Forensics firm urges police not to look at screens of iPhones with Face ID



  • Reply 21 of 24
    sphericspheric Posts: 1,786member
    macxpress said:
    spheric said:
    NemWan said:
    "Hey Siri, whose phone is this?" disables FaceID/TouchID.
    Just tried this (in German). It showed me my own contact data and definitely did NOT disable Face ID.
    It worked for must not have done something right. Either way though...not something you want to do when being asked to unlock your phone. It's not very inconspicuous. 
    Yeah worked for me too on my SE, it gave the contact details but when I went to open it it required my 15 letter diceware passcode. Which is moderately annoying. What you could do is simply say that it's not your phone and then just say 'look.. hey Siri whose phone is it', then you can say, oops sorry I guess it was my iPhone after all. The cops wouldn't even realise.
    Just tried it again. The issue is that if you LOOK at it while asking it, it will unlock the phone and then answer. 

    If you just "Hey Siri" it while not in reach of Face ID (or with your eyes closed), it will disable Face ID.
  • Reply 22 of 24
    eightzeroeightzero Posts: 2,483member
    entropys said:
    I don’t think the fifth amendment is ‘arbitrary’. Americans had to vote for it., they didn't. I guess you could say it was foisted upon the colonials by some renegades from the crown. They did tend to call themselves "Americans" but more commonly "Virginians" and "Georgians" and similar. 
  • Reply 23 of 24
    davidw said:
    these arbitrary decisions such as 5th amendment protecting your face but not your deadbolt key need to be decided.   People's rights shouldn't be decided on a whim or case by case basis.  Rules should be more defined.  We can hold your house keys against you but not your actual face, but maybe a good picture of your face we can use or we'll 3D print a composite of your face from the pic and use that...h'
    The 5th Amendment do not protect your face or your fingerprint. They are treated the same as the key to your deadbolt. The government, with a search warrant, can get the key to your deadbolt from your landlord or hire a locksmith. Just as they can take a mug shot of your face or get your fingerprint when charged with a crime and booked. 

    However, unlike having the key to a deadbolt, which anyone can use to unlock your door and there's no need to force you to do it, having a picture of your face or an ink copy of your fingerprint will not unlock your iPhone. The real question is, can you be forced to unlock your own phone, knowing that what's in it will incriminate you in a crime. Where as the government don't need you to unlock your deadbolt once they have the key, they still need you to unlock your phone, by placing the your correct finger/thumb  on the sensor or looking into your phone with the right facial expression. 

    So far, it seems with several court rulings, that what ever is required to unlock your phone, be it your fingerprint, face or pass code, is not protected by the 5th, as it is not considered self incrimination to unlock your phone, even if you know that there is evidence in your phone, that may be used against you. And not doing so can get you tossed in jail on a contempt of court charge. 

    However, with a pass code, the government can not force you reveal your pass code, if you simply tell them ... "I forgot". The government can still initially toss you in jail for not unlocking your phone but eventually they have to ask ....... what if you actually did forget your pass code? How can they prove that you didn't forget? It is not impossible nor  improbable, that someone might forget their pass code.

    Now if you clearly tell the courts that you know your pass code but you're not going to unlock your phone, then theoretically, the courts can toss you in jail for contempt, until you unlock your phone or until they found some other way to get the information from it and they no longer need the pass code from you. 

    Well, the courts and Congress most definitely accept the “l forgot” condition when it’s a politician being questioned.
  • Reply 24 of 24
    ZytkiewiczZytkiewicz Posts: 1unconfirmed, member
    macxpress said:
    NemWan said:
    "Hey Siri, whose phone is this?" disables FaceID/TouchID.
    I wasn't aware of that one. There's always the five quick taps on the power button. Someone can do that without even taking their phone from their pocket.

    That is SOS on a newer phone which also makes a loud noise until you cancel it. Probably not a good idea. 
    If you're trying to lock your phone so that you can't be forced by police to unlock it biometrically what does it matter? If you're in that situation it's more important to get your phone locked. As an added bonus calling emergency services means there's going to be an independent recording of your police interaction.
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