New #AppleToo movement drawing attention to racism, sexism, inequality inside Apple

Posted:
in General Discussion edited April 2022
A group of Apple employees has formed the AppleToo organization with the goal of exposing patterns of racism, sexism, inequity, and abuse within the company.




The formation of the group comes after weeks of public statements from Apple employees about internal complaints going unanswered or being outright ignored. A Discord community of around 200 Apple employees and contractors was used to launch the movement.

The Verge says that around 15 current and former Apple employees were directly involved in organizing the effort. The AppleToo website has a short statement and a login with a secret password that can be obtained from AppleToo organizers.

For too long, Apple has evaded public scrutiny. The truth is that for many Apple workers -- a reality faced disproportionately by our Black, Indigenous, and other colleagues from minoritized racial, gender, and historically marginalized groups of people -- the culture of secrecy creates an opaque, intimidating fortress. When we press for accountability and redress to the persistent injustices we witness or experience in our workplace, we are faced with a pattern of isolation, degredation, and gaslighting.

No more. We've exhausted all internal avenues. We've talked with our leadership. We've gone to the People team. We've escalated through Business Conduct. Nothing has changed.

It's time to Think Different.

The Discord where the movement was first shared is owned by Apple leaker "Fudge." AppleInsider staff reached out to Fudge to get the full story.

"One of the members sent an invite to cherthedev (Cher Scarlett), she saw my little corner and pretty much was 150% on board with its existence," Fudge said, speaking of the Apple employee Discord. "After that I just offered to give her a hand in terms of Twitter platform and server community members for her cause."

Fudge sees their goals in line with Scarlett's and welcomed the movement. According to Fudge, the Discord's response has been mostly positive.

Apple workers are coming together to talk openly about issues we want addressed in our workplace.

Discrimination, harassment, and retaliation happen at #AppleToo.

If you work or worked for Apple, or a third party, connect with us at https://t.co/sQMQ22Thvf.

-- Apple Workers #AppleToo (@AppleLaborers)


One Apple employee, Ashley Gjovik, was not part of the founding of #AppleToo as sometimes reported, but has been very vocal on Twitter by stating multiple problems that have occurred within Apple. She alleges a powerful cover-up culture within Apple that led to her eventual administrative leave.

Her story isn't the only one, and stories from many Apple employees are being gathered for the AppleToo website. Many examples of alleged harassment from within Apple can be seen on Gjovik's Twitter.

Read on AppleInsider

Comments

  • Reply 1 of 20
    I wonder what the as yet undisclosed/undiscovered role The Verge has in reporting of the sudden avalanche of turmoil at Apple. 

    It is well known how much The Verge gravitates towards negative reporting about everything Apple. I would not be surprised to learn The Verge is instigating the negativity so it can report on the negativity for clicks
    red oakcentaur9secondkox2Beats
  • Reply 2 of 20
    9secondkox29secondkox2 Posts: 2,571member
    Riiiiight…

    look, anywhere there are people, there will be issues. 

    But to slam Apple as some discriminatory based workplace culture is ridiculous. Apple strives harder than anyone to ensure this is not the case. 

    Anytime someone gets passed over or disagrees with something, or has a conflict does not equal inequality, discrimination, etc. these are the people who are discriminatory. They won’t be happy unless the CEO is not a white person. Or a man. Regardless of the best available candidate is white or male. Enough of that. 

    How about work hard and make yourself indispensable. The best candidates should get the best jobs. The hardest and smartest workers should get the promotions. 

    Enough hand outs because somebody creates some noise and pretends there’s a problem. It seems the actual good hard working people get nothing these days snd loud mouth problem creators get catered to. Hope Apple lets them run themselves ragged with this crap snd rewards actual good workers. 
    edited August 2021 centaurTheObannonFileFileMakerFeller
  • Reply 3 of 20
    red oakred oak Posts: 1,079member
    Apple - show these people the door.  Let them find a greener pasture to build and grow their career 

    It a bad fit 

    edited August 2021 smalm
  • Reply 4 of 20
    BeatsBeats Posts: 3,073member
    To the white knights on AI who constantly defended this #MeToo garbage, how does it feel now that #MeToo has come to Apple?!!

