Declining iPhone sales in India is a sign Apple is failing to adapt its business

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Comments

  • Reply 21 of 41
     "It is claimed OnePlus' focus on improving battery life for the market helped with its marketing in the region." 

    What does this gibberish even mean?  


    magman1979
  • Reply 22 of 41
    mike1mike1 Posts: 1,923member
    They have been failing on cloud services for a long time. There’s only so much phones you can sell. Google and Microsoft have taken the business market through their suite of excellent collaborative tools and professional hosting services. Amazon has taken their cut on pure hosting services. Apple kept us with bare bones consumer stuff and it’s not working except for consumers who do not look for anything else. 
    Meanwhile I can’t even edit a ‘group’ of items in Keynote because I shared the file - a process that often fails a couple of times before it works.

    I’m super bearish on Apple. Their OS ecosystem is great but they have not built their company around truly scalable SaaS solutions. Tim Cook is the wrong leader for this day and age. 
    That's like saying GM is failing because they decided not to make airplanes. Choosing to focus on what they believe to be their business (primarily consumer devices and services) and do it well has led to Apple's success.

    Google only makes money through advertising. EVERYTHING else they do including their "suite of excellent collaborative tools and professional hosting services" exists only to drive the advertising business.

    MS failed miserably at consumer devices (exception being XBox) for years before expanding into cloud services.

  • Reply 23 of 41
    They have been failing on cloud services for a long time. There’s only so much phones you can sell. Google and Microsoft have taken the business market through their suite of excellent collaborative tools and professional hosting services. Amazon has taken their cut on pure hosting services. Apple kept us with bare bones consumer stuff and it’s not working except for consumers who do not look for anything else. 
    Meanwhile I can’t even edit a ‘group’ of items in Keynote because I shared the file - a process that often fails a couple of times before it works.

    I’m super bearish on Apple. Their OS ecosystem is great but they have not built their company around truly scalable SaaS solutions. Tim Cook is the wrong leader for this day and age. 

    Right.  Other than the 350 million subscriptions running in the App Store including 60 million Apple Music subs.   The 50 billion iMessages/day.   12 million Apply Pay transactions/day.   900 million iCloud accounts

    Apple does not do "truly scalable" solutions  
    brisance
  • Reply 24 of 41
    jdgazjdgaz Posts: 357member
    Who wrote this hit piece.
  • Reply 25 of 41
    Over 99% of the population is literally dirt poor. Chinese manufacturers are willing to make single digit margins. Apple is a luxury brand. At some point India may catch up - but for now they are not a large market for Apple products - my guess is that BMWs and Rolex don't sell well either. I've worked at companies that outsource jobs to India - they are willing to work for 1/6th the salary of American workers.
    longpathmagman1979red oak
  • Reply 26 of 41
    Given the tariff situation, it seems the only way that Apple is going to be able to compete is with locally produced products. If the government tacks on a significant charge to your imported product; but not your competitor's local product, you're at a disadvantage. The question is whether local product has similar margins or is this a case of diminishing returns?
  • Reply 27 of 41
    gatorguygatorguy Posts: 21,095member
    clarker99 said:
    Lol... Apple is just fine. With or without India. Like wtf?
    We don't see market share stories about Columbia, or Indonesia, or even Russia. No one would bat an eye or waste time writing a story about how India sales are (under)performing either if Mr Cook himself had not called attention to Apple plans for them, making them a major priority. They were noted as potentially "the next China", a new and immense source of profit for them.  . 
    https://www.business-standard.com/article/companies/tim-cook-explains-why-india-could-be-the-next-china-for-apple-117080200265_1.html
    https://www.cnbc.com/2016/10/26/apple-india-new-china-as-iphone-sales-grow-50-percent.html ;
    https://www.wsj.com/articles/apple-looks-to-india-for-growth-1463512228

    ...and fanblogs and friendly trade papers bragging of the apparent success Apple was having there which made everything sound pretty darn positive and rosy. 
    https://appleinsider.com/articles/16/11/28/apple-killing-it-in-india-grabs-first-place-with-66-of-premium-phone-sales
    https://appleinsider.com/articles/16/05/06/iphone-sales-surge-56-in-india-as-apple-eats-into-samsungs-high-end-share

    If blogs and analysts are now noting it's not working out like they promoted it to be it's entirely due to Apple's PR themselves wanting them to pay attention to their next big success. 



    edited December 2018 muthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 28 of 41
    avon b7avon b7 Posts: 4,180member
    Many people are implying Apple's luxury brand has no place in India. The article makes it clear that this isn't the case and mentions TC's plans for Apple there. FTA:

    "The potential for the emerging market was noted by Apple CEO Tim Cook and other executives, producing a five-year plan to make India the next growth market and to raise annual sales to $5 billion by 2020"

    The only problems Apple have had are with direct competition in its premium segment and every tier below it, combined with management issues.

