Fewer Android users switching to 'iPhone 13' because of CSAM scan, no Touch ID

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  • Reply 21 of 33
    I've always owned iphones until last year. Took my iPhone 8+ and grudgingly upgraded to iphone 12. After 2 months I couldn't stand it anymore and traded in the iphone 12 for Galaxy S21+, much to my husband's glee. He's a diehard Galaxy fan. 

    Two reasons i dumped the iphone 12:
    1. That ugly notch! 
    2.  No touch id. 

    8 months in on my Galaxy S21+, and i love it. No plans to run back to Apple. Iphone 13 will still have a notch, (smaller doesn't matter to me...get rid of it), and no finger ID scan. Sigh.
  • Reply 22 of 33
    fastasleepfastasleep Posts: 6,435member
    xyzzy-xxx said:
    Beside Android users I will not switching from iOS 14 to iOS 15 and will not replace my iPhone 12 Pro with a 13 Pro.
    I would be fine with CSAM scanning in iCloud, but will not pay for a device with spyware installed.
    How many times have you posted this now? A dozen? Nobody cares. 
    jony0
  • Reply 23 of 33
    sflocalsflocal Posts: 6,103member
    crowley said:
    sflocal said:
    Beats said:
    Called it yesterday. 


    If Apple drops CSAM scanning the iPhone 13 would be huge.
    I keep reading this from people, but unless I'm really missing it, where does it say that CSAM is going to scan photos stored locally on one's iPhone?  Everything I've read says it's scanned on iCloud accounts on Apple's own servers, NOT individual iPhones which is what all other cloud providers do already.
    https://www.apple.com/child-safety/

    To help address this, new technology in iOS and iPadOS* will allow Apple to detect known CSAM images stored in iCloud Photos. This will enable Apple to report these instances to the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children (NCMEC). NCMEC acts as a comprehensive reporting center for CSAM and works in collaboration with law enforcement agencies across the United States.

    Apple’s method of detecting known CSAM is designed with user privacy in mind. Instead of scanning images in the cloud, the system performs on-device matching using a database of known CSAM image hashes provided by NCMEC and other child safety organizations. Apple further transforms this database into an unreadable set of hashes that is securely stored on users’ devices.

    There's a lot of detail in the linked documents about what they're doing.  The hash check against the CSAM database happens on-device.
    Thank you for that link!  I myself could not find official info from Apple about it, but now I am considered schooled.

    After reading it, I do not like the idea of Apple (or anyone else) scanning my phone to ping back to the mothership about what I have on it.  I'm a software engineer as well, yet I have zero clue how Apple is handling the uploading/downloading of hashes and the syncing/maintaining of that CSAM "database" in iOS15.  If it were done in iCloud, I could give zero f**ks about it, but the thought of my battery possibly draining faster because of some CSAM process running concerns me.

    Now that Apple is under the most biggest of microscopes, I'm going to take a step back and see how this CSAM evolves.  I'm all for catching child predators, but like so many things in the world, the actions of those few always ruins it for the law-abiding people.  Will it prevent me from upgrading to iOS15 or the new iPhone13?  Absolutely not.  I will though be watching this very closely.
    muthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 24 of 33
    sflocalsflocal Posts: 6,103member
    diznee25 said:
    I've always owned iphones until last year. Took my iPhone 8+ and grudgingly upgraded to iphone 12. After 2 months I couldn't stand it anymore and traded in the iphone 12 for Galaxy S21+, much to my husband's glee. He's a diehard Galaxy fan. 

    Two reasons i dumped the iphone 12:
    1. That ugly notch! 
    2.  No touch id. 

    8 months in on my Galaxy S21+, and i love it. No plans to run back to Apple. Iphone 13 will still have a notch, (smaller doesn't matter to me...get rid of it), and no finger ID scan. Sigh.
    You one-post Samsung-trolls just crack me up.  You make the childish effort of posting in an Apple-enthusiast thread to hype your garbage.  Get some help.  Seriously.  Get a life.  You're in a sad place in your life if you have to do this.

    Grow up.
    jony0
  • Reply 25 of 33
    fastasleepfastasleep Posts: 6,435member
    sflocal said:

    After reading it, I do not like the idea of Apple (or anyone else) scanning my phone to ping back to the mothership about what I have on it.  

    I'm a software engineer as well, yet I have zero clue how Apple is handling the uploading/downloading of hashes and the syncing/maintaining of that CSAM "database" in iOS15. 
    That’s not really what’s happening though. It doesn’t ping anyone until you have 30 verified pieces of CSAM on your iPhone that you’re trying to upload to iCloud. 

    The hashes and stuff is maintained by two third party orgs and is auditable. 

    I suggest you read this, it’s one of the more concise rundowns of how this all works. 