    The timing is quite suspicious shortly after that crazy cat lady spoke out against Apple. Her firing is long overdue.

    And Tim Cook deserves this for constantly bending over backwards for the sake of political correctness. News Flash! The same PC people don’t give a damn about you either!!

    If I ran Apple I would fire all these crybabies and tell them to work for a company who isn’t racist and sexist. Problem solved!!!
    sdw2001rbelizeTheObannonFilesmalm
  • Reply 5 of 20
    sdw2001sdw2001 Posts: 18,012member
    Ridiculous.  Apple is one of the most woke companies in the world.  It’s a large organization and there are bound to be problems.   But saying it is endemic is absurd.  We’ve all seen the slack channel complaining about actually going back to work.  This is what happens when you almost exclusively hire and promote the most self obsessed, entitled and clueless generation in the history of the world.  
    TheObannonFilebaconstangsmalm
  • Reply 6 of 20
    larryjwlarryjw Posts: 1,031member
    Riiiiight…

    look, anywhere there are people, there will be issues. 

    But to slam Apple as some discriminatory based workplace culture is ridiculous. Apple strives harder than anyone to ensure this is not the case. 

    Anytime someone gets passed over or disagrees with something, or has a conflict does not equal inequality, discrimination, etc. these are the people who are discriminatory. They won’t be happy unless the CEO is not a white person. Or a man. Regardless of the best available candidate is white or male. Enough of that. 

    How about work hard and make yourself indispensable. The best candidates should get the best jobs. The hardest and smartest workers should get the promotions. 

    Enough hand outs because somebody creates some noise and pretends there’s a problem. It seems the actual good hard working people get nothing these days snd loud mouth problem creators get catered to. Hope Apple lets them run themselves ragged with this crap snd rewards actual good workers. 
    You know this, How?

    Freedom of Speech not only gives you to right to speak, but the right not to speak. I'd suggest, since you could have no idea about the substance of these issues, you make use of the important right of not speaking.
    ronn
  • Reply 7 of 20
    jSnivelyjSnively Posts: 428administrator
    Beats said:
    To the white knights on AI who constantly defended this #MeToo garbage, how does it feel now that #MeToo has come to Apple?!!

    Pretty good, actually. Just ordered a pizza. A topic doesn't become unimportant just because it intersects with something we care about on the venn diagram. Apple is not a benevolent entity, it's a corporation made up of people. I happen to think that equal opportunity is important, and people -- even when they have the best intentions -- are falliable. If these employees have legimiate complaints and they have exhaused every other avenue available to them, then the least we can do is hear them out. They seem to have put together a council of sorts and are fielding complaints through an alternate feedback channel. That kind of job-risking orginzation doesn't tend to happen for absolutely no reason.

    If it turns out to be much ado about nothing then so be it.
    GeeAyeWesley Hilliardronnbestkeptsecretpscooter63FileMakerFeller
  • Reply 8 of 20
    dewmedewme Posts: 5,282member
    I'm at a loss to figure out what these people want. They do realize that Apple is simply one one very many companies that they can work for. They are in no way limited in their ability to walk out the door and take their services elsewhere. They are not indentured servants or contractually obligated to work for Apple. If they don't like working for Apple, for any reason whatsoever, they are free to leave at any time.

    None of this makes any sense to me. It's almost as if they are being paid or somehow compensated to conduct an organized internal attack against Apple. If these are people who are supposed to be motivated by creating things and advancing the benefits that technology can deliver to ordinary people throughout the world with highly personal products, it's inconceivable that they would embark on a public mission of destruction against the company that allows them to do their best work and fulfill their personal and professional ambitions.

    I hear them saying they want to Think Different but they are simply mocking Apple. If they really want to Think Different, they should absolutely think about what their lives could be like when they are drawing a paycheck from a company other than Apple. They can join a non-profit, serve their country, or embark on starting up their own business. That's truly Thinking Different. Acting like an entitled and impetuous child lashing out against a self-fabricated enemy is simply regressing to their childish ways in their secret tree house fortress. There's nothing different about that. It's actually rather pathetic - for adults.

    netroxJWSCpscooter63h2p
  • Reply 9 of 20
    sflocalsflocal Posts: 6,088member
    Beats said:
    To the white knights on AI who constantly defended this #MeToo garbage, how does it feel now that #MeToo has come to Apple?!!

