Many people have a bunch of the crappy 5W chargers Apple has been foisting on them -- even though every phone since the iPhone8 has been able to handle fast charging from a 30Watt brick.
Apple needs to supply quality chargers. They are as much a part of the phone as the screen. Without the brick, not even a wireless pad will charge the phone.
But, one thing they might do is give the user the option of a USB-A or USB-C brick & cord -- partly because the USB-A connection restricts the power it can provide and is being replaced by USB-C in a number of areas such as MacBooks.
I like the idea of offering such options, but they should be just that: options. It's important to minimize packaging and plastics (not to mention electronics) that come as automatic "bonuses."
There are plenty of heavy metals in PSUs which we should recycle and limit, but it seems most are still fine with that so long as they get a better one while under some perceived notion of "free".
Making these an option is ideal because there are so many ways in which you can setup your changing stations. Going forward, many have inductive charging stations so there won't even be a much normal wear and tear on cables, but then there are many other options like a Mac charger with other ports for charging in your living room or a gallium nitride (GaN) charger for travel so that it's ligher and smaller. Both of those are solutions I currently employ and nothing Apple could offer as an included charger will do anything but cost me money and take up space as eWaste in a drawer.
The entire iPhone market is not like the dorks reading these articles with drawers full of unsatisfactory 5W chargers and wired EarPods.
If they want to slim down iPhone packaging by separating these items and having them available as FREE optional add-ons, well that's Apple choice. They'll maybe save a couple dollars in logistics while inconveniencing every single customer. But hey, this is the new Apple. I've given up on them doing the reasonable thing, the logical thing, or even the comprehensible thing.
Apple almost certainly has pretty solid data on what percentage of customers buying new iPhones are actually upgrading from a previous device, and even how many are on their third or fourth iPhone. At this point that percentage is probably quite high, and Apple probably has a pretty good idea how many millions of those EarPods and chargers are going straight into a drawer or bin, unused. It only makes sense to quit including components that won't be used, and instead provide vouchers or other means for those who want them to get them. So perhaps they'll come with vouchers for free 5w charter and free EarPods, or a discount on a larger charger and/or AirPods. A lot of people don't want a new charger or buds. Others would like an upgrade, and will be glad to have all or part of the value of the unwanted components to put towards the upgrade. It's like a peripheral buffet. The math for that works out to a lot less waste, more profit, and more customers happy about getting the configuration they actually want.
I'd be fine with dropping EarPods as well, as long as they include the lightening-mini adapter again. If somebody is buying an iPhone for the first time and doesn't have a drawer full of EarPods and can't even plug in the headphones they already own, that would be bad. Don't want to start a new customer off with a bad experience.
I also believe they should include the 5W charger. No need to burden the cost of each and every iPhone with a 30W charger, when in reality only a portion of the users need to fast charge their phone, Apple knows how people charge their phone, especially with the new battery management charging feature. That alone should drive the decision. If the majority of people charge their phone overnight, then the fast charger is unnecessary. If you need fast charging, then you buy the fast charger.
What’s the cost difference between a 30W and a 5W charger? A $1 since it’s made in China? On a $650+ phone? Ridiculous reasoning.
Apple needs to include (or at least a voucher for) an 18W or better charger standard. Otherwise, it’s just Apple driving margins. Not sure I’ve ever bought a $1,000+ product and it not include a means to charge it.... But that’s the new Apple, all about the dollar.
Not ridiculous. Apple should be driving margins wherever possible. All of these other phone improvements are adding costs, not removing them. Even if the cost difference of the charger is only $1, which I doubt, if you take that $1 and multiply it by roughly 200MM iPhones sold in 2019, it's all wasted margin and will likely not impact a single sale. Who really is not going to buy the phone because of the included charger? I agree that Apple should include a charger for functionality, just not a premium charger when they probably know that the vast majority of users would not require it. Consider fast charging a niche feature, available if you need it, but not forced on you if you don't.
This would be a terrible decision. So Apple can eek out another 1-2% margin on each iphone but may loss 1-2% of customers so for every lost customer they have lost $400 profit per iPhone plus services. Over a few years you are looking at $500 per lost customer. Seems like a really bad idea financially as well as marketing wise.
Their competitors will have a field day making fun of them if they do not include a charger.
I never said no charger. That would be a bad decision. I did say they should include the base charger and those who really need to fast charge could buy the premium charger. As I said earlier, nobody is skipping an iPhone because it comes with a 5W charger.
I'd be fine with dropping EarPods as well, as long as they include the lightening-mini adapter again. If somebody is buying an iPhone for the first time and doesn't have a drawer full of EarPods and can't even plug in the headphones they already own, that would be bad. Don't want to start a new customer off with a bad experience.
