the company claims is what should transpire.
    Companies don't have to release a new product every year at the same time. Take the time to work the issues out BEFORE its released to the public.

    When the public gets enough of the problems associated with any product the sales drop off. I am not complaining per se I am giving another preview of what is wrong with the watch4.

    My wife and I own all the iphone XS Max devices, numerous apple watches from the beginning, the home pods, the air pods, iPad pro, iPad minis, iMac, 3 apple TV 4K devices and we are a big fan of their products. But they do make mistakes and the public should say it so people know.
  • Reply 53 of 58
    elector said:
    svanstrom said:
    That's bs though. Apple don't straight up fake demonstrations knowingly releasing non-functioning products. The cost of doing that is waaaay higher than any short-term money they'd be making.

    With enough complexity there's just no amount of testing that can be done to guarantee that there will be no bugs at launch. That's it. No ifs or buts about it. If you at day one get a product launched at this scale you have to expect that there might be bugs. There's even a slight chance that the whole damn first batch must be recalled due to a hardware failure. You just never know. And they don't know for sure until the product is actually released.

    The alternative would be to instead release the product in much smaller batches, but then everyone would be b*tching about how they can't buy it. 

    So… hey… either drop Apple, or drop this whole "I'm feeling so hurt that I'll never trust them again"-thing; because it won't change anything, and you should try to avoid things in life that makes you want to complain. :smile: 
    The facts are the product was released without through testing. Just looking at all these "Best watch ever" "Best design over previous models" "The watch that everyone wants" Please quit with the rah rah. I am giving alternate facts based on ownership. Not through paid sources of hype. Its a nice device but it has issues. I don't expect to purchase a product with half the functions touted at the apple event. I expect the device to do what was claimed to do. I as a consumer have that expectation as would any sane informed consumer.

    Released in smaller batches? Not viable. Release the product after through testing and make sure it actually does as the company claims is what should transpire.
    Companies don't have to release a new product every year at the same time. Take the time to work the issues out BEFORE its released to the public.

    When the public gets enough of the problems associated with any product the sales drop off. I am not complaining per se I am giving another preview of what is wrong with the watch4.

    My wife and I own all the iphone XS Max devices, numerous apple watches from the beginning, the home pods, the air pods, iPad pro, iPad minis, iMac, 3 apple TV 4K devices and we are a big fan of their products. But they do make mistakes and the public should say it so people know.
    At the end of the day you just have to choose between if the people that have sounded like you for the past thirty or so years are right about Apple screwing up so badly that they are going to loose all their customers, or go with… what's actually happening in the world.

    Yes, you did have some problems, but it is impossible to test all real life conditions in a secret lab somewhere. Even giving the device to thousands of employees to try before launch isn't enough to catch any and all potential problems. Simply ramping up the production might introduce problems not seen before, or a small subset of users run into problems because the software isn't calibrated to how their fingers are registered by the device due to whatever they do at work, or even due to the weather conditions at a way different place in the world. It is impossible to test everything. Heck, bugs might even be introduced somewhere between the software used when the product was introduced and when it was made available; or the product might be shipped with a version of the software that is outdated by the time it arrives to most users.

    You just have to accept all that, or, like a lot of people do, wait a bit instead of switching to the new products on day one of them being available.
    elector
  • Reply 54 of 58
    svanstrom said:
    At the end of the day you just have to choose between if the people that have sounded like you for the past thirty or so years are right about Apple screwing up so badly that they are going to loose all their customers, or go with… what's actually happening in the world.

    Yes, you did have some problems, but it is impossible to test all real life conditions in a secret lab somewhere. Even giving the device to thousands of employees to try before launch isn't enough to catch any and all potential problems. Simply ramping up the production might introduce problems not seen before, or a small subset of users run into problems because the software isn't calibrated to how their fingers are registered by the device due to whatever they do at work, or even due to the weather conditions at a way different place in the world. It is impossible to test everything. Heck, bugs might even be introduced somewhere between the software used when the product was introduced and when it was made available; or the product might be shipped with a version of the software that is outdated by the time it arrives to most users.