    The timing is quite suspicious shortly after that crazy cat lady spoke out against Apple. Her firing is long overdue.

    And Tim Cook deserves this for constantly bending over backwards for the sake of political correctness. News Flash! The same PC people don’t give a damn about you either!!

    If I ran Apple I would fire all these crybabies and tell them to work for a company who isn’t racist and sexist. Problem solved!!!
    I take this with a grain of salt.  Tens of thousands of Apple employees, and this group is (so far) 15 people?  That right there has me questioning the veracity of this "problem".  Are there a-hole bosses at Apple?  Probably so.  Those should be addressed, but to lump Apple as a whole?  Seriously.

    No one company in the world, regardless of Utopia will every be 100% all happy employees.  It's an ideal, but in the end unrealistic.  There are countless of personality types and get opposite ones in the same room, or one reporting to the other.  People will get their feelings hurt.  It's life.  Get over it.
    JWSCFileMakerFeller
  • Reply 10 of 20
    lkrupplkrupp Posts: 10,557member
    Much like the dissatisfaction shown by the AI crowd that is never okay with anything Apple does, so it is with Apple employees who are never satisfied with their jobs or salary. Some people just can’t be happy and must find something to be mad at.
  • Reply 11 of 20
    Wesley HilliardWesley Hilliard Posts: 177member, administrator, moderator, editor
    dewme said:
    I'm at a loss to figure out what these people want. 
    So your response is "you work for Apple, so what if you have a racist boss, at least you have such a coveted job. Get over it."

    Not a good look man, not gonna lie. If these allegations are true there are some dirty people in management and other controlling positions. Maybe not executive staff, but everything below VP is a mystery outside of Apple.

    Apple is a company like any other. If systemic issues are being ignored because of a corrupt culture, then speaking out is the only way to force change. There's a solid chance these complaints never made it past middle management. Tbh, todays coverage could be the first time Tim Cook is hearing these grievances.

    Not everything has to be conspiracy. These are real accusations and likely very real problems, so let's hope there's some resolution from Apple soon. Otherwise get ready to hear about this a whole lot more over the coming months.

    This is a whole lot more than 12 people. Apparently over 200 Apple employees have joined the Fudge Discord today. 
    ronnjSnivelybestkeptsecretpscooter63
  • Reply 12 of 20
    maestro64maestro64 Posts: 5,043member
    It looks like Apple is beginning to rot from within. They got a group of people who see bad things everywhere they look.
  • Reply 13 of 20
    JWSCJWSC Posts: 1,203member
    As others have said, you will find discontent in any large organization.  What I find curious is, despite the unhappiness these people show, they are still oddly loyal to Apple, which is evidenced by the fact they haven’t left the company yet.  True, they have an interesting way of showing it.  But most people would leave if they were truly unhappy with their employer.
    edited August 2021 pscooter63
  • Reply 14 of 20
    dee_deedee_dee Posts: 107member
    Ashley’s claims don’t seem genuine.   She has a bit of a history exaggerating claims, like when she claimed she live in apartments that were built on top of “Class 1 toxic waste”.  She was the only on in the entire complex who suffered nose bleeds and hallucinations.  


