What dongles do you need for presenting? If your projector doesn’t have USB C you just connect a USB C to HDMI cable or adapter. Other than that what do you need? You can flip slides with your phone, your watch, or a Bluetooth clicker.
You act like presenting is some sort dark magic. At home you probably already had a USB hub for connecting things to your laptop (or you should have). The ports on MacBooks aren’t really an issue unless you never upgrade your gear or just buy a thousand dongles instead of one that fits your needs.
Personally my I got a TB2 to TB3 adapter and that was all I needed.
"At home you probably already had a USB hub for connecting things to your laptop (or you should have)."
So it's user error if they at home have a minimalistic setup without a USB hub?
You can't get away from the fact for many people a MBP has a battery that lasts all day, and that it easily fits into very slim sleeves/bags; and it's a fact that wherever you go there's already a HDMI cable ready for presentations… Not having an HDMI port on a computer meant for professionals is a bit ridiculous.
If they put a 9900K in the Mac mini and sell it for less than $1500 with 32 GB of RAM I would regret my Threadripper 2990wx Linux purchase. Combining two or three Mac Minis would likely give as much performance as my Threadripper system (my work is generally embarrassingly parallel).
If they put a 9900K in the Mac mini and sell it for less than $1500 with 32 GB of RAM I would regret my Threadripper 2990wx Linux purchase. Combining two or three Mac Minis would likely give as much performance as my Threadripper system (my work is generally embarrassingly parallel).
No way that comes out under $1500, so you need not worry. The top-end configuration will be an i7 with 32 GB for over $2000 — specs and pricing comparable to the Intel NUC 8.
Using an i9 for the top end would cost even more, obviously.
[...] Also one snagged USB-C cord and a $4k macbook pro flying off a desk is not something I would look forward to or consider a design 'upgrade'...
You're overestimating the gripping power of a USB-C connection. It pops out when the cord gets snagged. I speak from experience. I share my living space with dogs who like to chase each other around the house. They frequently gather up the power cord for my MBP as they race by, and it has never once dragged the computer off the table.
If anything, my complaint about the USB-C port is that the grip is too weak. After two years of use, my computer occasionally fails to charge overnight because bumping it can dislodge the cable just enough to disrupt power.
It would be cool if Apple had a design that had a nice light indicator on it so you know if it’s charging. My computer has that feature. It’s a 2012 MacBook Pro. So it is correct here to say Apple has gone a step backward, regardless of how you slice it.
An iMac Pro update would make sense because the whole point of that model was to show pros that Apple still cared about them, and it would need to be regularly updated to carry that message.
What components could be updated? Intel hasn’t refreshed the CPUs Apple uses yet.
They haven't refreshed them but they have announced a new addition to the line, the Xeon W 3175X with 28-cores (previous highest being 18 cores). It's not shipping until December but a new 28-core iMac Pro could ship then.
Also AMD is keynoting CES on Jan 9 and is expected to announce the worlds first 7nm GPUs. When the original iMac Pro was announced at WWDC 2017 it included an as yet unreleased GPU (the Vega 56/64 was not yet out).
And it would also need whatever non-CPU and GPU upgrades the standard iMac gets. I am thinking/hoping for an HDR screen given that Apple sells HDR content on the iTunes Store, some iDevices already have this, and it would enable creative pros to create/preview HDR content.
The new Xeon-W 3175X uses a completely different platform/socket (LGA3647) from the earlier Xeon-W hardware used in the iMac Pro (LGA2066). So that’s not happening.
Whatever AMD unveils at CES, it could appear in the Mac Pro or some kind of iMac Pro refresh/revision next year, but Apple isn’t going to pre-announce it this Tuesday!
Your only point that makes any sense is your last one — I find myself wondering if the talk of a new iMac display is wrong (because it would mean the iMac would have a better display than the iMac Pro), and the iMacs are just getting a simple refresh while Apple is releasing a new Thunderbolt 3 display — it’s not hard to imagine how supply-chain insiders could get that wrong.
