another analysis sniffing toilets of supplier trying to count turds to back into some sort of number phones apple may or may not sell. Oh lets not forget Apple is not reporting those numbers anyone and getting a some sort of indication on what Apple service business will pull in is going to more of challenge, no toilets of suppliers to sniff for made up numbers.
Any why do you think Apple are no longer reporting numbers?
To answer that you should look at why Apple reported those numbers to begin with when everyone else didn’t
Because they were extraordinary. The sales numbers both as an absolute and relative value were absolutely vast, especially compared to Apple's previously stunning sales records with the iPod, and even more so compared to the Mac.
So here’s my 2 cents: As with any innovative and highly successful product what happens first is growth all around until you hit market saturation. This goes hand in hand in this case with global accessibility to mobile communication and an industry wide trend to have significant improvements of the first iterations, and over time hitting more or less some equilibrium from both: market saturation as well as technological progress. Apple isn’t stupid and I owe this, of course, so while they milk the cash cow before it becomes a DOG (see BCG matrix) they are long since preparing for other sources for revenue with growth oute tail as well as trying to create the next “a phone. An iPod. An internet Communications device”. And while for investors growth is above all, IMHO Apple’s biggest potential enemy are they themselves: if they cannot maintain the culture and spirit that made them where they are today. And the one thing that has this potential to kill “stay hungry. Stay foolish”, the six values of Tim Cook etc is long standing outrageous success. That’s everywhere the same risk and explains why it’s soo hard eg. for music bands that land a smash hit first album have more often issues to maintain what made them “them” in the first place. Part of the big circle one might argue. For sure, the beloved fruit company is still far far away from anything even close to seeing traces of dawn. (And if they’d they’d bring back first class designed and functional WiFi routers they’d be rlly heroes again
The golden years are over for Apple, IMO. I'm sure they'll still make billions in the future but their services like Apple TV+ don't look very enticing at all. Too much competition from others. These days, they just don't have great new products coming out every year that wow the public. That's more down to technology stagnating with 'the next big thing' probably still years away.
Agreed. There was a time when they created innovative and disruptive technologies that bordered on revolutionary (I still have my 1984 Macintosh, and my 2007 iPhone), but now it seems like the competition has caught up, and in some cases, surpassed them. I can only wonder how Apple might be different now if Steve Jobs had lived. Let’s hope the “next big thing” really is.
The golden years are over for Apple, IMO. I'm sure they'll still make billions in the future but their services like Apple TV+ don't look very enticing at all. Too much competition from others. These days, they just don't have great new products coming out every year that wow the public. That's more down to technology stagnating with 'the next big thing' probably still years away.
You got all that from an analyst guess ? Interesting..
The golden years are over for Apple, IMO. I'm sure they'll still make billions in the future but their services like Apple TV+ don't look very enticing at all. Too much competition from others. These days, they just don't have great new products coming out every year that wow the public. That's more down to technology stagnating with 'the next big thing' probably still years away.
"Custer's last stand." Replace "Custer" with "Apple" and we can see some sort of coming scenario. Instead of fighting the entire Sioux nation, Apple is fighting the entire Android nation. Apple is greatly outnumbered, so the outcome seems rather obvious. /s
Seriously, though, I'm tired of Apple stock's roller-coaster ride while Microsoft steadily climbs without fail. Apple really could have done a lot better to stop the volatility.
another analysis sniffing toilets of supplier trying to count turds to back into some sort of number phones apple may or may not sell. Oh lets not forget Apple is not reporting those numbers anyone and getting a some sort of indication on what Apple service business will pull in is going to more of challenge, no toilets of suppliers to sniff for made up numbers.
Any why do you think Apple are no longer reporting numbers?
That’s a good point. Apple announced they will stop counting numbers hoping a decrease in sales wouldn’t outweigh increased profit margins, then the next quarter they have decreased profit. I wouldn’t be surprised they are having a relatively large decrease in iPhone sales, even if they end up compensating with their services by next quarter(and it’s unclear if the services will be out by then).