I also believe they should include the 5W charger. No need to burden the cost of each and every iPhone with a 30W charger, when in reality only a portion of the users need to fast charge their phone, Apple knows how people charge their phone, especially with the new battery management charging feature. That alone should drive the decision. If the majority of people charge their phone overnight, then the fast charger is unnecessary. If you need fast charging, then you buy the fast charger.
What’s the cost difference between a 30W and a 5W charger? A $1 since it’s made in China? On a $650+ phone? Ridiculous reasoning.
Apple needs to include (or at least a voucher for) an 18W or better charger standard. Otherwise, it’s just Apple driving margins. Not sure I’ve ever bought a $1,000+ product and it not include a means to charge it.... But that’s the new Apple, all about the dollar.
Not ridiculous. Apple should be driving margins wherever possible. All of these other phone improvements are adding costs, not removing them. Even if the cost difference of the charger is only $1, which I doubt, if you take that $1 and multiply it by roughly 200MM iPhones sold in 2019, it's all wasted margin and will likely not impact a single sale. Who really is not going to buy the phone because of the included charger? I agree that Apple should include a charger for functionality, just not a premium charger when they probably know that the vast majority of users would not require it. Consider fast charging a niche feature, available if you need it, but not forced on you if you don't.
This would be a terrible decision. So Apple can eek out another 1-2% margin on each iphone but may loss 1-2% of customers so for every lost customer they have lost $400 profit per iPhone plus services. Over a few years you are looking at $500 per lost customer. Seems like a really bad idea financially as well as marketing wise.
Their competitors will have a field day making fun of them if they do not include a charger.
I never said no charger. That would be a bad decision. I did say they should include the base charger and those who really need to fast charge could buy the premium charger. As I said earlier, nobody is skipping an iPhone because it comes with a 5W charger.
Apple should remove the PSU from every iPhone. This reduces cost and waste in multiple ways.
Just like other add-on options Apple offers with other sales, the could easily let users pick a 5W charger, 18W, small 18W using GaN, 3rd-party option, or no option at all.
I've seen no evidence that people like libertyandfree make up "1-2%" of users and that they'd all go to Android or never update their iPhone if Apple didn't include a paltry 5W charger that often just sits in a drawer or in the original box.
Apple needs to UP its game with chargers -- not run away and hide.
Yeh, many people have a bunch of the crappy 5W chargers Apple has been foisting on them -- even though every phone since the iPhone8 has been able to handle fast charging from a 30Watt brick.
Apple needs to supply quality chargers. They are as much a part of the phone as the screen. Without the brick, not even a wireless pad will charge the phone.
But, one thing they might do is give the user the option of a USB-A or USB-C brick & cord -- partly because the USB-A connection restricts the power it can provide and is being replaced by USB-C in a number of areas such as MacBooks.
They need to get rid of them, not force every customer to pay even more money for every iPhone purchased to get a drawer full of PSUs that go unused.
Apple's PSUs are quality. I've never had a problem with mine and will always buy Apple's over some Dollar Store knockoff. There are some 3rd-party options that have proven to be excellent quality, too, but don't assume that the "quality" of a PSU is based on how many Watts it says it outputs.
I look forward to the day the I can choose to buy PSUs with USB-A, USB-C, or both, with various output options for various configurations without ending up with a drawer full of perfectly good PSUs and headphones that I'll never use but have paid for.
I think you missed my point -- although I probably phrased it wrong: Apple's 5W chargers are not junk. But they are obsolete. Every phone since the 8 will fast charge on up to a 30 watt charger -- but they are limited to the old slow charge on Apple old 5Watt chargers.
And, Bricks with USB-C are available now: Anker makes a nice one. I got it for my grandson and it has both a USB-A and USB-C ports. It also doubles as a remote charger with a battery that can charge an iPhone several times.
I'd be fine with dropping EarPods as well, as long as they include the lightening-mini adapter again. If somebody is buying an iPhone for the first time and doesn't have a drawer full of EarPods and can't even plug in the headphones they already own, that would be bad. Don't want to start a new customer off with a bad experience.
I also believe they should include the 5W charger. No need to burden the cost of each and every iPhone with a 30W charger, when in reality only a portion of the users need to fast charge their phone, Apple knows how people charge their phone, especially with the new battery management charging feature. That alone should drive the decision. If the majority of people charge their phone overnight, then the fast charger is unnecessary. If you need fast charging, then you buy the fast charger.