Personally I really dislike having a bag full of costly, messy dongles that seem outdated every few years, and one can of course arrive at a meeting and be surprised by a need for something one does not have... Also one snagged USB-C cord and a $4k macbook pro flying off a desk is not something I would look forward to or consider a design 'upgrade'…
My wife just upgraded from a 2011 MBP and I got her a Satechi USB-C Pro Hub that has 2 - USB-C (that runs at full 40GB/s, not 5 like most hubs), 2 - USB-A (USB 3.1), HDMI and SD Card and micro-SD card readers.
It's not cheap, but we can use all our existing cables and carry only ONE dongle.
I've been running a 2012 MacBook Pro and getting ready to upgrade and picked up a CalDigit TS3 Plus Thunderbolt 3 Station for my office. 15 ports, full 87 watt charging ability. ONE cable to connect to my MacBook Pro.
Again, not cheap, but it has all the ports I'll ever need and I can use all my existing cables and devices.
An iMac Pro update would make sense because the whole point of that model was to show pros that Apple still cared about them, and it would need to be regularly updated to carry that message.
What components could be updated? Intel hasn’t refreshed the CPUs Apple uses yet.
They haven't refreshed them but they have announced a new addition to the line, the Xeon W 3175X with 28-cores (previous highest being 18 cores). It's not shipping until December but a new 28-core iMac Pro could ship then.
Also AMD is keynoting CES on Jan 9 and is expected to announce the worlds first 7nm GPUs. When the original iMac Pro was announced at WWDC 2017 it included an as yet unreleased GPU (the Vega 56/64 was not yet out).
And it would also need whatever non-CPU and GPU upgrades the standard iMac gets. I am thinking/hoping for an HDR screen given that Apple sells HDR content on the iTunes Store, some iDevices already have this, and it would enable creative pros to create/preview HDR content.
The 3175-X wouldn’t be usable by Apple in iMac Pro, it’s a $10,000 265W part (not 140W like the other CPUs in the iMac Pro) but more particularly, as Tenthousandthings points out above, it would require a re-designed logic board.
re: graphics update announcing is one thing but it depends on when AMD can actually deliver. There have been rather long lag times between those two events in the past.
You make a good point with the display, I could see it being updated immediately. But I think we’re probably looking at an 18-24 month refresh cycle for iMac Pro, and most likely it would include CPU and GPU updates.
My bet is on a 13” MacBook, killing the air and making the whole line Retina and USBC. Maybe the new 13” will have 2 USBC, and maybe this will even replace the non-touchbar pro? It’s not an air, and not a pro, therefore it’s just MacBook! I’m expecting something like:
- 12” MacBook $999 - 13” MacBook $1299 - 13” MacBook Pro $1799 - 15” MacBook Pro $2399
A 1" difference in display size alone doesn't make a $300 difference in price. The 13" Air is currently $999 and the 12" Macbook is $1299. The Air starts with 128GB SSD, the Macbook starts at 256GB. The Macbook has a Retina display, Air doesn't. The 256GB Air is $1199.
The Macbook Pro pulled the side bezels in a bit, a 13" Macbook could do the same. If they have an entry model with 128GB SSD, they can start it at $1099 but SSD prices should be low enough to allow them to hit $1099 with 256GB and either way, ditch the Air.
A 15" Macbook would be nice too. With TB3, people could hook up an external GPU for extra power. The 15" form-factor is the most popular in the world and Apple's starts at $2400 now. It's possible to buy a 15" PC under $500. A $1499 15" Macbook would be doable pretty easily. I'd like to see an entry 15" Pro at $1999 again. They won't want to have an entry model without a touchbar because they know that would sell the most units so maybe the entry price will always be $2400 now. At some point they should reflect the lower SSD prices in the retail price. $200 for a 128GB upgrade is crazy when 500GB retail SSDs are going for $90.