    Apple needs to adapt if it wants to reach the goals it set out for itself.
    muthuk_vanalingamelijahg
  • Reply 29 of 41
    vulcan__ said:
    I believe it is time for Apple to get out of India. Apple is not ready to change the pricing strategy and my countrymen are not ready to change their mindset.

    The entire country rallies behind cheap android phones and have zilch worries when it comes to privacy and sharing data.


    wow a little snobby, 
    elijahg
  • Reply 30 of 41
    rob53rob53 Posts: 2,084member
    Isn't India filled with outsourced tech support hot lines for almost every company except Apple? Why would someone in India buy an iPhone if Apple isn't willing to use the services of its population? I can't imagine these call support people buying anything from a company they aren't supporting. Who knows, maybe they aren't even allowed to buy any Apple devices, only the devices they're paid to support.
  • Reply 31 of 41
    jungmarkjungmark Posts: 6,715member
    Apple isn't a charity. If anything, Keep releasing the old iPhones for the lower price. IPhones aren't a commodity so they shouldn't be treated as such. 
  • Reply 32 of 41
    gatorguy said:
    clarker99 said:
    Lol... Apple is just fine. With or without India. Like wtf?
    We don't see market share stories about Columbia, or Indonesia, or even Russia. No one would bat an eye or waste time writing a story about how India sales are (under)performing either if Mr Cook himself had not called attention to Apple plans for them, making them a major priority. They were noted as potentially "the next China", a new and immense source of profit for them.  . 
    https://www.business-standard.com/article/companies/tim-cook-explains-why-india-could-be-the-next-china-for-apple-117080200265_1.html
    https://www.cnbc.com/2016/10/26/apple-india-new-china-as-iphone-sales-grow-50-percent.html ;
    https://www.wsj.com/articles/apple-looks-to-india-for-growth-1463512228

    ...and fanblogs and friendly trade papers bragging of the apparent success Apple was having there which made everything sound pretty darn positive and rosy. 
    https://appleinsider.com/articles/16/11/28/apple-killing-it-in-india-grabs-first-place-with-66-of-premium-phone-sales
    https://appleinsider.com/articles/16/05/06/iphone-sales-surge-56-in-india-as-apple-eats-into-samsungs-high-end-share

    If blogs and analysts are now noting it's not working out like they promoted it to be it's entirely due to Apple's PR themselves wanting them to pay attention to their next big success. 



    Apple is going to report the biggest quarter in history... both in revenue and PROFIT. So, I repeat: Apple is doing just fine. With or without India. 

    Also, do we actually believe this article? Because no one knows Apple’s numbers but Apple. 

    Analysts and bloggers... jeez. Other than Neil Cybert at Above Avalon they are all idiots. 
  • Reply 33 of 41
    zoetmbzoetmb Posts: 2,480member
    Tim Cook is the wrong leader for this day and age. 
    Apple just had FOUR record quarters in terms of both Net Sales and Net Income.   Their Net Income (at $59.6 billion in fiscal 2018) was LARGER than their Net Sales through 2009.   Sales are 7.3x what they were 10 years ago.    But Tim Cook is failing?

    Having said that, I do think that Apple is pricing too high and there are signs that iPhone sales are tapering off substantially.  Otherwise, Apple wouldn't have pulled the b.s. that they're not going to report units anymore.  

