Do we really need an Apple car? I dislike cars so I may be biased ;-) I understand that for many people cars have a much prominent importance. Nevertheless, I would love Apple to innovate instead of (allegedly) improving something that already exists.
We need something better than what we have. Some people like the idea of a super car:
but this would only be worth doing if they could hit a mass market price point. One thing we definitely need is driverless taxis and if they can look cool at the same time so be it.
A lot of the Apple SVPs have been reported as fans of luxury cars and Steve Jobs was too. Jony Ive's cars are listed here:
If Apple does nothing then the industry won't improve much just like how the smartphone industry was. The car industry today looks like the smartphone industry in 2006 - too many models, nobody making anything that stands above the rest, all overpriced for the experience they offer, which is an experience of necessity rather than contentment.
Some people point to Tesla changing the industry but Tesla cars haven't done to the car industry what the iPhone did to smartphones, they've been going for 18 years and have around 2% marketshare. The car industry will change more slowly due to the high purchase price but even in isolation, a Tesla product doesn't feel significantly better than competing models to the point that it would be hard to choose something other than a Tesla. Tesla has made owning an EV practical, which has some significance but this is like Blackberry making the web accessible on mobile. It was usable but it wasn't the right way to do it. Jony Ive refers to this in the video above saying that innovating is hard because there's no point of reference. Making an innovative car requires rethinking every part that goes into making one based on everything we now know that people use them for. Apple is still the best company that can deliver on this.
Why do we “definitely need” driverless taxis? How exactly will that improve society? A lot of people rely on those jobs to survive. I think we’ll find that removing the human element from certain things won’t be the utopian experience we think it will be.
Driverless taxis are definitely convenient, especially in urban areas. Uber and Lyft are increasingly popular. But you’re right, not everyone wants one.
Apple’s claim to fame is making “personal” devices. Not sure that driverless taxis fit that mold. I believe Apple has a much better chance of making volume sales to individuals versus local governments or company fleets. And the latter will demand discounts, not something Apple would be particularly fond of providing.
I have loved Apple for close to 30 years. I have been accused by family and friends of being a fanboy. I have dreamed of an AppleCar.
However, I would not buy one, no matter how great it seems. Apple has a history of creating great stuff that they never fully put their energy into later. They basically abandon it. That just can't happen with a car. You can't tell your customers 4 years later that you are discontinuing it. I just don't trust them.
If these people can’t make a TV how on earth are they gonna make a car?
Of course, Apple can make a TV. So can thousands of others.
"Can" is never the issue; it's does it make sense, can a company bring something to the market that others have not been able to?
Tesla has mind-share. I'm not so sure Tesla is here for the long term; they don't have much of a track record. They exist by virtue of some unexplainable deification of Elon Musk -- the cult of personality.
What nobody outside of Apple has is any idea about Apple's plans, if any.
There may be a cult of personality around Musk. But what’s more important is that he is a driver of technology development and he knows how to motivate and inspire people the way Jobs did - perhaps even better.
Why don't they just contract this to Magna? Magna makes cars for almost all top car companies. It's much better than setting up their own manufacturing unit. Hell, even Apple's long term partner Foxconn has entered electric car manufacturing market, so they could look at that too.
Otherwise we are going to keep hearing about Apple's car ambitions ten years down the line with no clear timeline on the horizon.
I'm sure Apple will be developing proprietary manufacturing processes that it wants to keep secret. Apple will build a big factory. For years, the only thing going through the factory gates will be parts and materials, and the only thing coming out will be shiny Apple cars. The factory will be staffed by oompa loompas. Then, one day, Apple will announce the distribution of 5 golden Apple Wallet passes.
This is going to dribble along for another decade until it finally fades away producing nothing. It’s become someone’s vanity project.
IMO it’s Cook’s primary legacy, with AppleTV+ as a backup. I don’t believe Apple can set up a manufacturing facility for cars when they have little actual manufacturing experience themselves. They got out of that game in the early 90’s. It took Tesla 10 years to get manufacturing right, and even then it’s not to Apple standards.
Cook's primary legacy will be AR glasses, not a car. To boot, he's spent a heck of a lot more time hyping AR than he has cars. I believe he's reportedly even hinted at retiring after an AR product is released (but maybe that was just another rumor).