Apple could afford to take a hit on the margins for the Macs. Say $3b average across 19m Macs, which still leaves over $3b in profit. This is $157 per Mac and it can be $100 off the high volume low end and $400 off the low volume higher end so the Macbook can hit $999 and the MBP $1999. Then the unit volume goes up a bit and they make back some of the profit drop.
I'm very sensitive to Apple messing with the MacBook Air model as it seems to be the last remnant of practical computing.
Is USB-C for power better? It's really not, it's consuming a valuable port and MagSafe could be argued was an excellent design. USB-C for power feels like a step backward in that regard.
I was at an Apple event recently and watching the presenter carry his new MacBook Pro around with various dongles hanging off to be able to connect devices was quietly ridiculous.
1) it doesn’t “use up” a port because they wouldn’t have included four ports plus magsafe. So this is a power port that can also be an anything-port. That’s a pro, not a con.
2) what’s ridiculous is that he didn’t have the proper cables which have been out forever now.
I'm very sensitive to Apple messing with the MacBook Air model as it seems to be the last remnant of practical computing.
Is USB-C for power better? It's really not, it's consuming a valuable port and MagSafe could be argued was an excellent design. USB-C for power feels like a step backward in that regard.
I was at an Apple event recently and watching the presenter carry his new MacBook Pro around with various dongles hanging off to be able to connect devices was quietly ridiculous.
Almost as ridiculous as brining up the fucking dongle argument again. My god get over it already. It's not that big of a deal. Shame on Apple for making a laptop more practical without having set in stone ports on the sides.
Less practical for anyone that ever does presentations though. And for a company that does great design those dongles are just fudging ugly.
Then buy USBC cables and stop using them. But you don’t even have one so it’s all moot.
So is this MacBook Air replacement still going to be called MacBook Air? And is the higher resolution screen going to be the same as what’s in the retina MacBook and MacBook Pro? Also is it going to look like the retina MacBook or be thicker and heavier? If this device gets a retina screen what’s the point of the retina MacBook? Who would buy it, especially if this new laptop is cheaper?
It's almost like we'll have to wait 'til Tuesday since it's clear that nobody knows the answers to any of this.
Yeah I really don’t understand all the neurotic handwringing. It’s a disorder.
I'm very sensitive to Apple messing with the MacBook Air model as it seems to be the last remnant of practical computing.
Is USB-C for power better? It's really not, it's consuming a valuable port and MagSafe could be argued was an excellent design. USB-C for power feels like a step backward in that regard.
I was at an Apple event recently and watching the presenter carry his new MacBook Pro around with various dongles hanging off to be able to connect devices was quietly ridiculous.
Almost as ridiculous as brining up the fucking dongle argument again. My god get over it already. It's not that big of a deal. Shame on Apple for making a laptop more practical without having set in stone ports on the sides.
Less practical for anyone that ever does presentations though. And for a company that does great design those dongles are just fudging ugly.
Then buy USBC cables and stop using them. But you don’t even have one so it’s all moot.
So… your best attempt at a personal attack is based on that I’m still hanging on to a MBP with an HDMI port? That’s kinda sad…
I'm very sensitive to Apple messing with the MacBook Air model as it seems to be the last remnant of practical computing.
Is USB-C for power better? It's really not, it's consuming a valuable port and MagSafe could be argued was an excellent design. USB-C for power feels like a step backward in that regard.
I was at an Apple event recently and watching the presenter carry his new MacBook Pro around with various dongles hanging off to be able to connect devices was quietly ridiculous.
"Various dongles" = a single HDMI to USB-C adapter. GET THE FUCK OVER IT.
USB-C for power means you can just plug into your dock, monitor, whatever and get power as well. You can use portable power bricks from any vendor. It's the future. Magsafe means you need your proprietary Apple charger.
Since when does such abusive potty mouth incite represent the spirit of non-troll posting or constructive contribution ?