    India's per capita income was only $1670 in 2016.   Another source says that in 2016, average annual nhousehold income was Rs 202800 (just $2883).   Even a household making 5x the average can't really afford a current iPhone.  It's amazing they sell much of anything there.  

    brisancetmayelijahg
  • Reply 34 of 41
    tmaytmay Posts: 3,935member
    gatorguy said:
    clarker99 said:
    Lol... Apple is just fine. With or without India. Like wtf?
    We don't see market share stories about Columbia, or Indonesia, or even Russia. No one would bat an eye or waste time writing a story about how India sales are (under)performing either if Mr Cook himself had not called attention to Apple plans for them, making them a major priority. They were noted as potentially "the next China", a new and immense source of profit for them.  . 
    https://www.business-standard.com/article/companies/tim-cook-explains-why-india-could-be-the-next-china-for-apple-117080200265_1.html
    https://www.cnbc.com/2016/10/26/apple-india-new-china-as-iphone-sales-grow-50-percent.html ;
    https://www.wsj.com/articles/apple-looks-to-india-for-growth-1463512228

    ...and fanblogs and friendly trade papers bragging of the apparent success Apple was having there which made everything sound pretty darn positive and rosy. 
    https://appleinsider.com/articles/16/11/28/apple-killing-it-in-india-grabs-first-place-with-66-of-premium-phone-sales
    https://appleinsider.com/articles/16/05/06/iphone-sales-surge-56-in-india-as-apple-eats-into-samsungs-high-end-share

    If blogs and analysts are now noting it's not working out like they promoted it to be it's entirely due to Apple's PR themselves wanting them to pay attention to their next big success. 



    I too am not much worried about this one way or another. Apple will go ahead and build stores in the larger urban areas anyway, figure a way into the India's spectacularly convoluted governance so manufacturing can take place locally at rising rates, and probably arrive just about the time that China is throwing its weight around in South Asia a bit too much for India's taste.

    India for Apple will be a long term project, with yet more fits and starts. I agree that Apple was a bit too optimistic publicly, but truth be told, I doubt that there is much of any profits by the Chinese OEM's either. Such is the nature of marketshare acquisition.
    edited December 2018
  • Reply 35 of 41
    I think if they follow the same code & purify... they’ll be able to Unify. Do what is righteous...
  • Reply 36 of 41
    FolioFolio Posts: 630member
    As iOS becomes more versatile, functions more similar to computer, that should appeal to price conscious anywhere, including India. When you cut through ads, create PDFs, share files, markup, etc it’s a powerful experience. That’s why Apple stores would be helpful. I’m ignorant but wondering if India govt is concerned about Apple power that e.g. Apple will take too big share of Bollywood profits in ten years...
  • Reply 37 of 41
    The problem is what Tim Cook explained in on of the interviews about ever increasing ASP of iPhones. Which is, they assumes everybody buys phones from service providers on some contract or long term purchase plan. Nobody I know in India buys phone from service providers. Almost everybody buys it from the likes of amazon.in or from mobile phone shops which pop up in every street. I don't think i can every get myself to buy a phone for Rs. 100,000 ($1400 yep that's how much latest apple phone's cost in India). The Average phone price I buy is around 20K - 35K ( $300-500). And believe me I am not struggling for food :smiley: 
    edited December 2018 muthuk_vanalingampropod
  • Reply 38 of 41
    rob53 said:
    Isn't India filled with outsourced tech support hot lines for almost every company except Apple? Why would someone in India buy an iPhone if Apple isn't willing to use the services of its population? I can't imagine these call support people buying anything from a company they aren't supporting. Who knows, maybe they aren't even allowed to buy any Apple devices, only the devices they're paid to support.
    :smile: Wow!! Apple has a couple of development centers here! Nothing spectacular like the space ship campus but its there! The govt does impose lots of taxes and duties on fully imported products compared to locally manufactured ones. They can't also setup Apple stores here until some percentage of the products sold are manufactured locally. But there are no restrictions to sell through third parties.
    edited December 2018
  • Reply 39 of 41
    India is a price sensitive, and value conscious market. And clearly, Apple has been failing to deliver on the value front. In its relentless quest to up Average Selling Price, Apple has now upped the price points of its products to a level where even Apple loyalists look at Android as an alternative. I believe Apple's India sales serve as early warning signal that the direction Apple is headed in could have serious problems down the road.

    This is the first year when Apple has completely shifted away from its earlier sub-$700 pricing. There is no iPhone available today that is below $700! Unless you consider the older models.

    It is this sort of hubris that destroyed Apple 30 years back, and looks like they haven't learned from their mistakes.

    Never take your customer's loyalty for granted. Never leave your customer feeling cheated.
    propodcropr
  • Reply 40 of 41
    hentaiboyhentaiboy Posts: 1,014member
    It’s always amused me that if you Google “Samsung xx Review”, the top results are invariably Indian websites.
    edited December 2018
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