The people I know have the good taste not to buy their crap in the first place.
Even if I DID own their CD, I wouldn't burn it...just on economic grounds alone. I can't afford to be buying CDs just to burn or step on them in radio station parking lots.
My well-documented fascination/lust with Sheryl Crow hasn't been diminished by her vocal anti-war/anti-Bush position and statements.
I can separate the two and still dig her music and bod and just forgive her for being wrong on the other stuff.
As far as the Dixie Chicks, that's a funny one: they made the mistake of being popular in the ONE genre where you simply can't afford to come across the least bit anti-America/anti-troop/anti-whatever. Rock, pop, R&B, rap, etc. all have a long, glorious history of protest, left-leaning sentiments, etc.
But country music? These are the people who actually work for a living, whose kids go off to the military and do the dirty work, who often lead simple, no-frills lives,etc (the kind of people many here would probably love to make fun of?). It's kind of funny that they (the Chicks) stepped in it this bad. I'm sure when she said it she just thought she was being "daring" and "an artist" (easy to do in London...say that stuff in a crowd in your - AND President Bush's home state of Texas...THEN I'd say you got some balls).
I can separate the message from the messenger. Alec Baldwin is one of my favorite actors...has been for a long, long time. He's a horse's ass in his views, but he's a good, solid actor. I don't boycott his movies or refuse to rent one.
I try to differentiate (and notate when writing, if there's any doubt) between those who oppose war, protest from their heart, do so with dignity and grace, etc. from the mindless shitheads breaking stuff, tangling with police, toting signs saying "We support our troops...especially when they kill their own officers", etc.
Don't lump those of us who support this action in with the Dixie Chicks CD-burning brigade (of which I'm not a part).
In any case, it's still just people exercising their right to free speech too. That's what's cool about it: it's a two-way street.
Natalie Maines isn't guaranteed that her statements won't have consequences. Just like when ultra-right-wingers spew their stuff and get into trouble.
She can say whatever she wants, however she wants and whenever she wants. And people can respond in kind.
Being an "artist" doesn't get you a "shield me from repurcussions" card.
OK....back on topic here , if that doesn't get me a chewing from the moderators, it looks probable that Saddam wasn't in the that area when the bombs hit. The man's got so many doubles that nobody for sure knows where he is, or who for that matter.
Maybe the real Saddam has had plastic surgery and a sex change, now installed in a CIA safe house somewhere in Florida sipping those martinis.
Maybe the real Saddam has had plastic surgery and a sex change, now installed in a CIA safe house somewhere in Florida sipping those martinis...
Uh, yeah. THAT'S "back on topic"...
I sometimes have to defend myself against ShawnPatrick's latest and greatest, sammi. Get used to it.
Now, back on topic: I think Hussein is dead. I think he has been for quite some time. If not all-out dead, then certainly seriously injured. I just find it hard to believe that in a time of war and crisis for his country, he's not come on TV and made references to things actually going on that assure people he's still around and in power and is "fighting the good fight".
Think about it: unless I've missed one, none of the video released of him since this war began can truly be pegged/timed to being recent (since the war began). God knows what kind of footage they've got stored up and could show and caption as whatever they wanted.
Think about it (part 2): Flip the situation around and imagine the U.S. under attack by an army determined to remove President Bush from power (put a cork in it...spare me). Say that the White House or a section of the Pentagon he was thought to have been in at the time was hit hard with bombs a day or two before the "real" war starts, reducing the joint to rubble. Now suppose that in nearly three weeks, we never saw anything from President Bush on TV except videotaped segments of him walking around his Texas ranch with reporters, sitting around with various cabinet members in that big room, walking out to Marine One with his dog, etc. In other words, not once in three weeks has President Bush come on to talk SPECIFICALLY about what's going on, refer to recent events or otherwise let it be known that he's around, still alive, in control, etc.
