as for the glass feel. Well, I’ve been over that for years now. You just have to stop thinking about it.
I do a lot of writing in my Surface Pro and it's very nice the you can change the friction level by replacing the tip in the Pen. The writing experience improves a lot. I think Apple should do the same, instead of just stop thinking about it.
Another thing that IMO will improve the writing experience with the Pencil is a eraser. It's very quick and easy turn the Pen to erase something in the Surface instead of the double tap you have to do with the Pencil.
Actually, Apple nailed the erase thing with Scribble. All you have to do is “scratch out” the text you want to erase, as if you’re trying to black it out. It works great and is much better than flipping the pen on a Surface. A lot of things work great with Scribble once you conform to the tool’s expectations, and I guess as others have said, get over the unnatural “writing on glass” ergonomic. I’m not there yet, so either I need more training, the tool needs more training, or some combination of the two.
Like I said, this is a tough problem that many technically and human factors experts have been attacking for decades. Some of them put more emphasis on the pen side of the equation and others put more emphasis on the writing surface part of the equation. As users, we are the in the middle and our experience between pen/pencil and paper/tablet really determines how well the system delivers on the promise. Apple’s approach seems to be very successful for artists and sketchers but handwriting is a tougher problem to solve.
For me, part of the problem is that I haven’t actually been writing a whole lot for a very long time. Handwriting is no longer my primary means of getting thoughts committed to a permanent or semi-permanent form. My muscle memory associated with handwriting is way out of shape. I suspect I’m not alone, especially when I see how adept younger people who grew up with smart devices in their hands from a very early age are at text entry on phones. I wouldn’t be surprised if a lot of younger people struggle to write using a pen/pencil on paper. Perhaps they would prefer writing on glass, but I suspect they’d rather just type.
I didn't knew about the "scratch out" for erasing. For some reason, I miss that in the WWDC keynote. That's a big improvement over double tap. Being better than the eraser, maybe. I can see cases where the eraser is easier vs scratching out. For example, erasing long part of a note or erasing multiples notes in a PDF document requires less effort with the eraser vs scratching out each note. At the same time, I suppose there are cases where scratching out would be better.
Regarding the writing experience, I think Apple should improve it. Apple drawing experience is better than the Surface, but writing experience IMO is better with the Surface. And friction is one of the reasons. I see no reason that I have to adapt to a worst experience when you can improve with something as simple as replacing the tip, as MS did with the Pen.
Regarding taking notes vs typing, I agree with you that many people prefer typing for most things. But there are cases where note taking is better, for example when annotating a PDF or Word document, or when working with equations. In addition, it's completely silent compared to keyboards, and that's a big plus in conference rooms
It's nice to see Apple and MS improving in this area, specially for me, since I have to take notes in a weekly basis.
Apple has better solutions on the iPad Pro. The display provides the friction naturally by vibrating. For non Pro iPads one may buy those silicon Apple Pencil tip covers sold on Amazon. So Apple has no need to produce different tips for different friction levels, a third party solution can do the job. I simply trained my hand to write accurately on a slippery display.
Does anyone have any thoughts on how — assuming my question makes sense — one might improve ‘friction’ on the glass surface when writing on the iPad with the Pencil? I.e., to create a feel similar to writing on paper (than on glass).
I am guessing some type of not-too-smooth screen protector. Any suggestions would be most welcome!
I've used Paperlike for my gen 2 iPad Pro and my current gen 3 iPad Pro as well. Very happy with it albeit it's a little on the expensive side. Had a shipment where it came bent but they told me to keep it and shipped me a new one. 10/10 would buy again.
as for the glass feel. Well, I’ve been over that for years now. You just have to stop thinking about it.
I do a lot of writing in my Surface Pro and it's very nice the you can change the friction level by replacing the tip in the Pen. The writing experience improves a lot. I think Apple should do the same, instead of just stop thinking about it.
as for the glass feel. Well, I’ve been over that for years now. You just have to stop thinking about it.
