danvm said: At least with Windows 10, I don't think MS tried to adapt a desktop OS to work with touch, since you can switch to Tablet Mode. Even Apple copied some elements for iOS / iPad OS, like working with side by side application, something MS did since Windows 8.1. As a hybrid device, which one is better depends on your workflow and applications. As a tablet, iPadOS is better with more apps and better touch UI (IMO, Tablet Mode in Windows is very good, but iPadOS still better). As soon as you attach a keyboard / trackpad, Surface has the advantage with a long list of applications designed for trackpad / mouse, better multitasking and works as a desktop with the Surface Dock. I think iPad and Surface are excellent devices, and the best in their respective markets.
Yes, but I think Tablet Mode is a modified UI mode of Windows, right? Not a ground-up tablet OS. But, yes, that gives a bunch of advantages to a Windows tablet when being used more like a laptop... more real work-horse desktop/laptop apps.
What I'm hoping, is that now that iPad OS is maturing, along with some of this kind of hardware support, we'll start to see more serious apps being developed for iPad, too. The touch UI is awesome when you're using an iPad as a tablet, but trying to use an iPad like a laptop in productivity apps is just a total productivity-suck (let alone ergonomic nightmare).
I still believe, though, that Apple's approach (assuming it is the approach!) of two separate platforms, sharing data and sometimes apps, is the way to go. I don't really think (and I sure hope!) one will ever replace the other, but the overlap will become greater. And, that's a good thing.
I suppose Microsoft will keep making the tablet-like aspect better as well. But, I'm not sure their tablet-aspect will ever be as good as iPad OS.
danvm said: At least with Windows 10, I don't think MS tried to adapt a desktop OS to work with touch, since you can switch to Tablet Mode. Even Apple copied some elements for iOS / iPad OS, like working with side by side application, something MS did since Windows 8.1. As a hybrid device, which one is better depends on your workflow and applications. As a tablet, iPadOS is better with more apps and better touch UI (IMO, Tablet Mode in Windows is very good, but iPadOS still better). As soon as you attach a keyboard / trackpad, Surface has the advantage with a long list of applications designed for trackpad / mouse, better multitasking and works as a desktop with the Surface Dock. I think iPad and Surface are excellent devices, and the best in their respective markets.
Yes, but I think Tablet Mode is a modified UI mode of Windows, right? Not a ground-up tablet OS. But, yes, that gives a bunch of advantages to a Windows tablet when being used more like a laptop... more real work-horse desktop/laptop apps.
What I'm hoping, is that now that iPad OS is maturing, along with some of this kind of hardware support, we'll start to see more serious apps being developed for iPad, too. The touch UI is awesome when you're using an iPad as a tablet, but trying to use an iPad like a laptop in productivity apps is just a total productivity-suck (let alone ergonomic nightmare).
I still believe, though, that Apple's approach (assuming it is the approach!) of two separate platforms, sharing data and sometimes apps, is the way to go. I don't really think (and I sure hope!) one will ever replace the other, but the overlap will become greater. And, that's a good thing.
I suppose Microsoft will keep making the tablet-like aspect better as well. But, I'm not sure their tablet-aspect will ever be as good as iPad OS.
Windows 10x is the OS that MS designed from the ground up for modern mobile devices. And based on what I have seen, it improves the touch experience. Plus it runs win32 applications in containers.
As you said, both operating systems will get better with each release, and I even think MS have a chance of being as good as iPad OS with Windows10x. Let's see how it goes in the next few months / years.
This gets us a couple of steps closer to what I would like to see: an iPad OS Desktop device similar in function to the Surface Studio.
Imagine running iPad OS on a large touch/pen input screen but also with full support for keyboards, mice and trackpads. And a healthy set of I/O connectors.
danvm said: Windows 10x is the OS that MS designed from the ground up for modern mobile devices. And based on what I have seen, it improves the touch experience. Plus it runs win32 applications in containers.
As you said, both operating systems will get better with each release, and I even think MS have a chance of being as good as iPad OS with Windows10x. Let's see how it goes in the next few months / years.
Ahh, OK, but that hasn't been the experience so far. This looks like a move in the right direction for Microsoft, but they essentially lose the backward compatibility (as legacy apps running in the container lose the new UI experience).
Lol - I’m glad someone else caught the 19k Mail badge - a reminder of one of the reasons I’m happy to be back on iOS - that even with a zillion email accounts, you have such fine-grained control of the number in that badge count. Even with Android 10, I failed to understand why Google’s core app doesn’t handle multiple email accounts as well as iOS when all the features are starting them in the face (and let’s not get into how god awful it is to navigate notification settings even with the Android 10 improvements!)
It’s good to read the differing perspectives on where y’all think iPadOS is going. I got my first MacBook in 2007 along with the original iPhone and my MacBook finally kicked the bucket after 12 years. I held out as long as I could while doing the touch screen dance whether it was Windows, Android, tablet, phones, whatever. I got the original iPad in 2010 and agree with many here that it didn’t hold up well as a hybrid computing device. Fast forward to 2020 and I finally have my hands on an iPad Pro and while certain apps have quirks because they were never built for iPadOS, I couldn’t be happier - it’s clear there is a lot of work to do all around and so be it.