    You just have to accept all that, or, like a lot of people do, wait a bit instead of switching to the new products on day one of them being available.
    I can agree with much of your statements. My wife was saying that in releasing the products a percentage will fail. She is correct this happens with any product.
    However you must find it humorous in that no sooner was iOS12 and WatchOs 5 were released the company was already seeding 12.01 and 5.01 to fix issues and make enhancements to their devices. It still rings true that a company acting in this manner knows prior to release that they had issues with their products and released them anyway in order to garner revenue. 

    Years ago and still to this day people said that was the way Microsoft operated. They still do. They push out updates and fixes for fixes constantly. Now you have Apple doing the same business technique. The other bug I noticed was the so called automatic updating on the iphone XS does not function as it was claimed. Still have to go into the apps system and check for updates as you did before, epic hype once again. In fact it is a real pain that apps either purchased or free still are not compatible after all these updates because the app developers stopped updating their apps for the new iOS release. I have three apps that I paid for and now all it states is not compatible. so a waste of money.

    I am sure last evening when we were testing out our new watches walkie talkie feature we counted 18 times pressing talk before it even said connecting to (my wife's name) and then my wife said it took her 10 presses to get a connecting to me on the watch. I am thinking that it may be a cellular company issue. I have not read if the walkie talkie feature works like Facetime and through Apple and not from verizon's service. Will check into it today.
  • Reply 55 of 58
    elector said:
    However you must find it humorous in that no sooner was iOS12 and WatchOs 5 were released the company was already seeding 12.01 and 5.01 to fix issues and make enhancements to their devices.
    You call it "humorous" that they instantly start fixing all the things that it was impossible for them to catch before launch, as well as making enhancements? What did you expect, that the first iPhone with the first OS would be such perfection that there'd be no upgrades and nothing to be improved? What'll "12.1" be to you, hilarious, or a sign of how Apple are failing by making things better?

    Just listen more to your wife.
  • Reply 56 of 58
    svanstrom said:
    elector said:
    However you must find it humorous in that no sooner was iOS12 and WatchOs 5 were released the company was already seeding 12.01 and 5.01 to fix issues and make enhancements to their devices.
    You call it "humorous" that they instantly start fixing all the things that it was impossible for them to catch before launch, as well as making enhancements? What did you expect, that the first iPhone with the first OS would be such perfection that there'd be no upgrades and nothing to be improved? What'll "12.1" be to you, hilarious, or a sign of how Apple are failing by making things better?

    Just listen more to your wife.
    I find it humorous that in the release time (day) to the next day after Apple is seeding fixes already. It implies they knew of the buggy issues prior to release. That is not really humorous per se. in that the company was in such a rush to get the product to market at the expense of the consumer. Yes other companies also do the same tactic.
    Fixing it after the sale. I don't approve of that type of business.

    I always listen to my wife. She has stopped me from returning or canceling many a product or services. Improvements I am always for. Shoddy manufacturing or rushed product productions I am not.
  • Reply 57 of 58
    ivanhivanh Posts: 597member
    ECG feature, read a recent article from NewScientist that scientists are warning that consumer using ECG features may risk their lives more because more patients will be prescribed with blood thinner medication unnecessarily. And Apple has no measure at all to prevent false alarm.  See “New Apple Watch’s potential risks”, Clare Wilson, on 22nd September 2018, NewScientist.
  • Reply 58 of 58
    ivanh said:
    ECG feature, read a recent article from NewScientist that scientists are warning that consumer using ECG features may risk their lives more because more patients will be prescribed with blood thinner medication unnecessarily. And Apple has no measure at all to prevent false alarm.  See “New Apple Watch’s potential risks”, Clare Wilson, on 22nd September 2018, NewScientist.
    And you felt that you had to copy-paste spam that into every thread that mentions the Apple Watch?

    Fun fact: Apple Watches don't write prescriptions for medications. Whatever the watch says about anything you need to take to a real doctor, that should NEVER hand out any drugs whatsoever based on nothing more than a patient saying "my watch said something so I googled my way to wanting [this] drug".

    There will always be shitty doctors, but IMNSHO that shouldn't be a reason for warning people about having access to their own data/health tech devices.
    Soli
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