Personally I really dislike having a bag full of costly, messy dongles that seem outdated every few years, and one can of course arrive at a meeting and be surprised by a need for something one does not have... Also one snagged USB-C cord and a $4k macbook pro flying off a desk is not something I would look forward to or consider a design 'upgrade'...
Opinions and needs differ. Was someone having a bad day? Live and let live...?
Adults use adult language.
MBs get all-day battery life now, you’re not going to trip over your imaginary MacBook’s imaginary cord and lose your imaginary investment. If you’re so scared of this, buy a third-party magnet charging adapter for your imaginary MB. They’re out there.
What dongles do you need for presenting? If your projector doesn’t have USB C you just connect a USB C to HDMI cable or adapter. Other than that what do you need? You can flip slides with your phone, your watch, or a Bluetooth clicker.
You act like presenting is some sort dark magic. At home you probably already had a USB hub for connecting things to your laptop (or you should have). The ports on MacBooks aren’t really an issue unless you never upgrade your gear or just buy a thousand dongles instead of one that fits your needs.
Personally my I got a TB2 to TB3 adapter and that was all I needed.
"At home you probably already had a USB hub for connecting things to your laptop (or you should have)."
So it's user error if they at home have a minimalistic setup without a USB hub?
You can't get away from the fact for many people a MBP has a battery that lasts all day, and that it easily fits into very slim sleeves/bags; and it's a fact that wherever you go there's already a HDMI cable ready for presentations… Not having an HDMI port on a computer meant for professionals is a bit ridiculous.
That’s absurd nonsense. I’m a pro and have no need for a dopey HDMI port. Get an HDMI cable for your use cas and stop crying in your cup. No dongles needed.
I'm very sensitive to Apple messing with the MacBook Air model as it seems to be the last remnant of practical computing.
Is USB-C for power better? It's really not, it's consuming a valuable port and MagSafe could be argued was an excellent design. USB-C for power feels like a step backward in that regard.
I was at an Apple event recently and watching the presenter carry his new MacBook Pro around with various dongles hanging off to be able to connect devices was quietly ridiculous.
Almost as ridiculous as brining up the fucking dongle argument again. My god get over it already. It's not that big of a deal. Shame on Apple for making a laptop more practical without having set in stone ports on the sides.
Less practical for anyone that ever does presentations though. And for a company that does great design those dongles are just fudging ugly.
Then buy USBC cables and stop using them. But you don’t even have one so it’s all moot.
So… your best attempt at a personal attack is based on that I’m still hanging on to a MBP with an HDMI port? That’s kinda sad…
It’s not a personal attack. Your spouting some bullshit about need dongles while ignoring the fact that you don’t need a dongle because you can get a normal HDMI USBC cable for years now. But it’s all moot because you don’t even have one of these machines despite your excited hand-waiving.
I liked MagSafe when I had it on an old MB. My 2015 MB is very light and a snag on the cable does not release it easily. The MB goes flying and I have snagged it mid-air to avoid the unthinkable.
That said, two USB-C ports and plugs can fit in the space of one MagSafe port and plug.
I understand that a lot of gear is becoming legacy gear. My MUG's site is a school computer lab and the projector is ancient. The 'if your projector doesn't have USB-C' statement is ludicrous. 99.6% of projectors in service don't have USB-C.
There are two dongles in my kit: a USB-C to ethernet, and a dongle to rule them all, almost. It doesn't have enet so there's a second dongle. I'm not crazy about it, but I'll get by.
My complaint against dongles is simple— so many don't work as advertised or at all. Too many people seem to have a problem with them and none are without numerous bad reviews, so it make buying one a leap of faith. I got lucky and am 2 for 2 to the good.
USB-C offers a ton of versatility and is the future. The future has to start somewhere, and there's no time like the present. So lead or follow but get out of the way. And quit whining.
I'm very sensitive to Apple messing with the MacBook Air model as it seems to be the last remnant of practical computing.
Is USB-C for power better? It's really not, it's consuming a valuable port and MagSafe could be argued was an excellent design. USB-C for power feels like a step backward in that regard.