Wouldn't we all - after about a week or so of this - start to wonder "WHAT is going on...is he even alive anymore? We haven't seen anything by the administration that lets us know, 100%, that the President is still alive".
Saddam could've gone on TV numerous times and referred to - in detail, and in a way that left no room for interpretation - recent events during the war: the opening attack, the POWs, the chopper crash, Geraldo's nonsense, Peter Arnett's little episode, the various instances of friendly fire incidents, the Akbar case, the death of various well-known people or the destruction of certain structures.
He hasn't, far as I know. I would think OUR president was dead if this were all flipped around.
Nah. Don't take it personally. We were both admittedly off-topic. You know, today I read Newsweek for the first time since the war began. They're already talking about Who's Going to Lead the New Government?. With talk of Saddam's death already happening, I'll bet we'll be hearing more about Chalabi (BBC Profile) and Garner.
The CIA reference re. Saddam Hussein was a silly joke...it's more likely that if anyone of our enemies is in a safe house, it would be OBL.
Quote:
I sometimes have to defend myself against ShawnPatrick's latest and greatest, sammi. Get used to it.
Now, back on topic: I think Hussein is dead. I think he has been for quite some time. If not all-out dead, then certainly seriously injured. I just find it hard to believe that in a time of war and crisis for his country, he's not come on TV and made references to things actually going on that assure people he's still around and in power and is "fighting the good fight".
Saddam Hussein was on TV 2 days back, shown on Lebanese, Egyptian, Syrian, Iranian and other middle eastern TV stations over and over throughout the day doing an impromptu walkabout in downtown Baghdad, surrounded by TV cameras and loyal Republican Guard troops, and "irregulars" , yelling Saddam's name and punching the sky with fists and automatic weapons. I imagine the folk there do *know* what this man looks like...he has been their leader for some 25 years....and it sure looked like him...unless it was yet another of his doubles....
Saddam Hussein was on TV 2 days back, shown on Lebanese, Egyptian, Syrian, Iranian and other middle eastern TV stations over and over throughout the day doing an impromptu walkabout in downtown Baghdad, surrounded by TV cameras and loyal Republican Guard troops, and "irregulars" , yelling Saddam's name and punching the sky with fists and automatic weapons. I imagine the folk there do *know* what this man looks like...he has been their leader for some 25 years....and it sure looked like him...unless it was yet another of his doubles....
On one of the news channels (I think it was Fox) they showed a picture of Saddam that they knew was authentic and they showed the Saddam who was in that crowd. The real Saddam has a mole below his left sideburn. The guy in that crowd didn't.
This morning it is being reported from Baghdad that the minders who shadow the media didn't show up for work this morning. That may be a sign he's dead. It certainly indicates that he's losing control. And then there was the celebration in the streets of a Shiite section of Baghdad this morning. Thousands shouted, "There is only one God and Saddam is his enemy!"
OK....back on topic here , if that doesn't get me a chewing from the moderators, it looks probable that Saddam wasn't in the that area when the bombs hit. The man's got so many doubles that nobody for sure knows where he is, or who for that matter.
Maybe the real Saddam has had plastic surgery and a sex change, now installed in a CIA safe house somewhere in Florida sipping those martinis.
I just find it hard to believe that in a time of war and crisis for his country, he's not come on TV and made references to things actually going on that assure people he's still around and in power and is "fighting the good fight".
This is kind of like a chess game. Saddam may have been thinking an extra step out (so to speak).
If you're coming on TV, holding up the morning's newspaper every time the enemy proclaims your death, then the one day you don't do that, everybody will believe you finally are dead.
The way he's played it, we're still not sure. Yeah, we're asking, "If he's not dead, why won't he come on TV and hold up a current newspaper?"
"Well, he's never done that before. It doesn't mean anything that he's not doing it now." Is a possible answer to that question. It wouldn't be a possible answer if he had done it before.
Maybe?
Personally, I think he's dead. Left Iraq is my close second choice.