If Apple isn't able to maintain margins and needs to charge £1000 for a phone to keep them in line (around 35-40%) with previous years, they need to downsize their workforce. They've filled Apple Park and pretty much every office in a mile radius of Infinite Loop, the R&D costs have ballooned in recent years. But has the quality and frequency of innovations from Apple really increased in line with R&D spend? They produced the first iPhone with an R&D budget of about $3-400m per year in the 5 years up to its release, now they spend $3 billion a year on R&D. That's 750% more, has that 7.5x increase really been worth it?
So far, the margins themselves haven't been affected, and as you mention the bump in price will only result in profits from phones decreasing over time (possibly even at this quarter's earnings report). The pushing up of prices was a stop-gap measure to try and prevent a fall in profits, but its a really short term solution and one that historically, Apple's been wise to avoid. Like many others, with the decrease in new features and increase in cost, I've switched from a two year phone cycle to a 4 year one. My 6s whilst a bit creaky still works fine and does 90% of what a Xr does.
"I've switched from a two year phone cycle to a 4 year one"
The golden years are over for Apple, IMO. I'm sure they'll still make billions in the future but their services like Apple TV+ don't look very enticing at all. Too much competition from others. These days, they just don't have great new products coming out every year that wow the public. That's more down to technology stagnating with 'the next big thing' probably still years away.
Bullshit. My iPhone X is my favorite iPhone to date. My iPad Pro and Pencil 2 are incredible. My new MacBook Pro is a beast and my favorite Mac to date. My new AirPods are great. I can't wait to upgrade my Watch to the 4 form factor. Speak for yourself.
another analysis sniffing toilets of supplier trying to count turds to back into some sort of number phones apple may or may not sell. Oh lets not forget Apple is not reporting those numbers anyone and getting a some sort of indication on what Apple service business will pull in is going to more of challenge, no toilets of suppliers to sniff for made up numbers.
And why do you think Apple are no longer reporting numbers?
Because Apple said they are no longer breaking unit sales anymore, ever have you been for the last 6 months. Analysis are free to make up numbers and not be called out when Apple reports actual units sales.
another analysis sniffing toilets of supplier trying to count turds to back into some sort of number phones apple may or may not sell. Oh lets not forget Apple is not reporting those numbers anyone and getting a some sort of indication on what Apple service business will pull in is going to more of challenge, no toilets of suppliers to sniff for made up numbers.
And why do you think Apple are no longer reporting numbers?
Because Apple said they are no longer breaking unit sales anymore, ever have you been for the last 6 months. Analysis are free to make up numbers and not be called out when Apple reports actual units sales.
"Apple are no longer reporting numbers because they said they are no longer reporting numbers" Right yeah well done, and so what's the reasoning behind that?
There are some great points on this thread, as I expect from this community. We also have a few short sighted people that can’t use deductive reasoning.
Cracks me up when people say Apple doesn’t innovate or is stagnant. Apple’s products and innovation over the last 2 decades, were based on tech developed in the 90s. In order to launch next generation products, we have to wait for the underlying technology to be developed. As each generation of technology is developed, it requires a larger quantity of underlying technologies and increases in complexity.
Apple is spending fortunes on R&D, preparing the technology for tomorrow’s platforms, while their competition plays with folding phones.
For a company that doesn’t innovate, Apple is outperforming the competition In technology, profits, and consumer satisfaction.
iPhone sales are slowing down, that’s called market saturation, there’s no collapse of sales. Every year, my friends and family in the Apple ecosystem upgrade our phones, it’s a low monthly payment. Most consumers wait 2-3 years but there always seems to be some feature that drives upgrades. I also don’t complain about my phone cost, I enjoy my iPhone XS, its advanced technology, security, aesthetics, and funding Apple’s future. Apple will keep packing technology and sensors into the iPhone, allowing new possibilities.
Does Apple mess up on occasion? Absolutely, the growth of any company or individual is organic and a learning experience.
In my opinion, taking a season to round out services, their fastest growing department by revenue, sounds smart. Successfully updating multiple processor designs on an annual basis, while pushing the state of the art, nerve racking. Yearly updates on 2-3 iPhones, Apple Watch, iPad, some Macs, software and operating systems, impressive. Then there’s all the products not upgraded yearly, the Heath Research Lab, internal resources, iCloud, Siri, etc.
another analysis sniffing toilets of supplier trying to count turds to back into some sort of number phones apple may or may not sell. Oh lets not forget Apple is not reporting those numbers anyone and getting a some sort of indication on what Apple service business will pull in is going to more of challenge, no toilets of suppliers to sniff for made up numbers.