I was at an Apple event recently and watching the presenter carry his new MacBook Pro around with various dongles hanging off to be able to connect devices was quietly ridiculous.
Almost as ridiculous as brining up the fucking dongle argument again. My god get over it already. It's not that big of a deal. Shame on Apple for making a laptop more practical without having set in stone ports on the sides.
Less practical for anyone that ever does presentations though. And for a company that does great design those dongles are just fudging ugly.
Then buy USBC cables and stop using them. But you don’t even have one so it’s all moot.
So… your best attempt at a personal attack is based on that I’m still hanging on to a MBP with an HDMI port? That’s kinda sad…
It’s not a personal attack. Your spouting some bullshit about need dongles while ignoring the fact that you don’t need a dongle because you can get a normal HDMI USBC cable for years now. But it’s all moot because you don’t even have one of these machines despite your excited hand-waiving.
Call it a dongle or a cable, whatever it is it is one more thing to carry just to get back basic functionality for us pros that actually present stuff…
I'm very sensitive to Apple messing with the MacBook Air model as it seems to be the last remnant of practical computing.
Is USB-C for power better? It's really not, it's consuming a valuable port and MagSafe could be argued was an excellent design. USB-C for power feels like a step backward in that regard.
I was at an Apple event recently and watching the presenter carry his new MacBook Pro around with various dongles hanging off to be able to connect devices was quietly ridiculous.
"Various dongles" = a single HDMI to USB-C adapter. GET THE FUCK OVER IT.
USB-C for power means you can just plug into your dock, monitor, whatever and get power as well. You can use portable power bricks from any vendor. It's the future. Magsafe means you need your proprietary Apple charger.
Since when does such abusive potty mouth incite represent the spirit of non-troll posting or constructive contribution ?
Personally I really dislike having a bag full of costly, messy dongles that seem outdated every few years, and one can of course arrive at a meeting and be surprised by a need for something one does not have... Also one snagged USB-C cord and a $4k macbook pro flying off a desk is not something I would look forward to or consider a design 'upgrade'...
Opinions and needs differ. Was someone having a bad day? Live and let live...?
Seriously get over it. That ship has long sailed.
if folks would quit harping over dumb stuff that isn’t going to change maybe some folks wouldn’t get so frustrated and use adult language.
oh and the “bag of dongles” comment is pure trolling.
If they put a 9900K in the Mac mini and sell it for less than $1500 with 32 GB of RAM I would regret my Threadripper 2990wx Linux purchase. Combining two or three Mac Minis would likely give as much performance as my Threadripper system (my work is generally embarrassingly parallel).
I have work that was embarrassingly parallel that I threw a Xeon Phi at. No extra fussing with CUDA or OpenCL and it worked.
Comments
So it's user error if they at home have a minimalistic setup without a USB hub?
You can't get away from the fact for many people a MBP has a battery that lasts all day, and that it easily fits into very slim sleeves/bags; and it's a fact that wherever you go there's already a HDMI cable ready for presentations… Not having an HDMI port on a computer meant for professionals is a bit ridiculous.
Using an i9 for the top end would cost even more, obviously.
Whatever AMD unveils at CES, it could appear in the Mac Pro or some kind of iMac Pro refresh/revision next year, but Apple isn’t going to pre-announce it this Tuesday!
Your only point that makes any sense is your last one — I find myself wondering if the talk of a new iMac display is wrong (because it would mean the iMac would have a better display than the iMac Pro), and the iMacs are just getting a simple refresh while Apple is releasing a new Thunderbolt 3 display — it’s not hard to imagine how supply-chain insiders could get that wrong.