Saddam Hussein was on TV 2 days back, shown on Lebanese, Egyptian, Syrian, Iranian and other middle eastern TV stations over and over throughout the day doing an impromptu walkabout in downtown Baghdad, surrounded by TV cameras and loyal Republican Guard troops, and "irregulars" , yelling Saddam's name and punching the sky with fists and automatic weapons. I imagine the folk there do *know* what this man looks like...he has been their leader for some 25 years....and it sure looked like him...unless it was yet another of his doubles....
Again, though: how do we know it was live or from that day? How many times in his career has Hussein taken walks through town, filmed by TV crews and surrounded by hopped-up troops and scared-shitless "supporters" praising his name and presence?
How hard could it be to pop in a year-old video?
I'm sorry, but I'm getting to where I simply can't - and won't - take anything they say or do on face value. That "information" minister alone kinda gives me an indication of what to expect from their higher-ups.
I do realize that many here would take the word of Saddam, that lying-out-his-ass Information Minister, Republican Guard leaders, etc. over our side. But, thankfully, I'm not prepared to make that leap just yet.
Everything they do or say gets looked at with a skeptical eye by me at this point. As well it should. Their track record for open honesty and truthfulness isn't exactly A1.
An another lame comparison, between your thread and this one. Here nobody bet on the date of death on somebody like your thread.
I suggest you to move along. If you are not happy with the thread i locked feel free to contact an admin.
People have clearly speculated, expressed hope, even delight at the thought of Osama or Saddam dying on these boards with narry a reprimand from you, so don't pretend you are simply shutting down a thread because mock gambling was at play.
I geuss if I had said I hope he dies that would have been ok. I don't hope he dies, because I really don't think it will change anything. No real gambling was going on and you know it. It's a figure of speech.
Comments
The people I know have the good taste not to buy their crap in the first place.
Even if I DID own their CD, I wouldn't burn it...just on economic grounds alone. I can't afford to be buying CDs just to burn or step on them in radio station parking lots.
My well-documented fascination/lust with Sheryl Crow hasn't been diminished by her vocal anti-war/anti-Bush position and statements.
I can separate the two and still dig her music and bod and just forgive her for being wrong on the other stuff.
As far as the Dixie Chicks, that's a funny one: they made the mistake of being popular in the ONE genre where you simply can't afford to come across the least bit anti-America/anti-troop/anti-whatever. Rock, pop, R&B, rap, etc. all have a long, glorious history of protest, left-leaning sentiments, etc.
But country music? These are the people who actually work for a living, whose kids go off to the military and do the dirty work, who often lead simple, no-frills lives,etc (the kind of people many here would probably love to make fun of?). It's kind of funny that they (the Chicks) stepped in it this bad. I'm sure when she said it she just thought she was being "daring" and "an artist" (easy to do in London...say that stuff in a crowd in your - AND President Bush's home state of Texas...THEN I'd say you got some balls).
I can separate the message from the messenger. Alec Baldwin is one of my favorite actors...has been for a long, long time. He's a horse's ass in his views, but he's a good, solid actor. I don't boycott his movies or refuse to rent one.
Don't lump those of us who support this action in with the Dixie Chicks CD-burning brigade (of which I'm not a part).
In any case, it's still just people exercising their right to free speech too. That's what's cool about it: it's a two-way street.
Natalie Maines isn't guaranteed that her statements won't have consequences. Just like when ultra-right-wingers spew their stuff and get into trouble.
She can say whatever she wants, however she wants and whenever she wants. And people can respond in kind.
Being an "artist" doesn't get you a "shield me from repurcussions" card.
Maybe the real Saddam has had plastic surgery and a sex change, now installed in a CIA safe house somewhere in Florida sipping those martinis.
http://www.boston.com/dailynews/098/...hdad_bo:.shtml
although not sure the Israli's would let it sit at that. if he's alive they'd probably find him and track him down.
again. War news, wait 5 days. it's only been two, all news regarding the matter is therefore idle chitchat.