    edited August 2021
  • Reply 15 of 20
    I don't doubt at a company as large as Apple with thousands of employees all trying to move up the food chain that there are instances of a bad boss who for some reason won't promote the right person because of his biases.  But I think a lot of these complainers need to look in the mirror.  Maybe you think you're the cat's pajamas, but your superior may see that you're not the right person for the job and it has nothing to do with your sex, skin color, etc., but you see it that way.  And if you truly think you're being passed up unfairly, time to take your talents and convince someone else of your worth.  You'll find out soon enough if you were right or not.
  • Reply 16 of 20
    crowleycrowley Posts: 10,453member
    It seems the actual good hard working people get nothing these days snd loud mouth problem creators get catered to. 
    Yeah, the 13 white guys out of 18 on the Apple Executive Team sure do seem to be suffering.
    ronn
  • Reply 17 of 20
    maestro64maestro64 Posts: 5,043member
    rattlhed said:
    I don't doubt at a company as large as Apple with thousands of employees all trying to move up the food chain that there are instances of a bad boss who for some reason won't promote the right person because of his biases.  But I think a lot of these complainers need to look in the mirror.  Maybe you think you're the cat's pajamas, but your superior may see that you're not the right person for the job and it has nothing to do with your sex, skin color, etc., but you see it that way.  And if you truly think you're being passed up unfairly, time to take your talents and convince someone else of your worth.  You'll find out soon enough if you were right or not.
    I worked for my fair share of big companies and the grass is never greener, every company has its issues and most are caused by the people themselves and not anything the companies is specially doing. I can tell you most of the rules and policies companies have in place can be directly linked to something a employee did or did not do. I give a simple example, worked at a company which allow managers to do birthday parties for employees and the company would pay for it, it fell into a discretionary fund for employee morale. One day some idiot manage thought it would be okay to give his admin jewelry, others found out, complained, the parties and other company paid employee morale activities ended. People were all pissed off and complained the company no longer cared about them, most never knew the reason it stop since the company could not say a manager was giving gifts to employees since you can not share personnel issue with other people.

    Having people working for me and hearing the complaint first hand about how something is not fair or unreasonable and how it could be better. Most times people do not have any real solution other than to say it should be different and they could do better. My response to people like this was you're always free to do your own thing start your own company and do it better and when they do they can come back and let us know how well that worked for them.
    edited August 2021
  • Reply 18 of 20
    Dave CummingsDave Cummings Posts: 43unconfirmed, member
    dewme said:
    I'm at a loss to figure out what these people want. 
    So your response is "you work for Apple, so what if you have a racist boss, at least you have such a coveted job. Get over it."

    Not a good look man, not gonna lie. If these allegations are true there are some dirty people in management and other controlling positions. Maybe not executive staff, but everything below VP is a mystery outside of Apple.

    Apple is a company like any other. If systemic issues are being ignored because of a corrupt culture, then speaking out is the only way to force change. There's a solid chance these complaints never made it past middle management. Tbh, todays coverage could be the first time Tim Cook is hearing these grievances.

    Not everything has to be conspiracy. These are real accusations and likely very real problems, so let's hope there's some resolution from Apple soon. Otherwise get ready to hear about this a whole lot more over the coming months.

    This is a whole lot more than 12 people. Apparently over 200 Apple employees have joined the Fudge Discord today. 
    Exactly.  This private discord doesn't even mean that there's anything wrong with Apple in general.  But, there may be issues in their own departments and they want to make Apple better, out of love for the company.  If they didn't love the company,  it would be easier to just go to a different company. I don't know the incident that started the discord,  it could be born out of frustration from Apple's return to office plan,  or it could be something else. But even if it was just one person, you got to take any and all concerns seriously. But yeah, overall, I think they will help shape Apple into an even better company.
  • Reply 19 of 20
    One of the reasons I turned down a job at Apple is that they have a kind of cast system in which they treat their full time employees much better than they do their contractors. There were news stories about how contractors had to use different bathrooms. Frankly, it gave me the creeps. I would have been a full time employee but being forced to treat contract workers as lower class people is unacceptable. This speaks to a serious corporate culture problem. I suspect that Apple is not a fun company to work for.
  • Reply 20 of 20
    ronnronn Posts: 650member
    One of the reasons I turned down a job at Apple is that they have a kind of cast system in which they treat their full time employees much better than they do their contractors. There were news stories about how contractors had to use different bathrooms. Frankly, it gave me the creeps. I would have been a full time employee but being forced to treat contract workers as lower class people is unacceptable. This speaks to a serious corporate culture problem. I suspect that Apple is not a fun company to work for.
    Unfortunately this is par for the course at most large corps. Contractors often work side by side corp colleagues and get lower pay, limited (or no) benefits and can be gone in an instant. They often lack a path to advancement even with many years at the behemoths; they're called permatemps for this reason. IIRC, MS was found to violate employee coverage with contractors and had to cough up for back OT, SS, fringe benefits, etc. Apple isn't as severe as Google and MS, but they are guilty of the same nonetheless. And let's even get into H-1B visa BS.


Sign In or Register to comment.