It's not cheap, but we can use all our existing cables and carry only ONE dongle.
https://satechi.net/collections/usb-type-c/products/aluminum-type-c-pro-hub-adapter-for-2016-macbook-pro-13-and-15-40gbs-thunderbolt-3-4k-hdmi-pass-through-charging-sd-micro-card-reader-and-2-usb-3-0-ports
I've been running a 2012 MacBook Pro and getting ready to upgrade and picked up a CalDigit TS3 Plus Thunderbolt 3 Station for my office. 15 ports, full 87 watt charging ability. ONE cable to connect to my MacBook Pro.
Again, not cheap, but it has all the ports I'll ever need and I can use all my existing cables and devices.
http://www.caldigit.com/thunderbolt-3-dock/thunderbolt-station-3-plus/
re: graphics update announcing is one thing but it depends on when AMD can actually deliver. There have been rather long lag times between those two events in the past.
You make a good point with the display, I could see it being updated immediately. But I think we’re probably looking at an 18-24 month refresh cycle for iMac Pro, and most likely it would include CPU and GPU updates.
The Macbook Pro pulled the side bezels in a bit, a 13" Macbook could do the same. If they have an entry model with 128GB SSD, they can start it at $1099 but SSD prices should be low enough to allow them to hit $1099 with 256GB and either way, ditch the Air.
A 15" Macbook would be nice too. With TB3, people could hook up an external GPU for extra power. The 15" form-factor is the most popular in the world and Apple's starts at $2400 now. It's possible to buy a 15" PC under $500. A $1499 15" Macbook would be doable pretty easily. I'd like to see an entry 15" Pro at $1999 again. They won't want to have an entry model without a touchbar because they know that would sell the most units so maybe the entry price will always be $2400 now. At some point they should reflect the lower SSD prices in the retail price. $200 for a 128GB upgrade is crazy when 500GB retail SSDs are going for $90.
13" Macbook, 128GB/8GB, $1099
13" Macbook Pro, 256GB/8GB, $1299
15" Macbook, 256GB/8GB, $1499
15" Macbook Pro, 256GB, 16GB, $1999
Apple could afford to take a hit on the margins for the Macs. Say $3b average across 19m Macs, which still leaves over $3b in profit. This is $157 per Mac and it can be $100 off the high volume low end and $400 off the low volume higher end so the Macbook can hit $999 and the MBP $1999. Then the unit volume goes up a bit and they make back some of the profit drop.
2) what’s ridiculous is that he didn’t have the proper cables which have been out forever now.
Then buy USBC cables and stop using them. But you don’t even have one so it’s all moot.
Yeah I really don’t understand all the neurotic handwringing. It’s a disorder.
Adults use adult language.
MBs get all-day battery life now, you’re not going to trip over your imaginary MacBook’s imaginary cord and lose your imaginary investment. If you’re so scared of this, buy a third-party magnet charging adapter for your imaginary MB. They’re out there.
It’s not a personal attack. Your spouting some bullshit about need dongles while ignoring the fact that you don’t need a dongle because you can get a normal HDMI USBC cable for years now. But it’s all moot because you don’t even have one of these machines despite your excited hand-waiving.
That said, two USB-C ports and plugs can fit in the space of one MagSafe port and plug.
I understand that a lot of gear is becoming legacy gear. My MUG's site is a school computer lab and the projector is ancient. The 'if your projector doesn't have USB-C' statement is ludicrous. 99.6% of projectors in service don't have USB-C.
There are two dongles in my kit: a USB-C to ethernet, and a dongle to rule them all, almost. It doesn't have enet so there's a second dongle. I'm not crazy about it, but I'll get by.
My complaint against dongles is simple— so many don't work as advertised or at all. Too many people seem to have a problem with them and none are without numerous bad reviews, so it make buying one a leap of faith. I got lucky and am 2 for 2 to the good.
USB-C offers a ton of versatility and is the future. The future has to start somewhere, and there's no time like the present. So lead or follow but get out of the way. And quit whining.
if folks would quit harping over dumb stuff that isn’t going to change maybe some folks wouldn’t get so frustrated and use adult language.
oh and the “bag of dongles” comment is pure trolling.
of course I have source code so...