Originally posted by sammi jo
[B]OK....back on topic here...
Maybe the real Saddam has had plastic surgery and a sex change, now installed in a CIA safe house somewhere in Florida sipping those martinis...
Uh, yeah. THAT'S "back on topic"...
I sometimes have to defend myself against ShawnPatrick's latest and greatest, sammi. Get used to it.
Now, back on topic: I think Hussein is dead. I think he has been for quite some time. If not all-out dead, then certainly seriously injured. I just find it hard to believe that in a time of war and crisis for his country, he's not come on TV and made references to things actually going on that assure people he's still around and in power and is "fighting the good fight".
Think about it: unless I've missed one, none of the video released of him since this war began can truly be pegged/timed to being recent (since the war began). God knows what kind of footage they've got stored up and could show and caption as whatever they wanted.
Think about it (part 2): Flip the situation around and imagine the U.S. under attack by an army determined to remove President Bush from power (put a cork in it...spare me). Say that the White House or a section of the Pentagon he was thought to have been in at the time was hit hard with bombs a day or two before the "real" war starts, reducing the joint to rubble. Now suppose that in nearly three weeks, we never saw anything from President Bush on TV except videotaped segments of him walking around his Texas ranch with reporters, sitting around with various cabinet members in that big room, walking out to Marine One with his dog, etc. In other words, not once in three weeks has President Bush come on to talk SPECIFICALLY about what's going on, refer to recent events or otherwise let it be known that he's around, still alive, in control, etc.
Wouldn't we all - after about a week or so of this - start to wonder "WHAT is going on...is he even alive anymore? We haven't seen anything by the administration that lets us know, 100%, that the President is still alive".
Saddam could've gone on TV numerous times and referred to - in detail, and in a way that left no room for interpretation - recent events during the war: the opening attack, the POWs, the chopper crash, Geraldo's nonsense, Peter Arnett's little episode, the various instances of friendly fire incidents, the Akbar case, the death of various well-known people or the destruction of certain structures.
He hasn't, far as I know. I would think OUR president was dead if this were all flipped around.
Originally posted by pscates
[B]Uh, yeah. THAT'S "back on topic"...
The CIA reference re. Saddam Hussein was a silly joke...it's more likely that if anyone of our enemies is in a safe house, it would be OBL.
I sometimes have to defend myself against ShawnPatrick's latest and greatest, sammi. Get used to it.
Now, back on topic: I think Hussein is dead. I think he has been for quite some time. If not all-out dead, then certainly seriously injured. I just find it hard to believe that in a time of war and crisis for his country, he's not come on TV and made references to things actually going on that assure people he's still around and in power and is "fighting the good fight".
Saddam Hussein was on TV 2 days back, shown on Lebanese, Egyptian, Syrian, Iranian and other middle eastern TV stations over and over throughout the day doing an impromptu walkabout in downtown Baghdad, surrounded by TV cameras and loyal Republican Guard troops, and "irregulars" , yelling Saddam's name and punching the sky with fists and automatic weapons. I imagine the folk there do *know* what this man looks like...he has been their leader for some 25 years....and it sure looked like him...unless it was yet another of his doubles....
Originally posted by sammi jo
Saddam Hussein was on TV 2 days back, shown on Lebanese, Egyptian, Syrian, Iranian and other middle eastern TV stations over and over throughout the day doing an impromptu walkabout in downtown Baghdad, surrounded by TV cameras and loyal Republican Guard troops, and "irregulars" , yelling Saddam's name and punching the sky with fists and automatic weapons. I imagine the folk there do *know* what this man looks like...he has been their leader for some 25 years....and it sure looked like him...unless it was yet another of his doubles....
On one of the news channels (I think it was Fox) they showed a picture of Saddam that they knew was authentic and they showed the Saddam who was in that crowd. The real Saddam has a mole below his left sideburn. The guy in that crowd didn't.