What’s the cost difference between a 30W and a 5W charger? A $1 since it’s made in China? On a $650+ phone? Ridiculous reasoning.
Apple needs to include (or at least a voucher for) an 18W or better charger standard. Otherwise, it’s just Apple driving margins. Not sure I’ve ever bought a $1,000+ product and it not include a means to charge it.... But that’s the new Apple, all about the dollar.
Not ridiculous. Apple should be driving margins wherever possible. All of these other phone improvements are adding costs, not removing them. Even if the cost difference of the charger is only $1, which I doubt, if you take that $1 and multiply it by roughly 200MM iPhones sold in 2019, it's all wasted margin and will likely not impact a single sale. Who really is not going to buy the phone because of the included charger? I agree that Apple should include a charger for functionality, just not a premium charger when they probably know that the vast majority of users would not require it. Consider fast charging a niche feature, available if you need it, but not forced on you if you don't.
This would be a terrible decision. So Apple can eek out another 1-2% margin on each iphone but may loss 1-2% of customers so for every lost customer they have lost $400 profit per iPhone plus services. Over a few years you are looking at $500 per lost customer. Seems like a really bad idea financially as well as marketing wise.
Their competitors will have a field day making fun of them if they do not include a charger.
I never said no charger. That would be a bad decision. I did say they should include the base charger and those who really need to fast charge could buy the premium charger. As I said earlier, nobody is skipping an iPhone because it comes with a 5W charger.
I disagree.... Apple should not be peddling an obsolete charger on an unsuspecting public. They upgraded their phones to accept a fast charge from a 30 watt charger way back with the iPhone 8 -- but they've been dragging their feet on upgrading their charger.
I think the better option would be to include some sort of voucher or credit; you buy a phone and you get $25 towards a charger, or AirPods, or a case, whatever at the apple store. People who need one could get a charger. If you want a crappy charger you could get it. If you want to use it towards a pair of AirPods - great.
i find it amazing how many people think Apple will reduce the price of the iPhone if they do not include a charger.... Ain't gonna happen!
The price of an iPhone has little relationship to their variable cost of manufacture.
And, Apple is not known for cost cutting measures - particularly on their high end products (or even on their low end)
First of all, Apple works around a profit margin so the cost of components will absolutely adjust as the cost to Apple adjusts.
Second, if anyone thinks that Apple will adjust the price of the iPhone based on the inclusion of exclusion of a single, inexpensive aspect of the purchase price they're being foolish. For example, if the iPhone costs $799 and the 5W costs Apple $2.13 they aren't going to drop the price to $796.87. Pricing for customers simply don't work that way. What Apple may do is increase the quality of another component or add another feature altogether to stay within a profit margin.
I think the better option would be to include some sort of voucher or credit; you buy a phone and you get $25 towards a charger, or AirPods, or a case, whatever at the apple store. People who need one could get a charger. If you want a crappy charger you could get it. If you want to use it towards a pair of AirPods - great.
If the box is thin enough and the cable wrapped around the side instead of under the phone could have nfc access while still in box. So vouchers could be embedded in the phone. Resell your phone and never use the vouchers the current owner gets to use them.
Apple can then buy chargers from different factories even local ones in each country and just have them in unpackaged in a box. Reducing waste and travel, opening up supply lines.
If travelling and forget one or need a local one drop by store pick one up.. seems win win win to me
Apple needs to UP its game with chargers -- not run away and hide.
Yeh, many people have a bunch of the crappy 5W chargers Apple has been foisting on them -- even though every phone since the iPhone8 has been able to handle fast charging from a 30Watt brick.
Apple needs to supply quality chargers. They are as much a part of the phone as the screen. Without the brick, not even a wireless pad will charge the phone.
But, one thing they might do is give the user the option of a USB-A or USB-C brick & cord -- partly because the USB-A connection restricts the power it can provide and is being replaced by USB-C in a number of areas such as MacBooks.
It’s about eco-waste. Europe has been pushing for the eventual elimination of chargers being provided with each new mobile device since 2000. The first step was to standardize with 5 volt USB-A chargers and micro-USB ports on the devices. This took many years but eventually happened for the most part.
Now that we have USB-A, USB-C, and wireless charging it has become much more complicated.
Sounds like something the EU would do - uncontrolled nanny state. So let’s make life irritating for millions of people so we can place 0.0001% less garbage in a landfill. Is it any wonder that regions economy has been morbid for years.
Lest anyone from Mars should pick up this thread and think these comments are representative of the iPhone-buying public, they’re not. Of course it’s not acceptable to not provide some kind of charger. Additionally Apple is still using the awful lightning connector instead of USB-C? So they want continued revenue from lightning cables sales and licensing, and revenue from power blocks. I swear Apple does everything it can to make people hate them.