And why do you think Apple are no longer reporting numbers?
Because Apple said they are no longer breaking unit sales anymore, ever have you been for the last 6 months. Analysis are free to make up numbers and not be called out when Apple reports actual units sales.
"Apple are no longer reporting numbers because they said they are no longer reporting numbers" Right yeah well done, and so what's the reasoning behind that?
Not sure if you were implying that sales are going downhill which is why they are not reporting numbers anymore.
Well, Apple was the only company reporting numbers and they no longer want the copycats to know what or why their products are successful. Expect all their products to be this way.
I remember the iKnockoff users claiming Apple Watch must be doing bad because Apple does not hand out numbers to these baboons. Yet Apple stated they would not provide numbers for Watch even before it was announced!
Comments
Apple isn’t stupid and I owe this, of course, so while they milk the cash cow before it becomes a DOG (see BCG matrix) they are long since preparing for other sources for revenue with growth oute tail as well as trying to create the next “a phone. An iPod. An internet Communications device”. And while for investors growth is above all, IMHO Apple’s biggest potential enemy are they themselves: if they cannot maintain the culture and spirit that made them where they are today. And the one thing that has this potential to kill “stay hungry. Stay foolish”, the six values of Tim Cook etc is long standing outrageous success.
That’s everywhere the same risk and explains why it’s soo hard eg. for music bands that land a smash hit first album have more often issues to maintain what made them “them” in the first place. Part of the big circle one might argue. For sure, the beloved fruit company is still far far away from anything even close to seeing traces of dawn. (And if they’d they’d bring back first class designed and functional WiFi routers they’d be rlly heroes again
Seriously, though, I'm tired of Apple stock's roller-coaster ride while Microsoft steadily climbs without fail. Apple really could have done a lot better to stop the volatility.
That is quickly becoming the new normal.
There are some great points on this thread, as I expect from this community. We also have a few short sighted people that can’t use deductive reasoning.
Cracks me up when people say Apple doesn’t innovate or is stagnant. Apple’s products and innovation over the last 2 decades, were based on tech developed in the 90s. In order to launch next generation products, we have to wait for the underlying technology to be developed. As each generation of technology is developed, it requires a larger quantity of underlying technologies and increases in complexity.
Apple is spending fortunes on R&D, preparing the technology for tomorrow’s platforms, while their competition plays with folding phones.
For a company that doesn’t innovate, Apple is outperforming the competition In technology, profits, and consumer satisfaction.
iPhone sales are slowing down, that’s called market saturation, there’s no collapse of sales. Every year, my friends and family in the Apple ecosystem upgrade our phones, it’s a low monthly payment. Most consumers wait 2-3 years but there always seems to be some feature that drives upgrades. I also don’t complain about my phone cost, I enjoy my iPhone XS, its advanced technology, security, aesthetics, and funding Apple’s future. Apple will keep packing technology and sensors into the iPhone, allowing new possibilities.
Does Apple mess up on occasion? Absolutely, the growth of any company or individual is organic and a learning experience.
In my opinion, taking a season to round out services, their fastest growing department by revenue, sounds smart. Successfully updating multiple processor designs on an annual basis, while pushing the state of the art, nerve racking. Yearly updates on 2-3 iPhones, Apple Watch, iPad, some Macs, software and operating systems, impressive. Then there’s all the products not upgraded yearly, the Heath Research Lab, internal resources, iCloud, Siri, etc.
Give Apple a little credit, they’re only human.
Not sure if you were implying that sales are going downhill which is why they are not reporting numbers anymore.
Well, Apple was the only company reporting numbers and they no longer want the copycats to know what or why their products are successful. Expect all their products to be this way.
I remember the iKnockoff users claiming Apple Watch must be doing bad because Apple does not hand out numbers to these baboons. Yet Apple stated they would not provide numbers for Watch even before it was announced!
The hypocrisy is funny.