Do we really need an Apple car? I dislike cars so I may be biased ;-) I understand that for many people cars have a much prominent importance. Nevertheless, I would love Apple to innovate instead of (allegedly) improving something that already exists.
Why anybody can't like cars? It's best way to commute.
Why do we “definitely need” driverless taxis? How exactly will that improve society? A lot of people rely on those jobs to survive. I think we’ll find that removing the human element from certain things won’t be the utopian experience we think it will be.
If these people can’t make a TV how on earth are they gonna make a car?
Of course, Apple can make a TV. So can thousands of others.
"Can" is never the issue; it's does it make sense, can a company bring something to the market that others have not been able to?
Tesla has mind-share. I'm not so sure Tesla is here for the long term; they don't have much of a track record. They exist by virtue of some unexplainable deification of Elon Musk -- the cult of personality.
What nobody outside of Apple has is any idea about Apple's plans, if any.
Agreed. For a laugh watch this video on what a buffoon Musk actually is. Vaporware is his middle name.
larryjw said: Tesla has mind-share. I'm not so sure Tesla is here for the long term; they don't have much of a track record. They exist by virtue of some unexplainable deification of Elon Musk -- the cult of personality.
It's not unexplainable. The man tends to get results. Tesla has produced and sold over a million and a half EVs since its inception, single-handedly produced a major electric charing infrastructure, and built (and is building) a global automotive and battery manufacturing empire.
Other EV brands have done the same and sell more of them. Check out the top sellers in Europe.
If these people can’t make a TV how on earth are they gonna make a car?
Of course, Apple can make a TV. So can thousands of others.
"Can" is never the issue; it's does it make sense, can a company bring something to the market that others have not been able to?
Tesla has mind-share. I'm not so sure Tesla is here for the long term; they don't have much of a track record. They exist by virtue of some unexplainable deification of Elon Musk -- the cult of personality.
What nobody outside of Apple has is any idea about Apple's plans, if any.
The cult of personality, just like the cult following Jobsian Apple had? The only doubt over Apple’s longevity was when Jobs wasn’t CEO. And much the same for Tesla, if it didn’t have such a charismatic enthusiast at the helm I don’t think it’d have anywhere near the success it does.
Charismatic? Have you watched his presentations? Terrible speaker, awkward, nervous, shaken. Opposite of charismatic.
If these people can’t make a TV how on earth are they gonna make a car?
Of course, Apple can make a TV. So can thousands of others.
"Can" is never the issue; it's does it make sense, can a company bring something to the market that others have not been able to?
Tesla has mind-share. I'm not so sure Tesla is here for the long term; they don't have much of a track record. They exist by virtue of some unexplainable deification of Elon Musk -- the cult of personality.
What nobody outside of Apple has is any idea about Apple's plans, if any.
The cult of personality, just like the cult following Jobsian Apple had? The only doubt over Apple’s longevity was when Jobs wasn’t CEO. And much the same for Tesla, if it didn’t have such a charismatic enthusiast at the helm I don’t think it’d have anywhere near the success it does.
Charismatic? Have you watched his presentations? Terrible speaker, awkward, nervous, shaken. Opposite of charismatic.
That is true. Musk is a far cry from Jobs when it comes to presentation skills. It matters not. Some might even think that’s part of his charm. Wherever else you might say, he displays tremendous enthusiasm and that means something to many in his audience as well as those who work for him.
Musk dives into far more technical detail than jobs ever did. Jobs had good reason for not going too deep into the technology - he knew who his target audience was. Musk doesn’t care. He’s an engineer at heart just like Woz. And for that I am eternally thankful since it becomes tiring when leaders constantly feel the need to dumb down their presentations for the “unwashed” masses. It’s time younger, and hopefully more technically literate, audiences expect more in terms of technical communications. This is the 21st century.
This is going to dribble along for another decade until it finally fades away producing nothing. It’s become someone’s vanity project.
IMO it’s Cook’s primary legacy, with AppleTV+ as a backup. I don’t believe Apple can set up a manufacturing facility for cars when they have little actual manufacturing experience themselves. They got out of that game in the early 90’s. It took Tesla 10 years to get manufacturing right, and even then it’s not to Apple standards.