This morning it is being reported from Baghdad that the minders who shadow the media didn't show up for work this morning. That may be a sign he's dead. It certainly indicates that he's losing control. And then there was the celebration in the streets of a Shiite section of Baghdad this morning. Thousands shouted, "There is only one God and Saddam is his enemy!"
Originally posted by sammi jo
OK....back on topic here , if that doesn't get me a chewing from the moderators, it looks probable that Saddam wasn't in the that area when the bombs hit. The man's got so many doubles that nobody for sure knows where he is, or who for that matter.
Maybe the real Saddam has had plastic surgery and a sex change, now installed in a CIA safe house somewhere in Florida sipping those martinis.
http://www.boston.com/dailynews/098/...hdad_bo:.shtml
So, are you saying YOU are Saddam? It would make a lot of sense.
Originally posted by pscates
I just find it hard to believe that in a time of war and crisis for his country, he's not come on TV and made references to things actually going on that assure people he's still around and in power and is "fighting the good fight".
This is kind of like a chess game. Saddam may have been thinking an extra step out (so to speak).
If you're coming on TV, holding up the morning's newspaper every time the enemy proclaims your death, then the one day you don't do that, everybody will believe you finally are dead.
The way he's played it, we're still not sure. Yeah, we're asking, "If he's not dead, why won't he come on TV and hold up a current newspaper?"
"Well, he's never done that before. It doesn't mean anything that he's not doing it now." Is a possible answer to that question. It wouldn't be a possible answer if he had done it before.
Maybe?
Personally, I think he's dead. Left Iraq is my close second choice.
Originally posted by sammi jo
Saddam Hussein was on TV 2 days back, shown on Lebanese, Egyptian, Syrian, Iranian and other middle eastern TV stations over and over throughout the day doing an impromptu walkabout in downtown Baghdad, surrounded by TV cameras and loyal Republican Guard troops, and "irregulars" , yelling Saddam's name and punching the sky with fists and automatic weapons. I imagine the folk there do *know* what this man looks like...he has been their leader for some 25 years....and it sure looked like him...unless it was yet another of his doubles....
Again, though: how do we know it was live or from that day? How many times in his career has Hussein taken walks through town, filmed by TV crews and surrounded by hopped-up troops and scared-shitless "supporters" praising his name and presence?
How hard could it be to pop in a year-old video?
I'm sorry, but I'm getting to where I simply can't - and won't - take anything they say or do on face value. That "information" minister alone kinda gives me an indication of what to expect from their higher-ups.
I do realize that many here would take the word of Saddam, that lying-out-his-ass Information Minister, Republican Guard leaders, etc. over our side. But, thankfully, I'm not prepared to make that leap just yet.
Everything they do or say gets looked at with a skeptical eye by me at this point. As well it should. Their track record for open honesty and truthfulness isn't exactly A1.
Originally posted by tonton
That's a pretty stupid story. Of course there's no evidence. The area remains under Iraqi control. How could there possibly be any evidence?
Our friend Peter Arnett!!!
Oh the shame!!!
Originally posted by Nordstrodamus
Yet another thread unethically speculating on if or when a man will die.
Oh the shame!!!
An another lame comparison, between your thread and this one. Here nobody bet on the date of death on somebody like your thread.
I suggest you to move along. If you are not happy with the thread i locked feel free to contact an admin.
Originally posted by Powerdoc
An another lame comparison, between your thread and this one. Here nobody bet on the date of death on somebody like your thread.
I suggest you to move along. If you are not happy with the thread i locked feel free to contact an admin.
People have clearly speculated, expressed hope, even delight at the thought of Osama or Saddam dying on these boards with narry a reprimand from you, so don't pretend you are simply shutting down a thread because mock gambling was at play.
I geuss if I had said I hope he dies that would have been ok. I don't hope he dies, because I really don't think it will change anything. No real gambling was going on and you know it. It's a figure of speech.
Your biases are showing, clear and simple.