I do a lot of writing in my Surface Pro and it's very nice the you can change the friction level by replacing the tip in the Pen. The writing experience improves a lot. I think Apple should do the same, instead of just stop thinking about it.
Another thing that IMO will improve the writing experience with the Pencil is a eraser. It's very quick and easy turn the Pen to erase something in the Surface instead of the double tap you have to do with the Pencil.
Actually, Apple nailed the erase thing with Scribble. All you have to do is “scratch out” the text you want to erase, as if you’re trying to black it out. It works great and is much better than flipping the pen on a Surface. A lot of things work great with Scribble once you conform to the tool’s expectations, and I guess as others have said, get over the unnatural “writing on glass” ergonomic. I’m not there yet, so either I need more training, the tool needs more training, or some combination of the two.
Like I said, this is a tough problem that many technically and human factors experts have been attacking for decades. Some of them put more emphasis on the pen side of the equation and others put more emphasis on the writing surface part of the equation. As users, we are the in the middle and our experience between pen/pencil and paper/tablet really determines how well the system delivers on the promise. Apple’s approach seems to be very successful for artists and sketchers but handwriting is a tougher problem to solve.
For me, part of the problem is that I haven’t actually been writing a whole lot for a very long time. Handwriting is no longer my primary means of getting thoughts committed to a permanent or semi-permanent form. My muscle memory associated with handwriting is way out of shape. I suspect I’m not alone, especially when I see how adept younger people who grew up with smart devices in their hands from a very early age are at text entry on phones. I wouldn’t be surprised if a lot of younger people struggle to write using a pen/pencil on paper. Perhaps they would prefer writing on glass, but I suspect they’d rather just type.
I didn't knew about the "scratch out" for erasing. For some reason, I miss that in the WWDC keynote. That's a big improvement over double tap. Being better than the eraser, maybe. I can see cases where the eraser is easier vs scratching out. For example, erasing long part of a note or erasing multiples notes in a PDF document requires less effort with the eraser vs scratching out each note. At the same time, I suppose there are cases where scratching out would be better.
Regarding the writing experience, I think Apple should improve it. Apple drawing experience is better than the Surface, but writing experience IMO is better with the Surface. And friction is one of the reasons. I see no reason that I have to adapt to a worst experience when you can improve with something as simple as replacing the tip, as MS did with the Pen.
Regarding taking notes vs typing, I agree with you that many people prefer typing for most things. But there are cases where note taking is better, for example when annotating a PDF or Word document, or when working with equations. In addition, it's completely silent compared to keyboards, and that's a big plus in conference rooms
It's nice to see Apple and MS improving in this area, specially for me, since I have to take notes in a weekly basis.
Apple has better solutions on the iPad Pro. The display provides the friction naturally by vibrating. For non Pro iPads one may buy those silicon Apple Pencil tip covers sold on Amazon. So Apple has no need to produce different tips for different friction levels, a third party solution can do the job. I simply trained my hand to write accurately on a slippery display.
I never heard of the iPad Pro display vibrating to simulate friction with the Pencil. Are you sure of that?
Regarding Pencil tips, I know you can get them from Amazon. But my point is that the Pencil could offer a better experience out of the box. With the Surface Pen I had that experience from day one. I didn't had to train my hand like you did.
First thing I thought of when I saw this on the keynote was "Newton MessagePad." Gads, I tried so hard to like that thing. Kinda like...oh...the AppleTV remote.
And now, thanks to Serenity Caldwell, I can't stop saying "dub dub." dub dub. dub dub dee cee.
I think this features is going to be HUGE with students and others who prefer taking notes with a pen-like device rather than a keyboard, yet still want them to be converted to text or searchable and copy/paste-able even in their original form. The "clean up my shape drawing ... or don't" ability is also pretty cool. People wax rhapsodic about the Newton's handwriting ability, but I never found it to be good enough (though at times it was handy, for sure). "Egg Freckles" wasn't just a joke from one cartoonist: it was the shared experience of most users.