Cook's primary legacy will be AR glasses, not a car. To boot, he's spent a heck of a lot more time hyping AR than he has cars. I believe he's reportedly even hinted at retiring after an AR product is released (but maybe that was just another rumor).
My two cents is that Cook’s legacy is already here - Apple Watch. It is in the process of revolutionizing health care and will have an even more profound impact as time goes on. From personal diagnostics to preventative maintenance, Apple Watch might be the instrument that puts a couple more years on average life expectancy than anything else in the last few decades. That’s a pretty good legacy IMO.
Let’s not forget that the SpaceX StarLink system will be a huge asset for Tesla to provide their customers with new features, safety and entertainment, which will be difficult for most other companies to emulate, even deep pocketed Apple.
Anyone who thinks Musk is a a buffoon is foolish. He’s eccentric for sure, and has earned the right. Apple should’ve bought Tesla, and should’ve made Musk CEO, or CTO with broad powers at the very least. He’s revolutionized the auto industry, the rocket industry, and soon micro satellites, moon, Mars, ….
Henry Ford + Edison/Tesla + Werner von Braun + Jobs + …. No one comes close.
Tesla has mind-share. I'm not so sure Tesla is here for the long term; they don't have much of a track record. They exist by virtue of some unexplainable deification of Elon Musk -- the cult of personality.
I whole heatedly disagree about Tesla. They do have a 15 year track record, but comparatively, you are right it is not long. I would argue that in that short time, they have moved the industry a great deal. Their existence is not due to a cult of personality any more than Apple was with Jobs. It is a good product. You ask anyone who drives a Tesla, they fall in love immediately, and not with Musk.
I think Apple has to make cars because EVs are going to become moving entertainment centers, eventually containing a whole eco-system of electronics. If Apple's not a part of that, then they're leaving an opening for another company to fill the void in a huge market, and eventually compete against Apple in other things. Apple is so far behind, they should buy a car company, perhaps even one of the emerging EV companies, like Lucid, Rivian, etc.
Tesla has mind-share. I'm not so sure Tesla is here for the long term; they don't have much of a track record. They exist by virtue of some unexplainable deification of Elon Musk -- the cult of personality.
I whole heatedly disagree about Tesla. They do have a 15 year track record, but comparatively, you are right it is not long. I would argue that in that short time, they have moved the industry a great deal. Their existence is not due to a cult of personality any more than Apple was with Jobs. It is a good product. You ask anyone who drives a Tesla, they fall in love immediately, and not with Musk.
Since 37% of Americans do not have a garage or carport to install their own charging stations, Teslas can never be sold to the poorest 37% of Americans, since they have no place to charge their vehicles at home since they park on the street. I won't go so far as to say electric vehicle companies have a racist business model, selling only to the rich, but some people might claim that.
Comments
Apple’s claim to fame is making “personal” devices. Not sure that driverless taxis fit that mold. I believe Apple has a much better chance of making volume sales to individuals versus local governments or company fleets. And the latter will demand discounts, not something Apple would be particularly fond of providing.
However, I would not buy one, no matter how great it seems. Apple has a history of creating great stuff that they never fully put their energy into later. They basically abandon it. That just can't happen with a car. You can't tell your customers 4 years later that you are discontinuing it. I just don't trust them.
I will keep my Tesla, thank you very much.
https://youtu.be/rmkFrv80b7Y
Musk dives into far more technical detail than jobs ever did. Jobs had good reason for not going too deep into the technology - he knew who his target audience was. Musk doesn’t care. He’s an engineer at heart just like Woz. And for that I am eternally thankful since it becomes tiring when leaders constantly feel the need to dumb down their presentations for the “unwashed” masses. It’s time younger, and hopefully more technically literate, audiences expect more in terms of technical communications. This is the 21st century.
Anyone who thinks Musk is a a buffoon is foolish. He’s eccentric for sure, and has earned the right. Apple should’ve bought Tesla, and should’ve made Musk CEO, or CTO with broad powers at the very least. He’s revolutionized the auto industry, the rocket industry, and soon micro satellites, moon, Mars, ….
Henry Ford + Edison/Tesla + Werner von Braun + Jobs + …. No one comes close.
Apple is so far behind, they should buy a car company, perhaps even one of the emerging EV companies, like Lucid, Rivian, etc.