    If it were done in iCloud, I could give zero f**ks about it, but the thought of my battery possibly draining faster because of some CSAM process running concerns me.
    Why? Your iPhone processes your photos all day long detecting faces and dogs and cats and locations and creating memories and uploading/downloading to iCloud. Presumably, much of this happens while connected to power and not when your battery is low. Ever notice Photos has paused syncing while on battery to preserve power? This would be part of that exact same process. 
    edited August 2021 jony0
  • Reply 26 of 33
    Deciding to no longer be the "privacy company" is going to prove to be an extremely expensive decision for Apple. The loss of trust alone will cost them billions.
  • Reply 27 of 33
    fastasleepfastasleep Posts: 6,435member
    Deciding to no longer be the "privacy company" is going to prove to be an extremely expensive decision for Apple. The loss of trust alone will cost them billions.
    Counterpoint: it won’t. 
    jony0
  • Reply 28 of 33
    dewmedewme Posts: 5,476member
    I've thought about upgrading from my current iPhone Xs Max to an iPhone 13, because 13 is somewhat intriguing in a silly sort of way for those of us born on a Friday the 13th. But at the end of the day, and throughout the day in fact, I simply cannot logically justify replacing my Xs Max at this time because it's still an amazing piece of kit that more than meets my every smartphone need. The Xs Max still feels fast, still lasts all day on battery power, I'm still lovin' the Face ID with Apple Watch assist for the infrequent forays into the world of mask wearing, and the camera still exceeds my camera driving abilities. I will redirect my upgrade intentions to the rumored-since-the-last-ice-age new iPad Mini, which I hope will arrive before too many more keynotes have come and gone with no mini joy to be had.

    I wouldn't make too many predictions about the trajectory of upgrades and switchers until Apple shows what they've put together for the iPhone 13. Until more people really know what they're getting, or what they are passing on, the projections are incomplete. Even I know that logic can go out the window if the new iPhone 13 is tempting enough. Who knows, maybe Apple will offer an iPhone 13 + iPad Mini 6 bundle with a discount. Yeah, they won't, but hope springs eternal.
  • Reply 29 of 33
    NaiyasNaiyas Posts: 107member
    “Top of the list was a "lack of fingerprint reader," which scored 31.9% of the vote. Fingerprints are still the main form of biometric identification in Android devices, though it is unclear exactly why Face ID is shunned by the voters in favor of the removed Touch ID.”

    Touch ID works with masks, Face ID doesn’t (yet). It’s a significant issue, and it doesn’t look like it will be disappearing in the immediate future. Not significant enough that I would consider switching to Android for it—if anything, I’d just get an SE, which is a great phone and an incredible bargain—but if you don’t understand why anyone would want Touch ID these days, there is at least one very good reason. 


    Strange that... my Face ID works fine with a mask, just had to add an alternative face and hey presto it's working fine! Touch ID is so last decade...
    jony0
  • Reply 30 of 33
    omasouomasou Posts: 601member
    Maybe with fewer Android switcher to iPhone we’ll have less poorly informed people like we do in this thread.
    glennhjony0
  • Reply 31 of 33
    This has been rather eye opening. As an avid Android enthusiast for the better part of a decade, I have seen my fair share of tinfoil hat types throughout the community. It's rather interesting to see the same behavior here as well. While I can understand people's apprehension about Apple scanning your device, if you have nothing to hide, I honestly don't understand WTF the problem is. And I have said this very same line to hundreds of Android users who fancy themselves on running custom roms without Google services, because of "muh privacy". 🤦 If you can't see past your own narcissism to see what this tech was actually created for, that's on you.  As far as touch ID and those who want it's return, you can jump on Android, since they love using tech from 7 years ago. 😂
  • Reply 32 of 33
    chasmchasm Posts: 3,371member
    This doesn't speak well to the intelligence of Android users who participated in this survey ...

    CSAM hashing is happening on nearly every site where you post, share, or store photos. It's entirely platform-agnostic.

    And for the one forum-goer who says the difference is (paraphrasing) "well these other companies do it on their site, Apple does it on-device" ... oops, not quite. I understand your confusion, but you're partially incorrect.

    Apple does the "AI identifying and blurring nudes sent to or by children 12 and under" on-device. That's not CSAM hashing.

    Photos stored on an iPhone are also hashed on-device for CSAM images (against a database already on your iPhone), yes ... but that information doesn't go anywhere until you upload said photos to iCloud -- or share, post, or store any of those photos to any major site, which all do CSAM hashing/scanning as well.
    jony0
  • Reply 33 of 33
    lkrupplkrupp Posts: 10,557member
    diznee25 said:
    I've always owned iphones until last year. Took my iPhone 8+ and grudgingly upgraded to iphone 12. After 2 months I couldn't stand it anymore and traded in the iphone 12 for Galaxy S21+, much to my husband's glee. He's a diehard Galaxy fan. 

    Two reasons i dumped the iphone 12:
    1. That ugly notch! 
    2.  No touch id. 

    8 months in on my Galaxy S21+, and i love it. No plans to run back to Apple. Iphone 13 will still have a notch, (smaller doesn't matter to me...get rid of it), and no finger ID scan. Sigh.
    So you joined the forum just to inform us of this? Why?
    jony0
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