Lest anyone from Mars should pick up this thread and think these comments are representative of the iPhone-buying public, they’re not. Of course it’s not acceptable to not provide some kind of charger. Additionally Apple is still using the awful lightning connector instead of USB-C? So they want continued revenue from lightning cables sales and licensing, and revenue from power blocks. I swear Apple does everything it can to make people hate them.
If, as you suggest, Apple's goal was to get people to hate them they would switch to USB-C and make people buy them instead of supplying them with the phone.
Lest anyone from Mars should pick up this thread and think these comments are representative of the iPhone-buying public, they’re not. Of course it’s not acceptable to not provide some kind of charger. Additionally Apple is still using the awful lightning connector instead of USB-C? So they want continued revenue from lightning cables sales and licensing, and revenue from power blocks. I swear Apple does everything it can to make people hate them.
First of all, the Lightening connectoris a marvel of modern engineering. Incredibly capable, small, reversible and rugged. Second, there is absolutely no technical benefit to USB C connector. If you have a charger with the USB C connector, the Lightning cable can pass full power too. Change would only be for the sake of change. I guarantee that the majority of the "iPhone buyung public" has no clue what a USB C connector is but might recognize the ubiquitous USB A and Lightning connectors.
Apple needs to UP its game with chargers -- not run away and hide.
Yeh, many people have a bunch of the crappy 5W chargers Apple has been foisting on them -- even though every phone since the iPhone8 has been able to handle fast charging from a 30Watt brick.
Apple needs to supply quality chargers. They are as much a part of the phone as the screen. Without the brick, not even a wireless pad will charge the phone.
But, one thing they might do is give the user the option of a USB-A or USB-C brick & cord -- partly because the USB-A connection restricts the power it can provide and is being replaced by USB-C in a number of areas such as MacBooks.
Fast chargers damage the battery. No thanks.
This is not true. If your fast charger came from the phone manufacturer (my case) you will not damage your battery. My fast charged batteries have outlived slow charged iPhone batteries I have had at home. Fast chargers are often better for your battery as more effort is put into heat control and voltage management while charging. Other materials inside the battery (graphene, for example) have also improved the negatives of charging in certain conditions.
Comments
Making these an option is ideal because there are so many ways in which you can setup your changing stations. Going forward, many have inductive charging stations so there won't even be a much normal wear and tear on cables, but then there are many other options like a Mac charger with other ports for charging in your living room or a gallium nitride (GaN) charger for travel so that it's ligher and smaller. Both of those are solutions I currently employ and nothing Apple could offer as an included charger will do anything but cost me money and take up space as eWaste in a drawer.
Just like other add-on options Apple offers with other sales, the could easily let users pick a 5W charger, 18W, small 18W using GaN, 3rd-party option, or no option at all.
I've seen no evidence that people like libertyandfree make up "1-2%" of users and that they'd all go to Android or never update their iPhone if Apple didn't include a paltry 5W charger that often just sits in a drawer or in the original box.
I disagree.... Apple should not be peddling an obsolete charger on an unsuspecting public. They upgraded their phones to accept a fast charge from a 30 watt charger way back with the iPhone 8 -- but they've been dragging their feet on upgrading their charger.
It's time they caught up with the times....
"anyone can afford a $1000 phone can afford to buy a charger" /s
It's not fair on the new customers.
If they want to save the environment, fine, take them out by default, but they should be available for free on request.
I honestly feel bad for someone like my mother who could go buy an iPhone and then be left with extra confusion and unexpected costs.
Second, if anyone thinks that Apple will adjust the price of the iPhone based on the inclusion of exclusion of a single, inexpensive aspect of the purchase price they're being foolish. For example, if the iPhone costs $799 and the 5W costs Apple $2.13 they aren't going to drop the price to $796.87. Pricing for customers simply don't work that way. What Apple may do is increase the quality of another component or add another feature altogether to stay within a profit margin.
seems win win win to me
Fast chargers damage the battery. No thanks.
If, as you suggest, Apple's goal was to get people to hate them they would switch to USB-C and make people buy them instead of supplying them with the phone.
First of all, the Lightening connectoris a marvel of modern engineering. Incredibly capable, small, reversible and rugged. Second, there is absolutely no technical benefit to USB C connector. If you have a charger with the USB C connector, the Lightning cable can pass full power too. Change would only be for the sake of change. I guarantee that the majority of the "iPhone buyung public" has no clue what a USB C connector is but might recognize the ubiquitous USB A and Lightning connectors.