I came here in a debate as to whether a Trackpad 2 is really necessary (thanks for showing me how to see the battery status of it!) - I can totally see why there is a demand for a Magic Keyboard with a built in trackpad - long time MacBook users just have come to expect the trackpad to be there - it’s like a ghost as I get used to this new set up - my thumb keeps wanting to reach out for it
I can’t help but wonder if a cheap $20 bluetooth mouse is a better stopgap? The gestures are nice but after watching a video demonstrating all of them, the big discovery for me was Slideover! I knew from demos it kinda looked like an elongated iPhone and I can see how this is super useful for messaging apps. I haven’t kept up with the Surface so I don’t know if it compares - what a concept - it really paints a future where you don’t have to pick up your smartphone all the time while working on iPadOS.
I am pleasantly pleased to discover how Slideover works by touch and the fact that it seems even more Intutive to reveal it by touch.
udance4ever said: I came here in a debate as to whether a Trackpad 2 is really necessary (thanks for showing me how to see the battery status of it!) - I can totally see why there is a demand for a Magic Keyboard with a built in trackpad - long time MacBook users just have come to expect the trackpad to be there - it’s like a ghost as I get used to this new set up - my thumb keeps wanting to reach out for it ...
Yes, I can see that too. Hopefully some good 3rd party products will come along, but I'd like to see Apple do better too. Maybe an 'extended' type keyboard where the number-pad becomes the trackpad area? I suppose having it in front like a MacBook helps muscle memory, though, but on the side could be nice too (like how my independent keyboard and trackpad are setup on my Mac).
While I don't have any experience with them, it seems like neither of the Apple iPad options are all that great overall. The new one is more of a dock, and the old one more of a cover. It might be best to just use some kind of cover, and then have the keyboard/trackpad in your backpack, or around, for when you want to switch to 'laptop' mode. Trying to build it on is clever, but seems to have too many disadvantages.
With iPadOS 13.3.1 my Logitech Pebble mouse worked perfectly on my iPad Mini 4 - smooth and precise.
But with iPadOS 13.4 it's unusable. Jumps all over the place when just moving it and scrolling is hit or miss. I also have tried the Logitech MX anywhere with the same results.
Does anyone have experience with other older iPad's using a bluetooth mouse?
Comments
What I'm hoping, is that now that iPad OS is maturing, along with some of this kind of hardware support, we'll start to see more serious apps being developed for iPad, too. The touch UI is awesome when you're using an iPad as a tablet, but trying to use an iPad like a laptop in productivity apps is just a total productivity-suck (let alone ergonomic nightmare).
I still believe, though, that Apple's approach (assuming it is the approach!) of two separate platforms, sharing data and sometimes apps, is the way to go. I don't really think (and I sure hope!) one will ever replace the other, but the overlap will become greater. And, that's a good thing.
I suppose Microsoft will keep making the tablet-like aspect better as well. But, I'm not sure their tablet-aspect will ever be as good as iPad OS.
As you said, both operating systems will get better with each release, and I even think MS have a chance of being as good as iPad OS with Windows10x. Let's see how it goes in the next few months / years.
Imagine running iPad OS on a large touch/pen input screen but also with full support for keyboards, mice and trackpads. And a healthy set of I/O connectors.
This makes things more interesting, though.
It’s good to read the differing perspectives on where y’all think iPadOS is going. I got my first MacBook in 2007 along with the original iPhone and my MacBook finally kicked the bucket after 12 years. I held out as long as I could while doing the touch screen dance whether it was Windows, Android, tablet, phones, whatever. I got the original iPad in 2010 and agree with many here that it didn’t hold up well as a hybrid computing device. Fast forward to 2020 and I finally have my hands on an iPad Pro and while certain apps have quirks because they were never built for iPadOS, I couldn’t be happier - it’s clear there is a lot of work to do all around and so be it.
I came here in a debate as to whether a Trackpad 2 is really necessary (thanks for showing me how to see the battery status of it!) - I can totally see why there is a demand for a Magic Keyboard with a built in trackpad - long time MacBook users just have come to expect the trackpad to be there - it’s like a ghost as I get used to this new set up - my thumb keeps wanting to reach out for it
I can’t help but wonder if a cheap $20 bluetooth mouse is a better stopgap? The gestures are nice but after watching a video demonstrating all of them, the big discovery for me was Slideover! I knew from demos it kinda looked like an elongated iPhone and I can see how this is super useful for messaging apps. I haven’t kept up with the Surface so I don’t know if it compares - what a concept - it really paints a future where you don’t have to pick up your smartphone all the time while working on iPadOS.
I am pleasantly pleased to discover how Slideover works by touch and the fact that it seems even more Intutive to reveal it by touch.
to new adventures guys!
While I don't have any experience with them, it seems like neither of the Apple iPad options are all that great overall. The new one is more of a dock, and the old one more of a cover. It might be best to just use some kind of cover, and then have the keyboard/trackpad in your backpack, or around, for when you want to switch to 'laptop' mode. Trying to build it on is clever, but seems to have too many disadvantages.
But with iPadOS 13.4 it's unusable. Jumps all over the place when just moving it and scrolling is hit or miss. I also have tried the Logitech MX anywhere with the same results.
Does anyone have experience with other older iPad's using a bluetooth mouse?