I played around with Scribble for a couple of hours with the Apple Pencil 1 to get a feel for it. The handwriting recognition is impressive. However, as others have noted the tactile feedback with writing on glass is still a big detractor. At least on my iPad Pro there seems to be a constant struggle between whether the Scribble input or virtual keyboard has the focus. I still feel like I'm writing with a ten foot long pencil when entering text into edit boxes in the UI. Pencil input into standard edit controls seems very disconnected. When using the pencil in text editors the inability to insert carriage returns and discern paragraphs feels unnatural. I guess what I'm say is that handwriting recognition is great, but it is only part of the overall handwriting experience and Apple has not yet captured the full picture, not by a long shot.
I still feel like I need to conform to the tool's expectations instead of relying on the tool to conform to my expectations. Truth be told, if I was heading for a meeting today where I'd be taking notes I would still grab my steno pad and a pen rather than my iPad Pro. In my opinion, until Apple can get to the point where the iPad is the default, zero compromise, and natural choice it will not serve my needs for handwriting based note taking. It gets in the way.
I applaud Apple's efforts, but the margin for error in this particular application space is so damn minuscule, much like voice based interaction, that being 99.9 percent on-the-mark makes for a compelling demo but falls flat on its face for being a reliable tool that users can count on for everyday use. This is a Big O challenge, and Apple is making impressive progress, but I would not get too pumped up about its utility at this point. It has a long way to go before it becomes generally usable. I have no doubt that Apple will keep drilling deep on this until they get it to the level of maturity that it needs to be. It still feels more like a novelty and toy than a boring tool that just works. Whether the maturity process takes 2 years or 5 years or 10 years is the real question. This is absolutely not a knock on Apple. This is a very difficult problem to solve and I'm grateful that they are making a concerted effort to solve it.
Really makes you appreciate what the engineers were able to do back in the late 80’s and early 90’s with the Newton and even Palm Pilot for that matter.
I was frustrated that Apple seemingly abandoned the development in this area of user input. Steve was right, no one wants to be required to use a stylus, but they make certain things a heck of a lot easier. I hate how so many so called journalists took his words out of context.
Palm solved the accuracy problem by having the user adapt - they had a slightly modified alphabet that they used along with separate areas for writing numbers and letters. The script was easy enough to learn and with minimal practice was easy to use and accurate.
Does Scribble work on other apps? For example, can I write a number in a cell with the Pencil on Numbers and have it converted to a number that is readable by the app?
Numbers is almost unusable on the iPhone, even on the Pro model. If I could enter values into cells without the keyboard popping up, it would really improve the usability.
Does Scribble work on other apps? For example, can I write a number in a cell with the Pencil on Numbers and have it converted to a number that is readable by the app?
Numbers is almost unusable on the iPhone, even on the Pro model. If I could enter values into cells without the keyboard popping up, it would really improve the usability.
The article states that Scribble will be available throughout the OS. I am looking forward to trying it in Numbers as well.
as for the glass feel. Well, I’ve been over that for years now. You just have to stop thinking about it.
Not sure if you’re writing equations/formulae with subscripts, superscripts, Greek symbols etc.
Not sure how much you do of that, if any. If you don’t do a great deal of that, you probably don’t understand.
Well, that’s certainly less important for feel than painting on the screen. I’ve never had a problem with the glass feel, which Apple made better in recent years. I’ve done more than a bit of writing in a couple of apps with handwriting recognition. Other than the problems with the software itself, the feel wasn’t a problem. I don’t see how super or subscripts have anything to do with it. Or Greek, which I took in college, but have forgotten most of. I do drawings on my iPad which requires numbers, symbols, arrows, etc. I got used to the feel.
Comments
Regarding Pencil tips, I know you can get them from Amazon. But my point is that the Pencil could offer a better experience out of the box. With the Surface Pen I had that experience from day one. I didn't had to train my hand like you did.
And now, thanks to Serenity Caldwell, I can't stop saying "dub dub." dub dub. dub dub dee cee.
Numbers is almost unusable on the iPhone, even on the Pro model. If I could enter values into cells without the keyboard popping up, it would really improve the usability.